Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #17

[mrjitty]

It's a fair point. One thing that we know of CB's sexual offences against against children is that they seem to take place outdoors, in public settings. The two offences as a teenager were both out in the open. The sexual offence against the 5yr old child of his ex girlfriend took place in a park when you'd think he would have had opportunity to pick a more private setting. And then there's the masturbating incident in the playground in Messines.

It's entirely feasible CB may have taken MM to somewhere nearby but quiet, and disposed of her there too. The garbage system in Luz is based on large communal industrial type bins. These are emptied between 12 and 4am nightly, each bin collected in varying frequency depending on usage. No attempts to halt refuse collections were made following the disappearance of MM so they just continued as normal. The PJ did carry out checks on bins (not sure how thorough) but the work was not completed until the 7th by which time many of the bins had already been taken to landfill. CB may well have just got very lucky unfortunately.

I also find the templates of his known offending interesting, because they fit typical profiles.

The outdoor offending is relatively typical/opportunistic. We know he committed a worse offence where he had access. Lots of electronic offences.

Then on the rape - he leaves the victim alive because there is no link between himself and the victim. This again is common with that kind of offender.

MM abduction doesn't fit his other offending but that may be just because we don't know about his other offences, or it was an escalation. But like you say, there are typically 3 crime scenes in such cases. The place of abduction. A hidden place where the assault occured (this will be a place he feels safe in/controls) and then the dumping ground - where the body is dumped of hidden.

Like you say, there is a decent chance he simply dumped the body and it hasn't been found through dumb luck. It can take decades for some bodies to be found if ever

Your idea about bins etc, a remote burial, dumped at sea etc - IMO these are far more likely than moving the victim any great distance.

 

[katydid23]

I also find the templates of his known offending interesting, because they fit typical profiles.

The outdoor offending is relatively typical/opportunistic. We know he committed a worse offence where he had access. Lots of electronic offences.

Then on the rape - he leaves the victim alive because there is no link between himself and the victim. This again is common with that kind of offender.

MM abduction doesn't fit his other offending but that may be just because we don't know about his other offences, or it was an escalation. But like you say, there are typically 3 crime scenes in such cases. The place of abduction. A hidden place where the assault occured (this will be a place he feels safe in/controls) and then the dumping ground - where the body is dumped of hidden.

Like you say, there is a decent chance he simply dumped the body and it hasn't been found through dumb luck. It can take decades for some bodies to be found if ever

Your idea about bins etc, a remote burial, dumped at sea etc - IMO these are far more likely than moving the victim any great distance.

"Like you say, there is a decent chance he simply dumped the body and it hasn't been found through dumb luck. It can take decades for some bodies to be found if ever"

Yes^^^...and if he did happen upon a garbage bin, that was about to be picked up and taken to the dump---she will never ever be recovered.

And if that is the case, then he is supremely confident she will never be found. And he may be relatively certain he will never be charged.

 

[Lilly b]

I also find the templates of his known offending interesting, because they fit typical profiles.

The outdoor offending is relatively typical/opportunistic. We know he committed a worse offence where he had access. Lots of electronic offences.

Then on the rape - he leaves the victim alive because there is no link between himself and the victim. This again is common with that kind of offender.

MM abduction doesn't fit his other offending but that may be just because we don't know about his other offences, or it was an escalation. But like you say, there are typically 3 crime scenes in such cases. The place of abduction. A hidden place where the assault occured (this will be a place he feels safe in/controls) and then the dumping ground - where the body is dumped of hidden.

Like you say, there is a decent chance he simply dumped the body and it hasn't been found through dumb luck. It can take decades for some bodies to be found if ever

Your idea about bins etc, a remote burial, dumped at sea etc - IMO these are far more likely than moving the victim any great distance.

Working on the theory mm was in one of the pictures /video, then I don't suppose she would be put in a bin that night?, and if she was put in the sea, body would be washed up somewhere, unless weighted down. Then surely would be seen by someone and is quite risky.

 

[Lilly b]

NIGHT MADDIE VANISHED Nanny working when Madeleine McCann disappeared reveals what REALLY happened – and claimed resort was so unsafe she was given a rape alarm
The Ocean Club worker, who was childminding on the night Maddie disappeared and witnessed her parents' reaction, has spoken

ellie flynnlauren fruen
8:33, 18 Apr 2017Updated: 3:16, 19 Apr 2017
Comment now

A NANNY who was there the night Madeleine McCann vanished has claimed the resort was so unsafe she was given a rape alarm - and told not to go anywhere by herself.

The Ocean Club worker revealed her fears after a girl had been attacked "the year or so before in Praia da Luz" and said "it didn’t sound like a family resort to me".

A nanny who saw aftermath of Madeleine McCann's disappearance has recalled her parents' grief
A nanny who saw aftermath of Madeleine McCann's disappearance has recalled her parents' griefCredit: PAress Association
Kate and Gerry McCann were reportedly pacing up and down in anguish after Maddie vanished
Kate and Gerry McCann were reportedly pacing up and down in anguish after Maddie vanishedCredit: News Group Newspapers Ltd

The woman told The Mirror: "We were told, ‘Here’s a rape whistle, don’t go anywhere by yourself, ever.’ There’d been a girl attacked the year or so before in Praia da Luz. It didn’t sound like a family resort to me."

The nanny also recalled Maddie's parents' anguish and insists there is "no way they did it" - revealing Kate was in a "catatonic state" after realising her daughter was gone.


She blamed Portuguese police for a bungling investigation.

She told The Mirror officers told staff to "start looking in bins in case her body was in there" just hours after the youngster vanished and accused police of allowing people to traipse all over the crime scene.

The woman says she is regularly asked "if the parents did it", but insists there is "no way at all".

"A, timings and B, where it was, their reactions, the whole thing. Not a chance," she said.


MOST READ IN NEWS



Kate was reportedly in a "catatonic state" after realising Madeleine had vanished from their holiday apartment in Praia da Luz.

"She was pacing up and down. The worst possible thing had just happened to her," the woman said.

"I think I said something like, 'She'll be found, these things happen all the time.'

"She was crying but, almost in a catatonic state, and Gerry was very distressed. That's the one thing I really remember from him, looking under the cars. I can't forget that."


The worker claims police did not arrive for 90 minutes after being alerted and says people were walking in and out of the apartment - potentially destroying the scene.

That covers the bins were looked into, this was in the sun in 2017

 

[Victoria Chambers]

Which number should they have called?

Well I expect it is just the same as in the UK or the USA where you would not personally phone the FBI if your child went missing, would you dial the emergency services and ask for the police and they then contact the FBI? I don't know how it works in Portugal. Would it be the National Guard who you would dial to request an ambulance or is it another emergency number like 999 or 911 ? I've always thought the GNR were a higher rank than the local police. X

 

[Victoria Chambers]

Are we mixing up a guy helping translate on the ground discussions between police and a large number of foreign tourists with people giving actual statements?

As far as I am aware, RM was not involved in official statements

Honestly, if you read the official statements given and then signed by crèche staff, along with the officer conducting the interview RM name is printed at the top as being the translator of the actual interview. That's a far cry from helping out translations for the Media IMO X

 

[Victoria Chambers]

What is the difference between the PJ and the GNR ?? X

 

[Victoria Chambers]

Are we mixing up a guy helping translate on the ground discussions between police and a large number of foreign tourists with people giving actual statements?

As far as I am aware, RM was not involved in official statements

There you are mrjitty, 3 screenshots from the PJ files.

 

[Pixie Child]

Well I expect it is just the same as in the UK or the USA where you would not personally phone the FBI if your child went missing, would you dial the emergency services and ask for the police and they then contact the FBI? I don't know how it works in Portugal. Would it be the National Guard who you would dial to request an ambulance or is it another emergency number like 999 or 911 ? I've always thought the GNR were a higher rank than the local police. X

112 is the emergency number in European countries.

999 (& 112) works in Ireland/UK. 911 is the US emergency number.

112 should get you the PJ (not GNR).

 

[Victoria Chambers]

112 is the emergency number in European countries.

999 (& 112) works in Ireland/UK. 911 is the US emergency number.

112 should get you the PJ (not GNR).

It is a pity then that we did not see the phone records for 112. As a Brit, that is the number that I would dial in case of emergency. Phoning the National Guard would not enter my head. I've always believed that the McCanns did call police earlier than 10:41pm. Phoning the National Guard is not something we are taught to do in any situation tbh X

 

[Ardoch]

It's a fair point. One thing that we know of CB's sexual offences against against children is that they seem to take place outdoors, in public settings. The two offences as a teenager were both out in the open. The sexual offence against the 5yr old child of his ex girlfriend took place in a park when you'd think he would have had opportunity to pick a more private setting. And then there's the masturbating incident in the playground in Messines.

It's entirely feasible CB may have taken MM to somewhere nearby but quiet, and disposed of her there too. The garbage system in Luz is based on large communal industrial type bins. These are emptied between 12 and 4am nightly, each bin collected in varying frequency depending on usage. No attempts to halt refuse collections were made following the disappearance of MM so they just continued as normal. The PJ did carry out checks on bins (not sure how thorough) but the work was not completed until the 7th by which time many of the bins had already been taken to landfill. CB may well have just got very lucky unfortunately.

There's a bit of a pattern going on with public parks as well as videoing everything too.
Wonder if he was the only adult with the child in the park?
Maybe his girlfriend became his ex because she had suspicions about him and therefore he looked for opportunities to be alone with the child outside the house - if he lived with them?
Or did the assault happen after the ex girlfriend became his ex? If so, was he stalking the child? But then wouldn't someone know she was missing even for a short while?
Trying to form a pattern myself with a lot of questions and no answers.
I just wonder if there was an element of revenge in the attack and if so, has that been a factor in other assaults? JMO IMO

 

[Victoria Chambers]

NIGHT MADDIE VANISHED Nanny working when Madeleine McCann disappeared reveals what REALLY happened – and claimed resort was so unsafe she was given a rape alarm
The Ocean Club worker, who was childminding on the night Maddie disappeared and witnessed her parents' reaction, has spoken

ellie flynnlauren fruen
8:33, 18 Apr 2017Updated: 3:16, 19 Apr 2017
Comment now

A NANNY who was there the night Madeleine McCann vanished has claimed the resort was so unsafe she was given a rape alarm - and told not to go anywhere by herself.

The Ocean Club worker revealed her fears after a girl had been attacked "the year or so before in Praia da Luz" and said "it didn’t sound like a family resort to me".

A nanny who saw aftermath of Madeleine McCann's disappearance has recalled her parents' grief
A nanny who saw aftermath of Madeleine McCann's disappearance has recalled her parents' griefCredit: PAress Association
Kate and Gerry McCann were reportedly pacing up and down in anguish after Maddie vanished
Kate and Gerry McCann were reportedly pacing up and down in anguish after Maddie vanishedCredit: News Group Newspapers Ltd

The woman told The Mirror: "We were told, ‘Here’s a rape whistle, don’t go anywhere by yourself, ever.’ There’d been a girl attacked the year or so before in Praia da Luz. It didn’t sound like a family resort to me."

The nanny also recalled Maddie's parents' anguish and insists there is "no way they did it" - revealing Kate was in a "catatonic state" after realising her daughter was gone.


She blamed Portuguese police for a bungling investigation.

She told The Mirror officers told staff to "start looking in bins in case her body was in there" just hours after the youngster vanished and accused police of allowing people to traipse all over the crime scene.

The woman says she is regularly asked "if the parents did it", but insists there is "no way at all".

"A, timings and B, where it was, their reactions, the whole thing. Not a chance," she said.


MOST READ IN NEWS



Kate was reportedly in a "catatonic state" after realising Madeleine had vanished from their holiday apartment in Praia da Luz.

"She was pacing up and down. The worst possible thing had just happened to her," the woman said.

"I think I said something like, 'She'll be found, these things happen all the time.'

"She was crying but, almost in a catatonic state, and Gerry was very distressed. That's the one thing I really remember from him, looking under the cars. I can't forget that."


The worker claims police did not arrive for 90 minutes after being alerted and says people were walking in and out of the apartment - potentially destroying the scene.

That covers the bins were looked into, this was in the sun in 2017

Aww, looking under cars! It breaks my heart to think of K & GM on that night! They did leave their babies unattended but nobody deserves this to happen to them. Least of all, Madeleine. Heartbreaking.
I pray the police do get their evidence together. Make sure he never gets out! X

 

[tedtink]

Well I expect it is just the same as in the UK or the USA where you would not personally phone the FBI if your child went missing, would you dial the emergency services and ask for the police and they then contact the FBI? I don't know how it works in Portugal. Would it be the National Guard who you would dial to request an ambulance or is it another emergency number like 999 or 911 ? I've always thought the GNR were a higher rank than the local police. X

Emergency services is 112 on mobiles, Uk and EU.
This is common knowledge.

 

[snowpea666]

Line 15 - swabs of possible hematic stains collected at Rua 25 de Abril, PDL! That's too near Smithsonian sighting and worth sleuthing.

And the street SM lived !

 

[Chiatos]

If only the McCanns had known that they were surrounded by devouring monsters and that they had travelled right into an orc's den:
- Clement F.
- Martin N.
- Raymond H.
- Christian B.
- ...?

 

[snowpea666]

Gray car ........ could this be something ? P.J. POLICE FILES: NUNO LOURENCO

 

[snowpea666]

This is the car I mean

Haha I just posted this regarding the car, sorry I didn't see you already had it up

 

[snowpea666]

I keep my conviction that this was all masterminded by someone more clever than Sir Arthur Conan Doyle and bigmouth disastrous CB was but a pawn. The weakest link and lucky to be alive.

You know Mendel I really believe this also, could be wrong, but I think MM was a trophy for some sicko, yes paedos can get kids sadly from poor areas easy, but a little blond British girl from a well off family ??

 

[snowpea666]

If only the McCanns had known that they were surrounded by devouring monsters and that they had travelled right into an orc's den:
- Clement F.
- Martin N.
- Raymond H.
- Christian B.
- ...?

And how many more ? So very sad The LE knew about this and turned a blind eye

 

[Anxala]

And yet somehow it is always the fault of GNR/PJ that no one from the Tapa's group, all of whom had mobiles, decided to call for emergency police assistance

This, all day long.