Terri's friends want to distance themselves after being dragged into investigation

[human]

I still am mystified why the other woman who went through 5 hours of polygraph and apparently was not worried didn't invoke her "rights", but Dede is.

What is the difference here?

 

[Aedrys]

Okay, I think some clarification is needed here. I think even myself, I would probably get some legal advice before talking - but I would still talk. The people that make me mad are those that get legal advice and then refuse to talk. Yes, I know it's a right not to talk. But face it, it doesn't help the investigation and only makes the person not talking definitely look not innocent.

We don't know if Dede is cooperating or not. But anyway you look at it, there's a period of time that both she and TH can't account for that overlaps and doesn't look good. If Dede is innocent, then she needs to say so. Dede is a big question mark at this moment, so she has time to clear herself and get away from this. Why not talk to LE, even after getting a lawyer, to do that? Does she really want to be implicated in a child kidnappping or death, probably the worst thing a person can be involved in? What exactly does she gain from not talking, just her right not to? But again, we don't know if she is cooperating or not, and that's the frustrating thing here.

And I don't think Kyron's rights are more important than others, but he's a kid. He couldn't stop what happened to him, he can't get a lawyer now, and he can't speak up for what happened to him. So someone has to, and if it's his parents, I don't blame them. I am uncomfortable with that letter, but this is a lady that was telling people not to talk, that refused to identify herself when asked, and that looks almost as suspicious as TH with leaving abruptly and no one could get in touch with her. Plus, like I said earlier, her time gone overlaps TH's time driving on back roads. I'm sorry, but if I were Kyron's parents, that is not something I could ignore. And no, they haven't been calling every person out, ONLY TH and her good friend Dede. If these two aren't going to help and they are innocent, they are only making themselves look worse without any help from Kyron's parents. I'm sorry, but the "I'm innocent but I'm not going to tell you anything" way of doing things (I'm not saying they said that, just that that seems to be their attitude) really bugs me. It makes me think they aren't innocent and have something to hide. And nothing should be more important than a missing kid, not even a stupid affair on the side. That's just ridiculous.

Of course, I'd be less likely to publish a public letter like Kyron's parents did and more likely to confront her myself without media help, but that's just me. I do think the letter was a bit much even though I don't really blame them for it. There's two people here that aren't helping to find their son, and those two people are lucky that all they have done is out them in the media. (Okay, TH has had more happen to her, but still, she's not in jail and hasn't been arrested. She hasn't been physically hurt either and can still fight everything in court. All there is is talk against her at this point. That's what I'm saying). They could be directly going after both of them and they aren't. They could be directly framing the both of them, and they aren't. I hear all the time about people taking the law in their own hands, or stories of people going out of their way to frame someone, and I see neither of that here. I see more talking and threats of legal action, not actual legal action or physical action. What Kyron's parents have done is freaking mild compared to that.

I do know what I would do. I would at least ask my dad for some legal advice before I would definitely talk. I would not, however, get a lawyer and then keep my mouth shut, thus hampering an investigation and leaving Kyron out in the cold. That is wrong in my eyes, and that is using rights to hide behind, not to protect myself.

Also, it's time to stop being nice. I'm tired of people saying, if they were only nice to them...niceness doesn't get results. Niceness is not going to get Kyron found. I don't think rights should be violated either, but I don't think nice is going solve this case. Nice has been tried and it hasn't worked. So something else has to be done, pressure has to be upped, and the gloves have to come off. And if TH doesn't have any more friends (that's if Dede decides to or is talking), she better watch it because there's only one thing left that LE can turn the pressure on - her family.

ETA: My 1,000 post! Wow, I've had a lot to say since I joined in January!

ETA2: Kyron's parents have NOT outed people who didn't consent to searches because for all we know, these people are totally unrelated and having nothing to do with what happened to Kyron. We don't even know if these people know TH at all or just vaguely from school. These people are most likely not seven year best friends with Terri, they are probably totally different. Geez, give Kyron's parents a break. Now if they do come out against people who didn't consent to searches, then okay, that is way over the line. I don't blame them for trying to pressure Dede. She is far too entwined with Terri to be ignored.

 

[Kat010]

One thing that aggravates me, among others, is that the U.S. is a treasure in terms of its laws that try to punish criminals but also protect citizen's right, but sometimes those accomplishments aren't respected. And we have service people on the front lines who fight to protect our country and its freedoms and protections.

I respect their service, and don't really want to see what they're fighting for diminished. Yes, legal rights can slow things down--then again, would anyone prefer out-of-control police? Not me.

If the emotions in one case can give the right to run roughshod over people and their rights, then why not every case that touches someone's emotions? There are people raped, murdered, kidnapped, assaulted far too many, every single day and there are emotions for those involved.

So is it all right then for each of those cases to get an exemption from our rights and how people are treated? I believe the Soviet secret service has been an understanding example of that type of system. People got "disappeared", killed, tortured, shipped off to gulags, with no defense.

Before all this, and reading, reading on this case, I probably would cheerfully have talked without an attorney. But now, seeing how easy it is to create a mob reaction that demands action regardless of evidence and constitutional rights, I've changed my mind. All it takes is something circumstantial, an aroused public, cops and DA with tunnel vision, and any of us could wind up in serious trouble while being innocent of anything.

 

[cluciano63]

Has LE ever said that Dede is not cooperating? Does having a lawyer nowadays equal non-cooperation?

She may well have spoken to police by now, maybe several days ago. I will wait to hear from LE that she refuses to do so.

And I certainly don't blame her for the awkward exchange with the reporter from WW. Good grief.

 

[BeanE]

I hope so too, but I wonder how they can do that? What is there to say?

LE searched, can't find him, continues to follow tips and leads generated from them, searches in accordance with leads. We are concentrating on trying to force people who have direct knowledge about where Kyron is to talk. No one has told us where Kyron is, and we think TH took him, so we are targeting her and her known associates. Now, as part of trying to force people to talk (ie., confess), here is some more dirt on them.

Oh, and we firmly believe Kyron is alive, so please keep an eye out for him. This is what we are doing to prepare for his return. This is how badly we feel. Here is his picture. This is the amount of the reward for information leading to his return. If you see him, call 911. Here is the tip line phone number.

This show, if nothing else, will inform more people about what has happened to Kyron. Maybe it will jog some people's memories or convince someone who doesn't want to get involved to call LE. Maybe it will convince one or more of TH's friends to talk (or to say more) to LE. If Kyron is alive, maybe it will lead to his return.

But whoever took Kryon will be unmoved by this. How does it benefit him or her to confess? Confession leads straight to a permanent address change for that person. If that person has an accomplice, maybe it will persuade the accomplice to talk -- but that will be easier to accomplish if the perp and/or the purported accomplice were charged with a crime.

Kaine in the Wall of Hope interview:

Reporter asks if there's anything else he wants the public to know.

Kaine: Aside from we love him and miss him, no.


Expect brief interviews from here on out.

 

[human]

I also am wondering about Dede's and Terri's relationship of mutual interest in gardening and healthy food.

1. Why didn't she hire the unemployed Dede to landscape her yard?

2. Healthy food. I have read Dede's blogs and twitters and she is into healthy food. The really healthy food that many of my close friends are into .

I actually thought that Dede's recipe for the watermelon smoothie with the spinach sounded like something I am going to try.

But, I saw pictures of the baby's birthday with cupcakes and then the picture of the St. Patrick's day where Terri had made something to eat with those sprinkles and it looked like some kind of boxed mix.

Someone who is into healthy food would no more feed their children that than they would feed them ground up tires. There are so many more healthy alternatives to give children than a boxed mix and sprinkles.

So, I do not understand this healthy eating and gardening connection. It's a mystery to me.

And I know that people will say those kinds of things are fun for children. But seriously, healthy eaters equate that kind of stuff with poisoning your body.

And if you can't control it for yourself, you would never serve it to your children.

 

[BeanE]

A while back, a month or more ago, there was a report that some people near the school and the Hormans' home did not allow searchers to search their properties. Should the names of these people have been given to Desiree and Kaine so that they could call out these people as well? These people "weren't cooperating" either and we don't know if they had anything to hide about Kyron, or if they grow pot, or if they simply were exercising their rights.

I have to wonder if the people flat out and completely refused, or if they said they'd be happy to, but they wanted to consult their attorney first.

 

[passionflower]

O/T are DD friends being dragged into this also????
Since TH and DD are buddies they probably have mutual friends???
Friends from the same gym? landscaping? etc?

 

[Kat010]

A while back, a month or more ago, there was a report that some people near the school and the Hormans' home did not allow searchers to search their properties. Should the names of these people have been given to Desiree and Kaine so that they could call out these people as well? These people "weren't cooperating" either and we don't know if they had anything to hide about Kyron, or if they grow pot, or if they simply were exercising their rights.

Brilliant post.

 

[BeanE]

I still am mystified why the other woman who went through 5 hours of polygraph and apparently was not worried didn't invoke her "rights", but Dede is.

What is the difference here?

I don't know. I just know that I have always thought that if ever LE wanted to question me about anything, search my home, for me to take a poly, anything, for any reason, I would simply comply with no attorney because I am a law-abiding citizen.

Based solely on what is happening in this case, I've decided I will never do that. I will absolutely retain an attorney first. And if it happens to be a high-profile case, I will have my attorney negotiate to keep my name out of the media (not for myself, but for my loved ones.)

 

[RoughlyCollie]

Kind of OT, but on a crime show I saw some time ago (can't recall which case), a detective was talking about how people lie to LE all the time and about the dumbest things that don't even matter, except to the person.

I've been questioned by LE before. I sat at a large conference table with between 8 and 10 police officers (a few would leave and then come back), for a couple of hours. After awhile, I realized they were asking me the same questions over and over. Then I realized they were asking trick questions. Then I was convinced they did not believe what I was telling them. I was 19 years old, and had never spoken to the police before, and I was desperate to be believed because my life was at stake.

I can see how a person would change her story to make LE believe her, even slightly, if that's what it took. The change could very well be unnoticed by the person and not be done on purpose by a person being interrogated and involved in her story.

I didn't lie. Luckily, I had left my purse in the waiting room outside the conference room, and in there was absolute proof that I was telling the truth. (I say it was absolute proof because LE instantly provided me with continuous police officer body guards, talked to my boss about what to do if the perp came there and how to protect me, helped me find another place to live, and eventually arrested the perp. I had escaped, unharmed physically, after having been kidnapped by a stranger 24 hours before.)

Also, sometimes witnesses are mistaken about what they see or don't see something that was right there in front of their faces.

Last night, our family went to the Olive Garden restaurant for dinner. We were seated at a large table in an alcove. I was seated directly across from two kids and one friend's kid. I was focused on the kids, on my dinner salad, on how much I do not like that restaurant, on how I would rather not be adhering to a cardiovascular disease patient's diet, on how much this meal would cost us, and on how I would rather be eating at the Tex-Mex place next door, heart disease be damned.

As we pulled out of the parking lot, my husband remarked that he had seen the Target shopping center across the street from the restaurant window.

We were seated next to one another, facing the wall this alleged large window was in and I never saw it! How could that happen? The five teens with us had to verify the existence of the window before I believed my husband wasn't pulling my leg.

 

[Aedrys]

I don't know. I just know that I have always thought that if ever LE wanted to question me about anything, search my home, for me to take a poly, anything, for any reason, I would simply comply with no attorney because I am a law-abiding citizen.

Based solely on what is happening in this case, I've decided I will never do that. I will absolutely retain an attorney first. And if it happens to be a high-profile case, I will have my attorney negotiate to keep my name out of the media (not for myself, but for my loved ones.)

And I totally agree with that. Get a lawyer, then negotiate and talk to LE. Where we're splitting hairs here is not on getting legal advice before talking, but getting legal advice and then not talking. If a person gets a lawyer, but still negotiates and talks with LE, that is fine my book. A person who gets a lawyer and then refuses to help in any way whatsoever is what I don't agree with. And I'm not saying that person is Dede, I'm just talking in general.

 

[human]

I don't know. I just know that I have always thought that if ever LE wanted to question me about anything, search my home, for me to take a poly, anything, for any reason, I would simply comply with no attorney because I am a law-abiding citizen.

Based solely on what is happening in this case, I've decided I will never do that. I will absolutely retain an attorney first. And if it happens to be a high-profile case, I will have my attorney negotiate to keep my name out of the media (not for myself, but for my loved ones.)

It makes me wonder what I would do, but attorneys cost a fortune, your one of choice may not be available, and keeping your name out of the media would probably be impossible because of all of those tricky constitutional rights for the free press.

I think I would take my chances with LE as the court of public opinion is far more brutal and mainly because I would be innocent, although with hours of unaccounted for time.

 

[Haeve]

<snip>
2. Healthy food. I have read Dede's blogs and twitters and she is into healthy food. The really healthy food that many of my close friends are into .

I actually thought that Dede's recipe for the watermelon smoothie with the spinach sounded like something I am going to try.

But, I saw pictures of the baby's birthday with cupcakes and then the picture of the St. Patrick's day where Terri had made something to eat with those sprinkles and it looked like some kind of boxed mix.

Someone who is into healthy food would no more feed their children that than they would feed them ground up tires. There are so many more healthy alternatives to give children than a boxed mix and sprinkles.

So, I do not understand this healthy eating and gardening connection. It's a mystery to me.

And I know that people will say those kinds of things are fun for children. But seriously, healthy eaters equate that kind of stuff with poisoning your body.

And if you can't control it for yourself, you would never serve it to your children.

I dunno, my crowd is into healthy food, but they also choose their battles. They eat mostly healthy, but then sometimes they feel it's important to recreate the same type of holiday experiences they had as children, petrochemical sprinkles and all. My good friend is formerly an organic farmer, back-to-the-land-eco everything, but when her teen daughter wanted to make some gawdawful cake for her birthday--I can't remember what it was but I'm pretty sure it involved confetti cake mix--she totally supported her and they had a lot of fun. I think part of the fun is the irony of making something that is so unhealthy, if that makes sense. This same child has a thing for marshmallow peeps, and she does know that they're not really food. JMHO

 

[citigirl]

I'm sorry, but I am not 100% convinced that LE is not leaking this information through DY and KH. Or, at least, that they did so in the beginning. TY does seem more circumspect ("connect the dots") than KH and DY, though.

IF KH and DY are "going rogue," then it would bother me a lot if they are hampering the investigation out of a need to vent. But if they are not hurting the investigation, and LE has told them these things, I do not have a problem with them "outing" these people.

They have said they are going to pursue a civil remedy. They have that right. How angry they must be. Think Ron Goldman's family's anger with OJ Simpson. They do not have any responsibility to meet the same standard as LE does for a criminal case.

 

[debs]

As we've seen in a number of cases before, LE considers a person as "not cooperating" when they "lawyer up" and we've seen the disdain with which they utter the words.

Get a lawyer is the best advice a person can get. Talk to LE or be advised not to talk to them then is a legal maneuver which states that LE must prove why they need to talk to you in the first place. In the case of the disappearance of a child, I think it is the wisest advice. Ever.

As we've seen, once you give LE access, they'll dig into every aspect of your life. No one can suggest they want that.

 

[ZL27]

It makes me wonder what I would do, but attorneys cost a fortune...

That's why we have public defenders. Riley Fox's father was 100% innocent, but look what happened to him.

 

[cluciano63]

I'm sorry, but I am not 100% convinced that LE is not leaking this information through DY and KH. Or, at least, that they did so in the beginning. TY does seem more circumspect ("connect the dots") than KH and DY, though.

IF KH and DY are "going rogue," then it would bother me a lot if they are hampering the investigation out of a need to vent. But if they are not hurting the investigation, and LE has told them these things, I do not have a problem with them "outing" these people.

They have said they are going to pursue a civil remedy. They have that right. How angry they must be. Think Ron Goldman's family's anger with OJ Simpson. They do not have any responsibility to meet the same standard as LE does for a criminal case.

As long as D&K realize that civil action can go both ways, if the people they name are not involved.
And I do not believe that LE is orchestrating anything, I think they are trying to work as quietly as possible. I think D&K come to their own conclusions about who is cooperating and why. I feel very sorry for them, but I have never seen anything like this before in any case.

 

[RoughlyCollie]

Someone who is into healthy food would no more feed their children that than they would feed them ground up tires. There are so many more healthy alternatives to give children than a boxed mix and sprinkles.

I am a big proponent of healthy food, eating locally produced food, organic food, and whole grains. I do serve my family highly nutritious, well balanced, healthy meals, but I do not force anyone to eat tofu.

I would not even consider denying my children birthday cakes, Christmas cookies, and other homemade cookies and desserts. I make the birthday cakes the children request -- and two of them always want cakes made from boxed mixes and canned frosting (and sometimes sprinkles).

 

[RoughlyCollie]

That's why we have public defenders. Riley Fox's father was 100% innocent, but look what happened to him.

In my experience, public defenders are assigned after the person is arrested.