ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 36

[Snoop Sister]

Good to know, I have watched the video a few times, a couple different versions of the video, and the only people I see coming to the door are two guys, I haven't seen a female come to the door. I thought maybe I was losing it (since others on here have said a girl had initially come to the door), ha!

I saw one video of B answering the door and then going back inside and later two frat looking guys come out to talk to LE. I also saw one video where Kaylee came out to talk to LE.

 

[KPO]

I saw one video of B answering the door and then going back inside and later two frat looking guys come out to talk to LE. I also saw one video where Kaylee came out to talk to LE.

The one where Kaylee came out was from October 16th. Just FYI for anyone looking for it.

 

[Trouble1321075]

Does anyone for sure know there were no residents there? That opens a whole new can of worms about access to that house. JMO

Many have speculated that the girl who answered the door is one of the roommates. We don't know for sure but it looks like her.

 

[Trouble1321075]

Wow. Tell me which killers of women of the past 50 years were successful sexually with women? I'm waiting...

Ted bundy is the most obvious one

 

[KPO]

Wow. Tell me which killers of women of the past 50 years were successful sexually with women? I'm waiting...

Ted Bundy (most notably), Charles Shobhraj, Richard Ramirez, Paul John Knowles, Charles Manson...

 

[debbiediablo]

IMO, it would have been an interesting turn of events had the driver stayed nearby to take a lunch/dinner break, parked on the side of Queen Ave eating his sandwich and taking in the surroundings. I wonder what the driver would have seen?

Just saying: I'm old, 72, and I never, ever drive anyone anywhere without waiting the few minutes it takes for them to open their door, walk in their home, and lock up. I also keep my car doors locked. I learned from my oldest daughter who was grabbed around the throat and strangled by a guy hiding in the backseat of her unlocked sports car. She had at least one black belt in TKD by then, and her class constantly practiced how to disarm threats (people with knives, guns, a garrote). She was able to pry his fingers loose (the bruises remained as a reminder for a long time) and get out on the street where he came after her. At that moment the endless practice and tournaments likely saved her life. She kicked him in the groin hard enough to break an oak board suspended about her head. He doubled over and she used both hands to deliver a side-hand knife strike to the base of his skull. She sped away but then decided to go back to see if he was dead. He was still laying there; she watched the news for a week to see if he survived and maintained use of his body. There's no doubt he came to kidnap her, and she should've called LE despite being both underage and under-the-influence. The bruises on her neck were enough proof. After this, I started carrying a canemaster Shaolin fighting cane everywhere, and we all learned to drive and ride more defensively. But in this situation the driver might've saved lives with a 911 call or fell 5th victim due to being the only unwitting living witness. Or maybe he'd be the #1 suspect if the killer came and left through the south side of the house while he sat there snacking on leftover Halloween candy.

IMO

IMO, it would have been an interesting turn of events had the driver stayed nearby to take a lunch/dinner break, parked on the side of Queen Ave eating his sandwich and taking in the surroundings. I wonder what the driver would have seen?

 

[Ceska]

This article lists 8 specific "crimes" in a 21 year period. 1 was a suicide and 2 were disappearances. IMO, that sounds pretty safe...not like "a small town with serious issues". I live in a town with around 30-35K population. The median income is over 90K per household so it's a wealthy area, over 50% have college degrees and over 95% have a high school education. Looking at crime statistics for last year, there were 50 violent crimes. Moscow ID has 10 violent crimes for the same period of time, 6 of which were assault, 3 robberies and 1 rape. I consider that quite safe. Moscow, ID Crime Rates and Statistics - NeighborhoodScout

Well, I will respectfully disagree..... Moscow is only 25,000 population. I live in a city of over 60,000 and we have had nowhere near the amount of murders and such. And when you factor in the extremist groups, it is way off the charts in that area of Idaho.

 

[Curious Me]

Idaho murders: Footsteps can be heard on 'every floor,' former tenant says

A former resident of the home where four Idaho college students were murdered said that every footstep was audible in the "creaky" house with "poor insulation."

www.foxnews.com

Idaho murders: Footsteps can be heard on 'every floor,' former tenant says

A former tenant of the home where four University of Idaho students were knifed to death told Fox News Digital that every footstep can be heard in the "creaky, old" home.

"It's a very creaky, old house," said Cole Alteneder, who graduated in 2022 and lived at 1122 King Road his junior year. "You can hear the footsteps on every floor."

[...]

"The person who lived below me always said he could hear me walking around," recalled Alteneder. "I had a desk and a rolling chair, and he could hear that roll around."

The home also had poor insulation and the "ventilation system was really weird, so you could hear everybody talking throughout the house," he said.

[...]

A former first-floor tenant previously told Fox News Digital that he could barely hear activity on the second and third floors due to the unusual layout of the house, which is built on the slope of a hill.​

So he lived there 2020-21? I thought Xana was there at that time, with the other roommates moving there in 21?

Yes, you're right, I guess it wasn't all that long ago, and the house didn't change all that much in that time period. What he confirms for me is that the tenants on the upper floors heard noise within the house from others on a regular basis, and learned to block it out. The killer must have made noise in that creaky house, but the renters had learned to disregard noises, is what he suggests. The lower floor was different being built against the hill.

Idaho murders: Footsteps can be heard on 'every floor,' former tenant says​

"It's a very creaky, old house," said Cole Alteneder, who graduated in 2022 and lived at 1122 King Road his junior year. "You can hear the footsteps on every floor."

[...]

Tenants were used to the noises and learned to tune them out, he added.

A former first-floor tenant previously told Fox News Digital that he could barely hear activity on the second and third floors due to the unusual layout of the house, which is built on the slope of a hill.

Alteneder said if the tenant had the first-floor bedroom directly under the living room and the living room wasn't being used, this would make sense.

The King Road home is on a cul-de-sac known as "fratlantis" due to its proximity to fraternity row, said the former student who now works as a real estate agent in Newberg, Oregon. BBM

 

[LetsSolvIt]

A few ideas…I know it’s too long.

1-I think that the murderer lives within sight of the house and knows the interior of the house very well.

2- Since the day after the murders is Sunday, I think that he was working at a job having a standart off-day as Sunday and that's why he chose Saturday night.

3- I think he is a smart person and has calculated the escape plan after the murder, determined the places where he would get rid of his clothes and the murder weapon, and the car he used avoiding the cameras while managing this.

4-I think he escaped from the back of the house and got into his stolen parked car(white Hyundai imo) , then got rid of the car without being caught on camera and returned to his house by public transportation the next day. Or maybe before the murders he took his own car to the place where he switched the cars.

5- I believe that the cameras in the public transportation and the entrance and exit camera records of the neighbors houses and cars of Saturday and Sunday were checked .

6- My guess is he knew the people in the house from the neighborhood, he had been in the house before, he was pissed off due to the noise and loud parties, and he had serious psychological problems and had taken drugs before the murders. In his sick mindset, he targeted the house and its occupants .. The LE statement ‘’ targeting the house ’’ supports this view , in my opinion .

7-I think he started with K and M then E and X. I don’t think he would take the risk of waking up both above and below residents by starting from the middle floor.

8-In my opinion, people who live nearby and have a record of car theft and use heavy prescription psychological drugs should also be on the radar.

Very interesting and seemingly logical theory. Makes a lot of sense to me.

#7 is noteworthy because his intention may have been to murder all, moving from top to bottom under your potential noise theory, but he was spooked or interrupted after the second floor killings, and left before completing his mission. MOO. MOO.

 

[drmrgrl]

I'd be fearful of vigilante justice if a real suspect were announced; it's bad enough with guess suspects.

IMO

IMO, I think it’s likely that news stations are going break into regularly scheduled programming to announce the arrest. There is no way that LE is going to tip their hand early.

 

[KPO]

Explain who you're speaking of...

This is off topic. You can believe what you believe and I can have my own opinion. Killing women is not always about sex. But whatever. You do you.

 

[rahod1]

Killing your wife for money or revenge is not relevant to this case. Why post this? You must realize it's not relevant...

I won't mention Bundy and Ramirez..since it's been brought up.
BTK had a family and was a respected member of the community.

Dennis Rader - Wikipedia

 

[KPO]

Well, I will respectfully disagree..... Moscow is only 25,000 population. I live in a city of over 60,000 and we have had nowhere near the amount of murders and such. And when you factor in the extremist groups, it is way off the charts in that area of Idaho.

Moscow hadn't had a murder is 7 years. You live somewhere that hasn't had a murder in longer than that? I'd love to know where because that is impressive.

 

[bonniejeanne17]

Not necessarily. They could still go into work later that morning. Commit killing at 03.00hrs - 04.00hrs, then church doesn't start until 08.00hrs or later.
That's enough time to get cleaned up and pretend like nothing happened. They'd be a bit tired, but could still get through the day.

MOO.

That is thinking like a real Websleuther!

 

[AngTxGal]

Well, we'd just be a heck of a team because that's almost exactly what I'd have one. Arboretum open 24/7 and all the trees. Sand Road is wide open spaces. I'd have made Pullman my base camp, gotten back to my car and disappeared with football traffic. Gone to wherever home is from there.
when I first saw LE's perimeter, I did a big ole 'huh?' but then I drew it, and it became very clear. I had a plan, although fortunately, I'm not a homicidal maniac so it's all imi.

Once LE threw Troy/Kendrick into the mix, I had to do some more research, and bingo, the Latah Trail. The path allows them an easy car-free way home. Even better than hiding a car. And by the time they got there, did away with the HE, and got into their running/biking gear, they could get in a nice trek back to Moscow and stay or go.
This is all imo/jmo/imi, of course.

The only things LE knew for certain were: 4 dead young people, murdered; the killer had to come in; the killer had to go out. After that, everything else is a chess piece IMO so they nailed the in and out piece. imo

edited to correct s/v agmt.

Next time I decide to rob a bank I’ll be sure to contact you, lol.
My thoughts in going south was to avoid hwy cameras near Moscow thinking they would not cast a net as wide as down to Genesee. There is also a reservation east for Nez Perce.
Pullman and crossing state lines brings in possible LE inconvenience regarding jurisdiction, that kind of inconvenience used to be helpful to perps, I assume it is still to some degree.
I keep thinking this perp resided nearby and had to go back home that night to blend back into life, they work or live in Moscow so that Is where they gained first contact.
In my imagined scenario they ‘met’ the girls through one or more of the places they frequented- home, Univ of Idaho, Sigma Chi, Mad Greek, Corner Club, or GrubTruck.
With names they could follow them on social media to ‘visit’, figured out where they lived and had kept an eye on the place off and on for some time- obsessing.

JMO-

 

[LetsSolvIt]

Hi all, long time lurker, first time poster.

Just a couple of thoughts that I'd like to share. First of all, if any specific person was targeted the surely there must have been "better" (i.e. safer from the perps point of view) opportunities to attack that person when he or she is separated from friends or other people who may fight back. If it was a planned attack then why "plan" on going into a house full of people? Surely there are way better plans than that. Next, in my opinion there is no way (considering the staircase, movable stuff and dog running around) that the perp didn't use any sort of light amplification hardware. Surely at 3-4 AM the inside of the house would be pitch black and hard to navigate even if the perp was familiar with the layout, things get moved, young people ofter rearrange space around them. Finally, if it there was any sort of planning going into this attack and the perp was absolutely decided on using a knife then, again, surely he'd realize that it's hard to subdue two people fighting for life with just a bladed weapon. Back in the old days Zodiac, who definitely planned a lot, and was also boind on using a knife during one of his attacks, knew that it's safer to simply approach victims openly with a firearm, order to lay face down, tie them and only then attack with a knife knowing that they're immobilized. After all, what guarantee did King Street perp had that *all* of the house occupants are asleep and/or heavily inebriated. So potentially one loud scream and he'd have 6 people awake and fighting for life (or, more likely) running away. Only an idiot wouldn't have a firearm as a backup for "crowd control" in such situation.

So, while this doesn't seem to me like a work of a psychopath high on drugs (he had to be silent to a degree, didn't leave the weapon on site, wasn't spotted in bloodied clothes etc.) there also doesn't seem to be an evil mastermind behind it (using knife instead of gun, selected extremely risky venue).

And finally, I don't think the victims were completely unaware that some sort of attack may take place. I seems to me that multiple attempts to contact ex that night by one (or even both) of the girls would indicate they were trying to reach out for help. So this makes going into this house woth jist a knife, no matter how large, even more risky. Just the fact that the lighs are switched off doesn't always mean that everyone's soundly asleep instead of just laying awake with a handgun, taser or can of pepper spray close by...

Sorry for a lenghty post, all of the above IMHO.

Welcome — don‘t be shy! Keeping posting! Good thoughts!

 

[Arkay]

@DoctorPsychMike

I want to be respectful to everyone's opinions, but your tone seems very personally invested in trying to make a point.

You say you do research in this area.

Surely your research has uncovered numerous examples of all different types of men who kill women.

Some are incels on a quest to destroy what they feel they cannot obtain.

Others are married men with children and an outwardly happy family life. Not the men who kill their wives, but the men who contort themselves trying to hide their evil nature from their families.

You've already had many responses about men who were not unintelligent or unattractive or unable to have sexual relationships.

Even some who are not conventionally attractive, like Charles Manson, who had a harem of women to satisfy his sexual desires.
He famously committed mass murder as well, but not due to lack of sexual conquests. There are multiple other motives for men who kill.

Since we don't know the killer yet, we don't know the motive. None of us can claim with certainty yet who did this and why.

IMO

 

[KPO]

I won't mention Bundy and Ramirez..since it's been brought up.
BTK had a family and was a respected member of the community.

Dennis Rader - Wikipedia

Exactly. Rader had sadistic sexual fantasies and unusual sexual fetishes. Neglected by his mother as a child and resentful. Nothing to do with the size of his genitalia.

 

[AngTxGal]

Let's start with everytime I had my gas tank filled when Oregon (I know it's not Idaho) had required attendants, everyone had a large knife on their belt. Unknown why, it just was. Granted I only passed through 16 times, and every attendant was male, but I noticed because I happen to like knives, swords, anything I consider unusual. None that I saw were Ka-Bar brand, fwiw. Gerber was most common, some Benchmade, a few Buck brand, and some odds and ends that were pretty special. I asked about every one.

Having a knife on hand does not seem odd to me. I carried a Buck pocket knife for many years, wore a custom Buck special that would cut through a car when I camped, walked alone in the woods, road my mountain bike. I do not live rural, but suburban. Having a knife does not seem out of the norm. So no leaving and going to get a knife necessary, per my particular life experience. It would be nothing out of the norm for this person to have one somewhere.

As a theory, they might have gone in with permission or not, and the person was not emotionally stable.

Reasons they might have wanted to talk to someone in the house include:

• Felt slighted and wanted to address the issue.
• Asked someone out and was refused. Trying to seek understanding of why.
• Someone in the house had some kind of attitude that hurt someone the killer cared about.
• Someone in the house did something that the killer found offensive.
• Some agreement the killer might have had with someone in the house was broken.

The list is really endless. Remember in this theory the killer is not mentally stable. Anything can send them over the breaking point.

In this theory, the killer could just came in. Might have sat outside working up courage and figuring what to say. Confronted who they expected to confront. If one of the girls and they were so passed out they couldn't wake up and talk to him, rage could happen if he thought they were doing it on purpose. Or if someone had been awake and laughed at him. What no one seems to understand is that if you take a pillow and put it over someone's face, they are too busy trying to get a pillow off so they can breath that they aren't necessarily defending against a weapon. Pillow over one face, stab the other, stab pillow person.

In this theory, girls first, Ethan heard something and got up, he was third, Xana was last and since not near Ethan has defensive wounds.

There are many variations on the "came to talk and things went south" theories. Some would have the target to talk to as Ethan or Xana. (Wanted to talk to Xana, Ethan said no, bad things happened, someone upstairs made noise so they had to be killed, for example). But they all rely on mental instability of the killer.

JOOMO.

Wow, that works smoothly but what about timing?
When would this encounter at the door take place?
If there was an after party with the survivors and X and E then people would be moving about at the house between 10-3 so that timing would work.

JMO

 

[Ceska]

Moscow hadn't had a murder is 7 years. You live somewhere that hasn't had a murder in longer than that? I'd love to know where because that is impressive.

What I meant was, (I may not have worded that the best in my previous post), was, a town of that size/population, and not being a suburb of a large city, there is a higher number of serious incidents there, in a town of that population (when compared to other towns that size, not associated with a large metropolis), and then also there are the higher number of extremist groups there as well.