IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #169

[Prime8]

I think that is the strangest thing the way they parrot MS. Usually the media is so competitive; always wanting the scoop. I can't remember ever seeing them getting their news from a podcast.

That's not really been the vibe with local media and MS. I've listened to a lot of MS and interviews with local reporters. It sounds to me that they are pretty cooperative with each other.

Also, MS was integral in notifying law enforcement about the leaked CS pictures, so they are part of the story and have inside knowledge of what went down.

 

[twall]

LORT, just listening to the podcast with Mitch, the leak, Westerman. This guy must have been near soiling himself with excitement to be on a podcast talking about his association with Baldwin and "the team".

Loves to talk, loves to hear himself talk, thinks quite highly of himself even though he never passed the bar and is not able to practice as an attorney.

What I don't understand is how Baldwin could imagine him to be trustworthy. Why on earth would he let THIS GUY onto his "team" and further, let this yaywho run his law office??

ugggh, this podcast is so much longer and I can't stand hearing him just continue to go on and on and on about the chapter method. Seeds of thought. It's so obnoxious. I am trying to get through it but good gravy Baldwin is a horrible judge of character. Mitch is insufferable.

My thoughts also. I was interested in the beginning because I wanted to know his background and how he was affiliated with AB and the law office but tuned out about halfway through it.

 

[MistyWaters]

The October leak they seem to take responsibility for. The August leak isn't totally clear, but certainly looks possible. @MistyWaters post #819 discusses it:

IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #168

I don't recall any apology from him being reported anywhere. But he is after all, according to his lawyer's letter, a victim in all this...betrayed, abused and snookered...that I've read. What is the timeline of the breach? When did the Trusted Friend snap the photos, when were they passed...

www.websleuths.com

JMO

I don’t know who reported that prior leak of a discovery listing to a Delphi guy. You’re right, it was not crime scene photos, thanks for clarifying that. Other than MS suggesting the connection of this prior leak to the FB messages, I don’t recall them claiming to have reported it. What they did say was the leakers of this recent leak seemed to be making an attempt to have it seem the recent leak originated from the earlier leak.

MS however did say on a recent podcast they had noticed a pic of a tree awhile back with what was supposed to represent an Odisism F floating throughout the internet but didn’t report it as it didn’t appear authentic.

 

[MistyWaters]

He loves to tell a story.

If that interview with MS was transcribed I bet it‘d be at least 136 pages lol!

 

[twall]

October 5th, thank you, yes. Important date reference - we know D and P ... alerted of Leak; parties must advise Court immediately, IMO.

October 5 - one week before October 12th.
- two weeks before October 19.

So, 2 weeks ... and ... done.

mini-timeline observation:
A one-week LE investigation results in sufficient evidence to take an entire defense team down in advance of a ... likely franks hearing.

JMHO

The tree photo hit social media 10/4 because I recall I was waiting at Kroger pharmacy drive thru that evening and it was taking forever so I picked up my phone, opened an app and saw it. Went back to my bank records to confirm date. My first thought was WTH, second thought was has to be fake. Turns out it wasn't!

 

[girlhasnoname]

“Not completely true, are not supported by evidence”

Sounds like it fits the description of a fairy tale!

Wonder how the Judge felt about that and is it possible the meeting in her chambers did not solely pertain to possible sanctions relating only to the leak?

BBM

(amending to correct the link)

Defense motion alleges Delphi investigator misconduct

DELPHI, Ind. — A motion filed by attorneys representing accused Delphi killer Richard Allen claims investigators misled the court about the interpretation of its interview with an expert from…

fox59.com

“The memorandum is colorful, dramatic and highly unprofessional, it is not completely true,” wrote the prosecutor, and that the allegations, “are not supported by evidence…Sheriff Tony Liggett did not intentionally or recklessly omit evidence or lie about evidence in the probable cause affidavit to support the search warrant

Yes, and the Prosecution had witnesses there to testify at the hearing that 'wasn't" due to unforeseen circumstances.I think they would have shot down quite a bit of the Defense's interpretation of Discovery.

Oh, and someone associated with the Defense Office leaking highly exploitive, graphic crime scene photos of DEAD young girls. That's illegal besides being highly immoral by they way.

moo

 

[girlhasnoname]

Hi,
My question is … I can understand why Baldwin left (cos the leak from his office of the photos)…but why Rozzi too?

I think we'll hear more about that eventually, at least I hope so.

JMO

 

[MistyWaters]

Yes, and the Prosecution had witnesses there to testify at the hearing that 'wasn't" due to unforeseen circumstances.I think they would have shot down quite a bit of the Defense's interpretation of Discovery.

Oh, and someone associated with the Defense Office leaking highly exploitive, graphic crime scene photos of DEAD young girls. That's illegal besides being highly immoral by they way.

moo

Yes, good point, everyone wondered why Liggett and Carroll County LE were present in the courtroom. Wouldn’t that be a 360 turn of events, lies told by the ex-D alleging the Sheriff lied. Then the leak, no wonder the Judge looked highly peeved.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

MW > R > Mark > MS

And several other in between.

 

[Bergmann]

So how about this theory! The D had good reason to doubt a Frank’s Hearing was going to occur so all hopes of the SW being tossed were dashed. That the SW was squashed was critical to the defense of RA since evidence collected during the search was extremely damaging. Not wanting to defend a losing case, the D took the first opportunity to exit.

Good theory.

Can also be played the other way too.

J Gull has to demonstrate that the D didn’t meet the standard for a Franks hearing to refuse it. Let’s say it does (IMO it does, also the supplementary motion does a better job of pleading this to the court).

The evidence collected from the SW can be interpreted as circumstantial and inconsistent (blue coat/black jacket/ tan coat etc) and the gun, pffft junk science with the right expert etc.

But getting it potentially tossed (very low probability IMO - easier to prove error than actual intentional deception by LE) plays better for D at low risk (ie fine see you in court and I’ll go for reasonable doubt to which there is scope).

For P it is a disaster (but don’t worry it won’t happen - cannot see J Gull finding for the D in any significant way). If it did get tossed then as it stands they would be clinging very tightly to those alleged confessions rather than their original case.

The exit of AB and BR is all about the leak IMO. The states case is pretty weak IMO without additional evidence.

Maybe that’s going to come from google location from one of RAs phones which were recovered from the SW and maybe that’s why it’s so important to the P…?

 

[FrostedGlass]

NMcL's response to the ex-D's Motion for cameras in the courtroom.

Broadcasting Response Filed.pdf | PDF Host

PDF Host read free online - Broadcasting Response Filed.pdf

pdfhost.io

 

[girlhasnoname]

If that interview with MS was transcribed I bet it‘d be at least 136 pages lol!

500+

 

[Dhighsmith]

This is strictly JMO, but in the new MS episode with MW, I feel like we might be getting a hint at a possible motivation for the leak, although MW might not have known that at the time of the interview (March). Beginning around mm 00:58:00 and up to nearly the end, he delves into the importance of defense attorneys in keeping LE and prosecutors in check. He talks quite a bit about LE, specifically, not doing things correctly, construing things the way they want, and how much power they and the prosecutors have in small towns. IDK...he even says he and his "friends" talk a lot about it.

Just looking at the timing of the leak around the Franks hearing, it makes sense to me that he was likely supporting the D (in regards to the Franks issues), and when he had the opportunity, he shared photos and strategies with another trusted friend (R), most likely because they shared an interest in the case (or he knew R had an interest), but maybe even more so because of a shared distrust of some of LE or the prosecutor involved with Delphi. JMO. Of course it's unethical, on every level, but I'm seeing a potential "why" in there...

JMO, but I don't think it was MW's intention to spread the leak far and wide (it was still wrong, obviously).

MOO is that a private FB discussion group is responsible for influencing the sharing of images.

 

[Bergmann]

I’d put MS very close to fulfilling a role such as that but now in the era of podcasters.

I’d take a single Barbara McDonald over a hundred MS.

 

[MistyWaters]

Question to anyone who knows - what’s the special significance of the letter “F” to Odinism beliefs?

If it’s supposed to serve as important proof of who committed the crime, why does the memo not explain WHY that is?

“The “F” symbol, the defense attorneys contend, is associated with Odinism beliefs.”

Attorneys for Richard Allen want client moved, lay out alternative theory of ‘ritualistic’ murder

DELPHI, Ind. – A ritualistic killing involving cultists. A conspiracy among prison guards. Investigators fixated on a single suspect. Those are among the stunning allegations made in court document…

fox59.com

 

[MistyWaters]

MOO is that a private FB discussion group is responsible for influencing the sharing of images.

Tis the season to blame?

 

[MistyWaters]

I’d take a single Barbara McDonald over a hundred MS.

Am I remembering correctly that she tweeted a pic of the F tree?

Edit X’d or whatever. I’m not a member so I’m unable to search.

 

[MistyWaters]

NMcL's response to the ex-D's Motion for cameras in the courtroom.

Broadcasting Response Filed.pdf | PDF Host

PDF Host read free online - Broadcasting Response Filed.pdf

pdfhost.io

Reading this, if not for the ex-D walking, IMO for me it really does fit that the judge was planning to allow a pre-hearing (is that a word?) prior to announcing her decision to (not) hold a Frank’s Hearing. I don’t think “the State, the investigators and other State actors” would want these attacks to remain unrefuted and I don’t think the judge would be impressed by this type of grandstanding by the D either. JMO

 

[zh0r4]

Yes, and the Prosecution had witnesses there to testify at the hearing that 'wasn't" due to unforeseen circumstances.I think they would have shot down quite a bit of the Defense's interpretation of Discovery.

Oh, and someone associated with the Defense Office leaking highly exploitive, graphic crime scene photos of DEAD young girls. That's illegal besides being highly immoral by they way.

moo

Is it true that generally the judge would have alerted the defense of witnesses being brought to the hearing so they could prepare? IANAL so I’m unsure if that is the norm or not?

 

[zh0r4]

NMcL's response to the ex-D's Motion for cameras in the courtroom.

Broadcasting Response Filed.pdf | PDF Host

PDF Host read free online - Broadcasting Response Filed.pdf

pdfhost.io

A closed court room wouldn’t stop anyone from trying to present deep fakes anymore than an open courtroom. An open courtroom would allow for more technological scrutiny of both the D and P, which isn’t a bad thing for anyone IMO.

Regardless, every deep fake has code markers that anyone with a PC can find. One of the pros of video being digital now is that you can inspect the element, and if it has EfficientNetB4 + EfficientfacemapNetingB4ST + B4Att + B4AttST it's a telltale the video is a deep fake.

I hope both D and P would know this and check before they presented anything in court. JMO