MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #10

[mzmarymac]

Seriously? Then he tells her he expected her to stay in Canton during the blizzard! And he will fix her plumbing issues Monday.

ETA: Oh and he is relying on her for a ride home!

Has it ever been addressed as to how KR thought JOK would be getting home? Or did she just assume he'd find his way back or take an Uber or something?

 

[Recidivist]

But the prosecution doesn't have to present a second by second account of what happened to show murder actually happened. Neither do they need to trace every mark on his body back to the object that made it. This is reasonable doubt, not beyond any uncertainty. They have so far proven she was there, she was very drunk, she admitted to being in a fight, she accelerated backward with her foot 75% to the floor reaching 24mph in 60 feet, her tail light is broken, his DNA is on it, the pieces of tail light are in the yard and on the street, pieces of tail light are on his shirt, broken glass from the one he was holding in his hand as he left the bar were in the yard with him, and she knew exactly where to find him and speculated that she may have hit him, and he is dead.

The defense wants you to believe that all those things above are false or fabricated, and that he went into a house full of people, including law enforcement officers, all of them are now lying, he got beat up and bitten by their dog, then they dragged him out in the street to die and they were smart enough to plant him right on top of his broken glass. Without presenting a single piece of evidence any of this is real.

The defense's case is beyond ludicrous.

Gosh. How would you know the defense case is ludicrous, when they haven't presented their case yet?

 

[keek]

Has it ever been addressed as to how KR thought JOK would be getting home? Or did she just assume he'd find his way back or take an Uber or something?

She was texting him outside waiting to hear what the plan was. He never responded. She assumed he was ignoring her hence her angry calls or texts to him. She left after about 15 min I believe

 

[Wishbone]

I have an open mind. If they can show me she was not there, wasn't drunk, didn't speed down the road backward, her tail light wasn't broken, those pieces on him and in the yard are are not her tail light, that isn't his DNA on her tail light, then I'll definitely change sides.

Well, she was there to drop JO off at BA's. As to if she was drunk, I would say the whole lot of them were drunk. But as to the rest of it, none of it has been proved. JMO

 

[HarmonyE.]

I think I missed that the yard was fenced in. I just remember thinking it was odd they kept bring up taking her out to pee and where BA was, etc. Maybe it was simply to say Chloe could not have harmed him in the front yard because she only goes in the fenced in back yard?

They wouldn't have let Chloe out in front. Not fenced, busy road and a leash law. John would have had no reason to enter from the back yard and it was fenced and gated so he wouldn't have had access from the outside. Sounds like when Chloe attacked those two people one of the family members had accidentally left the gate open and she was roaming.

 

[Leilei]

I must have missed it when these pics of the shoes were shown in court, does anyone have a theory of why the sole of one of them seems more worn/dirtier than the other?

View attachment 511652
View attachment 511653
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Stained from being buried in snow/dirty water/ice? Wasn't he wearing the other one still?
IMO

 

[nightowl1975]

. But you have to ignore the massive amount of evidence that he got hit by a car out front by a person who was black-out drunk.

How do you reconcile the fact that multiple experts hired by the FBI and DOJ concluded he wasn’t hit by a vehicle? These are ACTUAL experts, unlike the…. people that the CW put on the stand as “experts”.

 

[cocomod]

The head wound - likely to be the main reason for his death. Where did it occur? It is doubtful that it happened where he was found because there just isn't enough blood there to have come from a head wound - they bleed a LOT! Blood on his pants - from 3 different people. Whose DNA profile is on his pants? The prosecution didn't even try to identify the other DNA profiles which should have been a red flag to them.

What about a coat we have heard was cut off of him? Where do the holes line up in both of the shirts he was wearing? If the outer shirt doesn't have the same holes, how is this explained?

 

[bobbymkii]

I have an open mind. If they can show me she was not there, wasn't drunk, didn't speed down the road backward, her tail light wasn't broken, those pieces on him and in the yard are are not her tail light, that isn't his DNA on her tail light, then I'll definitely change sides.

Well, if I may just politely try to help manage your expectations. You are a free thinking individual with agency and you have every right to interpret the case as if the defense have to prove it didn't happen, and express your thoughts in a public forum if you wish and that the "conspiracy" should be dismissed immediately on its' (admittedly) wild premise alone.

But bear in mind that whichever 12 members of the current jury panel get to deliberate on this case, they have sworn an oath to do the exact opposite, and judge whether or not the CW has proven its' case beyond a reasonable doubt.

With all due respect I have no idea why you think the defense has any obligation whatsoever to prove she wasn't there or argue that her tail light wasn't broken in order to prove her innocence, rather than that the CW have to prove that the damage caused to both the taillight and John O'Keefe's body were caused by Karen Read's car, thus proving her guilt?

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

How do you reconcile the fact that multiple experts hired by the FBI and DOJ concluded he wasn’t hit by a vehicle? These are ACTUAL experts, unlike the…. people that the CW put on the stand as “experts”.

That's my question as well.

 

[nightowl1975]

I have an open mind. If they can show me she was not there, wasn't drunk, didn't speed down the road backward, her tail light wasn't broken, those pieces on him and in the yard are are not her tail light, that isn't his DNA on her tail light, then I'll definitely change sides.

What if they show you that the evidence doesn’t support him being hit by a vehicle? None of the other stuff matters if he wasn’t hit by a vehicle.

 

[mzmarymac]

Of everything I’ve seen thus far, KR’s demeanor has been the ONLY thing that’s bothered me. I wish she would act more…. I’m not sure what word to use. Dignified? Serious? It’s nowhere near enough to convict her IMO, but she doesn’t come across as particularly likable, and t

Sorry if I cut off part of this post, as I am bad at this.

Consider that YOU feel you are being framed by a bunch of people, some of whom are actually responsible for killing your boyfriend. I'd probably be the same way, likely worse. I'd rather he be herself than pretend. She has every right to be infuriated with what this case as done to her and her family. IMO

 

[mzmarymac]

** Warning ** graphic photo **


@149Zone7

This is a photo of a dog bite. See the parallel bite marks? Experts are going to argue what caused the numerous parallel marks on John O’Keefe’s arm but the jury is going to have to believe flying pieces of tail light caused parallel marks in different directions without any blood or tissue being left on the plastic. Not one states witness has lead us to believe without a reasonable doubt a vehicle caused the injuries to the Officer O’Keefe.
View attachment 511601

Not to mention there are apparently no small shards of glass imbedded in any of the wounds either

 

[MerlinFalcon]

She was texting him outside waiting to hear what the plan was. He never responded. She assumed he was ignoring her hence her angry calls or texts to him. She left after about 15 min I believe

So he could have been dead or dying at that time and she didn't know it.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

Gosh. How would you know the defense case is ludicrous, when they haven't presented their case yet?

Thank you for this post. I welcome this candor and open-minded approach. And I have not yet made an opinion either. Fortunately I am not on this jury. MOO

 

[TTF14]

For those that were watching Friday's proceedings, we saw a lot of the ceiling fan and muted mics while various members of the Jury were spoken to. I came across this explanation:

Last Friday, one of the jurors in the Karen Read trial was dismissed from serving on the jury. This juror was inadvertently caught on camera as she made her way to the bench to speak with Judge Cannone.
It was obvious there was an issue prior to getting caught on camera, otherwise, why would she have been heading to the bench to begin with.
Sources tell me that this juror was "badmouthing" Karen to other jurors in the jury room. Some of the things being said included Karen always turning around talking to her parents as well as Karen smiling and making faces. Sources tell me one juror had enough and spoke up and allegedly other jurors were questioned and said "she needs to go." (from this source)

Interesting, thank you for sharing. Just today I was wondering if the jurors were even allowed to discuss the "kill me" comment (if they even heard it) amongst themselves.....probably not. That would be really hard!

 

[Ray_of_hope]

I agree. Those "scratches" are from a dog when you've got lazy and haven't cut his nails lately. My wood floors look like that, too.

lol, Our floors looked the same and we just had to porcelain tile over our wood floors due to our dogs!

 

[Wishbone]

So he could have been dead or dying at that time and she didn't know it.

If he was in the house dying or dead she had no way of knowing.

 

[Ray_of_hope]

I think I missed that the yard was fenced in. I just remember thinking it was odd they kept bring up taking her out to pee and where BA was, etc. Maybe it was simply to say Chloe could not have harmed him in the front yard because she only goes in the fenced in back yard?

I agree she didn't kill him.

There was a gate on the front side yard and people wondered if it had been left open. That was a question people had. On Court TV, a reporter noted that someone could come out of the back bulkhead, taken a left, gone through the fence gate and walked straight out, then they would be where John lay.

 

[HarmonyE.]

The defense wants you to believe that all those things above are false or fabricated, and that he went into a house full of people, including law enforcement officers, all of them are now lying, he got beat up and bitten by their dog, then they dragged him out in the street to die and they were smart enough to plant him right on top of his broken glass. Without presenting a single piece of evidence any of this is real.

The defense's case is beyond ludicrous.

I have to ask, how much of the trial have you watched?

It's the prosecution's case that is beyond ludicrous. They don't even have a viable theory of what happened (See Trooper Paul's testimony. It's the most embarrassing testimony I've ever heard. Well, aside from Proctor's). Not only are there independent witnesses who put Karen Read sitting alone in her car, no doubt waiting for John's return or call, no one in this "house full of people" saw a body lying in the front yard as they left the premises, walking near by and then driving by the exact location.

It's also important to put the "house full of people" into context. It's very possible the younger ones sitting in the dining area never saw John enter and head downstairs. The stairs down are off the foyer and the floorplan isn't open with a limited view from the doorway of the dining room. Which is not to say they weren't aware something had happened after the fact. These young people were not questioned and some weren't even identified until many months later. If they were told (and this is a direct quote from Matt McCabe) "Just tell them the guy never went into the house" and didn't want to rock anything with the no doubt intimidating Brian Albert, this would explain why they didn't come forth right away on their own.

No one asked and no one told, but by the time LE finally was forced (by the FBI's investigation) to deal with the bystanders, if they had heard something, they no doubt knew they were complicit in keeping silent as they knew the next day John was found dead on the lawn. This meets the definition of accessory to murder after the fact.

We're really only talking about two non-family members, Julie Nagle and Sara Levinson. Had they been questioned by law enforcement in a proper LE setting, they may well have told about a commotion in the basement. But they didn't and by the time LE did ask questions, they'd be silent long enough to know they could face charges. So they decided to take Matt's advice and just keep repeating, "The guy never went into the house". Easy enough. "I know nothing."

As for the cops, aside from John, there was only Brian Albert and Brian Higgins. And they are both shady as hell, denying documented phone calls and conversation (see butt dialing and butt answering), destroying phones under court order (BH's at a military base where State police have no jurisdiction), and with Brian Albert not bothering to even step outside when there were ambulance, police and a screaming woman right under his bedroom window. Probably too busy still doing clean up in the basement.

No doubt. John was killed in that house. The state doesn't even have a remotely viable theory to show otherwise. They only have a conflicted and dirty lead investigator and Trooper Joe Paul, who literally spoke gibberish on the stand.