ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 35

[Trouble1321075]

Can social media sleuths be sued?

Idaho murders: Can social media sleuths be sued for wrongful accusations?

Social media users spreading rumors about innocent people whom they believe to be involved in the murders of four Idaho college students could face legal consequences.

www.foxnews.com

I imagine they can be sued for defamation and slander if they make false statements of facts but I don't think they can be sued for having an opinion as long as they are clear that they are expressing that and not a fact.

 

[drmrgrl]

He harnessed the power and might of 100 men that night due to the immense amount of free-flowing adrenaline and epinephrine. He was pumped up and hellbent. It would have taken a LOT more than 4-6 students to stop him. He unleashed the kraken and HELL along with it. The scene was most likely frenzied and chaotic. He may have also even carried another weapon (gun, pepper spray) in case it was needed beyond the knife. It wasn’t. He didn’t. It’s exceedingly difficult to conceive such a heinous act for a morally upright and law abiding citizen. But for a killer, one well practiced by all outward appearances, it’s a simple walk in the park. JMOHO

IMO, I think the killer was also drunk and perhaps didn’t know what he was doing= messy, sloppy scene

 

[Sjöberg]

These are MOO- what should be added? Changed? To understand Risk

Victim- low - young women alcohol
Location- high - populated, entry/ exit not visible in rear
Timing- low - darkness, people asleep
Weapon- medium - speed and sharp

What intrigues me about this take, is that the only high risk aspect here is the location. Kinda rhymes with the PD saying the residence was the target. But also with the general idea that had it been just a thrill killer, it is unlikely to pick that particular house. While if someone wanted to target the resident(s) of this house, is makes all the sense to attack while they're drunk and asleep, while it's ca 3-4 AM, and mostly even to use knife (still hints at personal/damage/sadistic, but a gun at 3AM in a house with 6 people is also a bad idea).
So I still get the feeling of targeted. There was a reason to go to this house. And there might have been a reason for the knife (if the aim was to just kill one of them, they could have shot that person in any secluded location - why didn't they and what do these possible reasons tell us?).

 

[Aquarian]

Not all sexually motivated murders involve a sexual assault at the scene.

Right, instead we have stabbing. So maybe there are other things? That’s what I was asking…

 

[10ofRods]

Zodiac Killer
Eric Copple-Napa CA
Uvalde Shooter
Las Vegas shooter

Thank you. The last two are cases I've used as a parallel to this one - as they are all mass killings (albeit of different kinds).

So, the idea of some random person attacking for their own (sociopolitical) reasons is still on the table. I am writing a little piece on that topic (victimology when there are no specific victims targeted - but a group instead). I'm not sure about Zodiac (for obvious reasons) because we have no clue about his social nexus. I believe Zodiac lived and worked in the heart of SF, but that's just personal opinion.

From what I'm reading, Copple killed the BFF of his former fiancée - so not on the edge of the victims' social world. Actually, the victims' friend actually went ahead and married Copple. He went to the funerals of the people he killed. Someone who gets married is not, to me, a loner living on the edge of town.

Maybe I should have said "drifter." Both Uvalde shooter and Las Vegas shooter took advantage of ease of travel for their crimes, that's for sure.

However, it's possible the criminal in this one is a more Zodiac-like person. I think LE thinks it's someone closer to Moscow and the University, though. IMO.

 

[NuttMegg]

There's no evidence Chris Watts planned to murder his wife. It could've just been rage induced during an argument.

I always wonder why Chris Watts didn't just bury the bodies in the desert on his way to the oil rig. If you look on Google maps, there's miles and miles of just open countryside with no houses or anything.
He would've always been prime suspect but enough doubt to avoid a conviction.

I think there's lots of latent psychopaths in the world that don't know they're psychopaths.

To me the Idaho murders look like unplanned, personal, vengeful rage. Possibly alcohol involved also due to it being Saturday night.

I've heard before that the majority of murders, rapes, violent assaults involve alcohol.

Watts confessed to pre-planning the murders of his family to FBI/CBI/FPD on Feb 18, 2019. Within a few months after that he confessed to pre-planning the murders in personally hand-written letters that he agreed to have published. He also confessed, in writing, to attempting murder of his wife's fetus, which he carried out on July 31, 2018. The mother (and fetus) lived through it, with several accounts by family members of the severe illness she endured that night he drugged her in the attempt to murder the fetus.

 

[x_files]

In my opinion, LE knows and has proof of the suspect(s) involved. I believe they have received all of the digital forensics (phone, SM, camera) along with crime scene forensics (DNA, prints, etc) and interviews with family, surviving roommates, friends, old schoolmates, and fraternity/sorority brothers/sisters.

MOO LE is delaying the arrest of the suspected killer(s). I believe they have agents under surveillance waiting till after the holidays to make the arrests for the sake of the families (victims and LE).

IMO, LE is releasing tidbits to get information and input from the public on any additional accomplices or witnesses. This crime was a result of pent up rage from a person close to the victims and the killers left a messy crime scene that is making it easy to solve. Just wait till the New Year. IMO.

I hope you are right they have the suspect in their crosshairs and will arrest soon.

 

[thx4_medic_Babby]

One thing I continue to get a laugh at is how so many "sleuths" are descriptive, imaginative, and vivid when it comes to the culprit(s) mannerisms and methodology once inside of the home, but (they) completely have no resolve on how their murderer/s-of-choice arrived or left the scene of the murders.

 

[blackbeary]

IMO, I think the killer was also drunk and perhaps didn’t know what he was doing= messy, sloppy scene

I've been around messy, sloppy drunk's that can barely maintain their balance, let alone have the coordination to aim at something precisely.
Now, If they were a seasoned alcoholic, this may be possible.
If they were on a substance, meth, spice, crack, formaldehyde, acid, etc. they may have super human strength.
M00

 

[AngTxGal]

Zodiac Killer
Eric Copple-Napa CA
Uvalde Shooter
Las Vegas shooter

Lone mass killers that Survived- Blaze of Glory type killers
Parkland Florida School Shooting- 2018- Cruz
Santa Fe, TX School Shooting- 2018- Dimitrios
Highland Park July 4th Shooting- 2022- Crimo
Colorado Springs nightclub Shooting- 2022- Aldrich

Above appear to suffer mental illness- but not warranting an insanity defense

Lone mass stabbing killers
Reading, UK stabbing-2020- 3 killed knew them- Saadallah
Sagamihara, Japan stabbings- 2016- 19 killed, Uematsu

JMO

 

[10ofRods]

Where is the idea that these young women were really drunk coming from?

Just curious. KG's voice is not slurred in the security cam (pre-Grub Truck) video, although she is speaking somewhat loudly and she gestures in an animated fashion. I don't see any staggering and MM answers quietly. None of the three appear super drunk to me. This is at least 30-45 minutes before the young women will arrive back home, having stopped to eat food (no liquor consumed at the Grub Truck that I can see). Then they walk some more to meet their ride and take a 10 minute ride home, or thereabouts.

What's the evidence we have that they are so inebriated? Why does that keep being said as a fact here? Apologies if this has already been asked and answered.

The way the two women are dressed does not say "out for a party/drinking/socializing evening" to me. Nor does their behavior look exceedingly influenced by alcohol. If they did drink at the Corner Club, they walked some, ate some, walked some more, took a car ride. They'd be in the sobering-up phase. Is there evidence that they were drinking at home? I believe there was a fast food bag visible in the kitchen, but that's it. Maybe there were liquor bottles visible? Is that the evidence?

MOO. Speculation included.

 

[Trouble1321075]

Like so many aspects of this case the above though is sternly effected by what the killer knew or did not know -- which in turn we do not know.
If he had some familiarity with the home, say been to a party there in the past couple of years. Or if he stalked victims that night and observed their inebriated state. Then this killing may well have been relatively low risk to the killer. Or started out as low risk, but he perceived the risk as greater than he thought once he went into second room with two people in it -- while he might have logically thought each room would have one person (and a lower threat of resistance to him). So he could have had his expectation of low risk and then surprise of not one room, but two rooms containing a more difficult task of killing two people at a time.

We have to keep in mind we have the benefit of hindsight. he may have know many aspects of where was where etc, and been surprised by others.

We know so little about even the most basic of facts that it makes speculation little more than wild guesses.

For instance I watched an interesting video today that makes a compelling case that one of the surviving roommates room was actually the other bedroom on the 2nd floor. If that's true (and I can tell you the evidence supporting it is compelling) that raises a whole bunch of questions that most people have not even considered because they have been assuming those two lived on the first floor.

 

[10ofRods]

One thing I continue to get a laugh at is how so many "sleuths" are descriptive, imaginative, and vivid when it comes to the culprit(s) mannerisms and methodology once inside of the home, but (they) completely have no resolve on how their murderer/s-of-choice arrived or left the scene of the murders.

For this one, I do have hypotheses. LE has said they think entry was made through the slider on the back of the house (second floor) and I believe the exit was out the front door, as the neighbor said they saw the door standing open at around 8-8:30 am.

 

[drmrgrl]

I seem to recall that LE stated that there was something specific at the scene that led them to say this was targeted. They have pretty much been silent on what that is. Their reachout to the FBI/State for assistance seems to me to be exactly what they should have done. This is a big crime scene, lots of evidence, etc. They needed resources and that is what the state and FBI are for.

IMO, I am sincerely wondering what that “specific” thing was-so curious

 

[Tillyjames]

Where is the idea that these young women were really drunk coming from?

Just curious. KG's voice is not slurred in the security cam (pre-Grub Truck) video, although she is speaking somewhat loudly and she gestures in an animated fashion. I don't see any staggering and MM answers quietly. None of the three appear super drunk to me. This is at least 30-45 minutes before the young women will arrive back home, having stopped to eat food (no liquor consumed at the Grub Truck that I can see). Then they walk some more to meet their ride and take a 10 minute ride home, or thereabouts.

What's the evidence we have that they are so inebriated? Why does that keep being said as a fact here? Apologies if this has already been asked and answered.

The way the two women are dressed does not say "out for a party/drinking/socializing evening" to me. Nor does their behavior look exceedingly influenced by alcohol. If they did drink at the Corner Club, they walked some, ate some, walked some more, took a car ride. They'd be in the sobering-up phase. Is there evidence that they were drinking at home? I believe there was a fast food bag visible in the kitchen, but that's it. Maybe there were liquor bottles visible? Is that the evidence?

MOO. Speculation included.

I don’t think the general consensus is that they were “really drunk”. Thing is we don’t know. They spent the day likely drinking for the football game and then they all went separate ways and went out to bars, frats, wherever.

The two girls were dressed pretty typical of college students going to a bar IMO though

 

[OrlandoJames]

Right, instead we have stabbing. So maybe there are other things? That’s what I was asking…

Maybe, yes. But stabbings themselves can be evidence of a sexual motive. Male killers who cannot perform sexually in the usual way - and may have suffered humiliation about this - might seek to ‘penetrate’ their victims in other ways. Frenzied attacks by men against women usually have a sexual element to them irrespective of whether they actually try to sexually assault them at the scene. It would not surprise me if the perpetrator of this attack turns out to be a man harbouring this kind of misogynistic rage.

 

[drmrgrl]

Like so many aspects of this case the above though is sternly effected by what the killer knew or did not know -- which in turn we do not know.
If he had some familiarity with the home, say been to a party there in the past couple of years. Or if he stalked victims that night and observed their inebriated state. Then this killing may well have been relatively low risk to the killer. Or started out as low risk, but he perceived the risk as greater than he thought once he went into second room with two people in it -- while he might have logically thought each room would have one person (and a lower threat of resistance to him). So he could have had his expectation of low risk and then surprise of not one room, but two rooms containing a more difficult task of killing two people at a time.

We have to keep in mind we have the benefit of hindsight. he may have know many aspects of where was where etc, and been surprised by others.

IMO, I don’t think the killer took time to assess risk. I think he was pissed and did the job-no questions asked.

 

[blackbeary]

Can social media sleuths be sued?

Idaho murders: Can social media sleuths be sued for wrongful accusations?

Social media users spreading rumors about innocent people whom they believe to be involved in the murders of four Idaho college students could face legal consequences.

www.foxnews.com

Possibly the one's who are doxing and threatening friends, family, etc.

 

[NyxNY]

For one thing, LE has asked very little help from the public in solving this, preferring instead to go to ground and to interview lots and lots of people. As they went into the interview phase, my sense is that the Chief looks more confident and said as recently as yesterday that he's *very* confident that this case will be solved.

SBM for brevity

Your entire post was so insightful and reassuring. I snipped because I just wanted to say thank you for it.

 

[KentuckyMama]

Where is the idea that these young women were really drunk coming from?

Just curious. KG's voice is not slurred in the security cam (pre-Grub Truck) video, although she is speaking somewhat loudly and she gestures in an animated fashion. I don't see any staggering and MM answers quietly. None of the three appear super drunk to me. This is at least 30-45 minutes before the young women will arrive back home, having stopped to eat food (no liquor consumed at the Grub Truck that I can see). Then they walk some more to meet their ride and take a 10 minute ride home, or thereabouts.

What's the evidence we have that they are so inebriated? Why does that keep being said as a fact here? Apologies if this has already been asked and answered.

The way the two women are dressed does not say "out for a party/drinking/socializing evening" to me. Nor does their behavior look exceedingly influenced by alcohol. If they did drink at the Corner Club, they walked some, ate some, walked some more, took a car ride. They'd be in the sobering-up phase. Is there evidence that they were drinking at home? I believe there was a fast food bag visible in the kitchen, but that's it. Maybe there were liquor bottles visible? Is that the evidence?

MOO. Speculation included.

Agreed. I see them as having a bit of a buzz at the food truck. The food and a little bit of time likely was all it took to clear their heads. They definitely weren't fall down drunk.