ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 10

[gitana1]

What is everyone’s best current theory as of now?

So hard to know. Obviously, an ex- someone who knew them and who was called repeatedly by two of them shortly before the murders- would be a logical suspect.

But this was a mass murder by stabbing. And done quietly enough that each victim was stabbed while in bed and asleep and the remaining roommates didn’t hear anything to make them suspect such carnage was going on.

That’s crazy. It makes me feel like that’s more the MO of a serial killer type rather than a disgruntled ex. Someone who either planned it or who had the confidence due to a high level of psychopathology and experience in some type of criminal activity prior.

But I don’t know.

There have been horrific crimes perpetrated by people I never would’ve thought would be the demographic. Like teens committing bizarre murders of children. (Jessica Ridgeway’s monster, e.g.).

 

[jhock]

Homeless ex-student, inflated ego, high achieving family.

my opinion- Thrill killer.

 

[saralsim]

Activity on the police log is continuing to increase. Here's an interesting one from yesterday.


22-M10204 Suspicious Person/Circumstance
Incident Address: E 2ND ST & S MAIN ST
MOSCOW ID 83843
Disposition: ACT
Time Reported: 14:10
Cad Comments:
A male is walking around taking down the posters with the tip line information.
Officer responded. No report.

MPD Press Log 11/22/2022

 

[NickoD]

I would like to include this post to address both the "targeted" and "sloppy" issues that seem to bother people so much.

From the FBI Law Enforcement Bulletin Volume: 54 Issue: 8 Dated: (August 1985) Pages: 18-25 (abstract):

"The organized offender is socially adept and usually living with a partner. He may report an angry state of mind prior to the murder and admit to being calm and relaxed after the crime. The crime scene of the organized murderer shows a semblance of order before, during, and after the offense. The victim frequently is a stranger and may be targeted because he or she is in a particular location or has certain characteristics. Obsessive, compulsive traits surface in the organized murderer's behavior and crime scene patterns. In contrast, the disorganized offender is likely to be of below average intelligence, low birth order, and subjected to harsh parental discipline. He is in a confused and distressed state of mind at the time of the murder, is socially inadequate, and sexually incompetent. The crime scene shows that the crime was committed suddenly with no set plan of action for deterring detection. Facial destruction and sexually sadistic acts performed after the murder are typical. Disorganized offenders usually leave the victim in the same position in which he or she was killed and make no attempt to conceal the body."

Emphasis mine.

I feel that this is what "targeted" and "sloppy" mean: targeted based on certain characteristics (i.e. the location of the house or the kind of cars that were parked on the driveway might be a good enough "target" characteristic) and that the crime scene was chaotic and no attempt was made to conceal the crime.

I understand it's natural to read into "targeted" as "oh, that means the PEOPLE were targeted so it must have been someone who had a beef with them" and "sloppy" as in "the killer was going around touching and spitting on things" but I don't see this as being the case here at all.

NOTE: A fair amount of MOO.

 

[bkmdano]

Was Ethan just a sleep over and not a resident as reported earlier? The murderer was probably invited into the
residence or was able to force entrance..ie Uber driver "good samaritan ride home". Thinking out loud.

 

[Bnic84]

I have no life, I spent about 8 hours catching up ha

I should be doing something else. Like cleaning or studying. But here I spending my life with you all combing through the threads

 

[Curiosa20]

Maybe

I’m not able to see any comments.

Me either. I have a subscription, too.
I see that 3 were posted but none appear.
Was the 1st comment very weird?

 

[Pharmasgirl]

I have no life, I spent about 8 hours catching up ha

Omg I know the feeling… on pins & needles awaiting next presser

 

[sds71]

Steve Goncalves, Kaylee’s dad, is “a bit in denial” after the killings, he told CNN on Wednesday, and is focused on securing justice for his daughter, despite the dearth of information.

“We all want to play a part in helping, and we can’t play a part if we don’t have any real substantial information to work from,” he said, joined by his other children, Alivea and Steven.

Alivea expressed frustration with the timeline — saying she knows her sister got home about 11 minutes later than police say she did — as well as with rumors that have circulated amid the vacuum of information. She dismissed claims her sister was being stalked, echoing a statement Tuesday by police that they “have not been able to verify or identify a stalker.”

“She was extremely conscious,” the sister said. “She was very vigilant. I think that she really would have noticed something.”

Alivea Goncalves further described her sister as a goofball who “didn’t dwell on any of the negatives.” She enjoyed laughing and playing pranks on loved ones, she said.

“She would block me on Instagram if I borrowed shirts without asking — that was not uncommon,” Alivea said, chuckling.

Watch: Father and siblings of Idaho victim speak to CNN about investigation | CNN

The father and siblings of Kaylee Goncalves, one of the four University of Idaho students found dead in an off-campus residence, spoke with CNN's Jim Sciutto about the ongoing investigation into the killings.

www.cnn.com

Police promise update in University of Idaho killings as investigators collect video and hundreds of tips - KTVZ

CNN, KAYU, KLEW By Natasha Chen, Paradise Afshar, Steve Almasy and Eliott C. McLaughlin, CNN Authorities are scheduled to provide a Wednesday afternoon update into the fatal stabbing of four University of Idaho students as police sift through what could be key video evidence and more than 700...

ktvz.com

 

[positive]

I think it is a Danny Rolling-type stranger who happened upon this house and decided it was a good/easy place to take out his anger/fantasy on some drunk kids. The main reason I don't believe it's a friend or someone of similar age is because I just can't see someone that age having the sophistication (in all ways) to commit a crime such as this and then be able to not give major tells to their own friends/family and/or LE. Since it's still relatively early in the case, I think it could be someone from the general area who hasn't popped up on LE's radar and/or doesn't have a lot of contacts with the community at large, but the longer the investigation drags out the more likely I think it is that the killer was just passing through.

I agree with everything you said except "still relatively early in the case". For a murder like this it is getting late in the case. Most murders this style are solved sooner than this. I hope they announce an arrest or POI today but I am not gonna hold my breath.

 

[Hexe]

I noticed something interesting in the police logs from yesterday.

22-M10204 Suspicious Person/Circumstance

Incident Address: E 2ND ST & S MAIN ST

MOSCOW ID 83843

Disposition: ACT

Time Reported: 14:10

Cad Comments:

A male is walking around taking down the posters with the tip line information.

Officer responded. No report.

Now, the area in which this happened is exactly where Mad Greek, a restaurant where two of the victims worked, is located. Could it be the perp is an unhinged person hanging in the area of the South Main Street?

 

[trujac]

- [ ] So many interesting viewpoints from websleuths here concerning this awful quadruple murder--I feel motivated to add my thoughts. The focal points for me are the number of people in the house/the three floors of the house, the locked bedroom doors on the first floor, and the frantic calls to "Jack" regarding the dog right before the murders. I think it's possible the dog was missing/was removed from the house when Goncalves and Mogen returned home from the food truck--they called Jack several times thinking he might have stopped by to pick up the dog while they were out. The fact that the roommates on the first floor locked their bedroom doors leads me to think that everyone in the house locked their doors while sleeping. The defensive wounds some victims received might have occurred when they unlocked and opened their bedroom door to the assailant(s) or they were awaken with the picking of their bedroom door lock shortly before the murder(s) entered their bedroom and attacked them. Since the two girls on the first floor were not killed, it seems to me they were not part of the murderer's plan. Had this been a random stalking and psychopathic killing, such as the Groene/Sharon Tate case or a planned hit (the Rhoden family murders) everyone in the house would have been dealt with by the killer(s) in one form or another. imo, the killer was aware of the first floor layout with the additional bedrooms, along with the house front door. Perhaps, the girls on the first floor were spared because the killer didn't want the risk of being disturbed/caught by someone unexpectedly entering the house through the front door. I think there is a mix of possible reasons why these students were killed, along with possible suspects. The student's social activities and their social media seems like the pinnacle of the clue heap for LE to probe...money, isolation, poverty, sex, cult worship, proximity, in the wrong place at the wrong time, thrill kill, etc...seem low on the totem pole for me. I think envy, jealousy and anger seem to be possible motives in this crime--with Anger being the controlling factor.

 

[Hexe]

If as quoted: the killer was sloppy and left a lot of evidence..., I'd venture Law Enforcement is closing in on a suspect. I don't share that opinion. I feel the killer(s) was methodical in what they did and careful not to leave evidence.

Not necessarily. That evidence has to be connected with someone and making this connection in real life is not as easy or as fast as in tv procedural series.

 

[crax.t]

Activity on the police log is continuing to increase. Here's an interesting one from yesterday.


22-M10204 Suspicious Person/Circumstance
Incident Address: E 2ND ST & S MAIN ST
MOSCOW ID 83843
Disposition: ACT
Time Reported: 14:10
Cad Comments:
A male is walking around taking down the posters with the tip line information.
Officer responded. No report.

MPD Press Log 11/22/2022

this just made me so irrationally angry. IMO i can't imagine it would be the perp. it's likely some incel troll that doesn't want the victims to have justice.

 

[SuziQ]

Was Ethan just a sleep over and not a resident as reported earlier? The murderer was probably invited into the
residence or was able to force entrance..ie Uber driver "good samaritan ride home". Thinking out loud.

I believe the ride home was cleared.

 

[layer]

I believe the ride home was cleared.

Correct

 

[OneCrabbyDiva]

This thread moves so fast so forgive me, but I am so puzzled about the lack of security cameras or ring cameras. Did the apartment building next door have any security cameras? Is it a large complex? For all we know the perp could have lived in that complex and had been spying on the house for a long while. I hope to goodness the police have more than what they are telling us and are close to closing in on the perp.

I think that's one of the things that is taking so long. No one could convince me that most single family homes, student housing, and businesses wouldn't have security cameras even in a low-crime area just because of a large, young, student population. Not necessarily for heinous crimes like this one, more for things like vandalism, car accidents, worried parents, fights, etc. I can't find the link, but I remember one of the televised interviews said that they were going through a LOT of video submissions from citizens. I'm hoping that one of the close neighbors had cameras that were able to pick up the perp's exit from the house. He/she didn't just vanish into thin air. At that time in the early morning, I imagine that every car, walker, cyclist, and runner is going to be identified and I would go further and say that LE will probably ask for the public to help identify some people/cars. IMO.

 

[crax.t]

Was Ethan just a sleep over and not a resident as reported earlier? The murderer was probably invited into the
residence or was able to force entrance..ie Uber driver "good samaritan ride home". Thinking out loud.

seems like the parents believed he more or less lived there - ‘She’s a tough kid’: Avondale father says University of Idaho student killed fought her attacker

"Her and Ethan were together about a year, give or take. And she, really, when I went up there she, I saw her just a week before that and she changed a lot. She had a life. She got to see what it was like to have a boyfriend you live with. And she really turned around. She was really responsible. Helping him out with his studies and stuff. I was really impressed"

 

[mickey2942]

This could explain why the roommates called over friends before calling police. One of the family members has said in the press that the surviving roommates heard something that night. Pure speculation but maybe the woke up and just felt something was wrong, called friends to come assess.

Because that is how they think at this age, in college. No one immediately suspects any sort of criminal activity. The thought process makes sense to me...

"I can't reach X or E on their phone, what is up? Are they will someone else?...text other friend....nope....hmm, well, I will have those guys come over...".

At that age, the brain isn't going to go to catastrophic events. Or call the police and get everyone in trouble. My kids are this age, and go through so much drama over something weird, stupid, and simple to me. My daughter will be in some sort of weird panic, over something she has been agonizing over with her friends.

She told me, I solved it in less than 5 seconds.

Just remember when you were 19, calling the police is pretty much the last thing you would do. Even if it seems like the simplest and most logical thing to do.

 

[jollymon]

Or the killer wasn’t expecting Ethan at all. he watched the beautiful girls in the woods some time ago goes back to kill them and is ambushed in the hall by Ethan. Kills Ethan. Xena is woken up and he attacks her she defends herself and gets defense wounds. Possibly Kaylee and Maddy now hear something but not sure what and are too scared to go check and call J to come over and check the house for them. by which point the murderer is upon them and it’s too late. The murderer doesn’t know the house except what he sees from the woods(which makes me think he lived in town at the time of the murders and already owned the knife. The sort of man who likes slasher movies.) and accidentally spares the other two girls. The dog is petrified and hiding.Not sure about the last part. Well actually I’m not sure about any of it. But if I were a mom I wouldn’t let my child return to that town in case the murderer now thinks he is a fearless killer, enjoyed it, thinks he is smarter than the wonderful FBI and police, and strikes again. Imho and moo etc. God bless and God speed to the detectives. This one really is a battle of good versus evil.

Except the coroner indicated they were all sleeping when attacked