Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #16

[Chiatos]

Looks like it's this lorry @9.15 so probably not connected to IG imo
The car looks like a black/ dark blue Peugeot.

Reporter: Police found vehicals (plural) at the allotment. Without number plates.

 

[Sharkbite]

 

[Sharkbite]

DBM

 

[SuperdadV8]

View attachment 258904

Yes, should be the black SEAT Cordoba beside the policevan and in front of the gate.

 

[Ardoch]

I do think that there are safer places close by than 5a or the street.

Even if this location, be it a property or vehicle, were only used to restrain or sedate MM prior to taking her to a final destination. They didn’t need to stay in this place long, just so long as it’s outside the immediate area.

Someone with perhaps no experience of carrying a child, hence any 'awkwardness' in the method of carrying them. Carried down a back road near to the apartment, for a short distance, to an awaiting (discreet) car which is parked in one of the slightly concealed, off - street car parks on that road.
Or perhaps, as you say, to an empty apartment.
However, that's a scenario that fits in with the Tannerman sighting, why use that method rather than straight into a car parked at the apartment?
Maybe too close? In this way it might throw the scent off a bit? JMO IMO

 

[Tim N]

hang in there people..

 

[Denis R Tandib]

Someone with perhaps no experience of carrying a child, hence any 'awkwardness' in the method of carrying them. Carried down a back road near to the apartment, for a short distance, to an awaiting (discreet) car which is parked in one of the slightly concealed, off - street car parks on that road.
Or perhaps, as you say, to an empty apartment.
However, that's a scenario that fits in with the Tannerman sighting, why use that method rather than straight into a car parked at the apartment?
Maybe too close? In this way it might throw the scent off a bit? JMO IMO

I think trying to work with facts, while imperfect, gets you closer to the truth.

To my knowledge, there aren’t any sightings of a car near the apartment during the abduction window (or before, there was a sighting of a suspicious white van a couple of days before). There are no sightings, during the abduction window, of two or more potential abductors. There is no evidence from 5A that there were any abductors let alone two or more.

There is however a credible sighting of one perpetrator with someone who was given a 60% chance of being MM by three people.

in light of these facts, I don’t understand why people who think the abduction occurred favour a multiple abductors leaving by car ... I guess because it feels more plausible.

There were other clues that night that support the Smith sighting and could be aligned to CBs involvement - the driver at the OC that had the night off who lived in the Edificio Luztur near the Smith sighting, the two fair-haired men arguing near the same apartment at 11pm and SM’s parents house very close to the Smith sighting.

I mentioned this before but I don’t believe there aren’t any links between the case file and CB. If CB is the perpetrator of MMs abduction, I find it inconceivable that there isn’t anything or anyone in the case file connected to him.

 

[MENDEL]

I have this in my notes;

CB was first jailed in 1999 three years after settling in Portugal. He spent two months in jail in the city of Evora in central Portugal for theft and disobedience

Served only a couple of weeks

Deported after jail time?

ETA

Notes taken from separate sources, first I read he was sentenced for 2 months, then another source stating he only served 2 weeks.

That's controversial and perhaps we should check sources. I could only find an arrest for disobedience when he was caught driving his seized Jaguar, but he was already arrested at the time of sentence because of Dieselgate and perhaps that was inconsequential. For 1999 I can only find an arrest for extradition where papers were shown on "Sexta às 9".

 

[MENDEL]

I do think that there are safer places close by than 5a or the street.

Even if this location, be it a property or vehicle, were only used to restrain or sedate MM prior to taking her to a final destination. They didn’t need to stay in this place long, just so long as it’s outside the immediate area.

A agree there might be some same place nearby 5A, but how on earth could he leave in safety any time later? Everybody at PDL was suspicious at the time of course and a short call to police about a strange neighbor would be just fatal.

 

[MENDEL]

Looks like it's this lorry @9.15 so probably not connected to IG imo
The car looks like a black/ dark blue Peugeot.

That looks like a VW to me.

ETA: it's a SEAT from later pics.

 

[Sharkbite]

That's controversial and perhaps we should check sources. I could only find an arrest for disobedience when he was caught driving his seized Jaguar, but he was already arrested at the time of sentence because of Dieselgate and perhaps that was inconsequential. For 1999 I can only find an arrest for extradition where papers were shown on "Sexta às 9".

CB was first jailed in 1999 three years after settling in Portugal. He spent two months in jail in the city of Evora in central Portugal for theft and disobedience - بحث Google

Having problems finding where it said he only served 2 weeks of that sentence.

 

[MENDEL]

I’m not necessarily disagreeing but just a few things to help clarify in my own mind.

If a car was used in close proximity to 5a, there is a risk that the car would be seen and be identifiable? Are there any statements or articles that mention a car in in the area during the abduction window?

If the car wasn’t in close proximity to 5a, MM had to be carried to it by foot. What is the optimal distance to have minimal risk of a traceable car being identified vs being seen carrying the child on foot?

The Smith sighting was 3-4 minutes via backstreets then no further sightings. Does this meet the requirement of “vehicle close by?”

That would be quite easy to have a car parked just next to 5A opposite to window. That area is hidden enough, it's the least crowded area around 5A and had some tall trees at the time. The car would leave the area smoothly in less than 1min.

 

[MENDEL]

CB was first jailed in 1999 three years after settling in Portugal. He spent two months in jail in the city of Evora in central Portugal for theft and disobedience - بحث Google

We need more info on those dates and on German warrant later in 1999. Or could disobedience, theft and warrant be all the same arrest?

 

[Sharkbite]

We need more info on those dates and on German warrant later in 1999. Or could disobedience, theft and warrant be all the same arrest?

Maybe the warrant was served while CB was in jail for theft/disobedience, hence he only served 2 weeks and then was possibly deported/extradited?

 

[MENDEL]

CB was first jailed in 1999 three years after settling in Portugal. He spent two months in jail in the city of Evora in central Portugal for theft and disobedience - بحث Google

Having problems finding where it said he only served 2 weeks of that sentence.

His Portuguese criminal record issued November 16, 2006 was blank at the time ("Sexta às 9", ep. 22 @ 27.06).

Also, when questioned about prior prison sentences by judge in December 21, 2006 CB only mentioned serving prison in German, not any prior prison sentence in Portugal.

I think custody timeline is complete after he turned 18. We now miss custody timeline before in Germany.

 

[worldwatcher]

Does anyone here remember Dutroux and the excavations at that time?
Just a short intro about my question regarding to this...
I was curious about possible DNA traces that might have been found in the murder of Carola Titze,but what I read is about an mobile home (white and beige) wich was seen in the area,days before CT was found murdered. I cant find any pictures of the mobile that has been mentioned in several articles and compare it to CBs know vehicles. CB had the van in 1999? If I am correct?

“The man recognized in the images about the excavations at Dutroux a mobile home of the murderer, which strongly resembles a mobile home he saw in De Haan at the time.’
Speurder linkt mobilhome van Dutroux aan Duitse zaak

 

[Ardoch]

That would be quite easy to have a car parked just next to 5A opposite to window. That area is hidden enough, it's the least crowded area around 5A and had some tall trees at the time. The car would leave the area smoothly in less than 1min.

I think trying to work with facts, while imperfect, gets you closer to the truth.

To my knowledge, there aren’t any sightings of a car near the apartment during the abduction window (or before, there was a sighting of a suspicious white van a couple of days before). There are no sightings, during the abduction window, of two or more potential abductors. There is no evidence from 5A that there were any abductors let alone two or more.

There is however a credible sighting of one perpetrator with someone who was given a 60% chance of being MM by three people.

in light of these facts, I don’t understand why people who think the abduction occurred favour a multiple abductors leaving by car ... I guess because it feels more plausible.

There were other clues that night that support the Smith sighting and could be aligned to CBs involvement - the driver at the OC that had the night off who lived in the Edificio Luztur near the Smith sighting, the two fair-haired men arguing near the same apartment at 11pm and SM’s parents house very close to the Smith sighting.

I mentioned this before but I don’t believe there aren’t any links between the case file and CB. If CB is the perpetrator of MMs abduction, I find it inconceivable that there isn’t anything or anyone in the case file connected to him.

I tend to link up my theory of;
Two persons - needed for look-out and getting MM out of the apartment. One leaving in the opposite direction after the abduction.
Short walk - with MM to a car parked further away from the apartment. It would be more obvious to a possible witness very close to the apartments, who later associated suspicious activity directly to the abduction scene. This scenario ( of a short walk) would give him time to get away quicker. Look how long it took for any results from the Tannerman account.
to the witness accounts of Tannerman and the two blonde men seen a few days before. JMO IMO

 

[Dlk79]

Maybe the warrant was served while CB was in jail for theft/disobedience, hence he only served 2 weeks and then was possibly deported/extradited?

He first came to the attention of Portuguese authorities in 1999, when he was arrested following a bar brawl. He was handed a two-month jail term in Evora, near Lisbon, but was freed after a matter of weeks.

True untold story of Madeleine McCann suspect who seemed like 'perfect gent'

This article says he was arrested following a brawl, but I'm sure other reports stated the Evora sentence was actually for theft.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

A agree there might be some same place nearby 5A, but how on earth could he leave in safety any time later? Everybody at PDL was suspicious at the time of course and a short call to police about a strange neighbor would be just fatal.

That’s a fair point if MM was held in the safe location was for several hours or more.

If the safe location was to get MM out of sight though and a quick transition to a car, perhaps the abduction by foot and the Smith sighting is still occurred.

The picture below shows the distance from 5A to the Smith sighting, it’s downhill and not very far.

 

[MENDEL]

Does anyone here remember Dutroux and the excavations at that time?
Just a short intro about my question regarding to this...
I was curious about possible DNA traces that might have been found in the murder of Carola Titze,but what I read is about an mobile home (white and beige) wich was seen in the area,days before CT was found murdered. I cant find any pictures of the mobile that has been mentioned in several articles and compare it to CBs know vehicles. CB had the van in 1999? If I am correct?

“The man recognized in the images about the excavations at Dutroux a mobile home of the murderer, which strongly resembles a mobile home he saw in De Haan at the time.’
Speurder linkt mobilhome van Dutroux aan Duitse zaak

You recall such an important case connected to a powerful peds ring with lots of witnesses killed, or at least dead...

He's a good candidate in Titze's case as he was arrested August 13, 1996 correct?