IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #78

[kkdj]

I don't know how many stories we've heard in the press about DN are true, since he wasn't charged with some of the things and others he hasn't yet been convicted of, but to me DN seems like someone who acts on impulse and anger. If he had been triggered by something with the girls, given his history, I feel like he would have attacked right then and there-or at least a few feet off the bridge. Taking them "down the hill" and killing them there feels to controlled from what we've read about DN. He doesn't come across to me as a criminal mastermind who easily manages his actions and plans very far ahead; his alleged actions make him appear more like a loose cannon.

We really don't know if he is sometimes controlled, planning ahead. We do believe he has a hair trigger temper, but we don't know how his diabolical mind really works when he's not enraged. I don't think he was enraged when he exposed himself prior. I think he thought it was just something he wanted to do.
And, I have been in circumstances where I was positive someone had committed a crime, but the DA didn't feel the prosecution would prevail if the defendant had a good lawyer, so no charges were brought, even tho the DA and LE fully believed the crime was committed by that person. This is how it works sometimes. imo

 

[TeaTime]

I feel compelled to reiterate a few thoughts I have about DN. I do not think he is BG.

We are talking about a guy with a lot of baggage and zero role models in life. His father abandoned him and his mother, the drug addict. He went to live with his grandmother at 6, the same woman who raised his drug addict mother and there was no grandfather there either. By the time he was a senior in high school his mother was murdered by her drug addict half-brother who was likely raised by the same grandmother.

He went into the Marine Corps which is a very poor substitute for a father or counseling. He spent time overseas, likely in some desert hell hole. When he got back, he did some stupid stuff which got him thrown out of the corps, his last real hope. He went to jail. He has a record. The record prevents him from finding employment. He is married and has 3 kids and no way to support them.

He likely suffers PTSD for which he has been self-medicating much to his own demise. He no longer speaks to his grandmother then found out that his only sibling had been murdered in CO. He goes to CO to attend the murderers trial but a plea has been reached, there is no trial and no one asked him if it was okay. He likely feels that the murderer did not receive a harsh enough punishment. He is sad, he is angry, he is homeless, he is unemployed, he is responsible for 3 hungry mouths and he is an addict. And all of this is piled on top of the mountain of baggage heaped upon him because he was a member of the unlucky sperm bank.

I would be standing on the road waving a hatchet at people if I had his life, I get it. There is only so much one young man can bear and he has had his share.

But, he is not a murderer. He can't get out of his own way much less pull off a double homicide 90 miles from the bridge under which he lives, without a car, a clue or a trace left behind.

He is a mess, but not a killer of innocent children.

I am so glad someone posted that article about eyewitnesses and sketches, it hammers home how much the sketches look like someone, just not the perp. The faint resemblances of the sketches to the real deal are shocking to me all the time. They never match. The fact that everyone thinks DN is a dead ringer for BG tells me it isn't him.

I feel very sorry for DN and KN. They are a mess. They don't want to be, but they are, and now their children, one of whom is a newborn, are in the hands of complete strangers, he is in jail and she is homeless in IN. And, IMHO, it all has to do with the weight of the world falling down on him and him cracking under it. He was given no tools to deal with life and he has a life than needs lots of tools.

Pray that the murderer is captured. He is truly evil and can not walk among us.

 

[sumzero]

I feel compelled to reiterate a few thoughts I have about DN. I do not think he is BG.

We are talking about a guy with a lot of baggage and zero role models in life. His father abandoned him and his mother, the drug addict. He went to live with his grandmother at 6, the same woman who raised his drug addict mother and there was no grandfather there either. By the time he was a senior in high school his mother was murdered by her drug addict half-brother who was likely raised by the same grandmother.

He went into the Marine Corps which is a very poor substitute for a father or counseling. He spent time overseas, likely in some desert hell hole. When he got back, he did some stupid stuff which got him thrown out of the corps, his last real hope. He went to jail. He has a record. The record prevents him from finding employment. He is married and has 3 kids and no way to support them.

He likely suffers PTSD for which he has been self-medicating much to his own demise. He no longer speaks to his grandmother then found out that his only sibling had been murdered in CO. He goes to CO to attend the murderers trial but a plea has been reached, there is no trial and no one asked him if it was okay. He likely feels that the murderer did not receive a harsh enough punishment. He is sad, he is angry, he is homeless, he is unemployed, he is responsible for 3 hungry mouths and he is an addict. And all of this is piled on top of the mountain of baggage heaped upon him because he was a member of the unlucky sperm bank.

I would be standing on the road waving a hatchet at people if I had his life, I get it. There is only so much one young man can bear and he has had his share.

But, he is not a murderer. He can't get out of his own way much less pull off a double homicide 90 miles from the bridge under which he lives, without a car, a clue or a trace left behind.

He is a mess, but not a killer of innocent children.

I am so glad someone posted that article about eyewitnesses and sketches, it hammers home how much the sketches look like someone, just not the perp. The faint resemblances of the sketches to the real deal are shocking to me all the time. They never match. The fact that everyone thinks DN is a dead ringer for BG tells me it isn't him.

I feel very sorry for DN and KN. They are a mess. They don't want to be, but they are, and now their children, one of whom is a newborn, are in the hands of complete strangers, he is in jail and she is homeless in IN. And, IMHO, it all has to do with the weight of the world falling down on him and him cracking under it. He was given no tools to deal with life and he has a life than needs lots of tools.

Pray that the murderer is captured. He is truly evil and can not walk among us.

Good summary. Goes to show the difference between a narrative rooted in facts and a narrative based on nothing but conjecture and an unbridled imagination. Breath of fresh air. Thank you.

 

[TeaTime]

We really don't know if he is sometimes controlled, planning ahead. We do believe he has a hair trigger temper, but we don't know how his diabolical mind really works when he's not enraged. I don't think he was enraged when he exposed himself prior. I think he thought it was just something he wanted to do.
And, I have been in circumstances where I was positive someone had committed a crime, but the DA didn't feel the prosecution would prevail if the defendant had a good lawyer, so no charges were brought, even tho the DA and LE fully believed the crime was committed by that person. This is how it works sometimes. imo

I don't believe he has a hair trigger temper, I have nothing upon which to base such a thought. We don't know that his mind is diabolical. For someone allegedly so diabolical, he sure came out on the bottom every time.

I've had to evict people from my property. It is a messy ordeal and the tenants can act out very badly. They have no money and no where to go and panic at eviction. Of course, the fact that they are being evicted is the result of bad decisions on their part is of no merit, the landlord is the easiest one to be mad at and the property gets damaged in revenge. I've had really nice tenants destroy stuff when I wouldn't renew their lease and really bad tenants destroy stuff when they got evicted. They were ALWAYS angry with me and decided that I had ripped them off and made a fortune off of them already and owed them a free place to stay as if by renting they gained some ownership of the property. Never fails. So I don't want to base any judgment on a landlord/tenant issue.

Wife beater? So says the women who returned to him and fled with him from IN for CO without a job, a place to live, a working plan and 2 children in tow, one of whom was just born. She could have stayed behind and let the taxpayers of IN take care of her and her children, she chose to go with him. I don't think she feared him.

I am so not ready to pin this on DN and the flood of condemnation is based on speculation only, IMHO..

The real facts that we know are that he lived 90 minutes/miles from the crime scene, was homeless, lived under a bridge, didn't own a car, said he has never been to Delphi, can't be placed there by anyone, gave DNA to LE to compare with the perp's DNA and hasn't been charged with the murders.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I feel compelled to reiterate a few thoughts I have about DN. I do not think he is BG.

We are talking about a guy with a lot of baggage and zero role models in life. His father abandoned him and his mother, the drug addict. He went to live with his grandmother at 6, the same woman who raised his drug addict mother and there was no grandfather there either. By the time he was a senior in high school his mother was murdered by her drug addict half-brother who was likely raised by the same grandmother.

He went into the Marine Corps which is a very poor substitute for a father or counseling. He spent time overseas, likely in some desert hell hole. When he got back, he did some stupid stuff which got him thrown out of the corps, his last real hope. He went to jail. He has a record. The record prevents him from finding employment. He is married and has 3 kids and no way to support them.

He likely suffers PTSD for which he has been self-medicating much to his own demise. He no longer speaks to his grandmother then found out that his only sibling had been murdered in CO. He goes to CO to attend the murderers trial but a plea has been reached, there is no trial and no one asked him if it was okay. He likely feels that the murderer did not receive a harsh enough punishment. He is sad, he is angry, he is homeless, he is unemployed, he is responsible for 3 hungry mouths and he is an addict. And all of this is piled on top of the mountain of baggage heaped upon him because he was a member of the unlucky sperm bank.

I would be standing on the road waving a hatchet at people if I had his life, I get it. There is only so much one young man can bear and he has had his share.

But, he is not a murderer. He can't get out of his own way much less pull off a double homicide 90 miles from the bridge under which he lives, without a car, a clue or a trace left behind.

He is a mess, but not a killer of innocent children.

I am so glad someone posted that article about eyewitnesses and sketches, it hammers home how much the sketches look like someone, just not the perp. The faint resemblances of the sketches to the real deal are shocking to me all the time. They never match. The fact that everyone thinks DN is a dead ringer for BG tells me it isn't him.

I feel very sorry for DN and KN. They are a mess. They don't want to be, but they are, and now their children, one of whom is a newborn, are in the hands of complete strangers, he is in jail and she is homeless in IN. And, IMHO, it all has to do with the weight of the world falling down on him and him cracking under it. He was given no tools to deal with life and he has a life than needs lots of tools.

Pray that the murderer is captured. He is truly evil and can not walk among us.

They are a mess - that's true. They were both DN/KN not given the tools to deal with life, I assume. But do not all the murderers mostly have a terrible, indeed sad prehistory? And the wrong partner who isn't able to help them out of the swamp?
Maybe, DN isn't the perp in case Abby/Libby. If not, it will be someone with a similar terrible sad life and who is a mess too.
As you said:
Pray that the murderer is captured. He is truly evil and can not walk among us. DN or not DN.

 

[Shiressleuth]

That Co guy and his wife I bet must feel like important movie stars or something, all the attention they're getting on the internet. Three months, day after day, strangers searching and discussing every detail that can be found to reconstruct their sorry lives that nobody cared one hoot about before now. Just saying.......

What Co guy ?

 

[Shiressleuth]

mmmmmm........the first pic in the article resembled the pics of the home DN and KN were living in. I guess there's no reason to think they wouldn't do meth although to the best of my knowledge I don't think either has been arrested for it. However, DN has been for having drug paraphernalia. Wonder what it was specifically.

The names of the tenants were in the article. Can you link to a pic of the DN house?

 

[Shiressleuth]

"Cool as a cucumber" doesn't feel fitting to DN-someone who seems to get caught at just about everything he does and allegedly chased someone with a hatchet.

Perhaps his drug use changes his moods.? When he doesn't have any maybe he loses it or something. I cannot understand the reason he would attack his wife and break her nose in front of a child, choke her in front of his children, chase people with hatchets, continually get evicted, continually drive with no licence, continually expose himself in front of women and children. Unfortunately, if he does a plea deal, noone will know the reasons, which will help him if he does get charged with anything else.

 

[Shiressleuth]

I feel compelled to reiterate a few thoughts I have about DN. I do not think he is BG.

We are talking about a guy with a lot of baggage and zero role models in life. His father abandoned him and his mother, the drug addict. He went to live with his grandmother at 6, the same woman who raised his drug addict mother and there was no grandfather there either. By the time he was a senior in high school his mother was murdered by her drug addict half-brother who was likely raised by the same grandmother.

He went into the Marine Corps which is a very poor substitute for a father or counseling. He spent time overseas, likely in some desert hell hole. When he got back, he did some stupid stuff which got him thrown out of the corps, his last real hope. He went to jail. He has a record. The record prevents him from finding employment. He is married and has 3 kids and no way to support them.

He likely suffers PTSD for which he has been self-medicating much to his own demise. He no longer speaks to his grandmother then found out that his only sibling had been murdered in CO. He goes to CO to attend the murderers trial but a plea has been reached, there is no trial and no one asked him if it was okay. He likely feels that the murderer did not receive a harsh enough punishment. He is sad, he is angry, he is homeless, he is unemployed, he is responsible for 3 hungry mouths and he is an addict. And all of this is piled on top of the mountain of baggage heaped upon him because he was a member of the unlucky sperm bank.

I would be standing on the road waving a hatchet at people if I had his life, I get it. There is only so much one young man can bear and he has had his share.

But, he is not a murderer. He can't get out of his own way much less pull off a double homicide 90 miles from the bridge under which he lives, without a car, a clue or a trace left behind.

He is a mess, but not a killer of innocent children.

I am so glad someone posted that article about eyewitnesses and sketches, it hammers home how much the sketches look like someone, just not the perp. The faint resemblances of the sketches to the real deal are shocking to me all the time. They never match. The fact that everyone thinks DN is a dead ringer for BG tells me it isn't him.

I feel very sorry for DN and KN. They are a mess. They don't want to be, but they are, and now their children, one of whom is a newborn, are in the hands of complete strangers, he is in jail and she is homeless in IN. And, IMHO, it all has to do with the weight of the world falling down on him and him cracking under it. He was given no tools to deal with life and he has a life than needs lots of tools.

Pray that the murderer is captured. He is truly evil and can not walk among us.

This is a good summing up. Nature or nurture right? However, not everyone with a difficult upbringing acts like this. Also, what do you mean he is an addict? THC is non addictive according to all I have seen so I'm not sure what you mean there. Maybe he takes other stuff other than MJ do you think?
You say he has cracked with the weight of the world falling down on him. This could have been the reason he cracked on the trail that day in Feb. Maybe he went to get his head together- then lost it like he did with the truck driver when he chased it down the road and KN couldn't look?
He could also be schizophrenic. This could explain his rages and behaviour.
:cow:

 

[her]

mmmmmm........the first pic in the article resembled the pics of the home DN and KN were living in. I guess there's no reason to think they wouldn't do meth although to the best of my knowledge I don't think either has been arrested for it. However, DN has been for having drug paraphernalia. Wonder what it was specifically.

Well they haven’t been convicted or suspected of Meth so that’s a Major reason to not accuse them of that too.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Well they haven’t been convicted or suspected of Meth so that’s a Major reason to not accuse them of that too.

Teatime said he is an addict. I challenged that and asked what he was addicted to. Kk is also asking based on a meth article involving the Detective who attended to arrest DN for FTA. He hasn't been convicted on the drug charges because he just absconds all the time.

 

[newredtabby]

Well he sure didn't miss his appointment with his PO on the 14th. I would think that if he had just committed a double homicide the day before he wouldn't want to be any where near anyone affiliated with LE.

I think DN is smart enough to know missing that appt. would have been an even BIGGER flag that he was connected to the murders.


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[newredtabby]

Looks like DN and KN were kicked off of his grandma's property in S. Carolina and moved to Florida. I think KN's mother was residing in FLA at the time. We already know his murdered brother resided in CO. So, 3 out of 4 states we know that he's lived in had relatives. Who was in Indiana?

This is big, IMO. Finding out the IN connection may prove very telling!


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[Sleuthin' n TX]

So the sketch was from his mugshot because they were suspicious of him ? Is that what you mean? I have wondered that but I believe IN has around 25% of their RSO 's not where they are supposed to be.

Yes. I am also saying that there is a possibility that the witness could not positively ID him because he has so many mug shots and each is different. LE cannot put a pic out there if there is not substantive evidence to support that or they would open themselves up to a lawsuit. The next best thing? A sketch that could alert the public and, hopefully, place him at the scene of the crime.

 

[Sleuthin' n TX]

http://specials.idsnews.com/messes-of-meth/

This long article quotes a Frankfort Detective Chad Walker in narcotics. (towards the end-mentioned as an undercover detective?) The article is about cleaning up meth labs.
It was a detective Walker from Frankfort who accompanied LE to Greenwood to look for DN in July. Frankfort is 60 miles NW of Greenwood in the direction of Delphi. Why would a Frankfort narcotics detective be accompanying a Greenwood LEO in the July search for DN?
NB Frankfort is only 24 miles south of Delphi.

The detective with the Sgt. and listed in his report was Tom Walker, as originally posted by ocgrad....here is the link: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...Rp_pjSEO3LghnM

Also, Tom Walker: http://frankfort-in.gov/?s=detective+tom+walker&submit=

Apologies if this was already addressed...I missed a day and this thread has blown up!

 

[Sleuthin' n TX]

Family fun calls....I wish everyone a safe and very blessed Christmas! And a special prayer for A&L's families, for their loss is a great one.

'til next week...

 

[Shiressleuth]

The detective with the Sgt. and listed in his report was Tom Walker, as originally posted by ocgrad....here is the link: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...Rp_pjSEO3LghnM

Also, Tom Walker: http://frankfort-in.gov/?s=detective+tom+walker&submit=

Apologies if this was already addressed...I missed a day and this thread has blown up!

The one mentioned in the article was "undercover". Maybe it's not his real name. Strange if there are 2 detective Walker's in Frankfort . But the most unusual thing is why would a detective from Frankfort be involved at all with a jurisdiction 60 miles away?
Happy Christmas all WSers and mods and special thoughts and prayers for the families missing loved ones.

 

[sunsetbeach]

I feel compelled to reiterate a few thoughts I have about DN. I do not think he is BG.

We are talking about a guy with a lot of baggage and zero role models in life. His father abandoned him and his mother, the drug addict. He went to live with his grandmother at 6, the same woman who raised his drug addict mother and there was no grandfather there either. By the time he was a senior in high school his mother was murdered by her drug addict half-brother who was likely raised by the same grandmother.

He went into the Marine Corps which is a very poor substitute for a father or counseling. He spent time overseas, likely in some desert hell hole. When he got back, he did some stupid stuff which got him thrown out of the corps, his last real hope. He went to jail. He has a record. The record prevents him from finding employment. He is married and has 3 kids and no way to support them.

He likely suffers PTSD for which he has been self-medicating much to his own demise. He no longer speaks to his grandmother then found out that his only sibling had been murdered in CO. He goes to CO to attend the murderers trial but a plea has been reached, there is no trial and no one asked him if it was okay. He likely feels that the murderer did not receive a harsh enough punishment. He is sad, he is angry, he is homeless, he is unemployed, he is responsible for 3 hungry mouths and he is an addict. And all of this is piled on top of the mountain of baggage heaped upon him because he was a member of the unlucky sperm bank.

I would be standing on the road waving a hatchet at people if I had his life, I get it. There is only so much one young man can bear and he has had his share.

But, he is not a murderer. He can't get out of his own way much less pull off a double homicide 90 miles from the bridge under which he lives, without a car, a clue or a trace left behind.

He is a mess, but not a killer of innocent children.

I am so glad someone posted that article about eyewitnesses and sketches, it hammers home how much the sketches look like someone, just not the perp. The faint resemblances of the sketches to the real deal are shocking to me all the time. They never match. The fact that everyone thinks DN is a dead ringer for BG tells me it isn't him.

I feel very sorry for DN and KN. They are a mess. They don't want to be, but they are, and now their children, one of whom is a newborn, are in the hands of complete strangers, he is in jail and she is homeless in IN. And, IMHO, it all has to do with the weight of the world falling down on him and him cracking under it. He was given no tools to deal with life and he has a life than needs lots of tools.

Pray that the murderer is captured. He is truly evil and can not walk among us.

How do know he's not a murderer? Is it just because charges haven't been brought against him at this time?

I don't feel sorry for DN. He's a RSO, he jacks off in public in front of women & children. Nope, I don't feel sorry for a grown man who can't control his sexual urges. Some sexual deviants are violent so I will just wait to see what If anything LEO in IN come up with. It's not like he's going anywhere so they can take their time. The thing is, we don't know how much he's on their radar because they're keeping almost everything under the vest.

 

[kstephens98]

OMG. I am so sorry for putting so much emphasis on RL. Seeing what is happening now on this thread is really eye opening.

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[CrimeDawg123]

OMG. I am so sorry for putting so much emphasis on RL. Seeing what is happening now on this thread is really eye opening.

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Appreciate you saying that. I am confused all the attention to DN. I know he is the only straw we can grasp at, but LE went to CO and promptly left with no follow up. Nothing. They have nothing on him.

That said, Merry Christmas everyone and Happy Holidays. May 2018 bring us all health, happiness, and answers for the families so wronged.