NO BAIL! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 -#27

[pulpfiction]

GBC is in the psyche unit at Wacol. Apparently he freaked out when they put him in the usual cell they hold ppl in. He has been in the psyche ward since. This info is from an extremely reliable source. :jail:

Was told the same thing and I have an extrmely reliable source also Poor, poor GBC! I bet he's freaking out and I hope he is suffering. There's no access to mirrors or anything that he could use on himself as he's quite high risk naturally for self-harm.

**All IMO **

 

[Solaris]

There a saying around Psych traps that one is more 'at risk' from a person with a character disorder than an organic mental illness as the latter are managed by medication and case management. Character disorders usually cause more harm to others.MOO.

It is true that you are more likely to experience harm from someone with a personality disorder than someone with an organic mental illness like schizophrenia. A large percentage of prison inmates would have a diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder. Some of the biggest corporate crimes in history have been perpetrated by people with personality disorders (e.g, the collapse of Enron).

For me the essential and key difference between certain personality disorders (e.g., antisocial, narcissistic) and the general population (+ people with other forms of mental illness) is lack of empathy.

If you have no ability to put yourself into the shoes of the people who are likely to be affected by your actions and anticipate their pain and suffering, then there are no psychological barriers to you engaging in some truly heinous behaviours.

That is also the reason that a lot of people on this forum have trouble understanding GBC's actions (if he did murder ABC). A "normal" person with intact empathy would not consider murdering the mother of their children for money because they would be able to anticipate the emotional consequences for other people (e.g., ABC, her friends, the Dickies, the children etc.). If GBC does have a personality disorder where "lack of empathy" is a symptom, then he is unable to do this and is much more likely to engage in a range of behaviours that a person with intact empathy would not. IMO

 

[Rational]

Is anyone online who is at the cricket match? Would love to hear some news??

 

[pulpfiction]

You are right. Handy place to keep a prisoner who is still subject to forensic test ect.

GBC will be held in that area until he is classified.

When a prisoner is asked to go into a cell, he will goin. There is no oooops cannot go in there. Have you got any better? lol:floorlaugh:

There is nowhere to hide at Arthur Gorrie. Every prisoner is treated the same regardless of his offense. There is no cushy place.

· Assessment: during this process, your health, education and intervention needs will
be assessed. Your security classification will determine which centre you go to.
Classification and assessment can take up to three weeks. Once it is completed,
you may be transferred to another centre

http://www.correctiveservices.qld.g..._and_Reports/prisoner_information_booklet.pdf

Entirely correct

 

[KG1]

What a stressful way to live. Didn't Jocelyn say it was for a business venture that could have and should have worked?

From my understanding, the $200,000 and the $90,000 owed to Jocelyn Frost and the other male partner, would be the share of the partnership/business that they were in together. It likely consists of initial injection of funds, plus profits and less expenses. It appears that those two partners have walked away with nothing, and explains why they left. They must have discovered the extent of the debt, and knew that they were working for nothing, with no hope of any relief. The sad part for them is that they will be held responsible for the debts of any such partnership. More lives disrupted and ruined.

 

[Thinking]

I am sure it's true. I wasn't precise with my wording probably. By know I meant they are guessing. It is my impression only based on the video footage and photos. And I don't actually believe GBC will ever confess, even to his own lawyers. JMO.

In my opinion they would know as well as we know who is responsible - no doubt about it. They have been around for long enough to have known from day one as well - they know crims better than the average Joe!

It is only if the accused actually makes an admission of guilt to his lawyer, that they must cease to act or advise to enter a lower plea such as manslaughter, as I understand it. These lawyers are doing their job - their view would be that everyone is entitled to a defence and in law the accused is innocent until proven guilty.

 

[pulpfiction]

It is true that you are more likely to experience harm from someone with a personality disorder than someone with an organic mental illness like schizophrenia. A large percentage of prison inmates would have a diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder. Some of the biggest corporate crimes in history have been perpetrated by people with personality disorders (e.g, the collapse of Enron).

For me the essential and key difference between certain personality disorders (e.g., antisocial, narcissistic) and the general population (+ people with other forms of mental illness) is lack of empathy.

If you have no ability to put yourself into the shoes of the people who are likely to be affected by your actions and anticipate their pain and suffering, then there are no psychological barriers to you engaging in some truly heinous behaviours.

That is also the reason that a lot of people on this forum have trouble understanding GBC's actions (if he did murder ABC). A "normal" person with intact empathy would not consider murdering the mother of their children for money because they would be able to anticipate the emotional consequences for other people (e.g., ABC, her friends, the Dickies, the children etc.). If GBC does have a personality disorder where "lack of empathy" is a symptom, then he is unable to do this and is much more likely to engage in a range of behaviours that a person with intact empathy would not. IMO

All one can do is speculate. There are no hard and fast rules when it comes to PDs or other mental illnesses like schizophrenia. There are MANY schizophrenics who lead ordinary lives here amongst us in our community. I think we all know someone who is a bit this or that. We're looking at extremes with prison populations and a person like GBC. in a nutshell anyone can be unpredictable but some are more sinister than others and more dangerous.

Right now GBC will be in shock. He'd be going through a range of emotions. Some of it acted some legit. He'd want to stay in he psych/medical area. he can't control a prison environment in any way. This would annoy and frighten him considerably. He's a major risk ATM until he's classified and adjusts. Time will help with that and lets face it he'll have plenty of it.

 

[pulpfiction]

Both psyche and medical units could be just one physical place within the compound.

Exactly. And trust me the psych/medical units in prison are not cushy in any way. I've been to many all over Australia and internationally.

Arthur Gorrie is a HARD prison. Doesn't matter where you are it's TOUGH. but when he is moved its going to be even worse but keeping him where he is he's under constant obs and this is needed as he's a suicide risk big time.

They won't look at a move till he's more stable most likely and whilst we can all speculate only doctors there will determine this. It'd be dreadful if he topped himself. No justice at all. So they'll be reluctant to risk any self-harm.

Even in his present location you can rest assured he's suffering!

 

[minni]

As I cannot be at the cricket match as I live in Cairns am having a 'yellow' champagne to toast all the QPS, SES, Fire Service, volunteers and community workers.

Yes, I know any excuse!!!

I am in Cairns having a 'Trilogy' champagne..same excuse as you!! and its yellow, and Im wearing an eels jersey

 

[pulpfiction]

Oh should clarify. I've been to Arthur Gorrie many times over the years also.

Not as a resident

 

[minni]

What a stressful way to live. Didn't Jocelyn say it was for a business venture that could have and should have worked?

yes, I think so, but isnt this how scammers and manipulators work? they convince people to get on board with their wonderful foolproof venture, talk them out of thousands, then it falls through..bad luck to the investors

 

[Keentoknow]

All one can do is speculate. There are no hard and fast rules when it comes to PDs or other mental illnesses like schizophrenia. There are MANY schizophrenics who lead ordinary lives here amongst us in our community. I think we all know someone who is a bit this or that. We're looking at extremes with prison populations and a person like GBC. in a nutshell anyone can be unpredictable but some are more sinister than others and more dangerous.

Right now GBC will be in shock. He'd be going through a range of emotions. Some of it acted some legit. He'd want to stay in he psych/medical area. he can't control a prison environment in any way. This would annoy and frighten him considerably. He's a major risk ATM until he's classified and adjusts. Time will help with that and lets face it he'll have plenty of it.

So true.
Shock. He has more than likely subjected himself to the most horrendous visions....now flashbacks.
Have I seen this before? I sure have. Eventually they all slide into the system. He will not be asked to go anywhere else other than what his classo said.

 

[minni]

does anyone know whether GBC had a joint venture with these two 'partners' or was it a partnership? does anyone know what GBC's capital contribution was? joint bentures and partnerships are two different things I think

 

[pulpfiction]

From my understanding, the $200,000 and the $90,000 owed to Jocelyn Frost and the other male partner, would be the share of the partnership/business that they were in together. It likely consists of initial injection of funds, plus profits and less expenses. It appears that those two partners have walked away with nothing, and explains why they left. They must have discovered the extent of the debt, and knew that they were working for nothing, with no hope of any relief. The sad part for them is that they will be held responsible for the debts of any such partnership. More lives disrupted and ruined.

Yes...it all has a massive snowball effect. Many, many lives are ruined now. If you can imagine how TM kids are doing. They're innocent as well. And also the other mistresses, and their partners or children if they have them. And anyone owed money, and their quality of life now. It's a huge fallout.

The sad thing, whilst no one likes a woman or man who hooks up with a married man, there is no denying GBC was a total player who had them fooled. These women must have been easy targets for him (ie. easy to control) as this is what narcissists do. They prey on the weak. These women will be devastated they were duped and are now in trouble. I feel very sorry for all the innocents.

The lesson is what we all know. Never hook up with someone married or in a relationship. It's bad taste and it nevers leads to anything good. Poor Allison and her family.

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

Yes.

And is it strange that there was a bomb threat that halted proceedings when that phone info was only coming in that day - presumably the NBC phone evidence wouldn't have been able to be used at Thursday's hearing if the phone evidence only came in on Thursday - but with the hearing date changed to Friday, it was able to be used... sure would have helped the "interfering with witnesses" aspect of the bail and also showed that GBC was possibly lying about being asleep so assisted with argument against bail.....sorry I think my mind is just working overtime....

Interesting thought, but that would suggest that police would fake a bomb threat to stall bail hearing? I wouldn't think so. But it is quite likely they got the phone info(regarding the facecall) in the morning on Thurs or at some time that day prior to when the bail hearing was scheduled for 2:45pm wasn't it? (sometimes after 2pm). MOO

 

[pulpfiction]

So true.
Shock. He has more than likely subjected himself to the most horrendous visions....now flashbacks.
Have I seen this before? I sure have. Eventually they all slide into the system. He will not be asked to go anywhere else other than what his classo said.

Yeah flashbacks would be an issue. He's probably medicated already I'd say. They often are when a suicide risk.

IMO

 

[Nads]

GBC is in the psyche unit at Wacol. Apparently he freaked out when they put him in the usual cell they hold ppl in. He has been in the psyche ward since. This info is from an extremely reliable source. :jail:

Oh, but before that it was just business as usual?

Until there are some consequences, and the possibility that he might go down.

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

I don't know if anybody else heard/read this, but it was either on a TV news report or press, that the bomb threat was directed a GBC's hearing, but on the other hand they also said the bomb was supposedly somewhere on the ground floor and the courtroom 5 was on the first floor. All very suss really!

Yes it said on one of the news channels it was directed at GBC- cept he wasn't in court for the hearing.(not that the person who phoned it may have known that)

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

They can't question GBC because his lawyers won't allow it. They will have to wait till the trial. IMO.

NBC/EBC would have been really surprised IMO to find out the police knew about this alleged face time call and their jaw must have dropped wide open.

I wondered what you had meant also by saying they could not question GBC. I would think they can question regardless of what laywer says- just may mean he has lawyer present. However I thought maybe you meant once he has been arrested that is a different kettle of fish and they then wait till trial for that.

 

[CaseClosed]

Yes...it all has a massive snowball effect. Many, many lives are ruined now. If you can imagine how TM kids are doing. They're innocent as well. And also the other mistresses, and their partners or children if they have them. And anyone owed money, and their quality of life now. It's a huge fallout.

The sad thing, whilst no one likes a woman or man who hooks up with a married man, there is no denying GBC was a total player who had them fooled. These women must have been easy targets for him (ie. easy to control) as this is what narcissists do. They prey on the weak. These women will be devastated they were duped and are now in trouble. I feel very sorry for all the innocents.

The lesson is what we all know. Never hook up with someone married or in a relationship. It's bad taste and it nevers leads to anything good. Poor Allison and her family.

... and I wonder if TM is feeling enormous guilt and some level of responsibility for Allison's death, seeing it appears she may have pushed him to commit to a definite deadline.