JLM: Other Possible Victims - #2

Film_At11 · Nov 5, 2014

In Coy Barefoot's C-Ville article , "Abby", the woman watching the door that night at Tempo mentions that JM was rudely bumming cigarettes from patrons smoking outside. Most noticeably among them was a British couple who confronted him about his behavior , but did give him a cigarette. It may have been an uncommon brand ( or maybe I have been watching WAY TOO MUCH Forensic Files). It may have been collected from the sidewalk area at tempo , and matched against the Known DNA sample from the MH case.
I feel that LE already knew JM was bad news , and had a hunch he was involved in other cases.

FindHG · Nov 5, 2014

TheOptics said:
In Coy Barefoot's C-Ville article , "Abby", the woman watching the door that night at Tempo mentions that JM was rudely bumming cigarettes from patrons smoking outside. Most noticeably among them was a British couple who confronted him about his behavior , but did give him a cigarette. It may have been an uncommon brand ( or maybe I have been watching WAY TOO MUCH Forensic Files). It may have been collected from the sidewalk area at tempo , and matched against the Known DNA sample from the MH case.
I feel that LE already knew JM was bad news , and had a hunch he was involved in other cases.

Would that fall in a category of a defensive hunch by any chance? This hunch could be compellingly discussed on the thread below. I have a hunch there's a huge case building against him, based on other victims besides those so far publicly stated. What do you think of the other possible victims? Any thoughts what he may have done with them?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...When-will-charges-come-in-the-HG-and-MH-cases

FindHG · Nov 5, 2014

ThinkHard said:
http://www.whsv.com/home/headlines/...in-Good-Case-247573521.html?device=tablet&c=y

FindHG · Nov 5, 2014

Just K said:
He has many Indian Facebook friends in the Richmond and Northern Virginia/DC areas. I have a sneaking suspicion that he faked an Indian accent. The victim admits to being under the influence, IIRC, and she may not have been fully aware that the chubby dark skinned man was faking an accent.

Could she have missed the hair?

Film_At11 · Nov 5, 2014

FindHG said:
Would that fall in a category of a defensive hunch by any chance? This hunch could be compellingly discussed on the thread below. I have a hunch there's a huge case building against him, based on other victims besides those so far publicly stated. What do you think of the other possible victims? Any thoughts what he may have done with them?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...When-will-charges-come-in-the-HG-and-MH-cases

Thanks FindHG, I should have thought to post it on that forum . Here is my not-too-well-thought-out-theory........ I think JM is OBSESSED with football and wrestling. Whether he is playing , coaching , or watching on his big screen TV, I think it triggers him. Therefore I like him for any deaths/disappearances between Sept.and Feb. Regardless of whether or not he had a live in girlfriend at the time. As demonstrated by his reported actions in the Coy Barefoot article, he's QUICK!
Quick enough to remove Both socks off the woman in the bar before she could react ! Fast enough to lift 2 women onto his shoulders , and put an ex wrestler into a submission hold. His hands are his weapons.
So far we know of two women that have been described as " skull and bones" NOT "Skeletal remains". I think he uses a wrestling move that is not allowed in competition.
I think he has been active since early teens. It will be interesting to see what is found on his Cell Phone , which I am sure is in LE possession right now.
I also think that LE lulled him into a false sense of security the first few days with generic descriptions of the POI , to keep him from deleting,hiding , or getting rid of evidence.
Other than that , I haven't really thought too much about it . LOL
Your posts are always well expressed and insightful , Please solve this crime so I can sleep.

SolVol · Nov 5, 2014

ksj3 said:
I don't think the black community (or any community) was asked to voluntarily submit DNA samples in 2011 when familial DNA testing became a reality in Virginia. They are only running that DNA against DNA already in the system.

"The attacker [of the victim in Fairfax] would need to be related to someone who had been arrested for a violent crime in which police sampled his or her DNA." http://patch.com/virginia/fairfaxci...rs-dna-solve-a-fairfax-rape-and-mor84c9a34d12

The black community was asked to submit voluntary samples during the Charlottesville rapist case, in 2004, and there was a HUGE backlash because of it.

"As Charlottesville police chief Timothy Longo explained to the Post, the cops are not stopping black males at random. They already know the rapist is black from victims` descriptions, and asking only black males for DNA samples is therefore reasonable:

"In most cases, he said, police are responding to reports from residents about men who resemble a composite sketch of the suspect or who seem to be acting strangely."

Nevertheless, the progressive set at the local university has decided it just can`t stand the prospect of the cops taking what one of them called "a step backward" by actually doing something that might catch the rapistespecially, one of them sobbed to the Post, "in a place where the echoes of slavery and segregation can still be heard.""
http://www.vdare.com/articles/pc-trumps-dna-in-case-of-charlottesville-rapist

Apologies - My error - I was wrong yet again - and conflated the two cases (Charlottesville rapist and Harrington/Fairfax) in my mind. YOU ARE RIGHT - Law Enforcement did ask the AA community for DNA in the Charlottesville case.

4MYGUYS · Nov 5, 2014

ThinkHard said:
It would be very surprising if a girl who traveled around with her bible in tow, didn't celebrate Easter. It is after all THE most important day in the Christian calendar. If her parents were raising her in such a way that she carried a bible. I'm guessing they didn't neglect Easter.

There are many Asians who are Christian btw. I don't think her race is perhaps the best way to guess her religion.

You are right. Thanks for the correction. I do know however many non Christians that carry holy books that are not Christian Bibles and was just guessing that might have been found with her. I was just guessing, but upon further look into the links posted I did see she is related by her father and brother (Just K's link) to a Christian religion. And that would be another link to JM. And that would cast doubt also on her working, (I doubt she stocked shelves), on Easter Sunday.
Ukrops wasn't open on Sunday's as was the store policy due to religion.

SolVol · Nov 5, 2014

ThinkHard said:
Well say hypothetically...that's JM's unidentified DNA, WAS run through the familial DNA system...and did come back with a partial match....to a man they arrested 4 years earlier and was now serving 4 consecutive life sentences.

All they would know at that point was that one of "this prisoners" male relatives was the one who had the DNA that connected MH to Fairfax, but they wouldn't know which one.

Given the backlash in 2004, and the cries of racism...I'm sure IF that happened LE would be treading carefully on how they moved forward.

I've been trying to learn about DNA identification and how 'hits' and 'near hits' occur.

Did you know it takes over 54 hours of work to process one simple uncomplicated rape kit? That's just if everything goes well. There is a lot of prep work between sample processing - meticulous cleaning and sanitizing, complex analysis, documentation and note-taking all the way. Here's a great article on DNA testing - http://www.patc.com/weeklyarticles/dna-timeline.shtml

IF THERE WAS A NEAR HIT with the hypothetical prisoner when the DNA from the Fairfax rape and MH's shirt was processed, LE would have investigated and found that the hypothetical prisoner has a very large family. It would be hard for LE to guess which one of the many 'rape age' (16-55 or so years old) males was 'the one.' Especially since it took 10 years to catch the hypothetical prisoner.

Sounds like LE may have had their ears/eyes open watching for the mystery relative of the hypothetical prisoner to surface and commit another heinous crime for about 5 years.
;8->

4MYGUYS · Nov 5, 2014

Just K said:
He has many Indian Facebook friends in the Richmond and Northern Virginia/DC areas. I have a sneaking suspicion that he faked an Indian accent. The victim admits to being under the influence, IIRC, and she may not have been fully aware that the chubby dark skinned man was faking an accent.

Just K, following your link in the Jaisle Elizabeth Thomas case, I found that her relatives are high ranking in the Christian religion that seems to have built a church in Sterling, VA. I am thinking this may be the reason we see the numbers of Indian friends JM had on FB, and also may be linked to his reasons for being in Fairfax and also connected to the Fairfax rape case, through his affiliations with this church or friends belonging to this church. IDK, JMHO.

cville_bob · Nov 5, 2014

FindHG said:
clipped, respectfully. sorry, fixed a bit

Death or disappearance may be related to this perp for a number of good reasons and bear looking into for possible links. All mentioned at various times on threads, cited recently below:

~~~ Julie Fraser ~~~ SolVol's #636 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11155481#post11155481

~~~ Bonnie Santiago ~~~ #640 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11155826#post11155826

~~~ Jamisha Gilbert ~~~ #634 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...er-Possible-Victims-2&p=11155355#post11155355 I strongly think it's this predator.

~~~ Arianna Davis ~~~ #696 & 706 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11158717#post11158717

~~~ Jaisle Thomas ~~~ #183 & 238 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2/page2&p=11069153#post11069153 ~
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11074591#post11074591 ~ http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11074406#post11074406

~~~ Sara A. Bruehl ~~~ shutterbug22 #173 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11065382#post11065382

~~~ Vestora Spriggs ~~~ like many of the other women was going to a store, had just gotten in touch with family, and poof, vanished http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/s/spriggs_vestora.html

~~~ Janice Johnson ~~~ #735 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11160661#post11160661

~~~ Annie Horne ~~~ http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?104689-VA-Annie-Doris-Horne-38-Richmond-3-June-2001&p=11160689#post11160689

~~~ Tawanda Hill ~~~ #740 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11164749#post11164749

^^^ Already being investigated by LE for links: ^^^ Autumn Day  ^^^ Sophia Rivera ^^^ Heidi Childs & David Metzler 
^^^ Cassandra Morton  ^^^ Joan Cook ^^^ Lauren Smith^^^ Dashad Sage Smith 
Relooked, not necessarily for a link,
^^^ Alexis Murphy   ^^^ Samantha Clarke   ^ http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?259956-Possible-Links-between-RAT-and-JM&p=11165130#post11165130
^^^ Rachel Good http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?219105-VA-Rachel-Nicole-Good-20-Elkton-18-Oct-2003&p=11101724#post11101724

A link off of one of those pages brought me to this story:

http://www.wtop.com/41/3488413/Va-teen-missing-after-mothers-attempt-to-stop-dispute

I only know what is in that article, but it's at least remotely possible JM and I don't think I've seen her listed here yet.

Brianna Stewart, 15, Woodbridge, VA

Apologies if this is one that has been brought up and dismissed.

ThinkHard · Nov 5, 2014

FindHG said:
clipped, respectfully. sorry, fixed a bit

Death or disappearance may be related to this perp for a number of good reasons and bear looking into for possible links. All mentioned at various times on threads, cited recently below:

~~~ Julie Fraser ~~~ SolVol's #636 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11155481#post11155481

~~~ Bonnie Santiago ~~~ #640 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11155826#post11155826

~~~ Jamisha Gilbert ~~~ #634 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...er-Possible-Victims-2&p=11155355#post11155355 I strongly think it's this predator.

~~~ Arianna Davis ~~~ #696 & 706 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11158717#post11158717

~~~ Jaisle Thomas ~~~ #183 & 238 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2/page2&p=11069153#post11069153 ~
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11074591#post11074591 ~ http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11074406#post11074406

~~~ Sara A. Bruehl ~~~ shutterbug22 #173 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11065382#post11065382

~~~ Vestora Spriggs ~~~ like many of the other women was going to a store, had just gotten in touch with family, and poof, vanished http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/s/spriggs_vestora.html

~~~ Janice Johnson ~~~ #735 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11160661#post11160661

~~~ Annie Horne ~~~ http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?104689-VA-Annie-Doris-Horne-38-Richmond-3-June-2001&p=11160689#post11160689

~~~ Tawanda Hill ~~~ #740 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?258434-JLM-Other-Possible-Victims-2&p=11164749#post11164749

^^^ Already being investigated by LE for links: ^^^ Autumn Day  ^^^ Sophia Rivera ^^^ Heidi Childs & David Metzler 
^^^ Cassandra Morton  ^^^ Joan Cook ^^^ Lauren Smith^^^ Dashad Sage Smith 
Relooked, not necessarily for a link,
^^^ Alexis Murphy   ^^^ Samantha Clarke   ^ http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?259956-Possible-Links-between-RAT-and-JM&p=11165130#post11165130
^^^ Rachel Good http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?219105-VA-Rachel-Nicole-Good-20-Elkton-18-Oct-2003&p=11101724#post11101724

I think there are even more...

ThinkHard · Nov 5, 2014

TheOptics said:
Thanks FindHG, I should have thought to post it on that forum . Here is my not-too-well-thought-out-theory........ I think JM is OBSESSED with football and wrestling. Whether he is playing , coaching , or watching on his big screen TV, I think it triggers him. Therefore I like him for any deaths/disappearances between Sept.and Feb. Regardless of whether or not he had a live in girlfriend at the time. As demonstrated by his reported actions in the Coy Barefoot article, he's QUICK!
Quick enough to remove Both socks off the woman in the bar before she could react ! Fast enough to lift 2 women onto his shoulders , and put an ex wrestler into a submission hold. His hands are his weapons.
So far we know of two women that have been described as " skull and bones" NOT "Skeletal remains". I think he uses a wrestling move that is not allowed in competition.
I think he has been active since early teens. It will be interesting to see what is found on his Cell Phone , which I am sure is in LE possession right now.
I also think that LE lulled him into a false sense of security the first few days with generic descriptions of the POI , to keep him from deleting,hiding , or getting rid of evidence.
Other than that , I haven't really thought too much about it . LOL
Your posts are always well expressed and insightful , Please solve this crime so I can sleep.

Respectfully, but I don't think his only victims where in the fall-feb time frame. I also do not think he was obsessed with football in the way you suggest. I think football was a factor in regards to feelings of inadequacy. But I do not think they were even close to the only or even main contributing factor.

ThinkHard · Nov 5, 2014

SolVol said:
I've been trying to learn about DNA identification and how 'hits' and 'near hits' occur.

Did you know it takes over 54 hours of work to process one simple uncomplicated rape kit? That's just if everything goes well. There is a lot of prep work between sample processing - meticulous cleaning and sanitizing, complex analysis, documentation and note-taking all the way. Here's a great article on DNA testing - http://www.patc.com/weeklyarticles/dna-timeline.shtml

IF THERE WAS A NEAR HIT with the hypothetical prisoner when the DNA from the Fairfax rape and MH's shirt was processed, LE would have investigated and found that the hypothetical prisoner has a very large family. It would be hard for LE to guess which one of the many 'rape age' (16-55 or so years old) males was 'the one.' Especially since it took 10 years to catch the hypothetical prisoner.

Sounds like LE may have had their ears/eyes open watching for the mystery relative of the hypothetical prisoner to surface and commit another heinous crime for about 5 years.
;8->

I did read that article about the DNA testing posted the other day.

As far as the other stuff, we are in agreement, your saying the same thing I did...even a partial hit still would have left a pool of possibilities.

ThinkHard · Nov 5, 2014

4MYGUYS said:
You are right. Thanks for the correction. I do know however many non Christians that carry holy books that are not Christian Bibles and was just guessing that might have been found with her. I was just guessing, but upon further look into the links posted I did see she is related by her father and brother (Just K's link) to a Christian religion. And that would be another link to JM. And that would cast doubt also on her working, (I doubt she stocked shelves), on Easter Sunday.
Ukrops wasn't open on Sunday's as was the store policy due to religion.

Her case though did specifically say she left a "bible" in the car. Bible is pretty specific to Christianity.

4 Free Speech · Nov 5, 2014

Hi everyone..I just ran across this article, I haven't seen this on the threads (forgive me if someone already posted it).

http://wavy.com/2014/10/27/body-found-in-woods-in-va-beach/

VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. (WAVY) Police found a body in a wooded area of Virginia Beach, Monday afternoon.

Virginia Beach police said the body was found at the Owl Creek boat ramp on General Booth Boulevard, around 12:30 p.m. So far, the investigation indicates nothing suspicious happened. *?

Right now, police have not said who the person is or how he or she died.
Authorities continue to investigate.

hambirg · Nov 5, 2014

As far as Jaisle Thomas. . .sorry, I think she jumped.

ETA- Her car was found ON the bridge. Her car wasn't reportedly broken down. It was Easter Sunday and she wasn't at home with her Christian family. She took her keys (habit) but everything else was left in her car, including her SHOES. I don't know why, but this is a common behavior for people who suicide by jumping from bridges. . .they remove their shoes. Also, I noticed she was suppose to make an "announcement" at her church. I have to wonder what that was? Trying not to stereotype, but south Indian girls are often expected to marry shortly after high school, in my experience. Maybe her parents had arranged a marriage and she was expected to announce her engagement. Anywhoo. . .even without that speculating, I still believe she jumped.

4MYGUYS · Nov 5, 2014

hambirg said:
As far as Jaisle Thomas. . .sorry, I think she jumped.

ETA- Her car was found ON the bridge. Her car wasn't reportedly broken down. It was Easter Sunday and she wasn't at home with her Christian family. She took her keys (habit) but everything else was left in her car, including her SHOES. I don't know why, but this is a common behavior for people who suicide by jumping from bridges. . .they remove their shoes. Also, I noticed she was suppose to make an "announcement" at her church. I have to wonder what that was? Trying not to stereotype, but south Indian girls are often expected to marry shortly after high school, in my experience. Maybe her parents had arranged a marriage and she was expected to announce her engagement. Anywhoo. . .even without that speculating, I still believe she jumped.

Oh No! Thank you, for some reason I never even considered that.....really does make a lot of sense....sad.......
ETA: what do you make of the eye witness that saw her walking along the bridge?

CoolJ · Nov 5, 2014

hambirg said:
As far as Jaisle Thomas. . .sorry, I think she jumped.

ETA- Her car was found ON the bridge. Her car wasn't reportedly broken down. It was Easter Sunday and she wasn't at home with her Christian family. She took her keys (habit) but everything else was left in her car, including her SHOES. I don't know why, but this is a common behavior for people who suicide by jumping from bridges. . .they remove their shoes. Also, I noticed she was suppose to make an "announcement" at her church. I have to wonder what that was? Trying not to stereotype, but south Indian girls are often expected to marry shortly after high school, in my experience. Maybe her parents had arranged a marriage and she was expected to announce her engagement. Anywhoo. . .even without that speculating, I still believe she jumped.

This is a possibility. But what kind of body of water was below this bridge? I have a tough time believing her body wouldn't have surfaced by now?
The shoes left behind also hints at JM and his apparent foot fetish. IMO

ksj3 · Nov 5, 2014

CoolJ said:
This is a possibility. But what kind of body of water was below this bridge? I have a tough time believing her body wouldn't have surfaced by now?
The shoes left behind also hints at JM and his apparent foot fetish. IMO

They also did a search of the river below.

ThinkHard · Nov 5, 2014

hambirg said:
As far as Jaisle Thomas. . .sorry, I think she jumped.

ETA- Her car was found ON the bridge. Her car wasn't reportedly broken down. It was Easter Sunday and she wasn't at home with her Christian family. She took her keys (habit) but everything else was left in her car, including her SHOES. I don't know why, but this is a common behavior for people who suicide by jumping from bridges. . .they remove their shoes. Also, I noticed she was suppose to make an "announcement" at her church. I have to wonder what that was? Trying not to stereotype, but south Indian girls are often expected to marry shortly after high school, in my experience. Maybe her parents had arranged a marriage and she was expected to announce her engagement. Anywhoo. . .even without that speculating, I still believe she jumped.

I hadn't heard that about suicides and shoes before, that's interesting.

However it says they found her "sneakers" in the car. Though this could mean she was barefoot, it could also mean she was wearing other shoes, and had a pair of sneakers for running in the car with her.

I didn't think she was related to these cases either, until I starting looking into ALL of them and creating a format that let me see patterns better. There are too many similarities to other cases, for me to rule her out at this point.

JLM: Other Possible Victims - #2

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