OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #79

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This makes sense. Without being graphic or too personal.. lol I can verify there is a gap in time from the baby beginning to nurse and the milk as I called it "letting go"... in the first few months I could actually feel an odd sensation like uneasy feeling lasting just a few moments, but it's hard to explain.. just a feeling that often made me cringe and then you can actually physically feel the milk let down. There is scientific reasons for that and maybe it's just what you described the spinal nerves.... Almost like hitting your funny phone, but not painful just that moment of ughhhh well that happens when milk lets down. (I know it sounds odd, breastfeeding is this amazing bond forming thing, but it isn't all sunshine and roses..lol) So with that said it does make sense that the milk even already produced and ready to go might not be able to release if her brain function stopped. :(
I'm just disgusted that this barbaric animal took the life of the mother and then tried to offer this pathetic alleged effort of how he pulled the victim's body back onto the bed closer to the infant so the baby wouldn't starve to death. :mad:
 
So what if they say, I did it. This is where I struggle. If an attorney thinks their client did it, that's one thing, but if they tell them they did, can the attorney legally present a different theory in court or how does that work?
I won't let him get on the stand and testify to things I know are lies. But I can still defend him.
 
Court just ended for the afternoon in OH v. #GeorgeWagnerIV. Since lunch, Jake Wagner talked about his family buying a signal jammer to jam cell and radio signals. "I think it was dad's idea." Prevents people from calling 911

There wasn't a silencer for Billy's 40 Glock, Jake says. Tested it at Peterson Rd. to see how loud it would be. He says his mom, Angela, signed Hanna May's name to the guardianship documents. He said he and GW4 signed their names (cont)

in case they died carrying out the homicides. That way, if they died, their mom would get custody of their children, Sophia an Bulvine. They modified the bed of the GMC truck that Jake bought to make a false bed

Hay or straw went on top of it and there was an area underneath where he and GW4 would hide with their weapons. Jake said they waited until Hanna May gave birth to carry out the murders but it was up to Billy to choose the night. He wanted it to be overcast

It was Billy's idea to create the false bed in the truck. GW4 helped modify it. They used a 2x4 and plywood. They modified it

Jake said on the stand he thought it was a Chevy truck they bought. In fact, the photo shows a GMC. They didn't take great effort to keep the truck hidden.

That night, he watched the "Ding Dong" scene in Boondocks Saints 2 that shows a Mexican man saying Ding Dong Motherf&*ers in the Peterson Rd. home to "pych myself up" or get the "gumption" to do what "I was doing to do.”
He and GW4 had died their hair the week before the murders to make it darker but it turned out black. Jake said he wanted to look like Norman Reedus' character in "The Walking Dead.”

Jake says Billy informed him on April 21, 2016 that that was going to be the night they would carry out the murders. Jake said he walked barefoot to the truck b/c he didn't want soil from his yard being transferred to the crime scenes

He said they left their phones at home and his phone on Facebook so the GPS signal would look like he was home. Jake said he wore black baggie clothes, a ski mask and the ugly shoes from Wal-Mart. GW4 wore similar clothes. Wore ski masks

Jake had said earlier that he bought the Captain American Winter Soldier mask for his brother. No mention of it on the night of the murders.

Jake said he and GW4 climbed into the bed of the truck with their guns. It's a 15-mile drive from Peterson Rd. to Chris Sr.'s. BW, he said, went into the house and told them to wait for "the signal.”

Jake says BW walked out and lowered the bed of the truck. They'd been there about 10 minutes. Jake says BW told him and George to get into position so they did. BW walked to grow room with Gary and Chris Sr.

Jake says he was in the prone position on his stomach. Chris Sr., Gary and BW started to walk back to the house. Jake said he told GW4 to shoot Chris Sr but he didn't. Jake said he took GW4's SKS from him.

Jake said BW said "what happened?" Jake said BW told Chris Sr. to call his cell phone. Jake said he moved into GW4's position and fired at Chris Sr. The first shot missed, he panicked and fired another shot at Chris Sr's midsection.

Jake said his eyes were closed when he fired that second shot. After that, he said he hear 1 or two gunshots from inside the house. BW came out and was having "a nervous breakdown." Jake says he told him "calm down. It's too late now now to break down.”

Jake says he went into the house and got Chris Sr's keys out of his pocket for the grow room to get the hard drive for the security system. Went back into Chris Sr's house and took Chris Sr and Gary's cell phones. Their bodies had been moved to the back bedroom.

Jake says there were drag marks in blood. He put a blanket on Chris Sr. and Gary's bodies but doesn't know why. They went down to Frankie Rhoden's house. The doors were locked. Jake said BW said "it might have to be a kick the door in situation.”

Jake says they got into Chris Sr's truck and drove to Dana's to see if she was home. Then they drove to Kenneth's, he says, "we seen that he was home."

Then, Jake says they drove back to Chris Sr's house, parked the car and walked back to Frankie's. They tried to open back door but it was locked. Jake used his big hunting knife to try to open it but it broke. He climbed in an open window

Jake says he let BW and GW4 into the home. Jake says he saw Brentley asleep on the couch. He took a step into Frankie's room and noticed Hannah Hazel there. He shot Frankie in the head, Hannah Hazel stirred and he shot her, too

He saw Frankie and Hannah Hazel's son in the bed with them before shooting Hannah Hazel as he leaned over to shoot her. He said he wanted to use a .22 b/c it was quiet and he didn't believe the Colt 1911 .22 firing pin was “forensicable"

Jake says they got into Chris Sr's truck, went to Dana's. He saw all three were in there. He could see Dana Rhoden was still on her phone in her bed. He froze and then Kylie cried and Dana gasped so he shot her from the hallway in the head.

Jake says he saw Hanna May lean up on her shoulder to breast feed. Jake said he went into Hanna May's bedroom, she saw him and he shot her in the head. Then, went back to Dana's room, shot her again and then back to Hanna to shoot her again

He said he GW4 and BW were in the house at that time. Jake said he went into Chris Jr's room and shot him from the left. Chris Jr made a grunting noise and he shot him again. Jake said he collected the shell casings and the phones

Jake said Hanna had slightly fallen off the bed so he rearranged her body for Kylie. "It may not make sense but I did that because if the discovery of the bodies took a long time, I was concerned Kylie would starve to death."

Jake says he, BW and GW4 drove to Kenneth's and GW4 pulled off into a driveway. Jake said he drove Billy to Kenneth's and BW banged on the door a few times, then BW walked in, he saw a muzzle flash and then they left.

GW4 drove their truck, Jake says, and Jake drove Chris Sr.'s truck with Billy in it back to Chris Sr.s. Jake said he locked the door to Chris Sr and tossed keys inside. They went home to Peterson Rd. That's where we stopped for the day. More later.

https://twitter.com/Angenette5
 
I'm just disgusted that this barbaric animal took the life of the mother and then tried to offer this pathetic alleged effort of how he pulled the victim's body back onto the bed closer to the infant so the baby wouldn't starve to death. :mad:
I agree.

More disturbing was he admitted he didn't know Hanna Hazel had a baby in the bed. He really could have shot her baby. That was in an afternoon tweet. He knew Hannah Mae would have her baby there, but he didn't know about Hanna Haze's baby in bed with her.










Angenette Levy

@Angenette5
·
1h

Jake says he let BW and GW4 into the home. Jake says he saw Brentley asleep on the couch. He took a step into Frankie's room and noticed Hannah Hazel there. He shot Frankie in the head, Hannah Hazel stirred and he shot her, too
@LawCrimeNetwork

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Angenette Levy

@Angenette5
·
1h

He saw Frankie and Hannah Hazel's son in the bed with them before shooting Hannah Hazel as he leaned over to shoot her. He said he wanted to use a .22 b/c it was quiet and he didn't believe the Colt 1911 .22 firing pin was "forensicable"
@LawCrimeNetwork
 
Court just ended for the afternoon in OH v. #GeorgeWagnerIV. Since lunch, Jake Wagner talked about his family buying a signal jammer to jam cell and radio signals. "I think it was dad's idea." Prevents people from calling 911

There wasn't a silencer for Billy's 40 Glock, Jake says. Tested it at Peterson Rd. to see how loud it would be. He says his mom, Angela, signed Hanna May's name to the guardianship documents. He said he and GW4 signed their names (cont)

in case they died carrying out the homicides. That way, if they died, their mom would get custody of their children, Sophia an Bulvine. They modified the bed of the GMC truck that Jake bought to make a false bed

Hay or straw went on top of it and there was an area underneath where he and GW4 would hide with their weapons. Jake said they waited until Hanna May gave birth to carry out the murders but it was up to Billy to choose the night. He wanted it to be overcast

It was Billy's idea to create the false bed in the truck. GW4 helped modify it. They used a 2x4 and plywood. They modified it

Jake said on the stand he thought it was a Chevy truck they bought. In fact, the photo shows a GMC. They didn't take great effort to keep the truck hidden.

That night, he watched the "Ding Dong" scene in Boondocks Saints 2 that shows a Mexican man saying Ding Dong Motherf&*ers in the Peterson Rd. home to "pych myself up" or get the "gumption" to do what "I was doing to do.”
He and GW4 had died their hair the week before the murders to make it darker but it turned out black. Jake said he wanted to look like Norman Reedus' character in "The Walking Dead.”

Jake says Billy informed him on April 21, 2016 that that was going to be the night they would carry out the murders. Jake said he walked barefoot to the truck b/c he didn't want soil from his yard being transferred to the crime scenes

He said they left their phones at home and his phone on Facebook so the GPS signal would look like he was home. Jake said he wore black baggie clothes, a ski mask and the ugly shoes from Wal-Mart. GW4 wore similar clothes. Wore ski masks

Jake had said earlier that he bought the Captain American Winter Soldier mask for his brother. No mention of it on the night of the murders.

Jake said he and GW4 climbed into the bed of the truck with their guns. It's a 15-mile drive from Peterson Rd. to Chris Sr.'s. BW, he said, went into the house and told them to wait for "the signal.”

Jake says BW walked out and lowered the bed of the truck. They'd been there about 10 minutes. Jake says BW told him and George to get into position so they did. BW walked to grow room with Gary and Chris Sr.

Jake says he was in the prone position on his stomach. Chris Sr., Gary and BW started to walk back to the house. Jake said he told GW4 to shoot Chris Sr but he didn't. Jake said he took GW4's SKS from him.

Jake said BW said "what happened?" Jake said BW told Chris Sr. to call his cell phone. Jake said he moved into GW4's position and fired at Chris Sr. The first shot missed, he panicked and fired another shot at Chris Sr's midsection.

Jake said his eyes were closed when he fired that second shot. After that, he said he hear 1 or two gunshots from inside the house. BW came out and was having "a nervous breakdown." Jake says he told him "calm down. It's too late now now to break down.”

Jake says he went into the house and got Chris Sr's keys out of his pocket for the grow room to get the hard drive for the security system. Went back into Chris Sr's house and took Chris Sr and Gary's cell phones. Their bodies had been moved to the back bedroom.

Jake says there were drag marks in blood. He put a blanket on Chris Sr. and Gary's bodies but doesn't know why. They went down to Frankie Rhoden's house. The doors were locked. Jake said BW said "it might have to be a kick the door in situation.”

Jake says they got into Chris Sr's truck and drove to Dana's to see if she was home. Then they drove to Kenneth's, he says, "we seen that he was home."

Then, Jake says they drove back to Chris Sr's house, parked the car and walked back to Frankie's. They tried to open back door but it was locked. Jake used his big hunting knife to try to open it but it broke. He climbed in an open window

Jake says he let BW and GW4 into the home. Jake says he saw Brentley asleep on the couch. He took a step into Frankie's room and noticed Hannah Hazel there. He shot Frankie in the head, Hannah Hazel stirred and he shot her, too

He saw Frankie and Hannah Hazel's son in the bed with them before shooting Hannah Hazel as he leaned over to shoot her. He said he wanted to use a .22 b/c it was quiet and he didn't believe the Colt 1911 .22 firing pin was “forensicable"

Jake says they got into Chris Sr's truck, went to Dana's. He saw all three were in there. He could see Dana Rhoden was still on her phone in her bed. He froze and then Kylie cried and Dana gasped so he shot her from the hallway in the head.

Jake says he saw Hanna May lean up on her shoulder to breast feed. Jake said he went into Hanna May's bedroom, she saw him and he shot her in the head. Then, went back to Dana's room, shot her again and then back to Hanna to shoot her again

He said he GW4 and BW were in the house at that time. Jake said he went into Chris Jr's room and shot him from the left. Chris Jr made a grunting noise and he shot him again. Jake said he collected the shell casings and the phones

Jake said Hanna had slightly fallen off the bed so he rearranged her body for Kylie. "It may not make sense but I did that because if the discovery of the bodies took a long time, I was concerned Kylie would starve to death."

Jake says he, BW and GW4 drove to Kenneth's and GW4 pulled off into a driveway. Jake said he drove Billy to Kenneth's and BW banged on the door a few times, then BW walked in, he saw a muzzle flash and then they left.

GW4 drove their truck, Jake says, and Jake drove Chris Sr.'s truck with Billy in it back to Chris Sr.s. Jake said he locked the door to Chris Sr and tossed keys inside. They went home to Peterson Rd. That's where we stopped for the day. More later.

https://twitter.com/Angenette5
Thank you for this. You do a nice presentation.
Here is another that has about 60 tweets in the thread, covering entire day. Very similar to levy but a little more detail. It would be great if you could do this one too.
Here’s the start
part one

part two
 
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I have waivered back and forth on if I really think George WANTED to do this or if I think he literally got roped into it because he always went along with everyone's criminal plans. I do think both boys were controlled and manipulated for a long long time so their concept of normal and acceptable was obviously warped. They all felt these crimes like stealing from larger company's, insurance fraud, stealing gas, etc. it all seemed like par for the course to them.

Did George hear some of these plans and think like many others that were around the W's.. it's just fish stories, blowing off steam, not really gonna happen.. etc. Then at some point though he had to have realized this is for real, not just talk and threats, but it's happening. I guess only he knows the answer to that. George is the only one that can answer for George's motives and actions. Jake can say what he saw, what he knows George knew or talked about, what they discussed, but the reason it doesn't make sense to many of us is because there is no sense to be made of it.
We're not mass murderers. There is no way to understand why Jake felt Hanna had to die when Sophia hadn't even been molested or why Billy raised this murder idea in the first place (if that is what actually happened).

I know this is the George4 trial, not the Billy trial, but I can't figure out why Billy wanted Hanna to die--especially when he saw that as meaning Chris, Sr., Kenneth, and Frankie had to die too. I mean, it's not like Jake didn't have custody access to Sophia or like Hanna wanted to cut the family out of her daughters life. Or was i just the old "If my son can't have you, no one can"?
 
A tearful afternoon as Jake described in detail each kill. He said the mother of his child was beginning to breastfeed her crying newborn in the middle of the night when he shot her. He even repositioned her dead body so the baby could feed.

Jake told jurors he and his brother wore ski masks, gloves, dark clothing and the "ugly tennis shoes" he told his mom to buy for them at walmart.

He said before they left to kill the Rhodens, he and his brother watched the Boondock Saints II ding dong scene. Prosecutors played that for him in court, and he actually smiled and held back laughter.

He told jurors he watched that to psych himself up. "It was due to a sense of trying to, I think the word is, psych myself in to the gumption.”

He said his father Billy drove. He and George hid in the bed of the truck. They traveled like that 15 miles to Chris Rhoden Sr.'s home. He said dad went inside to talk to Chris. Gary Rhoden was also there. Billy lured the men outside.

Jake said George had a clear shot on them. "I told him to shoot, but he didn't." Jake said his dad made an excuse to come outside by saying he needed to look for his cell phone. Billy told the boys, "I'll give you one more chance.”

Jake said he took George's hiding spot. Chris came to the door way. "I had moved into the position George was." "I took aim. I was supposed to shoot one time... in the head so he wouldn't feel a thing." "I missed... closed my eyes and started firing in the mid section.”

He said his father shot Gary Rhoden inside the trailer. He said someone dragged the two bodies inside while he stole the security camera hard drive.

When she showed him pictures of the bloody crime scene, Jake said he recognized the spot where he tried to mop up blood with a rug. He said his mind has blocked out the images of the dead bodies now.

Then, there was an awkward moment. Special Prosecutor ACanepa handed him a metal pointer to show jurors on a photo where their truck was parked on the Rhoden property. His hands are cuffed to his waste. So, that was hard for him to do. Plus, he tried to hold the microphone, too.

Jake said next the trio went to Frankie Rhoden's home. He climbed in through a window. He said, "Right before I shot him, I noticed Hannah Hazel [Gilley] was there, too." Shot them in the bed with their baby in between them.

He said Frankie was asleep when he shot him. Then, Hannah began to stir. He shot her the. "I did not notice their baby until I leaned over to shoot Hannah Hazel.”

He said the trio left there, went back to Chris Sr.'s. Got in his truck. Drove to Dana's home. That's where he said he walked in the front door and back to the back bedrooms. Hanna, the mother of his child, was in one room, her mother in the other.

Hanna was asleep with her second child, a newborn named Kylie that she shared with her new boyfriend, Corey. He said Dana was awake on her phone in the room next door. "I had froze." He said Hanna woke as the baby cried. She started to breastfeed.

About that time, he said Dana saw him. "Dana gasped, I shot her once or twice." "Hanna rose up, I shot her." He said he then went back to Dana, shot her again. Then, back to Hanna shot her again. He went down the hall to Hanna's brother's room, Chris. Shot him.

Went back to Hanna's room, she had fallen off the bed somewhat. He repositioned her dead body so the baby could feed.

George and his dad were in the house at that point. They left. George got in their truck. Billy and Jake took Chris Sr.'s truck to Kenneth Rhoden's camper. Billy went in, shot him. They took Chris's truck back. then all went home. That's where we left off for the day.

https://twitter.com/CFranciscoWCPO
 
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So what if they say, I did it. This is where I struggle. If an attorney thinks their client did it, that's one thing, but if they tell them they did, can the attorney legally present a different theory in court or how does that work?
From the 3-4 law websites I looked at, my understanding is yes, as long as they don't commit perjury. That's why I said the good ones know how to walk that fine line between perjury & attorney client privilege. This is just opinion, I am not an attorney and do not claim to know the intricacies of criminal law.
 
I'm getting ready to walk the dog & may not make it back in time today if they break early. I can/will commit to pulling Courtney's in the morning.

@Niner FYI
Went ahead and pulled Courtney's pm tweets. Didn't want everyone to wait until tomorrow am. Everyone is great here, love you all! :)
 
A mention of George going with Jake to buy the murder truck. Can't find anything else against George so far.

GW4 must have walked pit of their home since this is what Jake testified to:

"The sale happened in the driveway of Peterson Rd. Uncle Todd, Uncle Gus, Jake and GW4 were all there for the transaction. 3 weeks before murders."
 
I just referenced a medical forum where a similar question was posed on whether a deceased, lactating mother's last milk could be captured by a breast pump and the answer is a rather technical "no." Somebody should tell that cold-blooded killer to thank the first responder that recovered the baby quickly or he'd be facing another murder charge.

Consider the mechanism that releases milk from the breast. When a baby begins to suck at the breast, it doesn’t get milk right away; it takes a several seconds before the milk begins to flow. Stimulation of the nipple and areola by the baby’s mouth triggers spinal nerve signals that are conducted to the hypothalamus of the brain. The hypothalamus stimulates the posterior pituitary gland to secrete the hormone oxytocin.

In other words, a dead woman can't secrete oxytocin to stimulate contractile cells in the breast.

MOO
Thank you. I didn't think so, either. Anyone who's ever breast-fed a baby knows it. Poor girl. Bless her and all the others.
 
It's not like we didn't know most of this, from the opening statement and later the medical examiner/coronor testimony and the forensics. But it's so much worse to get it from the murderer's mouth. And I cannot imagine what it was like to hear these words in court coming out of this monster's mouth.
 
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