OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#49

[RAISINISBACK]

It is larger caliber bullets. If he was the only one shot with larger bullets I wonder why? I can't think of a reason.

Opinion
No way did GW4 shoot only one. For some reason there seems to be some doubt recently about GW4's level of involvement but no doubt at all that Angie was a prolific shooter.

My emotions tell me she couldn't do it, but my intellect tells me the indictments against her are brutal, no sugar coating. So going by that, yes she could be more involved than just being the stay-at-home babysitter that night.

Just because GW4 is only the uncle and not a parent or grandparent of Jake's child, that doesn't mean he has any less of a motive or less skin in the game. He was the most vocal about revenge, what kind of revenge? I don't think he was talking about anything other than shooting innocent LE--- just doing their job--- in cold blood.

The words used were "to take revenge against anyone who goes against us. " Sounds like a 100% group effort---ride or die together. He had full custody of his child and he wanted his brother to have the same and was glad to help him get it. For all we know, he was in charge of the guns and assembled the silencers and did the most shooting.

Here is one of his favorite Facebook Communities. Pretty chilling when you scroll down.

Tactical Country

I live in a state that has open carry, concealed carry, make my day law, stand your ground law, one of the most lenient medical marijuana laws and is getting ready to pass a law allowing 18 year old's to openly carry. A lot of people here belong to communities like that. That is because they want information, what gun shoots easier, which is safest, which is the most accurate, which is the most affordable ect. I don't see anything sinister in someone either belonging to that sight or viewing that sight.

Just about everyone here owns at least one gun and most of them own two or more. Hubby owns about 15, rifles, shotguns, handguns, scopes, bullets and no telling what else is locked up in his gun safe. Son owns about 10, both adult grandsons own at least 3 and I call my nephews house Little Waco because he owns so many guns. All of them get on sights like that to find out information about a particular gun or scope or whatever before they buy it. Not one of them has ever killed anyone. Other than service guns used in work as far as I can see all of the guns in my family just sit around collecting dust.

So I really don't see anything unusual about George belonging to a community like that.

BBM
The words used were "to take revenge against anyone who goes against us. "

My daddy used to say "talk is cheap, takes money to buy whiskey".

JMO

 

[Yellowbeak]

So with the motions filed by GW4’s attorney, does that mean the trial is delayed??

 

[RAISINISBACK]

As far as the 4 Wags go, IRS wouldn't waste their money. But I do think the IRS is investigating FW big time. JMO

I saw the IRS audit a man with a wife and two kids making 20 thousand a year over a 110.00 charitable donation. They paid more in wages to the auditor than they could have ever hoped to recover had they been able to disallow the 110.00 donation.

But I do think you are right about FW.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Yah. I edited the post to take that out. But I think the tactical country community site is interesting to see. You learn anything you want to learn about weapons, ammunition, laser site (red dot) , scopes, silencers, how to stalk, where to buy tactical gear, all different sizes of ammo, gun reviews, the differences between weapons on and on.

I wonder if they used laser sites on their guns and night vision equipment? It was very dark and a big question is how would they see anyone? All the victims were shot with the muzzle almost touching their heads (the muzzle was pressed against the side of Gary's head) it wasn't just shooting in a general direction, they had to see precisely what they were doing.

BBM

You learn anything you want to learn about weapons, ammunition, laser site (red dot) , scopes, silencers, how to stalk, where to buy tactical gear, all different sizes of ammo, gun reviews, the differences between weapons on and on.

Yes, that's why just about every man here is on sights like that. They go on sights like that before they invest a lot of money to buy a gun.

Kind of like women who surf Walmart, Lowes, Home Depot, Utube videos, manufacturer's web sights, comments sections, reviews ect before they buy a washer and dryer. They want to review performance and durability before they invest a lot of money in an appliance.

JMO

 

[Loomis124]

So with the motions filed by GW4’s attorney, does that mean the trial is delayed??

It is still on the docket for early September.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I'd have either used a small headlamp, or put a rail and tactical light on my firearm, if I were planning to do something such as that, if I had a firearm that would accommodate them.

It seems they had the element of surprise on their side too. As you wander around in the night, your eyes adjust. For example; When I take the kids out to catch lightning bugs, at first we can't see anything but the blinkers, as it goes on, we can see more and more as our eyes adapt to the dark.

We have a couple of places that offer Tactical Training not far from me. They train self defense, how to handle your firearm in certain situations, etc... Just being a part of a firearm group, or training group, isn't enough to have noted a red flag. Some may disagree, but, I live in an area where gunfire is often heard around us, and sometimes, we are the ones who are target practicing.

BBM

It didn't hurt that Jake knew the layout of those homes either. He knew where the bedrooms were, where the furniture sat ect. It is my firm belief that they missed little BR sleeping on the couch that night because they were not expecting him to be there. Or else he would be dead too.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

1911?
An M-1911 is the designation of the US Military sidearm used from WW1 thru Vietnam.
.45 caliber = big bullet.

Hubby owns a 1911 military handgun that according to the serial number was made in 1959, apparently issued during the Vietnam war.

JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

The photo of the firearms from the "Punisher" movie look somewhat customized to me. Are they?

Yes. With a skull.

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/7f/45/66/...b5fbcb5ee92--punisher-logo-punisher-skull.jpg

 

[Cool Cats]

So with the motions filed by GW4’s attorney, does that mean the trial is delayed??

No.

07/22/2019 MOTION TO CONTINUE JURY TRIAL SCHEDULED FOR 9-4-2019 FILED

 

[Johnny B Bad]

So does the other Wagners know that George 4th is going to trial in September?

 

[Cool Cats]

I’m curious .... when do they decide if the trial will be moved to a different county? I know GW4 will be in Pike for sure, but if they would move the others, do you think it would be in the county they are being held in? Aren’t they in 4 different counties?

Even though they are in different counties, they will all be tried in Pike County unless their attorneys file Motions for change of venues and the judge grants the Motions.

Sometimes a change of venue is granted right away like in the OJ Simpson case, and sometimes the attorneys will try to seat an impartial jury first, find out they cant, and thus file a Motion for change of venue.

GW4 is going first so I assume his trial will be in Pike County. If he is found guilty I assume the others will want their trials out of Pike, I would, that's just my opinion.

Angela's attorneys have filed a Motion for change of venue, here is what they said:

"....Attorneys for Angela Wagner, 48, asked the court to consider moving the case outside Pike County Common Pleas Court to ensure she receives “a fair trial before a jury untainted by pre-trial publicity.”

Wagner’s attorney, Robert Krapenc, said he filed the motion “out of an abundance of caution.”

“My opinion of the process is that I filed a motion so I could preserve the right at a later date,” Krapenc said. “I would probably ask the judge not to rule on that motion until we try to find a jury in Pike County.”

Krapenc also asked the court to dismiss the death penalty specifications against Angela Wagner, arguing Ohio’s death penalty is unconstitutional....."

https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...-asks-court-for-new-venue-drop-death-penalty/
_______________________________________________________________

Hamilton County Prosecutor Joe Deters offers help in Pike County massacre trials
Says he expects changes of venue for murder trials

"....In Cincinnati, Hamilton County Prosecutor Joe Deters said he believes changes in venue are coming, and he offered help from his office if the state needs it.

Junk said he intends to try all four cases in Pike County.

In Hamilton County, Deters has been watching with some skepticism.

"I can't image a scenario where they will be able to try that out in Pike County," Deters said. "These cases, it's just overwhelming."

In 1993, Deters' office was called on to help prosecute the Lucasville prison riot cases in Scioto County, another area with limited resources because of its size.

"Our death penalty cases, we call in a couple hundred jurors," Deters said. "They're not going to be able to do that. There's no way."

On top of the complicated cases, prosecutors will have to deal with seating four separate juries in a county with just 28,000 residents. That's why Deters said he believes changes in venue are coming.... "

Deters offers help in Pike Co. massacre trials

 

[Cool Cats]

So does the other Wagners know that George 4th is going to trial in September?

Yes. Their attorneys won't keep this from them. And you can watch news in jail and rumors are all over jails, the other inmates talk, and the Wagner's get visitors and phone calls. They know what is going on. Also, we know Robin visits her brother.

2 Cents

 

[Cool Cats]

#10,11,12 - Hail Mary
#13 - we already know he is not allowed to speak to his co-defendants. Then who is/are the people he is trying to avoid talking to? Isn't he already in voluntary, self imposed, solitary confinement?
Is it Granny Fred, Robin, or the lawyers of his c0-defendants he is trying to avoid???

He might be about ready to turn on the others.......

My opinion and speculation only.

MOTION NO 13: DEFENANT'S MOTION TO RESTRAIN CERTAIN PARTIES FROM DISCUSSING THE CASE WITH ACCUSED FILED

An involuntary confession is inadmissible at trial. Withrow v. Williams, 507 U.S. 680, 703 (1993). The admission into evidence of an involuntary confession deprives the defendant of the Fourteenth Amendment right to due process of law. Jackson v. Denno, 378 U.S. 368, 376 (1964).

Just another typical standard Motion to protect GW4 from incriminating himself. Say your in jail and another inmate gets talking to you and you inadvertently say too much. So the inmate tells LE that you confessed something and the inmate wants to testify against you to get himself a reduced sentence for his crime. This happens alot.

Well, the Judge ruled on the Motion that no one ( inmates, jail staff, court staff, LE officers, etc...) can discuss the case with you so anything you said cannot and will not be used against you.

See Taylor Allen Mills Case:

Motion filed to bar jail staff inmates from discussing case with murder suspect

"...Stevenson cited the high profile of the case and the notoriety of a murder defendant in a local jail in filing a motion to restrain certain parties from discussing the case with the defendant. The defense wishes to restrain the state, its agents, employees, the police, social workers, corrections officers, (inmates) Sheriff’s Office employees and all institution personnel from speaking with Mills in any way about the case without the presence of counsel.

Permitting such contact, Stevenson argued, would violate Mills’ rights to due process and the Fifth, Sixth, Eight and Fourteenth amendments to the U.S. Constitution.

“In exercising his right to silence and the right to counsel, the defendant must deal with the realities of incarceration with its lack of privacy and curiosity seekers,” Stevenson wrote. “Because of the notoriety of murder cases, and of this case in particular… the curiosity toward an accused charged with murder, and the temptation to discuss details of the case, the various personnel could knowingly or even unwittingly entice the defendant into a discussion of the case....”

( Which would incriminate him )

 

[Loomis124]

GW4 still has a Pre trial hearing and motions hearing on the court docket for tomorrow July 24 at 1:30 p.m.

 

[Cool Cats]

GW4 still has a Pre trial hearing and motions hearing on the court docket for tomorrow July 24 at 1:30 p.m.

Thankx, I keep forgetting!

Don't forget @Betty P...LOL..

 

[Chelly]

How do prosecutors decide which defendant should be tried first?

 

[Cool Cats]

How do prosecutors decide which defendant should be tried first?

By speedy trial deadlines. GW4 waived his Constitutional right to a speedy trial but still there was a time limit put on it. Then when that time limit was going to expire he did not waive his speedy trial again. So now the prosecution has to take his case to trial. If they don't all his charges will be dismissed and can't be refiled!

The others have continued to waive their rights to speedy trials. I think Jake's is next to run out but I would have to research it. Without links consider this as only my 2 cents.

 

[Merrygirl]

So with the motions filed by GW4’s attorney, does that mean the trial is delayed??

I’m not sure where I heard this info or maybe I am imagining it but I vaguely recall during a June pretrial (I think) for GW4 that his trial was scheduled for the end of Sept and expected to last through most of Oct. I’m not sure if this is correct though. I remembered this because I am retiring on 10/31 (after 44 yrs in the work force) and was hoping it would be moved at some point to Nov so I don’t miss it. I plan to enjoy my retirement by being glued to my TV watching Court TV!

 

[Cool Cats]

I’m not sure where I heard this info or maybe I am imagining it but I vaguely recall during a June pretrial (I think) for GW4 that his trial was scheduled for the end of Sept and expected to last through most of Oct. I’m not sure if this is correct though. I remembered this because I am retiring on 10/31 (after 44 yrs in the work force) and was hoping it would be moved at some point to Nov so I don’t miss it. I plan to enjoy my retirement by being glued to my TV watching Court TV!

His trial starts September 4. His attorney said it will be a 2 month trial going through October. Yes let's hope it's on court TV!!!!!!

07/22/2019 MOTION TO CONTINUE JURY TRIAL SCHEDULED FOR 9-4-2019 FILED

07/24/2019 1:30 pm MOTION HEARING

 

[Johnny B Bad]

How long into GW4 trial will the court start talking about incriminating evidence?