ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 12

[wary]

Or the surviving roommates’ night. They might have the most important info.

I assume that they’ve talked to LE in great detail. From the fact that they haven’t talked to news media, I think they have received good advice, and followed it.

 

[accordn2me]

I'm looking - at this point there are so many articles, I can't even find the first neighbor interviews at this point. IMO

I'm hoping the dog's situation will help me understand the puzzling phone calls that came from inside the home.
1. to the co-owner of the dog from K & M; and
2. from the surviving roommates to other friends (rather than 911, or even contacting the other people you live with) upon waking to one unresponsive person in your home.....

If there was a missing dog, I could begin to understand...maybe...

 

[human]

New to this, first post. I found WS after madly googling for any additional info on the Moscow murders. I lived there and attended UI, and am having a hard time wrapping my head around it. I know that it isn’t the usual, but this feels more than bungling to me by police. Even the coroner has conflicting statements. I get why they want to keep certain info close, but it doesn’t seem like they even know what they’ve got and how to interpret it.

That 911 call. Seriously so convoluted. Unconscious person, made with a surviving roommates phone but not the surviving roommate? Oh yeah, and there were other people present. Maybe it was a surviving roommate who was unconscious.

It’s targeted but we’re not going to tell you who or what is the target but don’t worry everyone and then walk that back a few days later, you lost the community’s confidence there. If this is a stand alone case, then it sure feels like the target is women, Ethan happened to be there. And if that is the case, half of the population doesn’t need to worry.

Also not searching the woods behind the house for a week? Really?

My profile says white male 18-35, lives alone or with parents. Has hunting or military experience. Is a psychopath. Lives nearby. I think he watched from the woodsy part behind the house, didn’t know the downstairs contained two more bedrooms, methodically went room to room killing, then left on foot back up the hill and possibly cut through the arboretum to a waiting vehicle (car/bike) on Palouse River Drive.

I was wondering about the wooded area behind. How is the weather? Is it realistic to think someone could sit out there? And is it realistic to think he would not be seen? When do the leaves go away?

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Also agree there are degrees of familiarity but imo the more familiar* the murderer was with the victims the more confidence LE would have in locking in on that person. A stranger to everyone would raise more alarms right, more questions, for LE and the public.

My big concern (besides everything about this fright show) is that the murderer had that contact with the victims, but it was so isolated and one-sided that LE would have a hard time locking in on them. And quite possibly, they left and went back home, so how do you find the missing piece?

 

[WildWest]

Have not seen those reports. Will be very interested in them if they surface.

I have to mention, if they dog was incapacitated, knocked out or sedated/drugged. I don't know any dog that would not go crazy listening to murders.

 

[tstephens1981]

Fellow longtime lurker, first post.

My theory is perp came in while they were out, put dog out at that time so as to avoid barking later, hid in house, M&K looked for dog on arrival home which explains numerous calls to co-owner J. Were upset about missing dog but not much could be done at 3 am, retired for evening hoping dog would be home in morning. MOO Another poster made great point that dog apparently did not track through blood, which suggests he was either outside house OR crated when this happened. I think put out by killer beforehand since probably would have had blood on him if wandered around scene and left later through door left open by killer. MOO I don’t think cops would have delivered him to animal control as reported if he had been covered in blood. But if crated, then would not have been wandering around crime scene getting bloody, but maybe barking in morning and worried surviving roommates wondered why owner not roused. That is why dog is important. MOO

I like this theory a lot! I have a similar take:

What if Murphy was accidentally let out by the downstairs roommates or E & X upon their arrival that night? I seem to recall M & K were the last group home; upon discovering the dog missing they began searching and calling dog’s co-owner for assistance. Perhaps when this didn’t pan out, they left a door open for the dog to return through? And if the killer was watching the house, the open door was the final encouragement he/she needed to follow through on their plan.

Just a thought but if this or something similar occurred, it might be important regarding the killer’s entry/exit and further motivation. JMHO

Source: myself (see below)

Growing up we had a Westie that was an escape artist. She was a purely “inside” dog so the few times we couldn’t find her (particularly at night) we would leave the garage door slightly open in case she returned on her own- that way she was at least warm.

Granted I grew up in a small town (roughly size of Moscow now that I think about it!) and this was 20+ years ago, but we never really worried about locking our doors.

 

[Operationcatchthug]

This definitely looks significant.

I thought police said they know that these 4 were the only intended targets? Now police say it's a serial killer? Methinks the police know nothing.

 

[Operationcatchthug]

It would great if you could find those interviews and link them here. Thanks!

Why is the dog critical?

 

[debirlfan]

Has there been any discussion about the 2nd bedroom on the 2nd floor? (See floor plans in thread 11, post 371) Its a 6 bedroom house, but 5 residents + 1 guest were present. I am wondering if there is an unknown roommate or if this bedroom is unoccupied or used for something else.

Thanks from a newbie, great site!

Actually, there may have been two empty rooms. Had K moved her stuff out yet? I think it's possible she was sleeping in her friend's room, especially given they were both on the phone.

Which raises the question, with one (possibly two) empty bedrooms, had any attempt been made to rent those rooms? Had they been advertised? Did anyone come to look at them? If so, a great opportunity to case the house.

 

[saralsim]

It would great if you could find those interviews and link them here. Thanks!

Sorry - I'm only finding the other dog incident in my searches at this point. I am more than likely crossing random rumors I've read with actual sources, so I went back and deleted my post.

 

[layer]

Okay I gonna just throw this out here. We are aware that Kaylee came back to Moscow to show off her new car and to see her friends. What if the killer is not from the area at all and instead followed Kaylee back. Maybe they had some kind of negative interaction, or maybe they just saw a her as a target. I know it's a stretch but just thought I'd put it out there.

Since we're just throwing things out here... As I see it there are 2 basic categories this crime can fit into.

#1. Typical murder - The 4 L's - Love, Lust, Loot, Loathing.

#2. Something else - Serial/Thrill Killers, Cults, Killer on the run, God only knows

You sound like you could be in the #2 camp.

 

[JSTANOVICE]

Totally. I think this person was very familiar with these young women. *May* have even thought he had a 'relationship' with one. I was working with an incident trainer and at the time having a super creepy stalking work situation. After talking with the trainer about the situation, they told me that oftentimes the obsessed man will fantasize the 'relationship' to the degree that it's 'real' to them, and so the slight is HUGE when it happens. lovely. In my first post, I described the build up and the prep. He is someone they'll likely have seen, and may even be someone who day trips over to Moscow recently and frequently to be close.

I Thonk You’re spot on, The restaurant where The 2 girls worked Is A perfect setting for this To happen, LE needs to Go back and look At any unusual customers, especially The Shy Quiet type Who May Have taken A liking to one of The girls Working There, I know There’s been a report that one of the girls thought someone might be stalking Her.. This All makes sense Hopefully LE Has been looking into this

 

[layer]

Apparently they're useless. They slept through the entire ordeal!

That's a little harsh, don't you mean they're useless to the investigation or something like that?

 

[Operationcatchthug]

Fellow longtime lurker, first post.


I like this theory a lot! I have a similar take:

What if Murphy was accidentally let out by the downstairs roommates or E & X upon their arrival that night? I seem to recall M & K were the last group home; upon discovering the dog missing they began searching and calling dog’s co-owner for assistance. Perhaps when this didn’t pan out, they left a door open for the dog to return through? And if the killer was watching the house, the open door was the final encouragement he/she needed to follow through on their plan.

Just a thought but if this or something similar occurred, it might be important regarding the killer’s entry/exit and further motivation. JMHO

Source: myself (see below)

Growing up we had a Westie that was an escape artist. She was a purely “inside” dog so the few times we couldn’t find her (particularly at night) we would leave the garage door slightly open in case she returned on her own- that way she was at least warm.

Granted I grew up in a small town (roughly size of Moscow now that I think about it!) and this was 20+ years ago, but we never really worried about locking our doors.

Why are you distracted by the dog? Have police said that the dog's behaviour is important to understand?

 

[tstephens1981]

One more random thought:

Is it possible Ethan was not attacked as brutally as the girls, perhaps due to his being a male & the killer targeting women in general? If so, this *might* explain why his body could have been considered “unconscious” instead of clearly murdered. MOO

 

[Operationcatchthug]

That's a little harsh, don't you mean they're useless to the investigation or something like that?

Yes. Useless to the investigation. Why say they have critical information when police have already said they slept through the whole thing!

 

[human]

Fellow longtime lurker, first post.


I like this theory a lot! I have a similar take:

What if Murphy was accidentally let out by the downstairs roommates or E & X upon their arrival that night? I seem to recall M & K were the last group home; upon discovering the dog missing they began searching and calling dog’s co-owner for assistance. Perhaps when this didn’t pan out, they left a door open for the dog to return through? And if the killer was watching the house, the open door was the final encouragement he/she needed to follow through on their plan.

Just a thought but if this or something similar occurred, it might be important regarding the killer’s entry/exit and further motivation. JMHO

Source: myself (see below)

Growing up we had a Westie that was an escape artist. She was a purely “inside” dog so the few times we couldn’t find her (particularly at night) we would leave the garage door slightly open in case she returned on her own- that way she was at least warm.

Granted I grew up in a small town (roughly size of Moscow now that I think about it!) and this was 20+ years ago, but we never really worried about locking our doors.

Wouldn’t it be too cold to leave a door open?

 

[Sleuthchik7]

I can’t see notice of one listed anywhere. I’m guessing they may not do another until there is critical information to share, or they feel the need to reassure the public again. JMO

Don’t you find it odd though they had one last Sunday then right after on Wednesday although they had nothing new to say and now nothing?

 

[accordn2me]

Fellow longtime lurker, first post.


I like this theory a lot! I have a similar take:

What if Murphy was accidentally let out by the downstairs roommates or E & X upon their arrival that night? I seem to recall M & K were the last group home; upon discovering the dog missing they began searching and calling dog’s co-owner for assistance. Perhaps when this didn’t pan out, they left a door open for the dog to return through? And if the killer was watching the house, the open door was the final encouragement he/she needed to follow through on their plan.

Just a thought but if this or something similar occurred, it might be important regarding the killer’s entry/exit and further motivation. JMHO
<snipped>

Your theory would explain the calls to the other owner of the dog AND possibly the police saying they found a door open...

Here's the Q & A from the Moscow, Idaho website:

1. What happened to the dog?

On the night of the incident, officers located a dog at the residence. The dog was unharmed and turned over to Animal Services and later released to a responsible party.

Note: "On the night of the incident...."

To me, it's weird that the dog was turned over to Animal Services if it was any other time except the night of the incident when none of the occupants of the home had discovered he was missing.

 

[PacoElFlaco]

Okay I gonna just throw this out here. We are aware that Kaylee came back to Moscow to show off her new car and to see her friends. What if the killer is not from the area at all and instead followed Kaylee back. Maybe they had some kind of negative interaction, or maybe they just saw a her as a target. I know it's a stretch but just thought I'd put it out there.

Possible new boyfriend from Texas, jealous of her Moscow Ex?