ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #2

[Trident]

Yes but in order to be carried away, the wild animal has to drag the victim and in our case there is no sign of little Deorr being dragged. I repeat, there is NO signs whatsoever or prints, or blood, or ANYTHING. Again, I would like to know if anyone puts Deorr at the campsite that day, any witnesses?

No, a cougar would NOT have to drag the victim. A small child, as small as DeOrr was said to be, could be picked up and carried with little or no problem, and little or no blood. These cats are sneaky and very strong. They have been predating on people since America was first settled, although once they understood what guns were for and people became aware they were cat food, the attacks almost stopped - probably because there was a bounty on their heads and they were next to wiped out.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

The only "info" I have is from links posted earlier, such as the timeline and the mom's 911 call.
She said they arrived @the campsite at 1pm. And placed call to 911 @approx 2:30.
That's only one and a half hours. Am I wrong in thinking that at first it was posted that they searched for an hour?
Now that we've been corrected on that, it seems to have been a search of about 20 mins.
Also add in the new confirmed info of more than one vehicle @the site.

>Can't remember who just posted, but do we have any proof that the store had cameras? I'd really like to know because that would settle the strange difference in clerk's version of spotting the (her words) "filthy bawling" toddler w/the man in the black truck.<
Still holding out for a live Deorr.
jmho

~ 13:00 arrive @campsite
Leave immediately? to Leadore store ~40 minutes
Shop/pay at store ~5 minutes
Travel back to campsite ~40 minutes
Go explore ~10 minutes?
Search for ~20 minutes (or 1 hour)
Call 911 ~14:30

Is this about right from what we know? Corrections/additions welcome.

 

[slashkiss]

~ 13:00 arrive @campsite
Leave immediately? to Leadore store ~40 minutes
Shop/pay at store ~5 minutes
Travel back to campsite ~40 minutes
Go explore ~10 minutes?
Search for ~20 minutes (or 1 hour)
Call 911 ~14:30

Is this about right from what we know? Corrections/additions welcome.

I always took it that they returned to the campsite from their trip to the store around 1pm and did not leave after that. I am not sure what time they actually arrived at the campsite or perhaps they stopped at the store on their way into camp?

 

[LietKynes]

Would the parents volunteer for polys if they had anything to hide?

And maybe the woman in the store did see a filthy, bawling toddler in a black truck at 6pm. It might not have been DeOrr though. And at 6pm it certainly wasn't dad because LE were there by then.

My dad is in his late 60s and still goes hiking and camping with his friends, and he and my mam took me from being a few months old.

RSBM

Assuming that LE spoke with the store clerk, and that they're satisfied with her account , and that the child WAS DeOrr.
Also , many stores have vid. cams and I'm sure LE has checked them thoroughly.

I feel like I'm assuming an awful lot.
I can't speak for LE's efforts in this case and can only go by what's put out in msm... but surely they've examined every tip or possibility. If they were not sure about the store clerk knowing it was DeOrr in the truck--- wouldn't they say so ? In order to generate more info. ?
:moo:

 

[leilarose68]

No, a cougar would NOT have to drag the victim. A small child, as small as DeOrr was said to be, could be picked up and carried with little or no problem, and little or no blood. These cats are sneaky and very strong. They have been predating on people since America was first settled, although once they understood what guns were for and people became aware they were cat food, the attacks almost stopped - probably because there was a bounty on their heads and they were next to wiped out.

Seems very unlikely the cougar would eat the cowboy boots though. And as I've said, the cowboy boots are oversized and would definitely have fallen off as the cougar carried him.

 

[4senthia]

And in my own opinion that really is a problem.
If you get to campsite @1 and report toddler missing via 911 @2:30, what time did you "go down" to the store? As a family.
10 miles but 40 minute drive each way.
Probably just odd wording from stress.
jmho

 

[SleuthMom]

No, a cougar would NOT have to drag the victim. A small child, as small as DeOrr was said to be, could be picked up and carried with little or no problem, and little or no blood. These cats are sneaky and very strong. They have been predating on people since America was first settled, although once they understood what guns were for and people became aware they were cat food, the attacks almost stopped - probably because there was a bounty on their heads and they were next to wiped out.

Thanks. I will research more about this. Having said that, taking into consideration the large area that has been covered I would believe that at least ONE footprint or clothing item should have been found but we have nothing.

 

[La Louve]

Yes but in order to be carried away, the wild animal has to drag the victim and in our case there is no sign of little Deorr being dragged. I repeat, there is NO signs whatsoever or prints, or blood, or ANYTHING. Again, I would like to know if anyone puts Deorr at the campsite that day, any witnesses?

There is a difference between dragging and carrying.

 

[SleuthMom]

I want an interview with the clerk at the store!!! Can any journalist PLEASE do an interview that can CONFIRM that little Deorr was seen with his dad there? If you know any reporter, PLEASE ask this!

 

[Sillybilly]

GMa and the father of the other children are off-limits.

:tyou:

 

[slashkiss]

And in my own opinion that really is a problem.
If you get to campsite @1 and report toddler missing via 911 @2:30, what time did you "go down" to the store? As a family.
10 miles but 40 minute drive each way.
Probably just odd wording from stress.
jmho

This is my biggest problem with the case ... the timeline. We have so little to go on. Why have the reporters not sorted this out since LE is not addressing it?!

By the little bit of hazy information we have it appears they arrived at the campsite at 1pm and somehow the child is reported missing within an hour and half. The last time I went camping it took me that long just to unpack the truck and set up the campsite!

 

[4senthia]

~ 13:00 arrive @campsite
Leave immediately? to Leadore store ~40 minutes
Shop/pay at store ~5 minutes
Travel back to campsite ~40 minutes
Go explore ~10 minutes?
Search for ~20 minutes (or 1 hour)
Call 911 ~14:30

Is this about right from what we know? Corrections/additions welcome.

As far as I can read counting out some sort of "timewarp".
jmo

 

[Satchie]

there is no sign of little Deorr being dragged. I repeat, there is NO signs whatsoever or prints, or blood, or ANYTHING.

I don't believe that can be stated with such certainty. They were searching an area of several square miles for a little boy, not examining every inch of a backyard size 'crime' scene'. Besides, this is the wilderness, which is a chaotic mess by nature, not a carefully landscaped yard where something can be seen to be out of place.

There are very few people who can do that kind of animal tracking, that's not the kind of skill search and rescue personnel have or are trying to apply. In fact, they were probably disrupting the area by turning over every log, etc.

 

[SleuthMom]

There is a difference between dragging and carrying.

Yes of course. But so far, we have no evidence of Deorr being dragged or carried away by a wild animal. Possible? Yes, anything is possible at this point.

 

[LietKynes]

Deorr's dad said it was definitely not him w/the child any where near the time the clerk said she spotted the black truck/bawling blonde toddler.
This is a transcript from the parents' one video interview:

Reporter: Is there any rumors that you've seen or anything you want to clear up, Jessica?

JM: I just . . . Somebody at the store, um, in Leadore, said, it was one of the ladies that had worked at the store said that they saw, um, a gentleman and a younger blonde boy matching our description of our son, really filthy, buying candy for him and he was just bawling, in a black truck. That is the only . . .

DK: Here's the problem.

JM: . . . other . . .

DK: My pickup truck's black.

JM: [indicating DK] He drives a black truck.

DK: As a family we went down to get some, to get a few things.

Reporter: So it could have been you?

JM: Earlier, it was earlier that day.

DK: It was me, but it, but they claim it was at 6:00 that evening and I, we, we still were with Search and Rescue until, what [turning to JM] a quarter till four?
~~LINK to video~~
http://www.eastidahonews.com/2015/07/uncut-entire-interview-with-parents-of-deorr-kunz/
jmho

SABBM

Thank you, 4senthia ; for the link and clearing that up !
I'm also trying not to read the news channel's facebook comments, since I didn't care for the comments and tone that people have taken about the store clerk--- I'm sure she was trying to be as helpful as possible.

So, LE trusts this lady's (Jessica's) and DeOrr's dad's accounts , then. Since the family's accounts and testimony are "solid" ; we will have to consider other possibilities.

Have they considered bringing in wildlife experts who can track cougars , wolves, or whatever ?
Since LE has ruled out abduction, we know that no one took him.

Just a baffling case.
:moo:

 

[SleuthMom]

I don't believe that can be stated with such certainty. They were searching an area of several square miles for a little boy, not examining every inch of a backyard size 'crime' scene'. Besides, this is the wilderness, which is a chaotic mess by nature, not a carefully landscaped yard where something can be seen to be out of place.

There are very few people who can do that kind of animal tracking, that's not the kind of skill search and rescue personnel have or are trying to apply. In fact, they were probably disrupting the area by turning over every log, etc.

I can only go by the reports so far. The sheriff has stated they have no clue as to what happened to Deorr, I want to believe they did in fact examined thoroughly and even the father stated that he was assured 100% that he is not in the water. We are talking about professionals here so I want to believe they are doing a professional job.

 

[La Louve]

Yes of course. But so far, we have no evidence of Deorr being dragged or carried away by a wild animal. Possible? Yes, anything is possible at this point.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. I stand by my belief that Deorr was taken by a cougar.

 

[SleuthMom]

I stand by my belief that Deorr was taken by a cougar.

Fair enough. At this point, I do not know what to believe anymore.

 

[Trident]

" They have been known to drag entire deer carcasses into trees with them so coyotes can't share their meal. But they kill ONLY to eat (except in very rare cases where they have gone kill crazy and then they must be put down as they become EXTREMELY dangerous to humans) They will most often drag their meal off and usually will try to bury the remains for later or put it in a tree as mentioned.

http://hinessight.blogs.com/hinessight/2006/01/dead_deer_could.html

I've done extensive reading on animals attacks and I believe, contrary to many experts, that cougars take more children and small women than they realize.

MOO

 

[Sillybilly]

I am local to Chelsea Bruck case and I notice in that thread it is rampant with literally 100 different FB people that are friends of family, people who attended party, people that had a link to her somehow, so I will ask...I have found out who the father is of Moms older 2 children and the name of the Ggrandpa that was at the site. I also found out custodial situation. Am I, or am I not, allowed to post that info here?

Thanks for asking jashrema, but the answer is no ... only IF they are named in MSM or by LE, which they have not been.