OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #74

[Cool Cats]

IMO, AW got off too easy.

I agree, most on here seem to agree with this. I was really upset about it until it started sinking in that she gets no parole or any early release and will be 78 when she is released. That helps a little.

Not clear why they did the deal with her and not clear if the families agreed with it. We know for sure the families were satisfied with and agreed with Jake's sentence.

My big concern is George getting acquitted of murder and enough other charges to end up with only 30 years. He would then be out in his late 50's and could still live 30 years as a free man.

I get defensive when people talk about George getting acquitted of murder but I do understand the frustration that some posters have because they think there is NOT enough direct evidence on George to get murder convictions if the only evidence presented is Jake and Angela's testimony.

But the prosecution has more than just their testimony. There is other evidence to back it up but hard to be patient and wait to hear it all.

 

[Betty P]

I swear if humanly possible and allowed I am going to try to go when she testifies. I am about 90 miles away.

Angela Wagner will have to testify truthfully about all the things that happened to these girls while in her house. She will have to tell how Tabitha was physically abused by GW4 and Hanna by Jake. She will have to testify that GW4, along with the rest of his family, made the decision to kill the Rhoden family and Hannah Gilley.

IOW, Angela Canepa knows that everything Tabitha and Ms Staley testified about will be verified by Angela Wagner, per her plea agreement. AC isn't going to allow any of these witnesses to testify to anything that Angela Wagner and Jake aren't going to verify.

 

[TwoBlueJays]

Bulvine, the name appears on a character in a video game, and maybe another place but I don't recall.

From Urban Dictionary, but the name turns up more results:

Old School Gamer that started his killing career in UO and continues today. Egotistical, Slanderous and mean spirited. Also known to be used in conjuction with death spam. Gaming God among mortal men.
That gank squad just did a Bulvine on us.

Urban Dictionary: Bulvine

Old School Gamer that started his killing career in UO and continues today. Egotistical, Slanderous and mean spirited. Also known to be used in conjuction with death spam. Gaming God among mortal men.

www.urbandictionary.com

He was destined to stand apart living with some Ws. .. . moo

names.org does have a more favorable description for the name.

Thanks for the correction! Either way, a very unique name.

 

[dgfred]

It is looking a little like giving Manson 30 years and the actual killers LWOP.

 

[joe jones]

Attacking T over her address as an eleven year old really took the cake with me. She was not responsible for her address at that time. I was more angry over that than just about anything. She was a child, incapable of changing her address or even realizing it was anything but home school at AW's. Probably slept in GW's room b/c there were no other rooms or beds and at least she didn't have dave pawing at her. Good night Irene! GW4 and JW have to be messed up too, not that they don't belong in jail.

I didn't think he was attacking her over her address but the fact she lied when she said on direct, she moved in with Wagners when she was 18 or 19, omitting her first stint their when she was 11 or 12, I always get really cross when state do not bring out evidence or testimony that they must know defense will, she could have saved Tabitha hours of testifying if she had brought out the bizarre way that RW and AW appeared to be trying to set GW and JW up with Tabitha and her sisters, and how inappropriate it was, instead she left it for the defense who then made her out to have lied

AC could have very sympathetically questioned her about sexual abuse and even if she had to concede GW had reasons to keep TC family away from his son it would have meant the defense did not get her to concede that yes GW was right to keep their son away as she too wanted to keep her son from her family,

again with the affairs, AC could have brought them up on direct and allowed Tabitha to explain that we all do stupid things when we are young, again may have had to concede as she did on cross that she gave her phones and passwords willingly to GW to show him she was committed to their marriage and wouldn't cheat anymore, but she left it to defense who were then able to attack her character by making her admit to being unfaithful and with whom,

AC could have completely taken away much of that cross of TC if she had brought out on direct the things the defense would have used to attack TC with

 

[Chelly]

AW will probably deny knowledge of any physical or sexual abuse taking place in her home.

 

[rsd1200]

I didn't think he was attacking her over her address but the fact she lied when she said on direct, she moved in with Wagners when she was 18 or 19, omitting her first stint their when she was 11 or 12, I always get really cross when state do not bring out evidence or testimony that they must know defense will, she could have saved Tabitha hours of testifying if she had brought out the bizarre way that RW and AW appeared to be trying to set GW and JW up with Tabitha and her sisters, and how inappropriate it was, instead she left it for the defense who then made her out to have lied

AC could have very sympathetically questioned her about sexual abuse and even if she had to concede GW had reasons to keep TC family away from his son it would have meant the defense did not get her to concede that yes GW was right to keep their son away as she too wanted to keep her son from her family,

again with the affairs, AC could have brought them up on direct and allowed Tabitha to explain that we all do stupid things when we are young, again may have had to concede as she did on cross that she gave her phones and passwords willingly to GW to show him she was committed to their marriage and wouldn't cheat anymore, but she left it to defense who were then able to attack her character by making her admit to being unfaithful and with whom,

AC could have completely taken away much of that cross of TC if she had brought out on direct the things the defense would have used to attack TC with

Agreed. It was on AC to make sure there were no surprises. I don't see an eleven year old as "moving" themselves though. The adult issues don't concern me so much, but yes, AC could have made that much easier on her also. She handled herself well though.

 

[joe jones]

AW will probably deny knowledge of any physical abuse taking place in her home.

who would admit to it, nobody wants to admit to that, depends on what the state demanded of her, as to the things they expect her to admit, they may want her to admit to hitting TC with a board and threatening her with a gun as AC went over that many many times today. AW can't testify to what happened at the crime scenes she wasn't there, so she can testify pre and post the murders, I think she is very important in testifying about all the other crimes BW and JW and GW committed,

I am also of the opinion that her inside knowledge of the Wagners may have been utilized in LE gaining knowledge about anything FW may have been involved with throughout the years,

 

[Cool Cats]

I didn't think he was attacking her over her address but the fact she lied when she said on direct, she moved in with Wagners when she was 18 or 19, omitting her first stint their when she was 11 or 12, I always get really cross when state do not bring out evidence or testimony that they must know defense will, she could have saved Tabitha hours of testifying if she had brought out the bizarre way that RW and AW appeared to be trying to set GW and JW up with Tabitha and her sisters, and how inappropriate it was, instead she left it for the defense who then made her out to have lied

AC could have very sympathetically questioned her about sexual abuse and even if she had to concede GW had reasons to keep TC family away from his son it would have meant the defense did not get her to concede that yes GW was right to keep their son away as she too wanted to keep her son from her family,

again with the affairs, AC could have brought them up on direct and allowed Tabitha to explain that we all do stupid things when we are young, again may have had to concede as she did on cross that she gave her phones and passwords willingly to GW to show him she was committed to their marriage and wouldn't cheat anymore, but she left it to defense who were then able to attack her character by making her admit to being unfaithful and with whom,

AC could have completely taken away much of that cross of TC if she had brought out on direct the things the defense would have used to attack TC with

It's called mitigating the witness testimony.

The prosecution is sopose to be the first to bring up anything a witness could say that looks negative to the prosecution's case. Then mitigate it and the jury is not surprised by it and understands it.

Like if a witness is getting 5 years shaved off their sentence just for testifying for the prosecution, then it is important that the prosecution brings this up with the witness, gets it out in the open, etc... Doesn't blindside the jury with it.

Otherwise the defense will twist it totally to their advantage and could even damage a witnesse's credibility.

On the other hand:

Tabby was too young - a minor for crying out loud who had been abused - so I do not think it will matter to the jury that she was over at the Wagners at age 11 or 12. Just too young to matter in my opinion. Would seem like a visit and sleep over and home schooling help to her.

In fact, I think this makes her look used and sympathetic to the jury. Like Angie, the adult, used her for ulterior motives. God knows Angie doesn't do anything without there being something in it for her.

When I was 12 and my sister was 11 we were forced to live for awhile with our weird aunt and uncle out on their farm. We never thought we lived there, to us we were just visiting and having a sleep over.

Interesting, my aunt and uncle had 2 older boys.

 

[rsd1200]

Yes, that's it, thank you. I think some journalists were confused by her statement and reported that the state conceded he didn't shoot anyone.

Honestly, it's still confusing for me. If they are going to try him based on JW's plea/proffer then it's very confusing (at least for me).

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Imo. I think TC is well spoken and doing a good job. I don't see her being medicated. What I do see is someone who doesn't know how to read out loud. Most people do not know how to read out loud. It takes practice and most people do not have a reason to do that.

This was most certainly true.

 

[Skully67]

The son's name is Burvine. And I have never heard that name here. Maybe a family name?

Bulvine.

 

[Cool Cats]

Bulvine.

TwoBlueJays said:
The son's name is Burvine. And I have never heard that name here. Maybe a family name?

It's a name from a favorite character in a game George played.

Bet George misses his games in jail.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

well, he is a much better attorney than I thought, he completely changed the image of her from almost 2 days of state direct testimony,
It went from they would not let my family visit especially my mum to she enabled a man who she continued to live with to abuse me and my 5 sisters,

he elicited testimony about the times she was unfaithful both pre and post her marriage, she voluntarily gave up custody and was aware visitation was to be supervised at GW home, he obviously was not going to let his son go near her home or her parents,

I dunno. That just makes Tabitha's decision not to push for custody when she was going to be living with her mother make more sense to me. She wanted to wait until she had her own place where her son would be save from stepdad. I don't think she understood the concept of supervised visitation. She was, what, 19 years old? Minimal education?

 

[SuziQ]

Honestly, it's still confusing for me. If they are going to try him based on JW's plea/proffer then it's very confusing (at least for me).

GW4 and the other three conspired together. All for one one for all. They are all equally responsible. That is the basis for the charges against GW4. Imo.

 

[SuziQ]

I dunno. That just makes Tabitha's decision not to push for custody when she was going to be living with her mother make more sense to me. She wanted to wait until she had her own place where her son would be save from stepdad. I don't think she understood the concept of supervised visitation. She was, what, 19 years old? Minimal education?

And she was scared of the Wagner's.

 

[Skully67]

TwoBlueJays said:
The son's name is Burvine. And I have never heard that name here. Maybe a family name?

It's a name from a favorite character in a game George played.

Bet George misses his games in jail.

I still say I hear Bulvine.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

A name from a favorite character in a game George played.

Really@

See now to me it sounded like a young woman desperate to find someone to care about her. A child of abuse wanting to fit in somewhere with someone. She even said, I made bad choices. In hindsight it's easy to condemn her thought processes. When a young mind is damaged, it really does stay damaged, no matter what good may come their way later in life. My heart goes out to her, I think she did the best she could at the time. I hope she's found some happiness after all that trauma. <3

And I deeply admire that she was willing not just to testify in court but to do it on video. Brave young woman.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

State needs to do something about this case, 4 weeks and no evidence that places GW at scenes, days of Tabitha testimony about a failed marriage, and the controlling nature of AW she had nothing to say about family meetings as she never attended, she can't say if they voted,

the custody issue can now be seen as GW not wanting his son to be near any of her family due to SA, whether they were victim or perpetrator he wanted them, nothing to do with, AC isn't a very good attorney, the judge has given the state so much latitude with testimony and evidence, so she goes over and over the same ground and then goes over it again on recross.

I hope JW and AW deliver as to me it seems that is what they are relying on,

It's one thing for George to want PHYSICAL custody of his son because of the sexual abuse of TC's stepfather of her and sisters. Tabitha agreed to that, until she could get a place of her own. It's another thing to deny her contact or not allow her mother or sisters to visit their home or take the child out for an afternoon. Also, don't forget the ways the Wagners were trying to set her up as crazy, abusive, by calling police on her and laying charges. This is all foundation for what Angela will talk about, including the forged custody documents regarding Sophia, the FB hacking, etc. We're getting there.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

But the prosecution has more than just [Jake and Angela's] testimony. There is other evidence to back it up but hard to be patient and wait to hear it all.

Guns, guns, guns.