Jodi Arias TAKES THE STAND #38 *may contain graphic and adult content*

[FrayedKnot]

The world is so much easier for some to understand when it's black and white, with no shades of grey. I think black and white thinking is behind a lot of this.

My stepfather was a sociopath, criminal, drug addict. He intentionally burned down our home for insurance money, killing our 5 family pets. However, he paid the bills on time and was a creative and accomplished carpenter. It is hard to reconcile all these behaviors in the same person---because they don't make sense, but people are like that. The shades of grey are what is hard to reconcile, and it drives people to black/white thinking.

Oh man, LE.

I am so sorry. I can't imagine the horror! What lies beneath, indeed. (Hugs)

I am an example of the other side of that coin...lol

I guess I have had the privilege (I know this will sound weird) of being a person that made questionable life choices in my younger days. I was the wild child of my siblings and often found myself in jams and having to call my folks or my sibs to save my butt.

My family loved and valued me and my good qualities which were there, but were taking a back seat to my "fly by the seat of my pants" attitude. But they didn't pretend I was anyone other than what I was!

I really dug that about them both then and now, looking back. They didn't cut me any slack and actually roasted me on occasion for my big mess ups.... Like when I got arrested :blushing:for driving on a suspended license (for not paying a rather large collection of parking tickets near campus). That Christmas my brother gave me a "jailbird" costume. Ha ha very funny. :what:

Point is, I think I am a good person despite my screw ups and because of my family's treatment of me, I can love someone without having to like everything about them. Or having to pretend they're perfect.

IMO, that is really loving someone. :twocents:

 

[shelley921]

Can someone let me know if I've done this? I've seen posts like this and I'm not sure what that other site is...???

yes i am not clear on this--if i refer to a post from this site i must post a link to it?
even if it was weeks ago?

 

[FrayedKnot]

I'm scared to even see that site in my google searches. It's awful.

It's the first thing that pops up when I google JA

 

[Vresia]

Phone records June 2
Phone records show several calls between Arias and Alexander in the early morning hours:

Arias called Alexander four times between 1 a.m. and 3 a.m.

These calls were all very short, the longest 17 seconds.

Alexander called Arias twice during the 3 a.m. hour:

The first call was just under 18 minutes, the second about 41 minutes.
Arias called Travis at 4:03 a.m. The call lasted 2 minutes, 48 seconds.

June 3
Arias called Alexander twice:

A 17-second call at 12:57 p.m.
A 2-minute, 50-second call at 1:51 p.m.

Thank you Tex. The info that you posted is the most detailed that I have found on the telephones call between Jodi & Travis during that period. http://www.hlntv.com/slideshow/2013/02/11/jodi-arias-trial-tragic-roadtrip

On another subject, does anyone know of a link to the police report from when Jodi was arrested ?

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

The two jurors closest to Jodi won't even look at her testifying.

One female, one male.

I noted the male demonstrating that behavior the very first day she testified. He looks at Nurmi or straight ahead. He doesn't swivel his chair in her direction much less turn his head. It's almost like he couldn't sit there if he looked in her direction.
Then I heard beth K describe the woman closest to JA this last week demonstrating that exact stance.

I have complete confidence in this jury. There is just ONE man who concerns me but I don't exactly know what I'm reading so not gonna describe it. I think they are paying attention and they will come to the only reasonable conclusion here: conviction. Then I think they will find her crimes fit cruel, heinous and depraved and they will sentence her to death.

BBm -

Thanks for that insight. What age range is that man? And the lady? Just curious if they're younger, or older?

TIA

 

[nursebeeme]

yes i am not clear on this--if i refer to a post from this site i must post a link to it?
even if it was weeks ago?

if you are referring to a post made here at websleuths all you have to do is quote the post or copy and paste it and respond to it.

hth

 

[katiecoolady]

Listen, I'm always going to view this trial from a posture of a surviving sister of a homicide victim. I do know at least somewhat what his family is dealing with here sitting through this trial.

In our case, they tried arguing they did not commit the murder and conspiracy (both they were convicted of--death penalty and LWP each).

I was at one point flown back to AZ from IL where I was at that time for Christmas (her body was found on Christmas Eve day) and had no idea they were interrogating ME (he had thrown suspicion at me claiming I was a recipient of a life insurance policy--which was true but I had no idea about). I just thought they wanted me back there for a face to face interview to help them. I remember sitting on the plane writing down every single thing I could think of to help them, including every sex partner she'd told me about ...yes embarrassing but I was 100% about helping them. Her killers had not been arrested yet (but were days later).

I know something about how a 100% innocent person acts in a police interrogation. (the detective later apologized to me and I was totally clueless as it never entered my mind I was being considered under suspicion).

I had to read her diary on the stand, I had to discuss various sexual partners she had, I had to respond to claims she was a drug dealer, etc. etc. I had to listen to them arguing she deserved those 30 plus stab wounds because he HAD to inflict them because she fought too hard for her own life.

Yes my sister was flawed. She slept with a lot of guys. She liked to party and drink alcohol. She was to some degree on trial herself. It was horrible to hear her disparaged in that way...in PUBLIC. Knowing she was 1000% a victim of two men who slaughtered her on Dec. 23 the day a life insurance policy came in the mail. The homicide had nothing to do whatsoever with her behavior. It was a calculated execution for money.

So yeah, I'm not too keen on murder victims being disparaged publicly even if it is" the truth". NO ONE is a Saint. But most of us never have to endure our weaknesses being described in order to justify being heinously murdered, or even mistreated in life.

If there's a sensitivity around that on my part I have no problem "defending" it in empathy for Travis' loved ones. Especially considering the exploitive nature of this defense.

Some lines should be drawn imo. So...I also have no trouble using the scroll feature.

 

[neesaki]

ITA. I am in the minority, but I think TA was a real d-bag to the women he dated (hence his comments about the women he wanted, not wanting him).

Difference is, a rational person breaks up with a jerk. She doesn't murder him.

Not saying you think JA was justified, just making sure I don't get flamed again for thinking TA had it coming. I do not think that at all.

I know what you're saying. I somehow believe though that at least some of that, such as the really derogatory comments from the "sex" tape (rather not repeat), was Travis' way of trying to get JA out of his life. I think he thought that even as vile as she was, that if he came up with things that were more and more obviously debasing, that she would finally take offense to it, draw the line and back away from him. I could be wrong of course, but we do know he was trying to move on from her, so it just seems logical to me. jmo

 

[Really?]

I think that when one resorts to relativistic thought there is a loss of critical boundaries and standards. Then, all things are possible, all things become equal. Logic and commonsense, on the other hand, have to do with probability. Otherwise, one could equally argue that Travis simply had a mask and underneath was a depraved character just like JA.

Othello, for example, was largely a noble character. What makes him tragic is that he possessed a singular flaw, his jealousy over Desdemona. The probability is that Travis strove for good character as testified to by many others. I perceive Travis as a tragic character, essentially striving for nobility, who somehow lost his way and found himself in a dark wood, succumbing to a dark side that ultimately turned out to be his fatal flaw.

or,,,,,an evil dark eyed woman

 

[dog.gone.cute]

I have a question. Could a member of jury send a note stating Jodi is repeating her testimony, the same questions and answers over and over, lets move on and still remain a juror?

lease:lease:lease: Oh, I hope this happens SOON ! I just canNOT take another moment of JA and her DT !

:innocent: I hope the jury is reading here ... :innocent:

:seeya:

 

[katiecoolady]

BBm -

Thanks for that insight. What age range is that man? And the lady? Just curious if they're younger, or older?

TIA

My guess is they are both in their late 50's....maybe early 60's? That male juror is not buying her BS. I can tell you that. In my opinion of course.

 

[Linda From New York]

I am sure, knowing you Websleuther's a little, that this has probably already been posted somehwere, but this is the first time I am reading it and thought those who may not have read it, might find it to be of interest:

Mesa Police Report.

http://grahamwinch.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/floresinvestigationreport.pdf

I'm still in the middle of reading this, but one or two things so far that I found interesting is the interview with one of Travis' roomates, Zach.

He says that Jodi occasionaly cleaned his house and Travis paid her. Occasionaly. SHE said he paid her "$200/month" which I would interpret as she cleaned his house on a "regualr basis".

The other thing is that Zach talks about her calling Travis at innapropriate times, about being in the house unnanounced (doggie door?) and Travis would question her about why she was there.

Could Juan call Zach as a witness to impeach her testimony about being paid 200/mo to clean his house and "other services"?? I am sure there copuld be lotsa witnesses to call to impeach a lot of her "stories"! LOL. Will Jaun pcik apart all her mundane stories??

 

[gwenabob]

But since Jodi is also a Mormon, and survived the 'ritual', the jurors should logically conclude that she is the one who completed it.

A 'ritual' by any other name will still be murder.

I have been a Latter Day Saint for more than 35 years, and I have NEVER, EVER heard of someone committing suicide in this manner as any kind of "blood ritual" by any member of this church. Ever.

Latter Day Saints consider suicide to be a very bad thing. And there is no act, except maybe cold blooded murder ala JA, that is so serious a sin that it cannot be repented through penitence, prayer, confession, and restitution. Nobody would be made to feel they need to "cleanse" themselves in such a "ritual" over sexual impropriety, so I really think this whole "blood atonement" idea should be relegated to the trash bin. Thanks.

 

[Linda From New York]

I have a question. Could a member of jury send a note stating Jodi is repeating her testimony, the same questions and answers over and over, lets move on and still remain a juror?

HA! I am thinkling the jury will not want to submit any questions in fear of her rambling on and on and on for days on end. :floorlaugh:

 

[panthera]

ITA, the taped phone call really illustrated this, she used flattery and manipulation to conceal her true self and attempted to manipulate Travis into loving her. My own opinion is that Travis was naive and susceptible to this because of his lack of experience with women. Someone who was more seasoned might have picked up on her inauthenticity in time to save themselves.

BBM

Possibly the exact reason she preyed upon him in the first place.

MOO

 

[gwenabob]

I just got on the message board, but must ask, was Jackie Kennedy abused, she had a little girl voice. Melanie Griffith, there are many woman with little girl voices, I have a niece who has a little girl voice and I know she was not abused. Phyco babblers I remember someone on a talk show using that term for doctors like DD. my opinion only

I think the little girl voice is simply a tool that some women find to be very useful in manipulating certain types of men. Think Marilyn Monroe. Some men really go for that "helpless itty, bitty, needy" female. Even Michael Jackson found the little girl voice to be a useful tool. Gives the appearance of innocence.

 

[katiedid2]

Jodi's mom hit her with a wooden spoon! Her dad slapped her! Geez
Many of us from the old school had worse than that done to Us.
My siblings and I were beaten with an extension cord! Grounded! I was raised in a very abusive strict home.
I witnessed my stepfather get shot by cops because he tried to pull a gun on a cop in a drunken rage! After beating me and my mom to a pulp. He was paralyzed from the waste down! Afterwards. My ten siblings and I went thru horrific conditions. Because he became more violent! More hatred blamed everyone but himself for. His own doing.
I say all this to say!
I not once thought of killing him! I later was married to an abusive man! I never ever thought of killing him. I had enough common sense! I left him went to a shelter got my college degree and never looked back. You may wonder why my mom didn't leave him! In those days! There were no shelters! Or resources to help battered woman.
So all this jodi claims of a wooden spoon is not enough to validate her killing Travis. From what I read! She was always wild! Rebellious and self centered. Another thought I have!
I don't know if Travis was ever exposed to kinky sex until he met jodi. Remember he was raised by his grandmother who was a Mormon. She must have been elated to be the one to introduce him to kinky sex! I really believe that.
He didnt have any *advertiser censored* pics of any kind on his computer or in his home. Lets not forget jodi had already experienced anal sex with other boyfriends.
Just saying.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

i'm starting to wonder if the role playing costumes existed, as far as i know there is no french maid or little red riding hood outfit or spidie underwear that has been entered into evidence. yet on the phone sex tape, they talk about role playing lots of times. maybe they pretended and didn't have the actual outfits? i queastioned the claim travis wanted her to wear a french maid outfit to clean his house. the house was never locked and anyone could have come in, i don't think he would have wanted that.

:seeya: I am wondering the same thing about all this "fictional" and "fairy tale" characters ...

JMO ... Jodi's "stories" on the witness stand are as "fictitous" as all these fairy tale and fictitious characters that she has inserted into her "stories" ... her "stories" are mostly FICTION !

Yes, there may be a "factoid" hidden somewhere in her testibaloney, but IMO, mostly fiction ...

Let's see ... we have "Spiderman" ... "Little Red Riding Hood" ... the "School Girl" ... the "French Maid" ... the "Ninjas" ...

I know there's more, but can't think of all 'em ... oh yeah, she said that Travis made her feel like a "goddess" -- OFGS ... I am surprised she didn't come up with a name of a "goddess" ...

Anyway ... all JMO and :twocents:

:seeya:

 

[Really?]

Listen, I'm always going to view this trial from a posture of a surviving sister of a homicide victim. I do know at least somewhat what his family is dealing with here sitting through this trial.

In our case, they tried arguing they did not commit the murder and conspiracy (both they were convicted of--death penalty and LWP each).

I was at one point flown back to AZ from IL where I was at that time for Christmas (her body was found on Christmas Eve day) and had no idea they were interrogating ME (he had thrown suspicion at me claiming I was a recipient of a life insurance policy--which was true but I had no idea about). I just thought they wanted me back there for a face to face interview to help them. I remember sitting on the plane writing down every single thing I could think of to help them, including every sex partner she'd told me about ...yes embarrassing but I was 100% about helping them. Her killers had not been arrested yet (but were days later).

I know something about how a 100% innocent person acts in a police interrogation. (the detective later apologized to me and I was totally clueless as it never entered my mind I was being considered under suspicion).

I had to read her diary on the stand, I had to discuss various sexual partners she had, I had to respond to claims she was a drug dealer, etc. etc. I had to listen to them arguing she deserved those 30 plus stab wounds because he HAD to inflict them because she fought too hard for her own life.

Yes my sister was flawed. She slept with a lot of guys. She liked to party and drink alcohol. She was to some degree on trial herself. It was horrible to hear her disparaged in that way...in PUBLIC. Knowing she was 1000% a victim of two men who slaughtered her on Dec. 23 the day a life insurance policy came in the mail. The homicide had nothing to do whatsoever with her behavior. It was a calculated execution for money.

So yeah, I'm not too keen on murder victims being disparaged publicly even if it is" the truth". NO ONE is a Saint. But most of us never have to endure our weaknesses being described in order to justify being heinously murdered, or even mistreated in life.

If there's a sensitivity around that on my part I have no problem "defending" it in empathy for Travis' loved ones. Especially considering the exploitive nature of this defense.

Some lines should be drawn imo. So...I also have no trouble using the scroll feature.

God bless you Katie....Thank You for your contributions to this site. I always look forward to your posts. :gthanks:

 

[Linda From New York]

I know what you're saying. I somehow believe though that at least some of that, such as the really derogatory comments from the "sex" tape (rather not repeat), was Travis' way of trying to get JA out of his life. I think he thought that even as vile as she was, that if he came up with things that were more and more obviously debasing, that she would finally take offense to it, draw the line and back away from him. I could be wrong of course, but we do know he was trying to move on from her, so it just seems logical to me. jmo

I think their relationship, which morphed into "sex only", got the point where it was nothing but "dirty sex" that Jodi went along with/enjoyed/played the game. He continued with the "dirty sex" talk and otherwise because she went along with it and IMO he thought she was enjoying it as much as him. The "sex tape", IMO, proves she either liked it or went along with it. Hence, "consensual" "debasing" sex between the two.