Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, and Liberty (Libby) German, 14/The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #85

[Betty P]

Thank you so much for this sleuther. I even checked before I posted about GEDmatch and still didn't see Indiana was now one of the states using it. I'm unfamiliar with the April Tinsley case so that's probably how I missed this.

Golden State Killer DNA technology has been used in Indiana to provide the missing pieces that led police to arrest a man for the murder of April Tinsley. Two samples, each more than 30 years old, provided investigators with the name of a likely suspect.

How controversial DNA technology helped solve the April Tinsley cold case

What saddens me now is that it hasn’t helped establish who BG is. IIRC the lab was able to identify the Golden State Killer suspect in one or two days.

This is JMO, but I think there's a learning curve or something similar when it comes to using these new tools to solve crimes. This isn't the only high profile criminal case where LE and prosecutors have DNA from the perp, but haven't used it to track them down. Hopefully, once these experts learn more about the science of DNA evidence and how it applies to family trees, they'll become more comfortable in using it. Perhaps it has to do with the comfort level of prosecutors in knowing how to present this type of evidence to juries to secure convictions. IDK.

ETA: Maybe that's a good suggestion for one of Tricia's podcasts - reach out to some DNA experts and prosecutors to have them discuss the future of this technology in law enforcement and criminal justice.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Oh, I hope you won't take my response as criticism. I am happy to see the girls' thread open again and see new/different members posting, so I just wanted to try to keep it on track.

Like most everyone following this case I can't fathom that the two year anniversary is approaching and this guy hasn't been caught. IMO I kind of doubt LE will release more audio, but do hope something is coming that will help break this case open.

kizzykat, I definitely wasn't taking your response as criticism. I'm actually quite embarrassed to have made such an idiotic mistake.

Did you see my post at the top of this page? I feel terribly disheartened now. I was really hoping that GEDmatch would solve this but it doesn't look this will happen now. It's terrifying knowing that this monster is still out there.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I am not convinced that LE has the killer's DNA. To my knowledge they have never actually come out and said that they do. LE has talked about "having" DNA and "sorting out" DNA(I'm guessing separating the girls, family members, friends, etc) but have never really confirmed they have the killer's. They have talked all around the subject but really said virtually nothing. I don't think they want the killer to know whether they have it or not.
I hope I'm wrong and they do have some.

 

[sleuther0192837465]

I am not convinced that LE has the killer's DNA. To my knowledge they have never actually come out and said that they do. LE has talked about "having" DNA and "sorting out" DNA(I'm guessing separating the girls, family members, friends, etc) but have never really confirmed they have the killer's. They have talked all around the subject but really said virtually nothing. I don't think they want the killer to know whether they have it or not.
I hope I'm wrong and they do have some.

I agree. I have not seen LE or anyone, including the families say specifically, “We have the supsect’s DNA.” I’ve searched everywhere, trying to find a statement worded in that manner & have not found it.
IMO

 

[sleuther0192837465]

Found one just now! Posted by "DB Cooper" today on WTHR's FB page. You should be able to find by searching WTHR in FB. Their profile pic is a big "13" which is their local channel number. Anyway, 52 mins (it's currently 2:10pm) they've made a post about "SWAT officers are in a standoff..." and if you click in the comments you should see the BG side by side. You may have to scroll and/or load previous comments but you should find it!

Edit: I just looked again to read the 7 comments under it and it appears to be gone already.

2nd Edit: Search for "D B Cooper" no dots, maybe you'll find the guy. His profile is a pic of DB Cooper side by side but his whatever you call it top main picture thing is BG and the side by side of the Frankfort IN guy.

3rd Edit: Quitting after this but it's also posted on WTHR post about "CNN is suing Donald Trump..." DB Cooper posted a diff side by side with like 4 pics 4 hrs ago. 785 comments, I had to really scroll. Otherwise suggest randomly clicking in WTHR posts, you'll find it eventually.

4th: Last Edit, really! But it's back in the orig post about SWAT that I mentioned above and I also saw it in a post about "This Is Us". I really think you can find it by clicking a few posts on WTHR.

Wish I could see this. I don’t have FB MOO
Edited: removed first quote

 

[Me123]

Can you visit the page of the news fb acc through a browser and not the app to see this stuff?

Wish I could see this. I don’t have FB MOO
Edited: removed first quote

 

[sleuther0192837465]

Can you visit the page of the news fb acc through a browser and not the app to see this stuff?

Not sure, but I can try thanks
ETA: Nope, I can not view any comments on any of the news reports from FB, even through my browser.

 

[gregjrichards]

Would it be possible for BG to put zip tie or even rope restraints on the girls whilst wearing gloves? I just get the sense that he may have restrained them in some way eventually because they would have fought like hell to get him away. I am hoping they could have got DNA from them at least.

 

[Whiskers16]

Reminder: if you can't link a fact/document/picture, you can't discuss it.

 

[kc1023]

You know how many people say they should release more evidence in this case? Don't hold your breath I guess... they've just released a picture of a knife blade used in a well-known area murder of 4 teens abducted from a Burger Chef in Speedway, Indiana 40 years ago. Forty. Years. Ago.

Police release evidence in Burger Chef cold case murders

Guessing that would have been a lot more useful a few decades ago but here's hoping.

 

[heartgoesout]

The person LE needs to speak up and trust them is not going to. Period.

So either release more info that could potentially prompt the light bulb for someone else or the case goes cold. The sketch is mute at this point. And I really question the validity of it anyway. So very sad for these girls.

 

[MariageFreres]

Hello Sleuthers. I don't have anything new to add to this thread but I think so much about Libby and Abby and hope every day for an arrest. Everybody in "real life" thinks my interest in true crime is weird and morbid so here I am.

I strongly believe there will be justice thanks to those brave, quick-thinking girls. We just need the right person to come forward.

 

[heartgoesout]

Welcome MariageFreres!
I'm afraid the right person is not going to come forward. LE needs another angle or the DA needs to make a move.

 

[JudgeJudi]

I strongly believe there will be justice thanks to those brave, quick-thinking girls. We just need the right person to come forward.

I wish I shared your confidence. It may eventually be solved but I suspect it will remain cold for a very long time. Meanwhile this coldblooded, coldhearted killer remains at large. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he's done this before and may well do it again.

RIP Abby and Libby

 

[TTF14]

Hello Sleuthers. I don't have anything new to add to this thread but I think so much about Libby and Abby and hope every day for an arrest. Everybody in "real life" thinks my interest in true crime is weird and morbid so here I am.

I strongly believe there will be justice thanks to those brave, quick-thinking girls. We just need the right person to come forward.

If there is actually DNA, I agree. I think it will be solved eventually with familial DNA.

If not.....I think we're going to be waiting for a long, long, long time .

 

[heartgoesout]

So at this point, how long do they continue to wait until they release more info? A profile would be nice. Cause of death. Time of death. More of the voice. A theory.
I mean anything at this point!
If they don't have their guy anything could trigger someone's memory or suspicions.
If they do know their guy then the DA needs to make the move before he kills again. Circumstantial evidence does win convictions.
If they have exhausted all their leads the case is cold.
If they have nothing at this point for an arrest the case if cold.
Are we waiting for a miracle to happen 20 years from now?
Sorry to sound so frustrated, but I am.

 

[bradfordsleuth]

Sorry...a bit of a story here but it may apply to what could have happened to Abby & Libby...
Something just occurred to me as I was reminded of an incident in my past that happened when I was around 12.

I was walking to school along a sidewalk in Toronto (Willowdale area at the time) and I was with 2 friends when a man walked by us with his penis exposed. It took me a good 45 - 90 seconds for me to actually mention to my friends what only I had seen.
He was a block away by the time I spoke about it.

Maybe BG had exposed himself to them on the path prior to the bridge?
Perhaps this scenario has been mentioned before...but I was strongly reminded of it tonight....and came here to get it off my mind.

Sorry if too off topic. Mods please delete if I have messed up by posting this.

 

[sleuther0192837465]

Sorry...a bit of a story here but it may apply to what could have happened to Abby & Libby...
Something just occurred to me as I was reminded of an incident in my past that happened when I was around 12.

I was walking to school along a sidewalk in Toronto (Willowdale area at the time) and I was with 2 friends when a man walked by us with his penis exposed. It took me a good 45 - 90 seconds for me to actually mention to my friends what only I had seen.
He was a block away by the time I spoke about it.

Maybe BG had exposed himself to them on the path prior to the bridge?
Perhaps this scenario has been mentioned before...but I was strongly reminded of it tonight....and came here to get it off my mind.

Sorry if too off topic. Mods please delete if I have messed up by posting this.

I’m so sorry that happened to you! How scary!
Back when the pic & audio was first released, I had thought the same thing....that maybe BG had flashed the girls on the trails prior to him approaching them on the bridge. MOO

 

[TTF14]

Sorry...a bit of a story here but it may apply to what could have happened to Abby & Libby...
Something just occurred to me as I was reminded of an incident in my past that happened when I was around 12.

I was walking to school along a sidewalk in Toronto (Willowdale area at the time) and I was with 2 friends when a man walked by us with his penis exposed. It took me a good 45 - 90 seconds for me to actually mention to my friends what only I had seen.
He was a block away by the time I spoke about it.

Maybe BG had exposed himself to them on the path prior to the bridge?
Perhaps this scenario has been mentioned before...but I was strongly reminded of it tonight....and came here to get it off my mind.

Sorry if too off topic. Mods please delete if I have messed up by posting this.

This was discussed at length, and I think it's a very good theory. This happened to me as a teen as well.

IIRC, there was even a lot of talk on this thread about whether or not his penis is actually sticking out in the pic.

 

[rainwaterstill]

'Abby's Angels' resume care package tradition in Delphi from the WTHR website.

An article on what Delphi middle school students are doing to honor Abby. The article also has the tipline number.