MA - Remains of 3 infants found, Erika Murray charged, Blackstone, Sept 2014

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves

New Posts

http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...STYqV5aqG1afdw0i3UJ/story.html?rss_id=Top-GNP

Working with little more than skeletal remains, the state medical examiner faces a significant challenge in determining how three infants found in a Blackstone home last week died, according to legal analysts, who say the review will be a crucial part of the criminal investigation.

One key to whether prosecutors will have enough evidence to file a charge of homicide, manslaughter, or another serious felony will be the condition of the remains, and the length of time they were left in the home. The medical examiner will want to look for any tissue damage or trauma to determine if the deaths were unnatural, but that opportunity could be lost if the bodies have been fully decomposed, analysts said...

For investigators to know for sure what happened, it’s likely that Murray will have to cooperate and tell authorities, Baden said.
Click to expand...
 
Blackstone father in ‘complete shock,’ friend says

Said to be unaware of 2 children
http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...HJ/story.html?p1=Article_InThisSection_Bottom
Click to expand...
Just like everyone else, he also thinks he should have known,” the friend said. “She had everybody fooled.”
Click to expand...

Umm, yes, he should have known. These are his kids after all and he cannot be bothered to walk up a few steps to see how they are doing? I guess he never tucked his kids into bed at night.

“He wants the truth to be his support,” he said.
Click to expand...
The truth will support that he is an idiot, a horrible father and an *advertiser censored* to boot. I might be able to believe he didn't notice his GF was pregnant and had the other kids in secret, but no way you can live in the basement of a house that has diapers piled high and bodies of babies and animals and not know something is wrong. The smell alone has got to give it away, even if he never set foot on the first floor. He knew and didn't care or she threatened to out his marijuana growing if he said anything.
 
Linda7NJ said:
Those boxes have to be kept as evidence?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I wouldn't think so Linda - just that there is so much fecal matter in one place it creates a "bio-hazard". I would think this would be much more of a contaminate than just a few diapers tossed in a trash can that is dumped weekly. They probably have to dispose of them in a "bio-hazard" designated disposal site.
 
From the bostonglobe link above:

"A 2002 change in state law broadened the definition of child endangerment to go beyond physical abuse, and it applies to an adult who is “aware of and consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk” that the adult’s actions could cause serious injury to any child, said Laura Gold, a former prosecutor who sits on the board of Massachusetts Citizens for Children, a child-abuse prevention organization."

So here is my question . . . . this would certainly be applicable to the Father on the older 2 children, but . . . . wouldn't it also be applicable on the 3 y/o and the 5 mo old as her knew that these children were in this deplorable home (even if they were being babysat)? It shouldn't matter whether he knew those children were his - he still blatently disregarded the conditions in this home that presented a substantial (and unjustifiable) risk to any child!
 
Having MJ plants and smoking t even in basement............coud that be child endangerment also? The children ever go to basement? Saw a bike stored there.
 
They both should be locked up and throw away the key. I hope those children never have to see those faces again.
 
bflocket said:
You only need half of one eye open to see that she is mentally ill. To what extent and whether it could have been treated are different questions...

As crazy as it sounds, I am inclined to think that Rivera didn't know what all was going on upstairs.
We don't yet know if the kids (living and deceased) found upstairs were his children.
The home is owned by his family and is big enough to have a livable basement, which is likely why they were there. I can see him letting her (the mother of his children) live there. They may not have got along due to her mental state or something on his part, but she was the mother of his kids.
And when I say that, I mean the "kids" he knew about. We don't even know who the father is. He had no reason to pry into her business if she was up in her part of the house and wasn't causing him trouble. Since the kids were with him, why would he have a reason to venture upstairs?
Click to expand...

The smell and the bugs would be enough to go upstairs and see what was going on. There had to have been wet spots through the floor over his head. Jmt

ciao
 
re RR being high and oblivious. No pass IMO, Purposefully obtuse or purposefully oblivious are just as deplorable and inexcusable.
 
In "3" years RR claims he never knew anything........................not buying this at all!
In "3" years no one ever went in front door?...........not buying that either!
sorry, but I had a chipmunk die in our attached garage while we were on vacation and it smelled into my hallway this summer! horrible sickening smell................
 
wenwe4 said:
I wouldn't think so Linda - just that there is so much fecal matter in one place it creates a "bio-hazard". I would think this would be much more of a contaminate than just a few diapers tossed in a trash can that is dumped weekly. They probably have to dispose of them in a "bio-hazard" designated disposal site.
Click to expand...

This, and they probably picked most stuff apart as the got it out of there. They took a week, not a day. If they had any further concerns, they could always xray in addition to photograph, so there's really no reason to keep it.
 
bflocket said:
You only need half of one eye open to see that she is mentally ill. To what extent and whether it could have been treated are different questions...

As crazy as it sounds, I am inclined to think that Rivera didn't know what all was going on upstairs.
We don't yet know if the kids (living and deceased) found upstairs were his children.
The home is owned by his family and is big enough to have a livable basement, which is likely why they were there. I can see him letting her (the mother of his children) live there. They may not have got along due to her mental state or something on his part, but she was the mother of his kids.
And when I say that, I mean the "kids" he knew about. We don't even know who the father is. He had no reason to pry into her business if she was up in her part of the house and wasn't causing him trouble. Since the kids were with him, why would he have a reason to venture upstairs?
Click to expand...


bflocket, we do know that the older 2 children are his - according to reports he is listed as the Father on their birth certificates. We also know the basement did not have a bathroom or a kitchen - so he had to have gone upstairs for those 2 conveniences alone, I don't believe that counts as a "livable basement" and there has not been one MSM report that the children lived down in the basement.

There were pictures of the basement where he spent a lot of time with a pot plant on the floor with some debris and a coffee table loaded with bags of pot, pipes and a bong. Probably not the best if the older kids had regular access if this was the "normal" state of affairs in this enviornment either.

He did have reason to ensure that his children lived in a home that didn't present health and safety hazards which caused them harm. He is just as responsible for the care and keeping of children as she is. I am sorry but I am just not feeling the love to give him a pass - he had to have entered the main floor at least of this home to toilet and eat every day. Although the conditions on this floor were much better than the top floor, the rodents, bedbugs, stench, and filth had to be evident and probably had invaded into the basement as well.
 
ITA. I don't give a dayum if mom and dad can't/don't/ or won't get along. They are still equally responsible to make sure their children are safe and provided for. NO EXCUSES!

And, for people who are questioning their living arrangements and whether they got along or not, please remember, it appears they got along at least enough to make 7 babies!
 
nightwatch said:
The smell and the bugs would be enough to go upstairs and see what was going on. There had to have been wet spots through the floor over his head. Jmt

ciao
Click to expand...

He's lucky that the whole place didn't literally crash down on top of him!
 
The neighbor's sadness turned to anger when Murray returned to the home while she and police were still there.
"I said to her, 'What are you doing? What are you doing?' Just really upset. She kind of laughed it off and said, 'I don't know. I don't know'. I said, 'I want to know if you knew those babies were up there when you left this morning. I want you to say it to me.' She said, 'Yes I knew they were in there,'" the neighbor said.

http://www.turnto10.com/story/26534969/town-condition-of-blackstone-house-worse-than-thought

Just wow. That is chilling. The seeming cavalierness of the response. Makes me wish the neighbor had saved that little tidbit for court testimony. That would be a powerful thing for a jury to hear and without months leading up to trial for a defense attorney to try to minimize or mitigate.
 
tlcya said:
The neighbor's sadness turned to anger when Murray returned to the home while she and police were still there.
"I said to her, 'What are you doing? What are you doing?' Just really upset. She kind of laughed it off and said, 'I don't know. I don't know'. I said, 'I want to know if you knew those babies were up there when you left this morning. I want you to say it to me.' She said, 'Yes I knew they were in there,'" the neighbor said.

http://www.turnto10.com/story/26534969/town-condition-of-blackstone-house-worse-than-thought

Just wow. That is chilling. The seeming cavalierness of the response. Makes me wish the neighbor had saved that little tidbit for court testimony. That would be a powerful thing for a jury to hear and without months leading up to trial for a defense attorney to try to minimize or mitigate.
Click to expand...

Either way, cops were present when EM admitted this - so I hope witnesses will help in court. She also admitted her home was not fit for habitation by human or animal and agreed the children were no longer safe and that is indisputable. So sad when the witness teared up describing the conditions in the home.

I keep wondering if the court documents will give more info about the nature of the allegations of "witness intimidation". I understand it might be sealed but I am curious if the older children finally felt comfortable enough to disclose of the knowledge of the babies in the home - after 2 weeks of being in a safe environment.

I also wonder if the medical examiner will wait until toxicology results are in (I assume they did some) before they announce any of their findings. Honestly, I think it will be pretty tough to prove "murder" - even duct tape across a child's nose and mouth couldn't prove murder in another case I followed on WS. God forbid something like that turns up in this case!

I think the 3 y/o will be hospitalized for awhile to stabilize and be assessed for - well, everything. I think the 5 mo old may be able to transition to a therapeutic foster care much more quickly and for her I have a lot of hope! I hope the older children got to enroll (under a different name) in school and are making friends and enjoying a more normal home. I wonder if it won't be a struggle for them to learn how to maintain living in a clean and safe home. I think it speaks volumes when early reports stated the 10 y/o refused to get out of the CPS vehicle as he didn't want to go home. Hopefully those two get bedroom space they can fix up and keep nice just for themselves!
 
Since EM & RR lived in these horrible conditions with no regard for the children's well being..............was this the norm? Were they raised like this also? Just curious.
I also wonder if EM told RR that she babysat for money so she didn't have to go to look for employment.
What would she do all day? She didn't clean, cook?, take care of her children.............
where was she the day that she got caught???
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

DNASolves

Who is DeKalb County John Doe (2022)?

Members online

... and 169 more.
Total: 1,345 (members: 170, guests: 1,175)

Online statistics

Members online
170
Guests online
1,175
Total visitors
1,345
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
602,124
Messages
18,135,131
Members
231,244
Latest member
HollyMcKee
Back
Top