ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 31

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If this car seen is the suspect, it seems like they had one goal in mind. Something that I keep thinking about is how they knew for sure everyone was home and sleeping at that time and didn’t have more people over for an after party? I don’t think it would be unusual for any 4 of them to be out partying until later than the timeframe of the car seen at 3:15 and I don’t think it would be unusual for more people to be at the house after the bar and party at the frat. How did the killer know when to strike to be able to find them in their beds asleep and (in my opinion) be in and out of there quickly?
All MOO
 
Works perfect for my timeline. Suspect leaving food truck @ 2. Goes to house. Waits for lights to go out @ 2:55. Enters through predetermined easy access, scouted from being in the house previously. Kills K and M very quick- adrenaline is pumping. Tries to leave but is confronted or hears someone. Murders again quickly out of adrenaline and excitement- fear of being discovered. In the house about 5 minutes. Crime of passion from a disgruntled crush(stalker) who felt scorned that night, because his attempts at "hooking up" were denied. IMO

Ah this helps put things in context for me. Thank you.
5 minutes though?! Is that really possible to do this so quickly?!
MOO
 
Just from my experience as a woman, I cannot imagine these girls telling SUCH detail about a stalker to this store clerk.

Yes, the girls seemed vivacious and extroverted, from what we see, and I could MAYBE see them answering that they're in a group because one had a stalker.

However, this clerk went into great detail regarding said stalker, and it just feels off to me. At most I would think the girls would just say "we feel safer in a group" and leave it at that.

I agree about being friendly and chatty with clerks whom we see frequently, as @seemstome said, so I figured that perhaps they went there daily.
Once he said they've been there a total of 6 or 7 times, I felt like nope, that's not frequent enough to spill every minute detail about where and when there was a stalker.

Also I totally agree with @jcamh---they died mid-November, he claims he last saw them three weeks prior---he would've definitely said something about have a fun Halloween rather than leaping straight to Thanksgiving.

I agree with @las726 that the vibe is weird. I don't think he's a bad dude or a suspect and it could just be the 15 minutes of fame, wanting to feel that he has something important to add to the conversation or whatever, but it just, in my opinion, seems like an implausible scenario. Not impossible but unlikely.

Jmo

ETA: @seemstome Just wanted to add that I respect your owning a business. I would infer that to have achieved that, you are probably older than 21, but I don't know (and not my business, not asking for an answer) if you are a female or not. Just wanted to state that, in my own opinion and experience, if I were still young and wanted to pour my heart out to the store clerk about a stalker, I would ONLY do that, if I were going to talk about it at all, with a female. And one that I felt was trustworthy, such as one who owns a business I frequented.

Not EVER to a male clerk who appears to be about the same age.

That's just me, though; others may feel differently. I still just don't see it here.

He over explains and is overly animated while doing so. I am not buying anything he says, and you’re right in that I don’t think the girls would be sharing such information with him. IMO I don’t think he is involved. I see this interview as more of an attention kind of thing.
 
If this car seen is the suspect, it seems like they had one goal in mind. Something that I keep thinking about is how they knew for sure everyone was home and sleeping at that time and didn’t have more people over for an after party? I don’t think it would be unusual for any 4 of them to be out partying until later than the timeframe of the car seen at 3:15 and I don’t think it would be unusual for more people to be at the house after the bar and party at the frat. How did the killer know when to strike to be able to find them in their beds asleep and (in my opinion) be in and out of there quickly?
All MOO
Are the police any further ahead in solving E/X timeline that night? There seems to be a sense or inkling that something went terribly wrong and maybe, maybe followed them home. I hope police can figure it out. I believe tomorrow is the anniversary of the Honey and Barry Sherman murder in Canada, still unsolved.
 
I wonder if they went that far out west asking for video? What’s out east?

An employee at a gas station in Troy, Idaho, about 12 miles east of Moscow on Highway 8, tells Fox News investigators asked for video, but their property does not have a camera facing outside.

A manager from the Food City store in Kendrick, about 24 miles east of Moscow, tells Fox News investigators asked for video from cameras on their property.
 
My GUESS at this point is the white Elantra is being concealed in a garage/building, burned, in the bottom of a lake or river, abandoned over state lines, or something similar. Perps seem to think they can rely on “jurisdictional blindness”, as our Late Great @Foxfire used to call it.

Iirc, in Tim Bosma’s case (killed for his truck), the perp hid his truck in his mom’s garage.

My guess is the car doesn’t belong to a witness, but likely the killer, jmo.

I agree. It's also possible that the car has been crushed and junked, possibly after being burned.

I have seen a few conjectures that the Hyundai Elantra could have been burned after the crime. There are many places to hide a vehicle, but in a populated area, I think it would be very risky and very unlikely that a car could be torched without drawing attention. A fire capable of basically destroying a vehicle is not a small blaze. It is a fully-involved, black-smoke fire that would be noticed for quite some distance, and would very likely be seen and reported by someone. JMO
IF the white Elantra belongs to the killer hypothetically or even the killer's family member or friend, and the car is at the bottom of a lake, burnt or even hidden away. How do you explain the car away!?

How does the killer explain where the car is or what happened to it? Even if it's their car people are going to notice this person is no longer driving, or perhaps notice its no longer parked where it usually is. You can only make excuses for so long.

Even if this person was a student that left to go home for Thanksgiving early two states away and never came back, 4 students were brutally murdered where you go to school. Your family are definitely following the case. They'd know the car being sought. Your friends also know what car you drive.

Its only a matter of time.
 
This tragedy seems to be breaking news:

Police said they responded to King Road for a report of an unconscious person. When officers arrived, they “discovered four individuals who were deceased...”


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Media Thread/No Discussion

Press photo album (compilation courtesy of WS member cujenn81)

Moscow ID Police Departement Facebook page

City of Moscow re King Road Homicide

Detectives are looking to develop context for the events and people involved in the four murders at 1122 King Rd in Moscow, Idaho. Anyone who observed notable behavior, has video surveillance, or can provide relevant information about these murders:

Based on the search for a late model Elantra, I wonder if the authorities could tap into vehicle satellite technology and contact all of the major mobile satellite service providers (Sirius XM, OnStar, GPS, Etc.) and narrow down the vehicles that match that automobile type and we're in the area at the time of the murders?
 
The surveillance footage placed on top of his six-unit rental building on Linda Lane showed a white car speeding west on Taylor Road between 2.14am and 3.15am on Sunday.


Why such a wide time frame if security video is available? Isn't the time a little too early for the perp to be leaving the scene? Weren't K and M texting JD almost until 3am?
And who gives a time frame starting at 14 minutes after the hour? :D I advise not trying to parse any news article too closely. They tend to provide a decent summary, but often get details incorrect.
 
Works perfect for my timeline. Suspect leaving food truck @ 2. Goes to house. Waits for lights to go out @ 2:55. Enters through predetermined easy access, scouted from being in the house previously. Kills K and M very quick- adrenaline is pumping. Tries to leave but is confronted or hears someone. Murders again quickly out of adrenaline and excitement- fear of being discovered. In the house about 5 minutes. Crime of passion from a disgruntled crush(stalker) who felt scorned that night, because his attempts at "hooking up" were denied. IMO
That's an interesting possibility. Like maybe he went home to get his knife.
 
If this car seen is the suspect, it seems like they had one goal in mind. Something that I keep thinking about is how they knew for sure everyone was home and sleeping at that time and didn’t have more people over for an after party? I don’t think it would be unusual for any 4 of them to be out partying until later than the timeframe of the car seen at 3:15 and I don’t think it would be unusual for more people to be at the house after the bar and party at the frat. How did the killer know when to strike to be able to find them in their beds asleep and (in my opinion) be in and out of there quickly?
All MOO
Right, and neighbors described it as an 'unusually quiet' night at the house. M had a boyfriend who was out of town and K had an ex that she would call and that might come over early in the morning...
 
Maybe that camera got the vehicle coming and going? In at 2:14, out at 3:15? The perp does X and E at 2:30. K &M hear it and frantically call J. Perp moves upstairs, calls stop. Perp speeds out.
Reasonable theory, but the article says the car was "speeding west on Taylor Road between 2.14am and 3.15am."

Article says LE contacted the owner on 11/14. Maybe the camera time wasn't accurate or maybe the owner didn't note the exact time prior to LE retrieving the video. We don't know.
 
Works perfect for my timeline. Suspect leaving food truck @ 2. Goes to house. Waits for lights to go out @ 2:55. Enters through predetermined easy access, scouted from being in the house previously. Kills K and M very quick- adrenaline is pumping. Tries to leave but is confronted or hears someone. Murders again quickly out of adrenaline and excitement- fear of being discovered. In the house about 5 minutes. Crime of passion from a disgruntled crush(stalker) who felt scorned that night, because his attempts at "hooking up" were denied. IMO
If the perp attacked at 2:55, K an M weren't asleep yet, so the element of surprise was not as great.
 
That's an interesting possibility. Like maybe he went home to get his knife.
Yes. IMO he had two scenarios going into the night. He was either going to be successful at hooking up or or get shot down. K was only in town for the weekend, then moving out of state. This was the make or break night. Everything was prepared for getting shot down, and once K and M left the food truck without acknowledging him or asking him if he would like to come along the plan was in place. Works perfectly for the timeline of the vehicle. All speculation based on timelines and videos.
 
Hey long time lurker following from the UK. Just to let you all know Sky news are doing a special on the case today and have a podcast. I'm working so unable to look at it at the moment. Hoping and praying for a breakthrough soon
 
The surveillance footage placed on top of his six-unit rental building on Linda Lane showed a white car speeding west on Taylor Road between 2.14am and 3.15am on Sunday.


Why such a wide time frame if security video is available? Isn't the time a little too early for the perp to be leaving the scene? Weren't K and M texting JD almost until 3am?
I’ve thought about the time being really tight, too. However, I’ve watched a lot of true crime shows in which cctv, ring, etc all played a major part in identifying a suspect and/or debunking an alibi, and it’s amazing how often the time stamp on the videos are off. Of course, with that comes the problem of convincing the jury that the tape is still reliable.
ID’s See No Evil series, for those that haven’t watched it, focuses on crimes solved by the use of video footage. It is chilling to watch the final hours of a person’s life play out with evil lurking in the shadows.
 
Yes. IMO he had two scenarios going into the night. He was either going to be successful at hooking up or or get shot down. K was only in town for the weekend, then moving out of state. This was the make or break night. Everything was prepared for getting shot down, and once K and M left the food truck without acknowledging him or asking him if he would like to come along the plan was in place. Works perfectly for the timeline of the vehicle. All speculation based on timelines and videos.
Don’t you think he would have been questioned 100 times by now and something wouldn’t add up? It seems like it should be that simple, but I don’t think it is.
 
Absolutely! I'm not sure why people keep mentioning the dog's collar when one, we don't know if he was wearing a collar, and two, the police examined the dog and found no evidence.
they think the killer took the collar in hand and moved the dog into the room where it was found....that is why they ask...
 
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IMO, I think LE and FBI are going above and beyond to find the killer even expediting processes to get the job done, but a lot is contingent on blood evidence and DNA. My guess is that the case is going to be solved shortly. A lot of people are upset about this.

I feel the same as you. I mean they have over 40 FBI agents assisting, 2 BAU FBI…. Which they only have 8 BAU agents total in the entire country For these types of cases. 2 out of 8. That’s huge. If you think about the number of agents, both federal and state and local. Even with the extensive amount of tips the LE has received…. This case is being taken very seriously and the countries top LE are working very hard to solve.

I believe strongly they do have a suspect or suspects, they have a very good idea of what happened that night by now… and the hunt is on for that last bit of information / confirmation for the LE to issue a warrant for their arrest.

The risk is just too high to release too much of this information to the public because it could spook the killer and make them that much harder to apprehend.
 
Overall, what I feel like I’ve read is that K & M were killed in their sleep, I don’t think I’ve read anything that specifically states one or both of them had defense wounds. However, it has been said by X’s dad that she had defense wounds. K’s dad, in a recent interview, said there was more of a battle in X’s room.
This leads me in several directions. K & M were killed first and second (not sure who first), then E would have been 3rd with X last. Maybe the killer didn’t go to the lowest level of the home because they were injured in killing X.
So if E &/or X were the targets, why did the killer go upstairs?
Or maybe one of the survivors was the actual target but the killer wasn’t able to complete their mission due to an injury. Maybe they wanted everyone else dead so they could do whatever it was they planned on.
I just can’t get behind the theory that this was done by some random person they met for the first time that night. It was a ballsy act to attack with a knife when they *thought* the victims were sleeping. I keep thinking about that piece. You can enter a room and think someone is asleep, but they could be awake with eyes closed. This person(s) really must’ve felt they had nothing to lose. (MOO)
 
If the perp attacked at 2:55, K an M weren't asleep yet, so the element of surprise was not as great.
Last "drunk dial" by M at 2:52. K possibly sleeping already . At food truck they are visibly intoxicated. Everyone at the food truck knows they are intoxicated. The element of surprise definitely there on two unsuspecting victims at 3 in the morning after partying all night. I think other 2 victims went to sleep earlier. Once the Lights Went Out on 3rd floor it was game on for the plan. All MO
 
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