ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 36

[SRWCF]

With all of the DNA in that house, how can they sort it all out? I hope and hope LE I will make an arrest with a very solid conviction. I was wondering what I would do if I ever was a witness to something because I always thought I would come forward because it’s the right thing to do and I live my life by the law. But after thinking about it if I thought the killer would come after me and make me into chopped hamburger maybe I would keep my mouth shut. But maybe he would come after me anyway if he knew I saw something.

It's for this very reason why I think the surviving roommates have been completely silent in this whole ordeal. They definitely have not done any interviews w/journalists. They must be completely terrified. If it were me at that age, I'm pretty sure I'd go into hiding.

 

[SRWCF]

“DuCoeur, who is a mechanical engineering major at the university, was initially considered a person of interest in the Nov. 13 murders of Goncalves, her two roommates, Madison Mogen, 21, and Xana Kernoodle, 20, and Kernoodle’s boyfriend, Ethan Chapin, 20, authorities said.”

nypost.com/2022/12/24/ex-boyfriend-of-slain-idaho-student-kaylee-goncalves-is-devastated-family

This is wrong on so many levels! He was never considered a POI - the police haven't consider anyone to be a POI. The public has, of course.

 

[drmrgrl]

As I recall, the stabbings of the Juettens occurred the night before they were to leave for a trip to Hawaii. The person who was going to housesit/petsit stayed over the night the stabbings occurred, was not attacked, and was able to call 911. Since they had engaged a house sitter, I presume they would not have requested a USPS "mail hold" while they were gone, but they might have done so.

I also recall reading in Sandra Ladd's obituary that she loved to travel to Hawaii, but there was no mention of upcoming travel.

KG had traveled (somewhat spontaneously it seems) from where she had been staying (with her family) in Coeur d'Alene to Moscow to show MM her new Range Rover and to attend a sorority party (according to her family). I don't know, but presume that she declared her intended trip on social media. I also don't know, but presume she would not have requested her own mail be held while she was gone since it would likely be received at her family's home mailbox and they would be there to receive it. I do wonder whether she had ordered mail forwarding from Moscow to Coeur d'Alene since she was residing there.

I bring this up because it occurs to me that there MIGHT POSSIBLY be some commonality in terms of each of these victims associated with social media announcement of upcoming travel or notification to USPS or some other vendor about upcoming travel or moves. Maybe a long shot, but probably a tidbit to keep in mind.

ETA: MOO. I'm essentially wondering about this out loud (on the electronic screen).

That’s a wonderful tidbit of info. Thanks

 

[10ofRods]

University of Idaho President uses FB page and letter to the community to explain the situation:

University of Idaho reveals more information about four deceased students

In a Facebook post with a letter from the University of Idaho President, Scott Green, more information was revealed about the four deceased students in Moscow.T

idahonews.com

Madison was a marketing major,

Kaylee was a senior in General Studies.

Ethan was majoring in Sport, Recreation and Tourism.

Xana was a marketing major as well.

The named tech firm in Austin where Kaylee was doing a paid internship (and was supposed to get a full time job in January) is called Extreme. I can only find one company in Austin with that name. It specializes in selling advertising banners and car wraps.

 

[jgarris]

At the very beginning of the case, it was reported that K's sister saw a neighbor's Ring (or similar) camera which showed K and M arriving home that night. The sister also reported (making me think it was visible on the video), that after arriving home, K/M let the dog out to go potty and then brought him back in.

IF that is true, then the dog was with the girls at that time. Whether they put him in an unoccupied room or whether the perp did, we do not know.

My theory is that K initially planned to sleep in her own bed, and she put the dog in her room as usual. She then for whatever reason ended up in M's room but the dog stayed in K's room. Theory only.

without links so MOO

I don't know why, but this gives me a very uneasy feeling. JMO (without the obvious of the uneasiness protruding from a quad-murder)

 

[al66pine]

Establish Federal Homicide Investigation Task Force?

The same officers responding to underage drinking and noise complaints, investigating and on scene for a quadruple homicide. The captain said he had many young officers on the scene, whom had never experienced a homicide scene. LE system is broken.Many state there is a learning curve, and they are adapting well.... The lead on this case was hired in 2020.

I propose a Federal Homicide Investigation Task Force of experienced LE homicide detectives, (with a priority to bring more female investigators) that automatically has jurisdiction over any local LE agency. Nationwide procedures and standards.

snipped for focus @MountainDad
FHITF on the surface, has an admirable goal --- for more experienced LE personnel to work on homicides.
But isn't that essentially what FBI does now*--- when requested by to local & st. LE, provides support services, including science and lab services, like Biometrics and Fingerprints, Scientific Analysis, Forensics (IIUC, some in city of crime, some in DC area offices, some working remote, some in other locations). That's in addition to the FBI agents who arrive in city of crime.

Despite the "lead" on this case joining Moscow LE force in 2020,* seems imo Moscow LE has the investigatory assistance & resources needed to solve the case.

If FHITF would "automatically" have "jurisdiction" over local & st LE, task force would take over homicides in NYC, Dallas, LA, St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, NOLA, San Francisco, Philadelphia, Indianapolis, Baltimore, Kansas City, Houston, etc, i
mo for political reasons alone, that "automatic" aspect is a lead balloon tethered to anchors and anvils.

imo jmo moo I could be wrong.

[[[ETA: to paste in the footnotes ]]]]
______________________________________________
*FBI Resources for Law Enforcement

Science and Lab — LE

Science and laboratory resources for the FBI's law enforcement partners.

le.fbi.gov

** Sorry, ATM, can't find quote of Chief's stmt re the lead and cannot find info about the lead's experience, employment history, etc.
Maybe lead had already served a decade as detective on another agency, maybe in a location w more homicides than the 7 Moscow "murders" reported from 2007 thru 2019? IDK
Anyone? TiA.

Moscow, Idaho (ID 83843, 83844) profile: population, maps, real estate, averages, homes, statistics, relocation, travel, jobs, hospitals, schools, crime, moving, houses, news, sex offenders

 

[TeaTime]

So, IF the dog was in an unoccupied room, say, behind closed doors.... maybe that is why KG was calling ex bf to find out if he came and got the dog. Just wondering / thinking out loud as we've been speculating about the purpose of the calls.

Exactly what I was thinking.

 

[wary]

University of Idaho President uses FB page and letter to the community to explain the situation:

University of Idaho reveals more information about four deceased students

In a Facebook post with a letter from the University of Idaho President, Scott Green, more information was revealed about the four deceased students in Moscow.T

idahonews.com

Madison was a marketing major,

Kaylee was a senior in General Studies.

Ethan was majoring in Sport, Recreation and Tourism.

Xana was a marketing major as well.

The named tech firm in Austin where Kaylee was doing a paid internship (and was supposed to get a full time job in January) is called Extreme. I can only find one company in Austin with that name. It specializes in selling advertising banners and car wraps.

Car wraps? That’s an intriguing coincidence. (People have speculated that the Elantra may have been turned white by use of a car wrap.)

However, in real life coincidences happen. Happen a lot. This isn’t a well-designed novel or play.

 

[Trouble1321075]

Right, that’s what I was hoping. Otherwise it would mean that they haven’t really made much progress in 40 days.

If nothing else they should be getting lab results back at this point which gives them confirmation of the firesenic evidence they have collected. That is a very important part of giving them the ammunition they need to make a good arrest. That in itself is progress.

Moo

 

[Stephen2022]

So, IF the dog was in an unoccupied room, say, behind closed doors.... maybe that is why KG was calling ex bf to find out if he came and got the dog. Just wondering / thinking out loud as we've been speculating about the purpose of the calls.

Possibly. I was thinking it would be unusual to put dig in back bedroom alone as opposed to bedroom with them . Unlees it found its way there to hide ir killer moved it

 

[TIGER0822]

The suspect could also respond negatively i.e. suicide, go out in a blast killing more, even deeper hiding, target for hurt friends/family. All these things together makes me think they won't. If so would be abnormal, Totally IMO.

With all of the DNA in that house, how can they sort it all out? I hope and hope LE I will make an arrest with a very solid conviction. I was wondering what I would do if I ever was a witness to something because I always thought I would come forward because it’s the right thing to do and I live my life by the law. But after thinking about it if I thought the killer would come after me and make me into chopped hamburger maybe I would keep my mouth shut. But maybe he would come after me anyway if he knew I saw something.

The police would absolutely offer you anonymity. If they felt you were endangered security.

 

[acutename]

You said JMO more than once, and so I took it as your viewpoint and theory. A good reminder to us all to remember to put that in. IMO. or MOO.



He's mentioned as the boyfriend of 6 years in some articles, and her instagram would indicate at least 5 years as well (they were interacting on SM at 6 years ago). They met in high school. Some articles say "on again, off again" so I suppose they could have broken up before college, gotten back together, then split again. Her obituary states he's her long term boyfriend and he's listed as family. We really don't know their relationship history, in short. Mrs G has said, "They would have gotten back together," implying that they were not together at the time of K's death.

IMO.

she is taking a job x hundred miles miles away- they are both very young- doesn't anyone else think this was a distance break? I do not know these people so IMO but I knew a lot of people in different colleges or grad programs or first jobs or internships who did get back together.

 

[gliving]

Car wraps? That’s an intriguing coincidence. (People have speculated that the Elantra may have been turned white by use of a car wrap.)

However, in real life coincidences happen. Happen a lot. This isn’t a well-designed novel or play.

I was just going to mention the car wrap theory. Uncanny!

 

[10ofRods]

she is taking a job x hundred miles miles away- they are both very young- doesn't anyone else think this was a distance break? I do not know these people so IMO but I knew a lot of people in different colleges or grad programs or first jobs or internships who did get back together.

Thing is, she likely could have found a similar job closer to Idaho. Perhaps her BF was thinking of moving to Austin, as well.

I do not know what kind of break-up it was, because all we have are Mrs G's words on the topic, so far. She loves and accepts JD as if he were her son, so of course she wants to think they would get back together. Party house life can be a stressor for a young relationship, that's for sure.

 

[Diddian]

This is wrong on so many levels! He was never considered a POI - the police haven't consider anyone to be a POI. The public has, of course.

It's probably a good idea for close associates and family members of victims to avoid social media (or at least develop a very thick skin in response to what is said there) until the unfettered craziness that tends to erupt there after a violent crime subsides.

Unfortunately, LE must look at those close to the victims as, statistically, the perpetrator is often in that circle. And since the 3 female victims and KG's ex all came from the CdA area, KG's ex would likely be considered part of the social circle of all 3 of the female victims. Add in a recent breakup and there could potentially be a related motive.

A recent breakup could also bring OTHERS under the umbrella of suspicion, such as guys who'd long harbored an interest in KG and with a breakup saw an opportunity and then had been rejected, overlooked, or otherwise dismissed. Same goes for young women who might have harbored an interest in KG's ex and still considered KG an impediment to gaining his undivided attention.

It would be malpractice NOT to consider close associates and recent breakups. In considering possibilities, LE would likely start close and work out from there as close associates could be lifted from suspicion based on solid alibi or mismatch with the evidence gathered at the scene and from other sources (interviews, surveillance, etc.).

Hoping this is resolved soon for all who are so negatively impacted.

 

[Cyndesleuth]

Agreed. "Everything" could be anything.

Seems like the "everything" could be let but the LE should have already interviewed Adam and they know whatever "everything" means.

 

[MountainDad]

Establish Federal Homicide Investigation Task Force?
snipped for focus @MountainDad
FHITF on the surface, has an admirable goal --- for more experienced LE personnel to work on homicides.
But isn't that essentially what FBI does now*--- when requested by to local & st. LE, provides support services, including science and lab services, like Biometrics and Fingerprints, Scientific Analysis, Forensics (IIUC, some in city of crime, some in DC area offices, some working remote, some in other locations). That's in addition to the FBI agents who arrive in city of crime.

Despite the "lead" on this case joining Moscow LE force in 2020,* seems imo Moscow LE has the investigatory assistance & resources needed to solve the case.

If FHITF would "automatically" have "jurisdiction" over local & st LE, task force would take over homicides in NYC, Dallas, LA, St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, NOLA, San Francisco, Philadelphia, Indianapolis, Baltimore, Kansas City, Houston, etc, i
mo for political reasons alone, that "automatic" aspect is a lead balloon tethered to anchors and anvils.

imo jmo moo I could be wrong.

[[[ETA: to paste in the footnotes ]]]]
______________________________________________
*FBI Resources for Law Enforcement

Science and Lab — LE

Science and laboratory resources for the FBI's law enforcement partners.

le.fbi.gov

** Sorry, ATM, can't find quote of Chief's stmt re the lead and cannot find info about the lead's experience, employment history, etc.
Maybe lead had already served a decade as detective on another agency, maybe in a location w more homicides than the 7 Moscow "murders" reported from 2007 thru 2019? IDK
Anyone? TiA.

https://www.city-data.com/city/Moscow-Idaho.html[/UR

Lead Idaho investigator is US Army vet with two years of experience

Brett Payne is the officer now leading the investigation into the quadruple murder. Until two years ago, he had no police experience and was serving in the military.

www.google.com

How is this logical? Why?

 

[Nila Aella]

Establish Federal Homicide Investigation Task Force?
snipped for focus @MountainDad
FHITF on the surface, has an admirable goal --- for more experienced LE personnel to work on homicides.
But isn't that essentially what FBI does now*--- when requested by to local & st. LE, provides support services, including science and lab services, like Biometrics and Fingerprints, Scientific Analysis, Forensics (IIUC, some in city of crime, some in DC area offices, some working remote, some in other locations). That's in addition to the FBI agents who arrive in city of crime.

Despite the "lead" on this case joining Moscow LE force in 2020,* seems imo Moscow LE has the investigatory assistance & resources needed to solve the case.

If FHITF would "automatically" have "jurisdiction" over local & st LE, task force would take over homicides in NYC, Dallas, LA, St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, NOLA, San Francisco, Philadelphia, Indianapolis, Baltimore, Kansas City, Houston, etc, i
mo for political reasons alone, that "automatic" aspect is a lead balloon tethered to anchors and anvils.

imo jmo moo I could be wrong.

[[[ETA: to paste in the footnotes ]]]]
______________________________________________
*FBI Resources for Law Enforcement

Science and Lab — LE

Science and laboratory resources for the FBI's law enforcement partners.

le.fbi.gov

** Sorry, ATM, can't find quote of Chief's stmt re the lead and cannot find info about the lead's experience, employment history, etc.
Maybe lead had already served a decade as detective on another agency, maybe in a location w more homicides than the 7 Moscow "murders" reported from 2007 thru 2019? IDK
Anyone? TiA.

Moscow, Idaho (ID 83843, 83844) profile: population, maps, real estate, averages, homes, statistics, relocation, travel, jobs, hospitals, schools, crime, moving, houses, news, sex offenders

Here are some links: write up on the investigative team, 82nd airborne (BP previous job), and the chief's statement regarding his team in one of the updates from MPD.

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article269498497.html

82nd Airborne Division - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

https://www.ci.moscow.id.us/DocumentCenter/View/24978/12-20-22-Moscow-Homicide-Update

Lead Idaho investigator is US Army vet with two years of experience

Brett Payne is the officer now leading the investigation into the quadruple murder. Until two years ago, he had no police experience and was serving in the military.

www.dailymail.co.uk

edit: After reading the Idaho Statesman write up on the investigative team...the head of the investigative team is JL who handles most of the major crimes and who has been there since 1997 according to the article....that differs from the Daily mail article identifying the lead as BP.
Edit2: changed lead invesigator previous job to BP previous job

 

[RAISINISBACK]

MSN

www.msn.com

 

[CSIDreamer]

The time between attacks didn't double (if one takes those attacks as a series).

IIRC, it's 14 months between 1 and 2, and then 15 months between 2 and this quadruple murder. It's the number of victims that's doubling.

Refractory periods can go up or down, depending on all kinds of variables. I always wonder what made Joe De Angelo quit being a serial killer (if he did, we may never know).

Its only 16 months until March 2024. OPs math makes sense.