PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #5

[J. J. in Phila]

Wow...how creditable is that, I wonder?

Two more on 4/18 in Wilkes-Barre, a bartender and an out of town police officer visiting that day; the verification was independent, because the officer called LE and they checked the bartender.

One of the 4/16 witnesses, Bennett, is the owner of the SoS. He has an advanced degree from Penn (MBA) and is considered hugely credible.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I watched the program Disappeared Ray Gricar tonight. They mentioned his work cellular telephone was turned off. Does anyone know if he also had a personal cellular phone that he used? Didn't he call Patty that day and he was surprised that she picked up the phone...in regards to feeding the dog.

I still thought the guy in TX looked like Ray. Kudos to the lady in TX who was on the ball and took photos!

I've not heard about another cell, but LE would have checked any known phone.

Her called PEF at 11:12 - 11:14 AM on 4/15. The tower that carried the signal was outside of Rebersburg.

It might be on the past page, but there is an old witness list.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

The car being left in the parking lot the next day and cellular phone turned off makes me think staging.

He had voice mail, and it was his day off. There was nothing pressing at the office and the DA didn't generally need to be on 24 hour call.

 

[MaryLiz]

I watched the program Disappeared Ray Gricar tonight. They mentioned his work cellular telephone was turned off. Does anyone know if he also had a personal cellular phone that he used? Didn't he call Patty that day and he was surprised that she picked up the phone...in regards to feeding the dog.

I still thought the guy in TX looked like Ray. Kudos to the lady in TX who was on the ball and took photos![/quote]


BBM

I also thought the guy in Texas looked exactly like Ray..until they zeroed in on him in a close-up and you could tell the shape of the nose was slightly different from the side.

 

[Tristan]

"I still thought the guy in TX looked like Ray. Kudos to the lady in TX who was on the ball and took photos!"

I thought the guy looked exactly like Ray! I watched it with someone, and they remarked, "A lot of people look like him."

It's not like he had a purple mohawk, multiple tattoos etc.

He seems to have just vanished.

 

[justathought]

Since, as I understand it, Ray's pension hasn't been claimed, is the amount still building? If he were to reappear it would still be available to him, right?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Since, as I understand it, Ray's pension hasn't been claimed, is the amount still building? If he were to reappear it would still be available to him, right?

Yes, though I couldn't say that his monthly check would increase. He would be eligible to claim it. If he's declared dead, his heir will get it. His daughter, who so far as I know is his heir, could petition to declare him dead; she has not done so.

 

[MaryLiz]

Has anyone heard if there have been new tips or leads that have come in since the Disappeared show aired a couple weeks ago?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Has anyone heard if there have been new tips or leads that have come in since the Disappeared show aired a couple weeks ago?

No, but there was some new information.

 

[shefner]

Still one of the most perplexing cases....

 

[menna]

Hello all, I was compelled to join after seeing Disappeared featuring Ray's case. It is truly baffling. One day I feel that he committed suicide and the next day I think he just walked away. It really is a baffling case.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I think that suicide can almost be ruled out.

 

[Wannabe2]

Maybe Ray was thinking that he no longer wanted to hang around Bellefonte when retired. It may not be the most interesting place on earth. His girlfriend seemed to be much younger, and probably would not retire for quite a few years. Maybe he began to want a way out and the walk off theory is correct. Maybe he felt that any other solution would be too awkward. She and the daughter both seem to be in secure situations, so he might have felt free to go.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Maybe Ray was thinking that he no longer wanted to hang around Bellefonte when retired. It may not be the most interesting place on earth. His girlfriend seemed to be much younger, and probably would not retire for quite a few years. Maybe he began to want a way out and the walk off theory is correct. Maybe he felt that any other solution would be too awkward. She and the daughter both seem to be in secure situations, so he might have felt free to go.

The girlfriend, PEF, was planning to leave her job and travel with him.

She, however, was a native of Bellefonte, with strong tied there. The house she lives in was the house where she grew up. When she went away to school it was 11 miles south at Penn State; her brother works there. Her uncle was the mayor of Bellefonte in the 80's (and later county treasurer); her cousin is the county treasurer. Her uncle was actually known as "Mr. Bellefonte." As far as I can tell, she's never lived or worked outside of Centre County.

Heck, the first investigator remembered her from when she was in high school there.

I don't know how happy she'd be if RFG suggested leaving Bellefonte.

 

[menna]

I think that suicide can almost be ruled out.

The more I think about it I am now tending to agree with you. I also find myself thinking about this case alot, for some reason. It just kind of sneaks up on me and I'll dwell on what I have read here and just think about it. It might be because I am originally from PA and had a very good friend who lived in Bellefonte when I was in college.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

The more I think about it I am now tending to agree with you. I also find myself thinking about this case alot, for some reason. It just kind of sneaks up on me and I'll dwell on what I have read here and just think about it. It might be because I am originally from PA and had a very good friend who lived in Bellefonte when I was in college.

I went to school at Penn State and I lived in the Johnstown area for 25 years.

I would not rule out murder, though I thing voluntary departure is slightly more likely.

The last odds I gave, voluntary departure was 51%. Foul play was 40%. The odds on foul play will be increasing to 41%, at least.

 

[APIMaple]

I am pretty much done with the suicide idea myself.
And I think that if this is a homicide case, the situation remains close to home.
The phone call on his last day really bothers me. A call directly to her, so she is the real "last wall" so to speak.
That call "could" have been from anyone with Ray's phone.

And the witnesses at the shops "could" have been wrong.

All in all though, witnesses and such, so far I'm thinking this is a job well done of walking away.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I am pretty much done with the suicide idea myself.
And I think that if this is a homicide case, the situation remains close to home.
The phone call on his last day really bothers me. A call directly to her, so she is the real "last wall" so to speak.
That call "could" have been from anyone with Ray's phone.

And the witnesses at the shops "could" have been wrong.

All in all though, witnesses and such, so far I'm thinking this is a job well done of walking away.

There were people later in the day that saw not only RFG, but him driving the car. Disappeared indicated that there was at least one witness that saw him in route. I know that there are other witnesses that are unreported and some undisclosed details.

I think he was alive on 4/15 and in Lewisburg, well beyond a reasonable doubt. (And he could have been murdered that evening.)

 

[ThePhantom]

Do you think someone lured Ray to the town to abduct and murder him -- or -- to join him in escaping to the doldrums of Bellefonte?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Do you think someone lured Ray to the town to abduct and murder him -- or -- to join him in escaping to the doldrums of Bellefonte?

First, I doubt if he "abducted," if you mean forced into a car at gunpoint. There is an outside chance he was lured to Lewisburg, but how? Why, if it something related to his official duties, wouldn't he tell someone at the office, like one of his deputies? Why wouldn't he leave a note, just in case? It is possible, but unlikely.

Nobody "joined" him in disappearing, because no one else disappeared. Somebody else could have met up with him later.

That would not preclude a helper.

I'll give you the murder scenario I would call the most likely in a separate post.