ID - Doomsday Cult Victims - Joshua Vallow - Tylee Ryan - Tammy Daybell - Charles Vallow - *Arrests* #69
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Personally, I draw a distinction between the conspiracy police discovered by investigating real, tangible evidence, and conspiracy theories invented without any evidence by internet posters.
JMO
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Summary of tweets for Friday, April 14th -
State witness: Zulema Pastenes / part 1
Nate Eaton
@NateNewsNow
·
13m
Madison County Deputy Prosecuting Attorney Spencer Rammell says the next witness is Zulema Pastenes and the prosecution has recently learned of a criminal conviction in Arizona in the 1990s. Zulema is here with an attorney.
Zulema's charge is from 1998 and was for felony drug possession. Thomas argues it's not appropriate for Zulema's attorney to be here as he's not licensed in Idaho. The defense says it will not bring up Zulema's prior charge.
Prosecuting attorney Rachel Smith says Zulema's attorney is here more for aide and counsel. Smith says there is zero evidence that Zulema will take the fifth and her attorney is here "out of an abundance of caution."
Zulema was offered a limited-use immunity agreement signed four years ago with prosecutors.
Boyce says if her attorney is here as personal counsel in regards to matters in Arizona, it should be ok to have Zulema's attorney in the courtroom during her testimony. Her attorney is Garrett Smith, who also represented Melani and Ian Pawlowski.
Court taking a 15 minute break.
Zulema is called to the stand. She is wearing a gray skirt with matching suitcoat and white high heels.
Rachel Smith is questioning. Zumela lives in Gilbert, Arizona. Zulema says she met Lori in early fall 2018 at Melanie Gibb's house. Melanie was having a meeting at her house and she invited Zulema to come and see Lori speak.
Zulema and Melanie met at church and were in the same ward. When Zulema met Lori at Melanie's house, Lori testified that angels had visited her, including the angel Moroni, and she was a personal witness of Jesus Christ.
Zulema says when someone is getting visitations from heavenly beings, it would mean this person has a very high spiritual standing, is very righteous and is spirutualyl above other people.
Zulema says it was significant when Lori said she was a witness of Jesus Christ because it means Lori would have seen Jesus and this would be the highest spiritual experience a person could have. Lori said angels put names in the computer for her to take to the temple.
Zulema says she believed Lori.
Zulema got Lori's phone number and then they took a trip to St. George, Utah for a conference.
Zulema says during the trip to St. George, they sat next to each other in the car and their friendship developed. The conference was for "Preparing a People" -
a conference to teach you how to be better prepared for anything that may happen - disasters, etc. - as well as preparing for the Second Coming of Jesus Christ.
Zulema had met Chad Daybell at a prior conference and she saw him again at the St. George event. Zulema does not think Lori knew Chad before the conference.
Zulema says Lori spent a lot of time at Chad's table during the conference. They were talking with each other and Lori was very flirtatious, giggly and "putting the moves" on him.
Lori said she was going to stay at Chad's table until she sold all of his books for him. She stayed at the table a lot. Zulema says at the end of the conference, they helped Chad pack up his table and he only had one box left of books. They loaded up his car and then Chad left.
Lori drove their car back with Melanie Gibb and Zulema in the back seat. Lori was asking the women to look up scriptures about James the Less. Chad had told Lori in a previous life, they had been married to each other and he had been James the Less. She was his wife Elaina.
Lori had Zulema and Melanie look up scriptures in the Doctrine and Covenants about the 144,000 people who will usher in the return of Jesus. In court, Lori is attentively listening as Zulema testifies.
Smith asks if photos were taken at the conference. Zulema says yes. Smith to admit three exhibits as evidence.
The exhibits are photos - two taken at Preparing a People conferences in St. George and one taken at a conference in Boise.
The first photo shows Zulema with an author, Melanie Gibb, and two other women at the conference.
The next photo shows Chad Daybell with Zulema, Melanie Gibb, Lori and another woman at the conference.
After the St. George conference, Zulema says she saw Lori at a Preparing a People conference in Mesa, Arizona. Chad Daybell was there with his table. Lori had been "ghosting" Zulema so they had not spoken in a while.
Zulema went to chat with Chad and Lori approached "very sweet" and invited her to come to her house for a small gathering after the conference.
Zulema wasn't going to go to Lori's house but Chad said he really wanted her to go because Chad wanted to give Zulema a blessing.
Zulema says a blessing is given by someone who holds the priesthood and they receive inspiration, words of comfort or encouragement and convey those words to the person receiving the blessing.
Zulema ended up going to Lori's house. Some other women were there along with Chad and Alex Cox, Lori's brother.
Everyone was visiting with each other at the house and then Lori, Chad and Zulema went outside to the backyard. Lori was playing basketball and asked Chad to play with her.
Zulema says she felt like a third wheel - Lori was being flirtatious with Chad and it make Zulema uncomfortable. Chad said he was going to go inside with Zulema and Lori said something like, "Why, are you scared of me?" So they stayed outside a little longer.
Chad ended up giving Zulema a blessing. During the blessing, he told her she was a very special person, she was going to do some amazing things in the future and he was grateful to know her. The blessing was full of a lot of praise. Lori was present for the blessing.
After the conference, Melanie continued to see Melanie Gibb at church. Zulema says she used to visit Melanie Gibb a lot and there was a meeting with Chad, Lori and Zulema at Melanie's house. Chad came to record a podcast with Lori and Melanie.
During his visit, Chad said he wanted Zulema to meet him, Lori and Melanie Gibb for lunch at Firebirds in Gilbert. Chad told Zulema he had information to give her about her prior lives and probations.
Chad was trying to give Zulema the information but she says Chad and Lori did not want Melanie to hear what he was going to say. Later Chad called Zulema to tell her about her prior lives.
He said there was a way he rated people on the light and dark scale. He gave Zulema a light rating and said she had other lives on the earth with the times and who she was in prior lives.
Zulema says her thoughts are jumbled and has taken several drinks of water. She has also wiped her eyes with a tissue and is sitting in silence.
Zulema says in a previous probation, she was Lori's daughter and was raped and killed at age 14. Her body had been dismembered by the Lamonites and she was killed at the same time Lori was when Lori was her mother during that life.
Lori later invited Zulema to go to lunch at Firebirds. When they met, Lori made a diagram explaining how many worlds there are, how many probations one person has and how people are either light or dark.
Zulema doesn't recall how Lori explained where she got the information but Zulema assumes it came from Chad because he was one who had given Zulema her light/dark scale rating.
Zulema says her light level was 4.2 - a very high number on the chart. Lori's number was 4.3.
During their lunch, Lori told Zulema that Charles was possessed by a dark spirit named Garrett. She said Charles was acting different, more organized than he was before, he was a completely different person and he looked shorter than he was before.
This conversation at Firebirds took place in February 2019. Zulema kept a receipt from that lunch because that's where Lori drew the diagram. Zulema eventually turned the receipt and it will be admitted into evidence a bit later.
Zulema said while they were at the Preparing a People conference, Lori said that she and Charles were having financial difficulties. Lori said she had been the beneficiary of Joseph Ryan's $60,000 life insurance policy before he died.
Zulema asks to "take a second." She pours herself some water, wipes her nose and eyes with tissues.
Zulema says Lori told her she had slept with Charles twice "not knowing he was possessed." Lori later told Zulema that toward the end of March, Lori wanted a group of women to meet so Lori could show them and teach them some things.
The women met at Zulema's house at the end of March. Nicole, Christina, Serena, Melanie Gibb, Lori and Zulema were there. Lori had a whiteboard and drew the same diagram she had at the restaurant. Lori taught about multiple probations and the light/dark scale.
Lori gave Zulema a sticky note with her prior lives and all the other women received theirs too. Lori told the women they needed to cast out the demon from Charles and said they needed to do a casting on him.
This casting was to get rid of Garrett, the evil spirit that was possessing Charles. Zulema remembers back to the original lunch at Firebirds when Lori told her she and Charles had been arguing.
Lori said she and Charles separated in March and she took away Charles' pickup, keys and all of his stuff.
Zulema said Melanie Gibb and the other ladies in the group knew Lori and Charles were separated. Lori told everyone she had been in Hawaii and not living in the house with Charles.
Zulema said that all the women believed what they were doing had value. Lori was "very convincing and has a charming way of expressing things that are believing." Lori had expressed before that she had been visited by heavenly beings.
"If someone is telling the truth about that, I wouldn't be questioning them. I would believe they are telling the truth because I would never think that someone would lie about something as sacred as that."
Smith asks to admit two photos into evidence that were taken the night of the castings.
Second photo shows Zulema with Melanie Gibb and Serena Sharp standing like warriors with their hands out and their fingers shaped like guns. This was the first time Zulema had ever done a casting.
During the second casting, everyone had a different part. Smith asks Zulema was Alex's part was. She takes a minute to think and then says she believes Alex was a warrior but she doesn't exactly remember who he was. Lori assigned everyone's roles.
After the casting, Lori called Chad and was very confident that it had worked. Lori had told the group they needed to fast like Jesus did and they could not eat until after the casting.
Lori is looking at Zulema as she testifies and doesn't show much emotion. Zulema says if someone is dark/a demon, they are considered dangerous. Alex believed this more than anyone else, Zulema says.
Lori said Ned had been removed but now a more powerful demon had possessed Charle and this time it was a demon "expert" named Hiplos that had done the same things for hundreds of years.
Lori moved to Texas but she asked Zulema and the other women to be on a conference call for another casting so Hiplos could be removed from Charles. Christina, Nicole, Melanie Gibb, Melani Boudreaux, Lori and Zulema participated in this casting.
Zulema says several castings were done on Charles during this time.
Lori said this was a powerful demon and the castings were not working. Lori said Charles moved to Texas because there were doctors to help people who were possessed by demons and they could help keep the bodies alive. Alex was aware of all of this, Zulema says.
Zulema asked Lori why she moved to Texas with Charles after all the problems she had with him. Lori said she needed to go so she could get her finances straight.
Lori always told Zulema she had a connection with the number 711. Lori mentioned it all the time & said she had a spiritual connection with the number. Lori told Zulema it was 711 when Charles died so his death was orchestrated by God and Hiplos had been delivered to her and Alex
Lori told Zulema that on the day Charles died, he came from out of town to pick up JJ for school. While he was putting JJ in the car, Lori took Charles' phone and he came back for it but she would not give it to him. They started arguing about the phone.
Alex was there and got involved in the fight as Alex was trying to protect his sister. Tylee came into the middle of the fight with a baseball bat telling Charles to leave and Charles took the bat away from Tylee.
Charles then hit Alex on the back of the head with the bat. Charles and Alex wrestled and Alex got his gun and he shot Charles, all according to what Lori told Zulema.
Lori told Zulema certain things needed to happen before the Second Coming and she needed to cleanse the earth of evil spirits. She was taking steps to usher in the Second Coming and Charles' death one of those steps.
Lori told Zulema that Chad told her that Lori needed to move to Rexburg, Idaho because it was going to be a refuge as other countries were going to invade the United States. Chad said soldiers and warriors would defend Rexburg and the area had been prepared as a place of safety.
Lunch break until 12:45 p.m.
link: https://twitter.com/NateNewsNow
I forgot to post the pix of Lori on Duncan's post -
and I will continue the summaries tomorrow morning...
State witness: Zulema Pastenes / part 1
Nate Eaton
@NateNewsNow
·
13m
Madison County Deputy Prosecuting Attorney Spencer Rammell says the next witness is Zulema Pastenes and the prosecution has recently learned of a criminal conviction in Arizona in the 1990s. Zulema is here with an attorney.
Zulema's charge is from 1998 and was for felony drug possession. Thomas argues it's not appropriate for Zulema's attorney to be here as he's not licensed in Idaho. The defense says it will not bring up Zulema's prior charge.
Prosecuting attorney Rachel Smith says Zulema's attorney is here more for aide and counsel. Smith says there is zero evidence that Zulema will take the fifth and her attorney is here "out of an abundance of caution."
Zulema was offered a limited-use immunity agreement signed four years ago with prosecutors.
Boyce says if her attorney is here as personal counsel in regards to matters in Arizona, it should be ok to have Zulema's attorney in the courtroom during her testimony. Her attorney is Garrett Smith, who also represented Melani and Ian Pawlowski.
Court taking a 15 minute break.
Zulema is called to the stand. She is wearing a gray skirt with matching suitcoat and white high heels.
Rachel Smith is questioning. Zumela lives in Gilbert, Arizona. Zulema says she met Lori in early fall 2018 at Melanie Gibb's house. Melanie was having a meeting at her house and she invited Zulema to come and see Lori speak.
Zulema and Melanie met at church and were in the same ward. When Zulema met Lori at Melanie's house, Lori testified that angels had visited her, including the angel Moroni, and she was a personal witness of Jesus Christ.
Zulema says when someone is getting visitations from heavenly beings, it would mean this person has a very high spiritual standing, is very righteous and is spirutualyl above other people.
Zulema says it was significant when Lori said she was a witness of Jesus Christ because it means Lori would have seen Jesus and this would be the highest spiritual experience a person could have. Lori said angels put names in the computer for her to take to the temple.
Zulema says she believed Lori.
Zulema got Lori's phone number and then they took a trip to St. George, Utah for a conference.
Zulema says during the trip to St. George, they sat next to each other in the car and their friendship developed. The conference was for "Preparing a People" -
a conference to teach you how to be better prepared for anything that may happen - disasters, etc. - as well as preparing for the Second Coming of Jesus Christ.
Zulema had met Chad Daybell at a prior conference and she saw him again at the St. George event. Zulema does not think Lori knew Chad before the conference.
Zulema says Lori spent a lot of time at Chad's table during the conference. They were talking with each other and Lori was very flirtatious, giggly and "putting the moves" on him.
Lori said she was going to stay at Chad's table until she sold all of his books for him. She stayed at the table a lot. Zulema says at the end of the conference, they helped Chad pack up his table and he only had one box left of books. They loaded up his car and then Chad left.
Lori drove their car back with Melanie Gibb and Zulema in the back seat. Lori was asking the women to look up scriptures about James the Less. Chad had told Lori in a previous life, they had been married to each other and he had been James the Less. She was his wife Elaina.
Lori had Zulema and Melanie look up scriptures in the Doctrine and Covenants about the 144,000 people who will usher in the return of Jesus. In court, Lori is attentively listening as Zulema testifies.
Smith asks if photos were taken at the conference. Zulema says yes. Smith to admit three exhibits as evidence.
The exhibits are photos - two taken at Preparing a People conferences in St. George and one taken at a conference in Boise.
The first photo shows Zulema with an author, Melanie Gibb, and two other women at the conference.
The next photo shows Chad Daybell with Zulema, Melanie Gibb, Lori and another woman at the conference.
After the St. George conference, Zulema says she saw Lori at a Preparing a People conference in Mesa, Arizona. Chad Daybell was there with his table. Lori had been "ghosting" Zulema so they had not spoken in a while.
Zulema went to chat with Chad and Lori approached "very sweet" and invited her to come to her house for a small gathering after the conference.
Zulema wasn't going to go to Lori's house but Chad said he really wanted her to go because Chad wanted to give Zulema a blessing.
Zulema says a blessing is given by someone who holds the priesthood and they receive inspiration, words of comfort or encouragement and convey those words to the person receiving the blessing.
Zulema ended up going to Lori's house. Some other women were there along with Chad and Alex Cox, Lori's brother.
Everyone was visiting with each other at the house and then Lori, Chad and Zulema went outside to the backyard. Lori was playing basketball and asked Chad to play with her.
Zulema says she felt like a third wheel - Lori was being flirtatious with Chad and it make Zulema uncomfortable. Chad said he was going to go inside with Zulema and Lori said something like, "Why, are you scared of me?" So they stayed outside a little longer.
Chad ended up giving Zulema a blessing. During the blessing, he told her she was a very special person, she was going to do some amazing things in the future and he was grateful to know her. The blessing was full of a lot of praise. Lori was present for the blessing.
After the conference, Melanie continued to see Melanie Gibb at church. Zulema says she used to visit Melanie Gibb a lot and there was a meeting with Chad, Lori and Zulema at Melanie's house. Chad came to record a podcast with Lori and Melanie.
During his visit, Chad said he wanted Zulema to meet him, Lori and Melanie Gibb for lunch at Firebirds in Gilbert. Chad told Zulema he had information to give her about her prior lives and probations.
Chad was trying to give Zulema the information but she says Chad and Lori did not want Melanie to hear what he was going to say. Later Chad called Zulema to tell her about her prior lives.
He said there was a way he rated people on the light and dark scale. He gave Zulema a light rating and said she had other lives on the earth with the times and who she was in prior lives.
Zulema says her thoughts are jumbled and has taken several drinks of water. She has also wiped her eyes with a tissue and is sitting in silence.
Zulema says in a previous probation, she was Lori's daughter and was raped and killed at age 14. Her body had been dismembered by the Lamonites and she was killed at the same time Lori was when Lori was her mother during that life.
Lori later invited Zulema to go to lunch at Firebirds. When they met, Lori made a diagram explaining how many worlds there are, how many probations one person has and how people are either light or dark.
Zulema doesn't recall how Lori explained where she got the information but Zulema assumes it came from Chad because he was one who had given Zulema her light/dark scale rating.
Zulema says her light level was 4.2 - a very high number on the chart. Lori's number was 4.3.
During their lunch, Lori told Zulema that Charles was possessed by a dark spirit named Garrett. She said Charles was acting different, more organized than he was before, he was a completely different person and he looked shorter than he was before.
This conversation at Firebirds took place in February 2019. Zulema kept a receipt from that lunch because that's where Lori drew the diagram. Zulema eventually turned the receipt and it will be admitted into evidence a bit later.
Zulema said while they were at the Preparing a People conference, Lori said that she and Charles were having financial difficulties. Lori said she had been the beneficiary of Joseph Ryan's $60,000 life insurance policy before he died.
Zulema asks to "take a second." She pours herself some water, wipes her nose and eyes with tissues.
Zulema says Lori told her she had slept with Charles twice "not knowing he was possessed." Lori later told Zulema that toward the end of March, Lori wanted a group of women to meet so Lori could show them and teach them some things.
The women met at Zulema's house at the end of March. Nicole, Christina, Serena, Melanie Gibb, Lori and Zulema were there. Lori had a whiteboard and drew the same diagram she had at the restaurant. Lori taught about multiple probations and the light/dark scale.
Lori gave Zulema a sticky note with her prior lives and all the other women received theirs too. Lori told the women they needed to cast out the demon from Charles and said they needed to do a casting on him.
This casting was to get rid of Garrett, the evil spirit that was possessing Charles. Zulema remembers back to the original lunch at Firebirds when Lori told her she and Charles had been arguing.
Lori said she and Charles separated in March and she took away Charles' pickup, keys and all of his stuff.
Zulema said Melanie Gibb and the other ladies in the group knew Lori and Charles were separated. Lori told everyone she had been in Hawaii and not living in the house with Charles.
Zulema said that all the women believed what they were doing had value. Lori was "very convincing and has a charming way of expressing things that are believing." Lori had expressed before that she had been visited by heavenly beings.
"If someone is telling the truth about that, I wouldn't be questioning them. I would believe they are telling the truth because I would never think that someone would lie about something as sacred as that."
Smith asks to admit two photos into evidence that were taken the night of the castings.
Second photo shows Zulema with Melanie Gibb and Serena Sharp standing like warriors with their hands out and their fingers shaped like guns. This was the first time Zulema had ever done a casting.
During the second casting, everyone had a different part. Smith asks Zulema was Alex's part was. She takes a minute to think and then says she believes Alex was a warrior but she doesn't exactly remember who he was. Lori assigned everyone's roles.
After the casting, Lori called Chad and was very confident that it had worked. Lori had told the group they needed to fast like Jesus did and they could not eat until after the casting.
Lori is looking at Zulema as she testifies and doesn't show much emotion. Zulema says if someone is dark/a demon, they are considered dangerous. Alex believed this more than anyone else, Zulema says.
Lori said Ned had been removed but now a more powerful demon had possessed Charle and this time it was a demon "expert" named Hiplos that had done the same things for hundreds of years.
Lori moved to Texas but she asked Zulema and the other women to be on a conference call for another casting so Hiplos could be removed from Charles. Christina, Nicole, Melanie Gibb, Melani Boudreaux, Lori and Zulema participated in this casting.
Zulema says several castings were done on Charles during this time.
Lori said this was a powerful demon and the castings were not working. Lori said Charles moved to Texas because there were doctors to help people who were possessed by demons and they could help keep the bodies alive. Alex was aware of all of this, Zulema says.
Zulema asked Lori why she moved to Texas with Charles after all the problems she had with him. Lori said she needed to go so she could get her finances straight.
Lori always told Zulema she had a connection with the number 711. Lori mentioned it all the time & said she had a spiritual connection with the number. Lori told Zulema it was 711 when Charles died so his death was orchestrated by God and Hiplos had been delivered to her and Alex
Lori told Zulema that on the day Charles died, he came from out of town to pick up JJ for school. While he was putting JJ in the car, Lori took Charles' phone and he came back for it but she would not give it to him. They started arguing about the phone.
Alex was there and got involved in the fight as Alex was trying to protect his sister. Tylee came into the middle of the fight with a baseball bat telling Charles to leave and Charles took the bat away from Tylee.
Charles then hit Alex on the back of the head with the bat. Charles and Alex wrestled and Alex got his gun and he shot Charles, all according to what Lori told Zulema.
Lori told Zulema certain things needed to happen before the Second Coming and she needed to cleanse the earth of evil spirits. She was taking steps to usher in the Second Coming and Charles' death one of those steps.
Lori told Zulema that Chad told her that Lori needed to move to Rexburg, Idaho because it was going to be a refuge as other countries were going to invade the United States. Chad said soldiers and warriors would defend Rexburg and the area had been prepared as a place of safety.
Lunch break until 12:45 p.m.
link: https://twitter.com/NateNewsNow
I forgot to post the pix of Lori on Duncan's post -
and I will continue the summaries tomorrow morning...
I suggest you read up about cults. Nxivm is a recent one, it involved hollywood types and multi-multi- millionaires. There is Scientology, then the legendary Jim Jones. Also recent films/books about extremists in LDS.
JMO
ETA: recent comment on this case by the best known expert about cults
Expert: Doomsday cult leveraged control over Lori Vallow
The case gained attention for the couple’s doomsday beliefs and strange worldview that detectives think may have influenced Vallow and Daybell.
www.newsnationnow.com
Such a cult exploits a person's religiousness.
"They use doomsday predictions to essentially leverage control to make the people that are following them feel that it is urgent, and the only place of safety is with them,” Ross said. “And they become more dependent upon the leader to make value judgments for them to make choices for them.”
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Gut_feeling
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Gut_feeling
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@Niner , thank you so much for this summary. Reading this in it's entirety I am just shaking my head. I know I have probably used the term "mind blown" too many times, but I just can't think of any other way to describe it. Disgusted, mind blown, incredulous. How? How can people fall for this?!?
Gut_feeling
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"Two new exhibits about to be entered. Photo of Zulema with Melanie Gibb and Sarena Sharpe. Another photo of the three women standing back to back holding their fingers out like guns."
Like "Chad's Angels". I wonder if Chad told Lori she was Farrah Fawcett in one of her many past lives.
Like "Chad's Angels". I wonder if Chad told Lori she was Farrah Fawcett in one of her many past lives.
You have tons of reading and videos to do.
Gut_feeling
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In my opinion, the fact that it is not being televised is clearly serving it's purpose in terms of going under the radar. There is no VALID reason for this case not to be televised. Extremist Mormons got together, created their own cult, and murdered 4 people, including 2 children. And it's not televised.
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