OH - 9 killed + Gunman, 16 injured, Mass Shooting, Oregon District, Dayton, 4 Aug 2019

[rsd1200]

I've always felt that if you legally become a child's parent, you should be held to the same legal and moral obligations as a natural parent would. Birth parents are not "pet shops".

I was shocked. This child had grown up in their home, and was legally adopted at a young age. I hope they are never allowed to adopt or foster again.

 

[Murphy1950]

I've heard of similar struggles. In this case I have not hear of ANY efforts to obtain therapy. At all. Are you suggesting they tried and failed? Because by all accounts I've seen, he never had any intervention of any kind. Sometime therapy does help.

Yes...sometimes therapy does help. You haven't heard of ANY efforts as you say. In reality we haven't heard anything about his parents, his home life interactions, basically his upbringing, what was tried etc. in this regard, not a word. Only their sincere apologies to the community after losing two of their own children. It's has to be gut wrenching.

I would expect those details to follow over time and the time isn't now.

Unless the entire family was living in another reality, I have no doubt they tried, time will tell.

 

[MsBetsy]

Right? Why, at the very least, no THERAPY? His parents could have easily brought him to a therapist, even if he reluctent...

It's not always that easy. In many states, a minor child has total control over their own mental health treatment.
A therapist may not be allowed to share any information with a parent without the child's consent.
Where I live the age is 14.
It varies depending on the state. Imo

 

[MsFacetious]

Then that’s another big part of the problem. MOO

Well the strangulation was stopped because his Mom was crying and begging him to stop. They were going to take him to someone is all she was told... and she never told anyone. Then the gun thing was more recent and he didn't mention reporting it either.

There has been much focus on the failures to follow through with what was reported about this guy. I think if those had been reported the victims involved would have mentioned it.

 

[Safeguard]

It's not always that easy. In many states, a minor child has total control over their own mental health treatment.
A therapist may not be allowed to share any information with a parent without the child's consent.
Where I live the age is 14.
It varies depending on the state. Imo

I would be willing to bet my last dollar CB had problems long before age 14.

 

[MsBetsy]

Yes...sometimes therapy does help. You haven't heard of ANY efforts as you say. In reality we haven't heard anything about his parents, his home life interactions, basically his upbringing, what was tried etc. in this regard, not a word. Only their sincere apologies to the community after losing two of their own children. It's has to be gut wrenching.

I would expect those details to follow over time and the time isn't now.

Unless the entire family was living in another reality, I have no doubt they tried, time will tell.

Based on everything we have heard about him, it sounds like he not only needed therapy, but medication to help control his symptoms. Imo

 

[rsd1200]

Actually Adam Lanza had numerous mental health evaluations and therapy both in school and afterwards.

The Doctors at Yale University diagnosed and treated him, recommending rigorous ongoing therapy, special education services, and medication.

Most of this went unheeded. His mother stopped giving him medication after one day due to side effects.

The doctors at Yale University found that he was sheltered and that his mother accommodated his disabilities rather than treat them.
They claimed that it was not his diagnosis that contributed to the events leading up to the shooting but the fact that it was not treated. Imo

A parent has to be "the parent" and if that means doing what makes them unpopular with their child, so be it. You can't just throw your hands in the air and give up. Maybe after all the years, she'd possibly just given up, or thought being his friend would help. My guess is that he had been a "difficult" child from the get go, and she was at the end of her rope. Parents need a break from it all too, but who is there to give them one? Living with someone with mental health issues, can be a very stressful existence.

 

[MsBetsy]

I would be willing to bet my last dollar CB had problems long before age 14.

Yes, if he had violent fantasies in middle school, I'm sure he did.
I would be surprised if the school didn't recommend an evaluation or some kind of treatment, if they were aware of it. Imo

 

[squareandrabbet]

Take away all the weapons you can, and you still are still left with the genesis of the problem. When are we going to get around the solutions for that?

eta: There's been a gigantic shift in the dynamics of American families, and clearly it has not been beneficial to our children. Particularly our boys. I really think we need to look at that a lot harder than we are willing to.

I found this article about the effect of absent fathers in the home. Didn't have time to do more than skim it, but looks interesting.

Father-Absent Homes: Implications for Criminal Justice and Mental Health Professionals

 

[Murphy1950]

Based on everything we have heard about him, it sounds like he not only needed therapy, but medication to help control his symptoms. Imo

Meds can help with some illness, bipolar for example. Not much help with psychopaths, that's a toss up from what I know...(I'm not an expert in any way)

 

[crhedBngr]

I would be willing to bet my last dollar CB had problems long before age 14.

If this includes animal abuse, as an animal lover, could we please just say said abuse existed and not go into details?

I would appreciate it.

Thanks.

 

[crhedBngr]

DBM. Double post. Sorry.

 

[MsBetsy]

A parent has to be "the parent" and if that means doing what makes them unpopular with their child, so be it. You can't just throw your hands in the air and give up. Maybe after all the years, she'd possibly just given up, or thought being his friend would help. My guess is that he had been a "difficult" child from the get go, and she was at the end of her rope. Parents need a break from it all too, but who is there to give them one? Living with someone with mental health issues, can be a very stressful existence.

Yes, that was a typical case of a parent enabling her child.
She was fully aware of his problems yet allowed him access to numerous firearms in the home.
He taped black garbage bags over his windows and wouldn't allow his mother to enter his room. That would scare the heck out of me if my child did that.
Yet she never indicated to close friends or family that she was afraid of him. Imo

 

[MsBetsy]

Double post

 

[FunkyMonkey]

Well the strangulation was stopped because his Mom was crying and begging him to stop. They were going to take him to someone is all she was told... and she never told anyone. Then the gun thing was more recent and he didn't mention reporting it either.

There has been much focus on the failures to follow through with what was reported about this guy. I think if those had been reported the victims involved would have mentioned it.

A previous poster asked why there weren’t assault charges. I asked if they had been reported. Since the answer seems to be “no”... then that explains why there weren’t charges even considered. Can’t blame the lack of charges on the police if they never knew. MOO

 

[FunkyMonkey]

DBM: Duplicate post

 

[FunkyMonkey]

DBM: Duplicate post

 

[Gardenista]

I'm guessing they were advised not to apologize. That's the only thing I thought might be in here that isn't.

Are you thinking they may have some legal repercussions?

 

[KALI]

I truly do not understand.
Where were his parents?
Did they know anything about this?
How can you live in the same house with one of your children who feels so out of touch with wants of hurting others?
What did they do after he was expelled for creating his horrific "Rape and kill lists"?
I am so confused. How on earth do these written words just go by the wayside? In this family AND with law enforcement?

How on earth was this guy able to get a gun? Any gun?
Because he was under the age of 18 years old when he was exposed?
So upsetting to me.
Everyone around him knew that he was one messed up human being.
I really would like to hear from his parents. But, I'm sure, that we will not.
I'm sure they are lawyered up.
Plus, he's now an adult.
I'm just out of words.
Parents, please know your children.
Go right ahead and snoop on their social media. 100%.
It's your right as a parent and guardian to know what's going on in their heads.
Obviously, your child is unlikely to be a mass murderer.
However, you need to know what is going on with them.
It's a new world with new rules and you need to know what your children are up to and who is influencing their lives.
Seriously.

More and more coming out about this guy. I really think he was insane. In his MySpace, 10 years ago, he draws a "bloody maggot fetus " "total carnage" "all shall be annihilated" "bloodlust" etc...

And then there is this and lots more at the link:

Seven years after they dated, Doll recalls Betts as a serious and reserved kid who wrestled with hallucinations and menacing voices in his head.

While they were in high school, Betts told Doll that he had suffered from psychosis since he was young and feared developing schizophrenia.

"He would cry to me sometimes," she said, "saying how he's afraid of himself and afraid he was going to hurt someone one day. It's haunting now."

Ex-girlfriend says Dayton shooter heard voices, talked about 'dark, evil things'

 

[Gardenista]

A previous poster asked why there weren’t assault charges. I asked if they had been reported. Since the answer seems to be “no”... then that explains why there weren’t charges even considered. Can’t blame the lack of charges on the police if they never knew. MOO

At least one person reported him to the police, but said nothing happened. I posted the link somewhere on this thread.