ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #15

[desert-blue]

I am feeling in my gut that we were given a totally bogus timeline of the 2 days' events. I would LOVE to see LE's and Klein's timelines. We don't even know if the timestamp on the store receipt matches when they said they were there.

The time stamp has deliberately, on several occasions, been withheld by both LE and Mr. Klein. I'm assuming there is a reason for that.

 

[desert-blue]

I keep going back to the fact that in the parents' first interview, Isaac was not mentioned one time. Listening to their interview, you would have no idea that there even was a fourth adult present. Later, the press referred to him as a "family friend" and it was some time IIRC before his name was even released. If the parents had any inkling that he had done something to DeOrr why didn't they even mention him being there? Why, in their first interview, three days after DeOrr's disappearance, did they insist little DeOrr had been abducted? Why didn't they insist that the sheriff investigate the family friend? I'm just not buying into the idea that Isaac killed DeOrr on his own (in 17 minutes, to boot). It makes no sense.

 

[Aunt_Tulip]

If the "probably not a rumor" is even true, there are more reasonable explanations for IR to disappear than he had to quickly go hide a body. Maybe he had been drinking and didn't want GGP or others to know. Maybe he is totally freaked out by LE because of something in his past. I honestly have no solid theory as to what happened, but I'm definitely not convinced IR killed or disposed of DeOrr. I hope no one did, but its not really looking that way.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Noah Chamberlin has been found

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

I would also like to think that even a hard nosed PI would not publicly declare a 2 year old dead unless 110% certain.

That would be especially cruel to the family/friends irrespective of what turns out to have happened and worse than anything a internet troll has said or done.

 

[Hoosier952]

If the "probably not a rumor" is even true, there are more reasonable explanations for IR to disappear than he had to quickly go hide a body. Maybe he had been drinking and didn't want GGP or others to know. Maybe he is totally freaked out by LE because of something in his past. I honestly have no solid theory as to what happened, but I'm definitely not convinced IR killed or disposed of DeOrr. I hope no one did, but its not really looking that way.

It seems like if the parents knew Deorr was missing and IR was conveniently missing as well, there would have been an attempt in that hour to search for both of them. I would imagine most parents would immediately run to ask everyone there if they'd seen my child and if I couldn't find the adult, I'd be looking for them while looking for my child, hoping the child had followed/found the adult.

Klein also specifically said no one has been ruled out as a suspect/POI, he'd be taking the word of a potential suspect as truth. If I had killed someone and wasn't up for jail time, I think the best course of action would be to point fingers at someone else (with a criminal record, no less), say anything I could to take the heat off myself, and do anything in my power to lead investigators on a wild goose chase.

 

[Mickshawn]

Noah Chamberlin has been found

but dead......http://wreg.com/2016/01/21/search-crews-find-noah-chamberlin/

 

[giagreen]

New article (nothing earth shattering):

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/14-questions-you-wanted-us-to-ask-the-deorr-kunz-private-investigator/



Eaton: Lisa Marie says, “Is it true that Isaac disappeared for over an hour after DeOrr disappeared or is this just another rumor?”

Klein: Again, that goes into the actual investigative issues that we are investigating. We’re not wiling to discuss that at this time but I would classify that probably as not a rumor.


Eaton: Annalee asks, “I would like to know if Great Grandpa or Isaac actually saw DeOrr on Friday or if they just assumed he was there because they had seen him Thursday?

Klein: Again that goes into testimony and I’m not willing to answer but I will say is we have witnesses collaborating that he was on the mountain on that Friday.


Interesting comment about Isaac. Also, he continues to use "on the mountain" instead of saying he was at the campsite.

Ehhhh nothing new except I feel like I can believe now that Jessica did in fact say what I beleived she had said amd that Its probably not a rummor. So....

 

[giagreen]

I don't think Klein is going against the family but I do think IR is being set up, whether as a scape goat or whatever but thats my opinion. He may have seen it coming and thats why he lawyered up, but I think he is being set up to take the blame no matter what. Even if Deorr is still out there somewhere and he had nothing to do with it. How does this make Klein going against the family? To me its making Klein help cover the familys butt by putting blame elsewhere. I will admit I have no clue what happened to Deorr but I do feel Klein is tyring to take the eyes away from the parents, just like I would and have expected.

Well then its up to IR to start talking and save his own butt. As far as I'm concerned he was lawyered up long before Klein came on the case. Imo innocent people don't just sit back and let people slowly make them a killer. Guilty peope tho do seem to wanna hide.

 

[giagreen]

Eaton: Jessica says, “Why haven’t all four lie detector results been revealed?


Klein: That’s really a question that should be directed at law enforcement – both federal and state level. I want to repeat that again – on the federal and state level. We are aware of the polygraph tests and probably it’s in the best interest of everybody that they’re not released right now.

Sounds like two separate tests to me.

Well idk he says "tests" and there are four people who took them. So yes it sounds like more then one was taken.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

So, then Bessie wasn't mistaken. I will concede that -- at least according to Vilt -- DK mentioned black Rubicon. But you've got the stories mixed up.

First story, July
The store clerk allegedly reported that she saw a man in the store with a dirty, crying little boy around 6 pm. She said the man drove a black truck. In the first interview, DK pointed out that he has a black truck, but she could not be referring to him because at the time of the alleged sighting, he was back at the campsite searching for Deorr.

At about 7:00 in the video here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwM1oG3z358

Second story, September
According to Vilt, a different woman (not the store clerk) claimed to see a suspicious looking man that afternoon. She described him as being in his 50's with curly, gray/white hair. When Vilt released that story, he indicated that JM saw a man fitting the same description in the store. According to Vilt, JM said the man was "fixated" on Deorr.

September 18, 2015, KID Radio

[...]

Another tip came in on a national hotline set up by Vilt. A woman in the Idaho Falls area called in to say that she, her husband and four sons were hiking in the Palisades area. She said there was a man in his mid 50s with gray hair staring at her boys. She told Vilt the man followed them to a convenience store. He was driving a black Jeep Rubicon.

Vilt says DeOrr’s parents reported a similar-looking man inside a store in Leadore the day before their son went missing. He says the parents saw vehicle matching that description.
http://590kid.com/2015/09/18/tips-about-missing-toddler-forwarded-to-idaho-fusion-center/

---

In my opinion, the statements below illustrate what Klein referred to as a "farce". In other words, the story was overblown by Vilt. Those who are interpreting Klein's use of the word "farce" as an indication JM fabricated the story are either honestly mistaken, or deliberately grasping at every straw in an effort to vilify JM. JMO


October 31, 2015, Idaho State Journal

[...]

The black Jeep Rubicon
On the morning of the disappearance, Kunz’s parents recall seeing a suspicious man at a convenience store in Leodore. This man, who reportedly drove a newer model black Jeep Rubicon, was described as being in his 50s with long white hair that was curly at the bottom.

“He was fixated on the boy,” Vilt said. “This man made the family nervous.”

A week later, a woman told Vilt she saw a man matching this description at an ice cream store in Swan Valley, approximately 150 miles east of Leodore.

The woman said she was creeped out by this man because he kept eyeing her four children, who range in age between 2 and 9.

Since setting up the national hotline, Vilt has received numerous tips from across the region regarding this mysterious man in the black Rubicon. Some of the leads have turned out to be false, but others appear to be promising. However, Vilt is still waiting for a lead to come in with the Rubicon’s license plate number.

Though Vilt said he isn’t working with Kunz’s family anymore, he still follows up on the leads he receives through the hotline regarding the case.
http://www.idahostatejournal.com/me...cle_10d44717-75dc-5601-aa30-5726228128f8.html

I do owe you an apology, Bessie. Please forgive me.

Maybe Klein was talking about Vilt's story when calling it a farce, but I wasn't trying to vilify JM. It was the way it was written, imo.

 

[giagreen]

I keep going back to the fact that in the parents' first interview, Isaac was not mentioned one time. Listening to their interview, you would have no idea that there even was a fourth adult present. Later, the press referred to him as a "family friend" and it was some time IIRC before his name was even released. If the parents had any inkling that he had done something to DeOrr why didn't they even mention him being there? Why, in their first interview, three days after DeOrr's disappearance, did they insist little DeOrr had been abducted? Why didn't they insist that the sheriff investigate the family friend? I'm just not buying into the idea that Isaac killed DeOrr on his own (in 17 minutes, to boot). It makes no sense.

It might not have been 17 min ..possibly if what Klein says about it not being a rummor that he had disappeared for an hour while they searched for DeOrr till they called 911. Then if he was missing from the time they called 911 till LE showed up then that gives him about two hours. So he just might of had the time.

 

[JVWayne]

New article (nothing earth shattering):

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/0...s-to-ask-the-deorr-kunz-private-investigator/



Eaton: Annalee asks, “I would like to know if Great Grandpa or Isaac actually saw DeOrr on Friday or if they just assumed he was there because they had seen him Thursday?

Klein: Again that goes into testimony and I’m not willing to answer but I will say is we have witnesses collaborating that he was on the mountain on that Friday.


Interesting comment about Isaac. Also, he continues to use "on the mountain" instead of saying he was at the campsite.

It seems to me he is saying exactly and only that they have witness collaborating that he was on the mountain. That implies they don't have a witness (other than the 4) saying he was as the campsite. That doesn't mean he was or wasn't at the campsite. I assume "on the mountain" means he was probably sighted by a witness in Leadore or somewhere between Leadore and the campsite.

 

[scmom]

Hmm, maybe some witnesses are collaborating to say he was on the mountain. For some reason I think Klein meant corroborating though.

 

[Mickshawn]

It seems to me he is saying exactly and only that they have witness collaborating that he was on the mountain. That implies they don't have a witness (other than the 4) saying he was as the campsite. That doesn't mean he was or wasn't at the campsite. I assume "on the mountain" means he was probably sighted by a witness in Leadore or somewhere between Leadore and the campsite.

I wonder if Klein is including the town of Leadore as part of "the mountain"?

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I thought this too. I have been surprised at how open he has been about the direction of the investigation, particularly given what that direction is. It's interesting too that DK's dad (DK Sr. Sr.) has stated that he does not believe Klein's assessment that DeOrr is deceased.

He could be in denial about his grandchild being dead and/or in denial that one or more of those four people could have vanished him as his own son is part of that group. I don't think it is unusual for him to take such a stance.

When LE told the Cummings family they believed HaLeigh to be deceased, the family rejected their assertion because her remains were not recovered. I haven't seen it too often where LE or the investigators told families straight up without a body, but there are obviously times LE/investigators feel they have enough information to make the call.

I am not exactly certain who hired Klein. Did the parents? The grandparents? Other family members? I don't think it has ever been revealed.

 

[iluvmua]

He could be in denial about his grandchild being dead and/or in denial that one or more of those four people could have vanished him as his own son is part of that group. I don't think it is unusual for him to take such a stance.

When LE told the Cummings family they believed HaLeigh to be deceased, the family rejected their assertion because her remains were not recovered. I haven't seen it too often where LE or the investigators told families straight up without a body, but there are obviously times LE/investigators feel they have enough information to make the call.

I am not exactly certain who hired Klein. Did the parents? The grandparents? Other family members? I don't think it has ever been revealed.

I believe it was extended family

 

[renarde]

I wonder if Klein is including the town of Leadore as part of "the mountain"?

It is at least "near" the mountain.

 

[iluvmua]

IF IR is the one who killed/disposed of Deorr than WHY have the parents never said anything????

and how could he pull it off in 17 minutes with no vehicle???

This is why I don't think he killed deorr (possibly helped dispose of the body).

jmo

I also could be totally wrong too.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I keep going back to the fact that in the parents' first interview, Isaac was not mentioned one time. Listening to their interview, you would have no idea that there even was a fourth adult present. Later, the press referred to him as a "family friend" and it was some time IIRC before his name was even released. If the parents had any inkling that he had done something to DeOrr why didn't they even mention him being there? Why, in their first interview, three days after DeOrr's disappearance, did they insist little DeOrr had been abducted? Why didn't they insist that the sheriff investigate the family friend? I'm just not buying into the idea that Isaac killed DeOrr on his own (in 17 minutes, to boot). It makes no sense.

I have to agree. It was as if they were intentionally leaving him out of the story and I have to wonder why now? What reason did they fail to include him as being there? Maybe they were afraid of what he would say to the press if they named him? Maybe they felt like he would be a distraction from finding DeOrr with all the follow up questions? There are many reasons they could have left him out, but if they felt he was responsible...I cannot imagine they would have kept news of him being there quiet. It doesn't make any sense, but nothing about this case has made sense from the beginning...at least to me. I have been waiting a long time so we could discuss the real situation instead of beating around the bush and pretending there was no elephant in the room. Thank you, Mr. Klein.