Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #16

[Chiatos]

Does anyone here remember Dutroux and the excavations at that time?
Just a short intro about my question regarding to this...
I was curious about possible DNA traces that might have been found in the murder of Carola Titze,but what I read is about an mobile home (white and beige) wich was seen in the area,days before CT was found murdered. I cant find any pictures of the mobile that has been mentioned in several articles and compare it to CBs know vehicles. CB had the van in 1999? If I am correct?

“The man recognized in the images about the excavations at Dutroux a mobile home of the murderer, which strongly resembles a mobile home he saw in De Haan at the time.’
Speurder linkt mobilhome van Dutroux aan Duitse zaak

Hi WW! Yes, I agree, I have posted once that CB reminds me of Dutroux and of Fourniret.
Certainly not of Fritzl.

Dutroux was also constantly surrounded by scrap cars / meddling with number plates etc.

I have no time to post further now, will have to do that some other time.

 

[tedtink]

I have four kids and shoulders are definitely the easiest carrying option. Psychologically though, for an abductor I think it would feel like it would draw more attention. Additionally, shoulders are no option if you want to keep the child asleep.

I agree.
If SM sighting was the perp, the route doesn't seem far to walk in normal circumstances.
Carrying a child after having taken them from their bed, putting them over your shoulder, going through a window, or door without them waking, or stirring baffles me.
I can't see how a child would not have woken up, or stirred, over that distance and a child, if woken, cannot usually be soothed by an accent or voice that is unfamiliar to them imo.

 

[MENDEL]

Witness MMMdS at about 2200 saw a small grey car parked close to the window. However it is still there in press photos next morning and therefore irrelevant IMO.
P.J. POLICE FILES: MARIA MANUELA MARTINS DA SILVA

Yes, I agree. An irrelevant sighting that couldn't be linked to MM's disappearance.

 

[worldwatcher]

You recall such an important case connected to a powerful peds ring with lots of witnesses killed, or at least dead...

He's a good candidate in Titze's case as he was arrested August 13, 1996 correct?

Yes correction 1996.
(Carole Titze went missing on Juli ,5 1996 and a week later her badly decomposed body was found)

I was just wondering if the mobile home that has been mentioned looks similar to CBs van? I am not very good with cars/vans/models etc.
And to be honest, I don’t know anymore,first the mobile home,that was seen prior to Carole T. missing, was white and beige and here it says ‘
There was a car in the parking lot of Dutroux's property. A big brown and beige American mobile home".

The investigator claims it was the same vehicle.’

Privacy settings

 

[Pixie Child]

When I Googled ‘Jaguar’ with McCannFiles, this came up. I can’t find the reference on the actual page. Any idea what this ‘Jag’ was?

 

[redplanet]

Yes, I agree. An irrelevant sighting that couldn't be linked to MM's disappearance.

Irish witness JJ reported seeing a black saloon car containing two men reverse sharply in the supermarket car park at about 20:30. Sorry can no longer find the MSM source

 

[redplanet]

When I Googled ‘Jaguar’ with McCannFiles, this came up. I can’t find the reference on the actual page. Any idea what this ‘Jag’ was?

That was GA's car and therefore irrelevant. It is nothing to do with CB's jaguar.

 

[peanutJelly]

When I Googled ‘Jaguar’ with McCannFiles, this came up. I can’t find the reference on the actual page. Any idea what this ‘Jag’ was?

Just skim read, looks to refer to a Jag used by GA but not directly owned by him so couldn’t be used to pay any court costs?

 

[Newthoughts]

I’m not necessarily disagreeing but just a few things to help clarify in my own mind.

If a car was used in close proximity to 5a, there is a risk that the car would be seen and be identifiable? Are there any statements or articles that mention a car in in the area during the abduction window?

If the car wasn’t in close proximity to 5a, MM had to be carried to it by foot. What is the optimal distance to have minimal risk of a traceable car being identified vs being seen carrying the child on foot?

The Smith sighting was 3-4 minutes via backstreets then no further sightings. Does this meet the requirement of “vehicle close by?”

I think quickly into a car would be sensible BUT I think his VW van was very noticeable. If he escaped onto the car park - which is via the window or the front door - it would be noted. There were other holidaymakers - campervans are cool.

So I think the risk of carrying her a short distand outweighed the risk of noticeable van.

And nobody has come forward

 

[Denis R Tandib]

A car would be fast enough to be too discreet to notice. Smithman's sighting makes CB unlikely. Where's the truth I can't know so far. But each possible lead should be consistent.

Physically and especially considering the sighting was in the dark, don’t you think the description of Smithman (26/5) is consistent with CB?

A child physically matching MM was definitely sighted; German LE seem certain CB was responsible.

Why do you give the chances of Smithman being CB less than 10% chance? I’m curious to understand this.

 

[MENDEL]

When I Googled ‘Jaguar’ with McCannFiles, this came up. I can’t find the reference on the actual page. Any idea what this ‘Jag’ was?

That's a Portuguese plate and car's VIN is SAJAA011X87N81360

Seems to be a 2004 Jaguar X-type XE but I don't know if VIN checkers I used are reliable enough.

If manufacture year is correct it can't be the same as his was seized by customs before January 15, 2004.

Jaguar owners club states model year 2008 which readily excludes it.

Please do your VIN search and let me know.

Can you link that source, Pixie?

 

[MENDEL]

Physically and especially considering the sighting was in the dark, don’t you think the description of Smithman (26/5) is consistent with CB?

A child physically matching MM was definitely sighted; German LE seem certain CB was responsible.

Why do you give the chances of Smithman being CB less than 10% chance? I’m curious to understand this.

For the simple reason it's nonsense CB would follow such a path. He had to have a destination within PDL and none is known so far and he wouldn't park a car that far away.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

I agree.
If SM sighting was the perp, the route doesn't seem far to walk in normal circumstances.
Carrying a child after having taken them from their bed, putting them over your shoulder, going through a window, or door without them waking, or stirring baffles me.
I can't see how a child would not have woken up, or stirred, over that distance and a child, if woken, cannot usually be soothed by an accent or voice that is unfamiliar to them imo.

I agree entirely. I could be wrong but I don’t think any of my kids aged four would have remained asleep while being carried or passed through a window ... especially not by a stranger/s. Perhaps my kids are light sleepers.

That said, GM was very unconvincing when questioned by SF about sedation. And, Sean and Amelie slept through post abduction mayhem. Perhaps the McCann kids are deep sleepers.

 

[Tekno]

I think trying to work with facts, while imperfect, gets you closer to the truth.

To my knowledge, there aren’t any sightings of a car near the apartment during the abduction window (or before, there was a sighting of a suspicious white van a couple of days before). There are no sightings, during the abduction window, of two or more potential abductors. There is no evidence from 5A that there were any abductors let alone two or more.

There is however a credible sighting of one perpetrator with someone who was given a 60% chance of being MM by three people.

in light of these facts, I don’t understand why people who think the abduction occurred favour a multiple abductors leaving by car ... I guess because it feels more plausible.

There were other clues that night that support the Smith sighting and could be aligned to CBs involvement - the driver at the OC that had the night off who lived in the Edificio Luztur near the Smith sighting, the two fair-haired men arguing near the same apartment at 11pm and SM’s parents house very close to the Smith sighting.

I mentioned this before but I don’t believe there aren’t any links between the case file and CB. If CB is the perpetrator of MMs abduction, I find it inconceivable that there isn’t anything or anyone in the case file connected to him.

Hi Denis, also interesting is that the Ocean Club staff quarters are on that same route, almost across the Edificio Luztur building.

 

[Ausgrlz]

For the simple reason it's nonsense CB would follow such a path.

This is a bit harsh surely especially when CB had a nickname of ‘Nightwalker’ and had an excellent background on the quieter streets. Perhaps you could rephrase this to include ‘in my opinion’.

Edited to fix capitalisation error

 

[enjy15]

Madeleine McCann suspect 'won't go on trial' over disappearance, lawyer claims This reads to me FF seems to be sweating bit I think, he knows LE have something, but I think its getting to him not knowing what ? hahaha maybe well played LE I think, keep CB and FF on their toes.

I really think FF is trying to patronise the LE by going to MSM saying they have nothing, I think he is playing a game with them to force out what evidence they have so he can prepare better. How can FF be so confident on CB being innocent when he hasn’t seen the evidence or knows what it is?

 

[Tekno]

No car sightings is the most strange part to me. Only RM's mother mentioned a seemingly rental car driving counter-hand near 5A (a likely British tourist IMO).

Hi Mendel, wasn’t a small car noticed in the parking area of block 5, by the two women who left an apartment from block 6 at around the time of M’s disappearance? It is in the PJ files. I will post a reference.

 

[Tekno]

No car sightings is the most strange part to me. Only RM's mother mentioned a seemingly rental car driving counter-hand near 5A (a likely British tourist IMO).

Hi Mendel, wasn’t a small car noticed in the parking area of block 5, by the two women who left an apartment from block 6 at around the time of M’s disappearance? It is in the PJ files. I will post a reference. Sorry, I see RedPlanet has already posted.

 

[Pixie Child]

That's a Portuguese plate and car's VIN is SAJAA011X87N81360

Seems to be a 2004 Jaguar X-type XE but I don't know if VIN checkers I used are reliable enough.

If manufacture year is correct it can't be the same as his was seized by customs before January 15, 2004.

Jaguar owners club states model year 2008 which readily excludes it.

Please do your VIN search and let me know.

Can you link that source, Pixie?

Goncalo Amaral - The Interviews (2011-2012)*

Seems Amaral bought the car in May ‘09 and it was seized as part of the McCann libel case. Court gets Gonçalo Amaral's Jaguar. Expresso 28-10-09

 

[Denis R Tandib]

For the simple reason it's nonsense CB would follow such a path. He had to have a destination within PDL and none is known so far and he wouldn't park a car that far away.

If this is the case, perhaps considering possible destinations is worthwhile.