IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #28

[Ros]

Yes, it was line of sight from the dumpster to the handrail that the keys/wallet were found at, (depending on the trees/shrubs).
The entrances to 5 North are facing North on 11th Street.
The dumpster is behind the apartments. There are no back doors that I remember, (I'll have to double check that).

You can see the 10th & College Village apartments in the background of the dumpster pic, (where the handrail is located that the keys/wallet was claimed to be found). You can also see the South West corner of 5 North in the picture. I was standing on the sidewalk on Morton, at the South West corner of 5 North when I took the picture of the dumpster.

New construction on the old gravel lot has now blocked the line of sight, but this Google maps pic gives you the overview.

A bit more detail of the dumpster location.

The dumpster is the type a garbage truck empties into the truck. The company name on the dumpster was Sears & Sons. Anyone can contact them for more info about their schedule, if they take the trash to a transfer station, straight to the dump, etc.

You now have more info about the dumpster than I ever dreamed would be needed when I posted that pic on 06-14-2011...


Where are you Lauren?

What about the dumpsters for 10th and College Village? Do they belong to Sears too? Where area they located?

 

[Btown]

What about the dumpsters for 10th and College Village? Do they belong to Sears too? Where area they located?

10th & College Village apartments has a pair of dumpsters in the alley that Lauren was last seen at on video. They are inside the wooden fenced area behind the green transformer on the right of the alley in the below pic. There are 2 cameras in the alley. I don't think you can get to the dumpsters without showing up on video. The dumpsters are currently Republic Services Inc. waste disposal dumpsters. Anyone can contact them. IDK what company they were at the time.

Image courtesy of :+:MrTT:+:


The 10th & College dumpsters are also a pair of Republic Services Inc. dumpsters, located just inside the closed parking garage door, next to the alley that Lauren was last seen on video. The dumpsters are covered by, or have video of the area you must pass by to get to them.

IDK what waste service was used at the time.

Overview

 

[Ros]

Can one see the balcony of JR's apt from the corner of 11th and College?

 

[Jacobite]

I just got off the phone with Sears and they were very nice. They informed me they were at 5 N last night to empty that dumpster. It's emptied every Monday and Thursday. And, It was the same in 2011. So, the dumpster was emptied the day before Lauren went missing and again the Monday after. The lady also told me that if something Lauren's size was in a dumpster, she would have seen it and there is no way she is in that landfill.

 

[Btown]

Can one see the balcony of JR's apt from the corner of 11th and College?

Tough call.

The below pic shows his "balcony". To the left out of sight is 11th & College.

This next pic is perhaps 20 feet closer to the intersection than his "balcony" and from ground level. You can barely make out some signs at the intersection.

Thats the best I can do for the moment. I'll have to work on that...

 

[Jacobite]

Thanks Btown. I see Jay's balcony is built out so the yellow building to the east does not block his view towards College Avenue.

 

[Btown]

I just walked over there and took a pic from the sidewalk at the corner of 11th & College.

You can clearly see the balcony with the naked eye, but its much harder to see in the pic.

Zoomed in.

 

[CoolJ]

I just walked over there and took a pic from the sidewalk at the corner of 11th & College.

You can clearly see the balcony with the naked eye, but its much harder to see in the pic.

Zoomed in.

Alas, another white truck!

 

[IUGrad84]

Btown - Thank you for posting the images. Since it's not apparent if there are street lights in the area between 5N and College, would you be able to share any insight into the overall lighting? Assuming you could see to the corner from the 5N balcony - do you think anything or anyone would be visible at that distance around 4-4:30a (before daybreak)?

 

[bx2]

Btown - Thank you for posting the images. Since it's not apparent if there are street lights in the area between 5N and College, would you be able to share any insight into the overall lighting? Assuming you could see to the corner from the 5N balcony - do you think anything or anyone would be visible at that distance around 4-4:30a (before daybreak)?

Cell phone quality, and not sure what lighting has changed in the last year and a half but this may help.

http://tinypic.com/r/291koyx/6

(approaching north on Morton, turn East on 11th to College)

 

[bessie]

That's always been one of my theories.....that 1, 2, or maybe all 3 guys raped her while she was in no shape to consent, and she was unable to defend herself. During the commission of that crime it's possible that she died. There would be physical evidence of rape and also DNA.

I really hope that didn't happen to her.

That's been my theory since the beginning, and I believe it to this day. Two or more of the boys in LS's company that night took advantage of her condition. When she died -- either from an OD, her head injury, or a combination -- they went into a panic and disposed of her body in such a way that it would never be found. And that is why no one has talked, and why her parents' plea for anonymous information went unanswered. IMO.

I hope the memory haunts them for the rest of their pathetic lives.

 

[Btown]

Yes, it was line of sight from the dumpster to the handrail that the keys/wallet were found at, (depending on the trees/shrubs).
The entrances to 5 North are facing North on 11th Street.
The dumpster is behind the apartments. There are no back doors that I remember, (I'll have to double check that).


Where are you Lauren?

I've double checked.
There are no windows on the ground level on the back side of 5 North.
There is 1 door on the back side of the apartments, but it is a mechanical closet for the sprinkler system. It does not lead to an apartment.
There are no apartment exit doors on the back of 5 North.

 

[Btown]

Btown - Thank you for posting the images. Since it's not apparent if there are street lights in the area between 5N and College, would you be able to share any insight into the overall lighting? Assuming you could see to the corner from the 5N balcony - do you think anything or anyone would be visible at that distance around 4-4:30a (before daybreak)?

I've never been there at 4-4:30am.
However, there are lights on the exterior of 5 North, as the video Bx posted shows. There is 1 street light in front of the yellow building just East of 5 North.

What that means to me...
JR standing on his balcony has a light shining about a foot from his face as he looks East toward 11th & College.

There are 3-4 more lights he has to look past, and past the street light at the yellow building.
The traffic lights at the intersection may provide a bit of light at the corner, but for the most part its a darker area than what he is trying to look thru.

As anyone knows, looking thru a bright section into a dark section lowers visibility a great deal. He may have been able to see someone at the intersection at that time of night, but unless he watched her the whole way, IMO there is no way he could positively ID who the person at the darkened corner was. It seems too far with too many visibility problems.

I will try to go there after dark sometime and take pics and video...

 

[doubtingthomas]

Can someone from the WS community post the link that states exactly what JR is quoted as saying about LS leaving his apartment and heading home?

 

[bessie]

Can someone from the WS community post the link that states exactly what JR is quoted as saying about LS leaving his apartment and heading home?

It starts on p. 5 of the article at the link.

http://www.lohud.com/article/201206...avy-drinking-drug-use?gcheck=1&nclick_check=1

MB called JR at 3:30 AM to say LS was drunk and trying to persuade MB to go with her to a party at Smallwood.

MB and LS walk over to JR's apartment. JR throws on some sweat clothes and opens the door.

LS has her key card and her fake ID.

“When Lauren walked into Rosenbaum’s apartment, he observed a very noticeable bruise under her eye,” the investigator wrote in a report summarizing his interview with Rosenbaum. “He stated he asked her what happened, and she responded, ‘I don’t know.’ ”

MB tried to convince LS to sleep over at JR's apartment. According to MB, LS sat down and seemed agreeable. MB returned to his apartment.

JR says LS picked up an iPod, mistaking it for a cell phone.

In the half-hour before she purportedly left, two calls were placed from Rosenbaum’s phone. Rosenbaum said Spierer placed both calls, one to Rohn and another to a male friend who also was with her earlier that night watching basketball at Smallwood.Both were sleeping, neither picked up, and no messages were left.

Rosenbaum said he finally let Spierer leave after she demonstrated she could walk without stumbling.

As she was walking away, he said, he urged her again to stay, then told her to text him if she retrieved her phone. He said he then walked up to his second-floor balcony and watched her walk toward College Avenue, the route that would have taken her home.

 

[Ros]

Can someone from the WS community post the link that states exactly what JR is quoted as saying about LS leaving his apartment and heading home?

Here's a link to the Herald Times article on 28 June 2011
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/06/28/news.qp-3857730.sto
"Attorneys for the man who reports he was the last person to see Indiana University student Lauren Spierer before she went missing say their client has cooperated with police and passed a polygraph.

Jason 'Jay' Rosenbaum, 21, reported last seeing Spierer at the intersection of 11th Street and College Avenue, headed south on College, about 4:30 a.m. Friday, June 3."

 

[bx2]

Rosenbaum said he finally let Spierer leave after she demonstrated she could walk without stumbling.

As she was walking away, he said, he urged her again to stay, then told her to text him if she retrieved her phone. He said he then walked up to his second-floor balcony and watched her walk toward College Avenue, the route that would have taken her home.

I have so many questions that will go unanswered to this particular segment of the story:

-How much time elapsed between seeing her leave and seeing her again from upstairs?
-Did he see her actually turn right outside of his door, or merely see her walk out and presume he was seeing her later on from the 2nd floor?
-How can he definitively say she made it to College and wasn't instead turning down the alley?
-Is there any mention of witnessing her walking from his balcony in the original police statement? (this detail was not included until the Lohud story a year later, just curious on if it was originally omitted and later included due to the extremely unlikely ability to be able to see a person at the corner from the ground)

 

[Ros]

Where did the residents of 5N park their cars? Where did their guests park their cars?

 

[VeryVeritas]

1) B-Town (thanks again for these new / updated images)
It's really amazing how fast they throw up buildings there.
Also, it's good to clear up that there was no way into 5N without going around the building to 11th. So CR / LS's(most likely dragged or carried) path appears it would go very close or directly past the 5N dumpster. So, no surprise a scent would follow that path at least to there. Someone also had said her scent was lost at Morton(which is rather close to the dumpster), where one would then turn to get around to the 5N Entrance on 11th. Interesting is that there was no one saying that a scent was found for LS (barefoot and not being carried) going from 5N towards N. College which should have been fresher than the scent that was leading up to 5N. Perhaps LE has withheld that? Doubt it. No scent of her leaving 5N along 11th towards N. College would make JR's story of her leaving, a LIE, would it not? The poor Visibility from JR's balcony also supports the unlikeliness of his story.
The white pick up in the 5N Balcony photo is facing the wrong direction because of construction when the photo was taken? From the aerial view it does seem there are a few large trees around the dumpster area. No 1st Fl windows in the back of 5N, no cameras there either, Trees and dumpster blocking view from gravel lot and beyond, this area between 5N and the dumpster seems like quite a blindspot. Most logical place where LS would have been placed into a vehicle whether she was brought out of 5N or never made it that far.

2) Post #595 (Bessie) - This account has some interesting differences:
It clearly has MB bringing LS to JR's.
Why the detail of JR putting on sweats?
This is the first time I'm seeing that she wanted MB to go to the party AT SW(Home).
MB is trying to convince LS to SLEEP at JR's!
And detail of the second call at 4:15 is to another MALE who was watching BB with her at SW earlier in the evening. Why not just say who this person was??
"text him, if she retrieved her phone" - this of course implies that she was looking for it.
Why would he say that instead of "call me when you get home?" It's even more incredulous that he would be letting her roam around at 4:30 am barefoot searching for her phone all alone, than just letting her walk home alone(which is in itself not believable).
Now, I'm back to thinking about that keycard and FAKE ID which JR notes.
When LS fell flat on her face, without blocking the fall, she dropped her wallet and keys. Why did she not drop her keycard and fake ID?
Why were these not inside of the wallet? Her friends should know where she commonly kept these items. Was it in her bra perhaps? If so, why would she whip it out and show them to JR? If they were in her bra, she would have no reason to reveal them to anyone. If they were in her hand when she fell down cold, it makes no sense that those things show up at JR's while the rest is just abandoned. I feel that she was carried or dragged from that fall point at the gravel lot, and that those items were not in her hand. Seems to me that the keycard and Fake ID were concealed if she really did have them. She was very bad off when CR / LS entered SW and got into the altercation with ZO. Seems likely that CR may have taken possession of her keycard and ID if it were in her hand at SW when she was falling down, etc... Also now, wondering, why she did not lose the purse and keys earlier, for example when she slammed her head the first time at 10th and college apt steps. From the alley video, LE should know if it was LS or CR that was carrying the wallet and Keys. If CR had them... he may have dropped them to carry her. If she dropped them, don't see her being selective and dropping those items but keeping keycard and ID. Either she had them concealed, or someone else had them. And either way, curious that JR sees them and makes a point about them.

 

[masootz]

veritas - regarding your second points. one of the many frustrating parts of this case is that you're dealing with inebriated people so some of the things you point out as not making sense might make perfect sense given the random things that happen when people are drunk/high. i could see a scenario in which drunk LS manages to lose everything except her keycard/id. i could also see her leaving the apartment and trying to head toward the party she was trying to get those guys to go to with her. i could also understand jr/mb giving up on getting her to stay with them if she's being drunk and belligerent. i've been in situations where you try to get the drunk friend to just calm down, sit on the couch, eat some food, go to sleep, etc and they're up every five minutes doing something else dumb and drunk. i can certainly understand that at some point if your choice is to a) physically restrain this girl for a lengthy period of time until she sobers up or b) get her at least sober enough to stop falling and then let her do what she wants where you'd finally give up and go with b. there's still a lot of fishy stuff with the stories but their stories of dealing with a drunk friend don't alarm my skeptic radar. just my 2 cents.