IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #26

[GGE]

I assumed it was a reference to the cellphone artifact of Libby's. Watching/listening to something like that has got to shake even veteran police to the core.

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I, too, have always taken the discussion of this case having a "twist" to be a clear reference to the one thing that makes this case so very different from others - a victim videotaped her suspected murderer.

I mean, if there's ANOTHER twist, that's going to be absolutely gobsmackingly earth shattering, IMO, given the one massive twist we already have going on. JMO.

 

[Hazelnutty]

So early in the morning to be out of new pages to read on Abby & Libby threads. Does this mean that members are giving up? Oh, My, I surely hope not. I believe it's vital to remain in a positive mindframe even tho we may be frustrated over the fact that the murderer hasn't been been captured yet. It's hard to be positive about anything when thinking of the two precious girls whose lives were taken by this evil person (s). Don't give up hope. Please don't be negative. If I lived closer I would be baking cakes and making trays of sandwiches and snacks for the very hardworking LE and volunteers in Delphi. May God bless these good people in their vital work, in their "down" time. And in their own homelives . I cannot imagine what these good people have gone thru and how much of their physical, mental, emotional, and psychological strengths they are pouring into this case. God loves them and their work. Let us be patient and kind with one another whole we work together to assist /sleuth what we are allowed to and put this evil person away.

 

[ninij9]

Because I think we could all use a drink, I'll ask, who is "BG"?

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Good morning guys.
I'm not caught up yet.
Skipping posts like a pebble on a pond,
But hey, next time you all start drinking, WAKE me up. Pretty please.

When I catch up I have some thoughts on the arrest(with TOS), media silence, etc.

Just don't wanna repeat if it's been said..

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[kellala]

I just want to thank you whoever posted the link about the oba chandler story yesterday. What an amazing story. It took that long for somebody having a hunch to step forward to contact police. And as much as how eager LE wanted to solve this case, human error is common. Tips being neglect, potential evidences being misplaced... but the persistence, never giving up kept the case going and mistakes were corrected. For a experienced criminal, the repeatedly crimes made Oba eventually paid the price. Never give up hope! Thanks again for posting the story. Side note, my hubby is always cautious about asking strangers directions when lost. I always laughed at him. But after reading this story, I will be more cautious next time.


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[KenzieK]

A side (emotional) note here:
I have been busy at a beautiful Naples wedding on a golf course among the nicest people and a beautiful bride. It couldn't have been anymore perfect, right? That's if anyone knows Naples it's ideal.

During the father daughter dance, I actually started crying and I'm not one to do that easy. It really hit home how real this is and those poor children, girls won't have that.

Then I thought omg those families, no matter how overwhelming that feeling was for me it's nothing compared to their hell.

Dear Lord

Thank you for sharing this! Like you, I keep being reminded of these girls in every day situations, and especially the emotional moments in life. I attended a funeral yesterday, and it made me think of Abby and Libby and the grief of their families.

I cannot pinpoint exactly what it is about this case that has had such a profound effect on so many people, but I can honestly say that it has changed me, and how I view the world, how I relate to people, and how I intend to live my life. As horrible as this crime was there also is a silver lining. The pain of the families will always be excruciating, but I hope that they can find some comfort in knowing that their loved ones left this world a better place.

 

[sf92]

To mirror another comment it could be possible also they asked him if he had guns to clear him, he showed hunting stuff not realizing he was in violation. I've had buddies with similar drunk driving violations ask to borrow a shotgun during deer season. Or maybe targets out back. Even though people get in trouble they still feel it's their god given right to their arms and don't give them up very freely, especially in Indiana. But, not sure if drunk driving is even something that would warrant guns being taken away, or limited, whatever. I'm not educated enough to know the law.

Not all probation cases limit access to firearms. But when they involve felonies it is an automatic NO! even if there is a condition that it be reduced to a misdemeanor after the fact. I know of one person who was still allowed their 2A rights while under court supervision for theft. But if you are under it for a felony or domestic violence case that would automatically declare you a prohibited possessor under law. Same with a drug or alcohol abuser. Which with a DUI/OWI case would be that, even if it was reduced to a misdemeanor before conviction.

The fact that RL waived his 4th Amendment right is telling that he was under strict court supervision (alcohol, guns, certain weapons, etc). And an interesting note: At least in Indiana a crossbow is considered a firearm in this instance because it is operated by pulling a trigger.

 

[mollymae]

So early in the morning to be out of new pages to read on Abby & Libby threads. Does this mean that members are giving up? Oh, My, I surely hope not. I believe it's vital to remain in a positive mindframe even tho we may be frustrated over the fact that the murderer hasn't been been captured yet. It's hard to be positive about anything when thinking of the two precious girls whose lives were taken by this evil person (s). Don't give up hope. Please don't be negative. If I lived closer I would be baking cakes and making trays of sandwiches and snacks for the very hardworking LE and volunteers in Delphi. May God bless these good people in their vital work, in their "down" time. And in their own homelives . I cannot imagine what these good people have gone thru and how much of their physical, mental, emotional, and psychological strengths they are pouring into this case. God loves them and their work. Let us be patient and kind with one another whole we work together to assist /sleuth what we are allowed to and put this evil person away.

My brain won't let me give up on this. Liberty was brave enough to take that video in the hopes the perp(s) would be caught. She will be the prosecutor, not the victim. I want to make sure of it.

 

[KyMom]

My brain won't let me give up on this. Liberty was brave enough to take that video in the hopes the perp(s) would be caught. She will be the prosecutor, not the victim. I want to make sure of it.

Well said and same here!

 

[CrimeDawg123]

I obviously can't say 100% that it wasn't RL, but I have known him for many years, and even though at his age he is very mobile and in excellent health, there is no doubt in my mind he is innocent of any involvement with the murders. Yes he likes to have some beers, and maybe made a few bad decisions, he is a good man. I hope his name will be cleared very soon. First post by the way. I couldn't stand seeing the suspicion being unaddressed by anyone who might know him.

Thank you so much for this post. IMO RL is completely innocent. By all accounts, he has a solid alibi. Not only that, he does seem to me to be genuinely distraught over the victims being found on his property. Add to that losing his son. IMO he is a very sad man who has lost a bunch - his son, the tranquility of his land, his peace of mind. I feel very sorry for him and send my prayers to him. IMO he is another victim of this evil perp.

 

[sf92]

It also could be something like LE found firearms owned by RL , which would violate parole. I would be more surprised if he didn't have guns, hunting is part of Indiana life for many. Gun ownership is common.

Also, the lovely lady here and her husband that filmed the area saw a deer stand , I think it was on Logan's property.

Just to add a bit of info that may not have been figured into this part of it. He (RL) owns quite a bit of land. It is not uncommon,especially in Indiana, for those who do to rent or lease out the property for hunters, especially those who do not have ready access to it. So this deer stand may belong to someone else.

 

[mollymae]

SBM - I absolutely 100% am convinced there's something in his jacket personally because of the way the jacket is pulled downward from his shoulders, causing a vertical wrinkling in his coat from the shoulder all the way down to the pocket. If it was just a fat belly takig up all that space, the wrinkles would be horizontal across his belly from side to side, but they're not. They're definitely vertical, indicating heaviness weighing it down. JMO

View attachment 112638

I too believe he has something in the jacket, likely the right pocket. It might be a gun, but if so, I don't believe he actually used it for anything other than intimidation. Someone would've heard a gunshot in that area at that time of day. And on that thought - I believe the murders were committed fairly close to where the bodies were found, because if he'd taken them to another location, it would risky for the perp(s) to return to the area where he took the girls - especially when people could have been out looking for them.

 

[sideob]

I think the question that needs answering with respect to RL is why his lawyer would file a petition on March 7, 2017 and then tell the court to disregard it.

 

[Angelcat13]

I obviously can't say 100% that it wasn't RL, but I have known him for many years, and even though at his age he is very mobile and in excellent health, there is no doubt in my mind he is innocent of any involvement with the murders. Yes he likes to have some beers, and maybe made a few bad decisions, he is a good man. I hope his name will be cleared very soon. First post by the way. I couldn't stand seeing the suspicion being unaddressed by anyone who might know him.

I do not feel he is involved. And I feel that he is a victim in this situation, too. He has my sympathies.

 

[sf92]

JMO but this is a thought that has been nagging me for the last few days.

Maybe the arrest of RL is just a Red Herring. An intentional act that was set up to mislead others and to make the BG (drink up!! , lol) take pause and maybe throw off his way of thinking. Just an idea but I really think it is a diversionary tactic of some sort.

 

[sf92]

I think the question that needs answering with respect to RL is why his lawyer would file a petition on March 7, 2017 and then tell the court to disregard it.

Discovery after the fact? The process of reducing a Felony to a Misdemeanor is allowed in Indiana under a law passed a few years back, but you have to be away from trouble for some time.

But this would be a little different if he was still under court supervision. This would be more of a request to change the terms of conviction/plea. They may have realized it was not in the best interest to proceed after the filing.

Post Conviction Relief (which needs judicial approval) is what he would need seeing as his conviction exceeds 365 days. An Alternative Misdemeanor Sentencing (which could be part of the terms being completed) would apply if his conviction was less than 365 days.

 

[KyMom]

Along with the actual murders of these two young girls & thinking of the devastation it's brought to their loved ones..what really is eating me up is seeing the image Libby took of Abby, knowing it's her last photo ever and then seeing/hearing the suspect(s). I want so badly to be able to reach in, grab up both of those girls and take them out of there. I also want to reach in with a bag of big rocks & hit that upside his head with them, knocking him off that bridge and if's there was someone with him, send the 2nd
right behind the 1st one.

 

[No it's not]

Just to add a bit of info that may not have been figured into this part of it. He (RL) owns quite a bit of land. It is not uncommon,especially in Indiana, for those who do to rent or lease out the property for hunters, especially those who do not have ready access to it. So this deer stand may belong to someone else.

The deer stand is not on RL's property. His property ends on the N side of the creek. The couple making the walk-around video (great job!) were staying S of the creek. They never crossed it in the video.

-Nin

RL property marked yellow:

Source:

https://beacon.schneidercorp.com/?site=CarrollCountyIN

 

[sideob]

Discovery after the fact? The process of reducing a Felony to a Misdemeanor is allowed in Indiana under a law passed a few years back, but you have to be away from trouble for some time. But this would be a little different if he was still under court supervision. This would be more of a request to change the terms of conviction/plea. They may have realized it was not in the best interest to proceed after the filing.

If that is the case, perhaps the filing caused a review of the file and the Court discovered that RL was not in compliance with the terms of his probation. The warrant may be the direct result of the court filing and not any activity by law enforcement. In other words, don't get your hopes up.

 

[skibaboo]

So early in the morning to be out of new pages to read on Abby & Libby threads. Does this mean that members are giving up? Oh, My, I surely hope not. I believe it's vital to remain in a positive mindframe even tho we may be frustrated over the fact that the murderer hasn't been been captured yet. It's hard to be positive about anything when thinking of the two precious girls whose lives were taken by this evil person (s). Don't give up hope. Please don't be negative. If I lived closer I would be baking cakes and making trays of sandwiches and snacks for the very hardworking LE and volunteers in Delphi. May God bless these good people in their vital work, in their "down" time. And in their own homelives . I cannot imagine what these good people have gone thru and how much of their physical, mental, emotional, and psychological strengths they are pouring into this case. God loves them and their work. Let us be patient and kind with one another whole we work together to assist /sleuth what we are allowed to and put this evil person away.

Oh don't you worry, there is no way any of us here are giving up NO WAY. These threads have been moving at an absolute insane rate, I spend hours every day following and sleuthing and thinking, it is pretty exhausting. This is what happens when we have nothing new we can discuss (within TOS), I think we take a collective breather and a little rest. But we are here and we are not going anywhere I can guarantee that. We'll be here until there is an arrest(s), we'll be here through any possibly hearings and trials, and we'll still be here beyond that, remembering Libby & Abby.

I know for a fact every one of us here wishes we could do more. I know I've wished I could jump on a plane and be there to offer any help or support (idk what lol) but I've wanted to, every day.

 

[ocgrad]

I'm not insinuating RL has any involvement at all but feel it's odd that they just happened to be back searching the immediate area/silo so closely to his arrest for a pv. I would think they have been aware of that for a while. I'm sure they looked him up and down closely from the start. Why pull him in right now for that and also search again. I don't remember seeing any info the past week or about any recent extensive searches of the area other then road blocks. Searching again means they are out there for a new reason due to some sort of new info. They wouldn't just randomly go out there. Thinking more of a tie to some one else or something along those lines. Still the timing is strange.


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Me too. I do not think RL ia BG. But why search the farm across the street to collar him for a parole violation? Unless they found out he had hidden his rifle over there. Seems like a lot work to go through for something like that.