Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #16

[mrjitty]

Crossing junction exactly as female JT described is a reasonable route from block 4 to creche. Their block 4 apartment had a kitchen therefore it is not necessary to assume eating out. IMO a reasonable explanation is she saw him walking towards creche, carrying the 2yo, to collect the 3yo. You can find evidence that only one of the two attended evening creche on a different evening tapas reservation sheet. The usual "witness stated direction wrong" analysis omits to even consider that there were 2 kids.

In any event, seeing as the Met could speak to both JT and the crecheman to unravel all this, one is entitled to presume the Met resolved that aspect of her evidence to everyone's satisfaction.

 

[redplanet]

Yes. "Zufall" oder "zufällig" means random or by coincidence.

Which ties in with a news report which stated that it was a member of public (a walker) who found the dog bones. Sorry I have lost the link, i will try to find again.

 

[redplanet]

The discovery of the dog bones is so crucial (because of the data stash found buried beneath) that I would like to know exactly the date the dog bones were found.

 

[tedtink]

The discovery of the dog bones is so crucial (because of the data stash found buried beneath) that I would like to know exactly the date the dog bones were found.

It's difficult to ascertain what was found first.
The 'big' raid was reportedly done on Feb 23 2016 after suspecting child *advertiser censored*.
Maybe the data from the dog was found previously when the illegal waste search was going on? I would have imagined one would have stumbled on the dogs head (previously mentioned) sticking out of the ground if looking for illegal waste?
Perhaps it was a dogs skull sticking out and this is what the bones could have been?

Großeinsatz in der Börde:Kinderporno-Razzia auf vermülltem Fabrikgelände
JMO.

 

[redplanet]

In any event, seeing as the Met could speak to both JT and the crecheman to unravel all this, one is entitled to presume the Met resolved that aspect of her evidence to everyone's satisfaction.

I hope so. BTW the common forum explanation (claiming she remembered direction wrong) fails to consider or explain: where is his other child?

 

[Sharkbite]

I might have missed this, but something interesting about the Diakoniewerk Wilhelmshof close to where IG went missing and where CB was said to have visited a friend who was employed at the facility.

"Clinic embroiled in scandal in 2008
The facility serves to help the disabled and addicts and has nothing to do with the forensic specialist clinic, which is about 3.5 kilometers away. Sex offenders and pedophiles are also housed here. In 2008 the clinic was even involved in a scandal. Child *advertiser censored* has been smuggled into it. A swap ring existed in the clinic, uncovered during a raid."

Inga Gehricke und Madeleine McCann: Staatsanwaltschaft Stendal sucht Verbindung zwischen Maddy und Inga
Google Translate

 

[Newthoughts]

Sure. And no one will guess a car parked on the street is from an abductor in action. Same reasoning. Why bother? Smithsonian sighting is as valuable and vague as all other sightings that night and all are worth the same. Only interpretations differ and some are quite palatable. But assuming CB is perpetrator I prefer to analyze things prospectively under such assumption and not retrospectively trying to make irrelevant facts relevant. CB has nothing to do with PDL village and so he fled somewhere else. Then, he wouldn't park a car that far away just because no one would guess he was carrying an abducted child but it would be extremely suspicious to see a car on street.

Your points are valid if CB drove something like a Honda Civic or Suzuki swift or any of the other thousands of anonymous cars we don't register as we walk past. But he wasn't - he was driving a mustard and white campervan. It would stand out even in a place where they were more common than usual. Even now 13 years later German LE are assuming it unique enough to ask people for sightings.

I assume LE would asked folk if they'd seen anything at the pertinent time but nobody reported seeing or hearing anything.

I've been I awe of the work all of the sleuthers have done in identifying where the van was parked and in identifying specific locations and acquaintances. The only thing that remains a mystery is that night. There is very little info from that night which does make this sighting important IMO.

If it was an innocent parent I think they'd have come forward. Everyone was hit by the story.

 

[tedtink]

I might have missed this, but something interesting about the Diakoniewerk Wilhelmshof close to where IG went missing and where CB was said to have visited a friend who was employed at the facility.

"Clinic embroiled in scandal in 2008
The facility serves to help the disabled and addicts and has nothing to do with the forensic specialist clinic, which is about 3.5 kilometers away. Sex offenders and pedophiles are also housed here. In 2008 the clinic was even involved in a scandal. Child *advertiser censored* has been smuggled into it. A swap ring existed in the clinic, uncovered during a raid."


Inga Gehricke und Madeleine McCann: Staatsanwaltschaft Stendal sucht Verbindung zwischen Maddy und Inga
Google Translate

Thanks!
Very interesting read.

"Only now has it become known that witnesses allegedly testified that the man only repeatedly visited the property until May 6, 2015. In December 2017 he was sentenced to prison for sexually abusing a child (in 2013) and for possessing and procuring child *advertiser censored*."
Inga Gehricke und Madeleine McCann: Staatsanwaltschaft Stendal sucht Verbindung zwischen Maddy und Inga


and this from Sleuths timeline..........

"G 2015: 2 may: inge gehricke goes missing
Diakoniewerk Wilhelmshof e. V., Wilhelmshoferstr. 14, 39576 Stendal, Germany
a family outing. a visit to their friends working and living on the premises of the Deaconry.
The Deaconry (the employees care for people with addictions and disabilities)


So it seems, both CB and IG's parents knew people/had friends at this facility.
.

 

[mrjitty]

I hope so. BTW the common forum explanation (claiming she remembered direction wrong) fails to consider or explain: where is his other child?

It's a good insight

Also I think in these forum discussions it can be forgetten that LE can talk to the people concerned and figure out these sorts of issues.

From my point of view, JT must have told the detectives she is now satisfied it was crecheman

 

[Chiatos]

I watched it yesterday but after a while,my brains refused to registrated what I wachted:
Privacy settings
.I did read that the POI in Carola’s murder, was staying in a tent near by.I am trying to find that link again,I do think I picked it up from the German forum All Mystery

ETA (found) :

“Seven years later, the murder remains unsolved. For a while, suspicions hung over a mysterious young ex-East German who would have stayed in a tent in the campsite next to the complex.

The young man had been seen on several occasions frolicking with Carola at the Aquafun, a Sunparks attraction. A composite portrait was even made, but the German was never identified. The investigation was never successful.”
Encore un meurtre au Sunparks

Apparently, Dutroux had an American mobilhome. It was visible in images in 1996. (Images that I have not been able to find).
The investigator who recognised the mobilhome said: Niet het soort mobilhome dat je op elke hoek van de straat aantreft.
Not the kind mobilhome that you find at each street corner. Was it a Winnebago?

Eleven years later CB turns up with an American mobilhome, a huge Winnebago. Not the kind that you find on every corner.

How many Winnebagos were there in Europe at the time? Were they being imported on a regular basis?
Were they imported to, say, London? Berlin?
I haven't been able to find any info on that.

 

[worldwatcher]

Apparently, Dutroux had an American mobilhome. It was visible in images in 1996. (Images that I have not been able to find).
The investigator who recognised the mobilhome said: Niet het soort mobilhome dat je op elke hoek van de straat aantreft.
Not the kind mobilhome that you find at each street corner. Was it a Winnebago?

Eleven years later CB turns up with an American mobilhome, a huge Winnebago. Not the kind that you find on every corner.

How many Winnebagos were there in Europe at the time? Were they being imported on a regular basis?
Were they imported to, say, London? Berlin?
I haven't been able to find any info on that.

Hi Chiatos
Really have no idea what I watched yesterday, it is French (not my language) and due to the hot weather was not really paying attention. But from what I read /understand it must be in this crime stopper program or doc?
"Faites entrer l'accusé""
It came from the link I posted and you replied.
Also when CB first arrived in Portugal with his GF, he/they camped in a tent.
As it was also mentioned the POI did, who was seen with Carola T.

I really lost track of the dates of his unregistered cars, but from my memory collection he had that old rusty VW van.
Feel free to correct me...

 

[worldwatcher]

So it seems during the search for illegal waste, (inc smelly rotting dogs maybe?) child *advertiser censored* was found which then lead LE to look at possible connection to IG and not because they busted the site because of IG suspicion.

I thought that some children alerted their parents/LE because they found bones.
Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #7

 

[Newthoughts]

JT says she saw him cross the road from west to east. I suggest that is exactly the way he went. Remember the Met have not released the man's statement. Why should he not be walking towards the creche at about 10pm? There is actually an example on the Wednesday night of another couple picking up a child from creche then later carrying that child back towards the creche, for a very good and logical reason.

Why would you be walking towards the creche at 10pm. I'd assume you'd pick your child up and go back to your appt

How sure was JT of her sighting

 

[Sharkbite]

I might have missed this, but something interesting about the Diakoniewerk Wilhelmshof close to where IG went missing and where CB was said to have visited a friend who was employed at the facility.

"Clinic embroiled in scandal in 2008
The facility serves to help the disabled and addicts and has nothing to do with the forensic specialist clinic, which is about 3.5 kilometers away. Sex offenders and pedophiles are also housed here. In 2008 the clinic was even involved in a scandal. Child *advertiser censored* has been smuggled into it. A swap ring existed in the clinic, uncovered during a raid."

Inga Gehricke und Madeleine McCann: Staatsanwaltschaft Stendal sucht Verbindung zwischen Maddy und Inga
Google Translate

To add:

The same facility had a similar CP scandal in 2013

"The man from North Rhine-Westphalia is being investigated for child *advertiser censored*. He was also an inmate in Uchtspringe in 2008 when child *advertiser censored* files were found on him during raids."

Staatsanwaltschaft ermittelt wegen Geldwäsche in Uchtspringe
Google Translate

Not sure if and where CB would fit into this, but they do seem to be his 'type' of people.

 

[SuperdadV8]

To add:

The same facility had a similar CP scandal in 2013

"The man from North Rhine-Westphalia is being investigated for child *advertiser censored*. He was also an inmate in Uchtspringe in 2008 when child *advertiser censored* files were found on him during raids."

Staatsanwaltschaft ermittelt wegen Geldwäsche in Uchtspringe
Google Translate

Not sure if and where CB would fit into this, but they do seem to be his 'type' of people.

Here you have got another article, that referred to possible traces between C.B. and an employee of the Wilhelmshof, being investigated.

But Maßregelvollzug Uchtspringe and Diakoniewerk Wilhelmshof are different facilities!

Fall Maddie: Ermittler prüfen Zusammenhang zu weiterem Vermisstenfall - DER SPIEGEL - Panorama

 

[tedtink]

Here's a little info on the drugs trafficking

Christian B. "bought two kilograms of marijuana at a price of 8,000 euros from a 'Julia' in Oranienburg in the summer of 2007"
According to the trial documents, Christian B. is said to have bought "by spring 2008 in eight further cases at least one kilogram of marijuana for 4,000 euros each" in Oranienburg. On October 6, 2011, the Niebüll District Court finally sentenced Christian B. to a suspended sentence of one year and nine months for drug trafficking. Reason for the suspended sentence: The court attested Christian B. a "favorable social prognosis" and assumed that "the accused will let the conviction serve as a warning and will not commit any more criminal offenses in the future without the influence of the prison system".

Vermisst: Fall Maddie McCann - Spur von Christian B. führt nach Oranienburg

 

[peanutJelly]

In any event, seeing as the Met could speak to both JT and the crecheman to unravel all this, one is entitled to presume the Met resolved that aspect of her evidence to everyone's satisfaction.

I think not, given that there’s still a sketch of Tannerman on the official Find Madeline website, appealing for help identifying him

Witness Accounts: | findmadeleine.com

 

[Newthoughts]

It's a good insight

Also I think in these forum discussions it can be forgetten that LE can talk to the people concerned and figure out these sorts of issues.

From my point of view, JT must have told the detectives she is now satisfied it was crecheman

As he appears to have been eliminated I imagine LE are satisfied it was him.

The woman in purple seen by JW is assumed to have been JT herself.

The dreadlocked man seen by JW that night has been identified as an innocent OC resident.

Only Smithman has not been eliminated and therefore seems to be the only clue left to that actual night as far as I'm aware.

I don't think it's particularly illuminating. I think a car nearby would be sensible for an abduction. But Smithman is all there seems to be as far as I can see - from that night in the important timeframe

 

[peanutJelly]

It's difficult to ascertain what was found first.
The 'big' raid was reportedly done on Feb 23 2016 after suspecting child *advertiser censored*.
Maybe the data from the dog was found previously when the illegal waste search was going on? I would have imagined one would have stumbled on the dogs head (previously mentioned) sticking out of the ground if looking for illegal waste?
Perhaps it was a dogs skull sticking out and this is what the bones could have been?

Großeinsatz in der Börde:Kinderporno-Razzia auf vermülltem Fabrikgelände
JMO.

I’m not sure it was one of his beloved dogs that were found buried with their heads sticking out. IMO this was just for his fun, the USBs were more likely buried beneath a dog buried properly, not advertising the burial site with a literal ‘headstone’

 

[mrjitty]

I think not, given that there’s still a sketch of Tannerman on the official Find Madeline website, appealing for help identifying him

Witness Accounts: | findmadeleine.com

So you think the Met ruled out Tannerman despite the witness being unsatisfied?

Or could it be JT and the Met have no official relationship with that website?