OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #75

[Recidivist]

GWIV looked a bit rattled when he came in, JMO

It's his birthday.

 

[sunshineray]

alot of discussion on conspiracy criminal enterprise so i decided to look up the exact wording etc even tho its a foreign language lol. found a very compelling sectin that has not been brought up- the affirmative defense from a conspiracy prosecution.
(I) The following are affirmative defenses to a charge of conspiracy:
(1) After conspiring to commit an offense, the actor thwarted the success of the conspiracy under circumstances manifesting a complete and voluntary renunciation of the actor's criminal purpose.
(2) After conspiring to commit an offense, the actor abandoned the conspiracy prior to the commission of or attempt to commit any offense that was the object of the conspiracy, either by advising all other conspirators of the actor's abandonment, or by informing any law enforcement authority of the existence of the conspiracy and of the actor's participation in the conspiracy.

george the super hero had plenty of options before succesfuly running a mass murder criminal enterprise conspiracy. some options that didnt involve the police. george had no regrets until the cuffs went on

Yeah GWIV did neither. He didn't say to JW, BW and AW, we can't do this, I'm not doing this...freezing in the act of firing (according to JW's proffer via AC opening statement) doesn't constitute # 1 or 2. He also, even if it were true he stayed home with AW and the kids (which I don't believe for a second and neither is that stated in JW proffer), alert LE to stop the carnage. He's toast for that defense, AJMO

 

[sunshineray]

It's his birthday.

Yeah he gets to have more birthdays

 

[BeckyF]

I have seen useless lawyers on both sides in many trials,

Same here. But not in this trial, IMO.

 

[ColMustard]

It's his birthday.

Rue the day! moo

 

[sunshineray]

Defense is going to say either previous owners, neighbors or people who were following the case threw those items in the well and then threw all that stuff on top of it, to hid it or child proof it. AJMO

 

[justtrish]

Where oh where is the defense going with this line of questioning?

 

[newtonskeyz]

Why did they wait so long to search the Wagner properties?
Why wait until they moved out?
Why not get a warrant when Jake refused to give the phone?
Why when they interviewed Billy in the car, did they not ask more about Jake? Billy ran that whole interview.
Taking phones after a year? many people get new phones all the time. Why wait a year?

I find it so annoying that after a year, they got good photos of the empty property.

Were they afraid of them? Or just incompetent.

I had the Wagner's on my radar almost from day one. To me, the timing, new baby, was critical and completely glaring.
I think Billy Had his own additional motive here. Money business deals, something. He did mention the 20k that was owed him.

I do see the confusion as the Wagner's skillfully manipulated social media and threw blame everywhere else.
They need an award for that.

the interior decorating.

 

[justtrish]

Defense is going to say either previous owners, neighbors or people who were following the case threw those items in the well and then threw all that stuff on top of it, to hid it or child proof it. AJMO

The only issue there would be Jake told them and confirmed or Angela or both. Nice try defense, but no cigar.

 

[justtrish]

Why did they wait so long to search the Wagner properties?
Why wait until they moved out?
Why not get a warrant when Jake refused to give the phone?
Why when they interviewed Billy in the car, did they not ask more about Jake? Billy ran that whole interview.
Taking phones after a year? many people get new phones all the time. Why wait a year?

I find it so annoying that after a year, they got good photos of the empty property.

Were they afraid of them? Or just incompetent.

I had the Wagner's on my radar almost from day one. To me, the timing, new baby, was critical and completely glaring.
I think Billy Had his own additional motive here. Money business deals, something. He did mention the 20k that was owed him.

I do see the confusion as the Wagner's skillfully manipulated social media and threw blame everywhere else.
They need an award for that.

the interior decorating.

They have to have more than thinking someone is suspicious to get a search warrant. They have to be specific and have specific reasons. I am sure if they had enough they would have done it sooner. It sounds like when they went out on the 3rd or 4th of May they learned they were going to Alaska and had sold the house. They were able to obtain phone records from that day and I believe it was said that was rushed and they learned that George had texted Billy to not come up there got company during the exact time BCI was there to talk to them. They observed shell casings on the ground then and my guess is that was the things that allowed for the search warrant on the 10th. They still didn't want to alert the Wagner's so they went quietly with a few people only. Found enough that day to go back on the 12th and I'd imagine by then they didn't care weather the Wagner's knew or not. I think it was best this way because they didn't try to gather all the evidence and destroy it, they left in a hurry it seems and left behind all the things.

 

[Chelly]

James Pilcher

@jamespilcher
·
6m

Replying to
@jamespilcher
On redirect, White says the first search was done in secret. On second search, media was present and it became public.
@local12

 

[Chelly]

James Pilcher

@jamespilcher
·
7m

Restating a .40 caliber 2nd generation Glock was one of the murder weapons. Now onto .30 caliber - says it was could have been fired by SKS
@local12
James Pilcher

@jamespilcher
·
2m

Presenting a list of guns from a download - which ones could be used in murders. Yesterday they introduced the list from Jake's phone. Prosecutors ask whose name was next to SKS ... but then withdrew the question before White could answer.
@local12

 

[Chelly]

James Pilcher

@jamespilcher
·
52s

Now onto the shell casings found at Peterson Road - the Wagners' house.
@local12

 

[sunshineray]

No lab ticket on the big bag...I sure hope that doesn't get the evidence associated with it thrown out

 

[Pru2U]

They have to have more than thinking someone is suspicious to get a search warrant. They have to be specific and have specific reasons. I am sure if they had enough they would have done it sooner. It sounds like when they went out on the 3rd or 4th of May they learned they were going to Alaska and had sold the house. They were able to obtain phone records from that day and I believe it was said that was rushed and they learned that George had texted Billy to not come up there got company during the exact time BCI was there to talk to them. They observed shell casings on the ground then and my guess is that was the things that allowed for the search warrant on the 10th. They still didn't want to alert the Wagner's so they went quietly with a few people only. Found enough that day to go back on the 12th and I'd imagine by then they didn't care weather the Wagner's knew or not. I think it was best this way because they didn't try to gather all the evidence and destroy it, they left in a hurry it seems and left behind all the things.

I agree. My understanding is they have to be specific about what they were searching for and why they believed it to be on the property in order to secure the search warrant. Also, they (Wagners) fled the USA and now time was critical as to searching the property prior to new owners. I don’t know but I feel like all these factors might have been part of the affidavit for warrant.

Just a reminder: our laws are set up to provide rights for the accused (innocent until proven guilty) vs providing rights for the victims, or victims survivors - and those are the laws that have to be followed (or met) when investigating crimes.

Kudos to the detective who noticed the shells in the driveway & resisted the urge to reach down & pick one up. That’s some serious self control.

 

[sunshineray]

22 casings that held the bullets that killed some Rhodens match casings found at Peterson...BINGO

 

[Niner]

I had to go to a funeral earlier today for a good friend - so I will grab all the tweets in the morning - just too tired right now to do them - I hope you all don't mind...

 

[Chelly]

James Pilcher

@jamespilcher
·
2m

Matt White says microscopic analysis between .22 casings found at crime scene showed casings at Wagner house were fired by same gun. That led to another search warrant. More .22 casings found then also matched.
@local12

 

[Tena]

JMO...During that year after, everyone was was blaming everyone, voicing opinions, rumors etc. BCI was following up on all leads...imagine how tedious that was...ruling out everybody and everything...I wonder if JM caught wind that the W's were leaving for Alaska and taking SW. I am sure the Manleys believed the W's were responsible for these acts and the proof was not there yet. Thank goodness the agents made that trip to visit the W's again. All of this long drawn out testimony is getting us to "laser focused" suspects.

 

[rsd1200]

James Pilcher
@jamespilcher
·
9m

Now introducing a 9 mm casings - another objection from defense. But before sidebar, prosecutor says they will show the initial plan was to bring a 9 mm on the night of the killing. Yet another long sidebar.
@local12

Took a break after this.

Wonder why they planned to bring a 9 mm, but changed their mind? This must be information from Jake's proffer.

I'll let those of you who know guns and ammo explain why they debated this. Every time I try to search about guns online, I get the videos of someone waving a gun around. I reflexively duck and hide when they do that.

9mm is louder could be a possible reason.