Thailand - FOUND ALIVE - Officials Believe 12 Boys And Coach Trapped In Cave , 23 June 2018

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What happens sometimes in times of national catastrophe, local
officials or military officials become the spokesperson in these
countries and they're not always the sharpest people with
accurate up to date information or skills. then you get multiple people
vying to be in charge or sound like they're in charge and you
get misinformation like we are getting here.

I hope the Thai officials continue to take the advice of the British
Cave Divers on scene who happen to be the best in the world
at cave rescues. None of the Thai Navy Seals are even qualified
in cave diving according to the cave divers groups.
The Thai officials should step back and allow the more competent
'volunteers' from Britain and US run this operation.
 
enelram said:
What happens sometimes in times of national catastrophe, local
officials or military officials become the spokesperson in these
countries and they're not always the sharpest people with
accurate up to date information or skills. then you get multiple people
vying to be in charge or sound like they're in charge and you
get misinformation like we are getting here.

I hope the Thai officials continue to take the advice of the British
Cave Divers on scene who happen to be the best in the world
at cave rescues. None of the Thai Navy Seals are even qualified
in cave diving according to the cave divers groups.
The Thai officials should step back and allow the more competent
'volunteers' from Britain and US run this operation.
Click to expand...

I agree we are getting lots of conflicting parts of information and I am hoping that the real decision makers are the experts on scene.

The thing that scares me somewhat is it sounded like there is some sort of Thai rules or something that has to be followed before an action can happen. I hope any obstacles or authority type things dont get in the way of doing what is best. I am afraid some of that is already happening causing delays.

Someone there should by now have stepped up and tell everyone else to stand down and let the experts do the right thing.
 
Excellent post, Hatfield.
I've seen this happen in airline crashes where the country's spokesperson, sometimes they're a politician and sometimes
military as here, so far- are B.S. ing their way through a press conference and the incompetence shines through.
 
1&2&3 said:
When I posted last night I was trying to not be alarming as I stated my thoughts. However, honestly, my intuition told me there was no way diving these boys out of that cave was going to work.

Having been around pools all my life, watching children start swim lessons, or seeing children come to a pool who have never been before, the fear on their faces of the water is a terrifying look. So to get these trapped boys into murky water, told to breathe through this mask, carry this heavy tank, and it will be about a five hour journey, I cannot see a successful rescue! Add to their weakness of no food and mental stress, it adds up to a disaster.

It may be the only way out, but these boys and coach need to be carried out in some manner wherever possible. We don’t expect mountain climbers or skiers lost for days to get back to base on their own two feet.

My opinions only.
Click to expand...

bbm
They might not be able to swim in the way we think of swimming - make the 'correct' arm and leg movements and propel themselves forward, but it has been reported that a) they grew up "on the river", and b) they used to "swim" at the waterfalls with their coach. So they certainly have been in water and have played and splashed and paddled around in it. I don't believe they are terrified of being in water. They might be scared of diving though.

It has been reported that parts of the route are now dry, thanks to pumping, and parts still have water but are walkable, so it's not a five hour continuous dive. I would like to know how long are the stretches that still need to be dived through. That would be crucial imo. If they are relatively short I feel they should take them out.
 
enelram said:
From the SCUBA Forum-
2:55pm Friday- Emergency crews rushed to the cave after report that at least 2 rescue workers have been electrocuted by an
electrical wire inside the cave. Information is scant as it just happened but the reports say the power has now been turned off
temporarily.
4:30pm Friday- Chiang Rai Govenor has denied the report and stated 1 rescue volunteer simply fainted inside the cave and has been taken to hospital and is in safe condition.
Who You Gonna Believe???
Click to expand...

Just to clarify, I believe that this happened last week Friday.
 
‘Not Working’ – Doubts Raised Over Cave Rescue Plan

“The water is still not going down. If you want it to go down by a meter, it’s going to take up to a month,” Bin Bunluerit said after finishing work with his team to widen chambers of the cave leading to the 12 boys and their coach.

“I dare say this: What we’re doing every day here is not working,” he said. “Water is still there. From the third chamber, SEALs have to dive four to five hours to reach the boys.”

He also noted that the oxygen levels beyond this spot are falling low.

“It’s very narrow, very difficult to bring things through. Only one person can go at a time,” said Ekkapun Bunluerit, Bin’s twin brother. “At first they had to take off the [oxygen] tanks and reassemble them again. It took a lot of time.”

“It’s very difficult because of all the diving. From the third chamber to the Pattaya Beach chamber, water is filling up the whole way, for very long. A SEAL has to use four tanks. It’s kilometers [of diving],” he continued.

Outgoing Gov. Narongsak Osottanakorn, who’s been leading the operation, has said that the main plan is to pump water out until the level is low enough for the boys to come out through the main entrance.

Sgt. Maj. 1st Class Saengpol Kaewlarn said ropes have been laid all the way to where the boys are trapped. They’re waiting for the water level to go down, and he hopes to see at least one of them walk out safely from the entrance.

'Not Working' - Doubts Raised Over Cave Rescue Plan

What a depressing article :( I thought the dives would be shorter by now.

And this: "he hopes to see at least one of them walk out safely" Huh? :confused:
 
Elainera said:
Ramillah‏ @Ramillah_Sierra

More depressing news keeps coming. The Chiangrai Governor just informed that the oxygen level inside the cave is getting low; especially where the kids are located. The Thai Navy is working on boosting the oxygen level right now. #ThamLuangCave #ThamLuang #Caverescue #Thailand

https://twitter.com/Ramillah_Sierra/status/1014913913152987136
Click to expand...

Not very eloquent, but ugh. It's just one bad thing after another... they just HAVE to get them out safely. :(:(
 
Elainera said:
Ramillah‏ @Ramillah_Sierra

More depressing news keeps coming. The Chiangrai Governor just informed that the oxygen level inside the cave is getting low; especially where the kids are located. The Thai Navy is working on boosting the oxygen level right now. #ThamLuangCave #ThamLuang #Caverescue #Thailand

https://twitter.com/Ramillah_Sierra/status/1014913913152987136
Click to expand...
I saw a reference to this earlier that said the boys' O2 levels were
below 15%, but I can't find the details.
I wonder how many 'extra' people are in that area of cave using
up the O2.
 
Thai cave rescue: army drains site in bid to free boys before monsoon

About half-way down the page is a graphic showing roughly how much water is left to be drained out and approximately what they think it looks like now. More places with headspace above the water from what I can see, but I have no idea how accurate the graphic might be.

It also mentions some of the health issues developing in the boys.... apparently three have intestinal upsets :-(
 
Also from the Guardian link in my last post...

All the info about the cave that arrives at the entrance is about 11 hours old as that's the time it takes for a diver to go all the way in and all the way out!

So it doesn't sound like they've yet managed to set up a direct comms link :-(
 
I'm thinking that the divers who are in the boys' end of the cave might have to make some autonomous decisions based on their gut feeling on the boys' health situation and their knowledge that more rain is forecast in a few days. With an 11 hour comms delay it's no good to make the final decision from the outside when there are 13 people to be extracted.

Well, it would be about six hours to get a message from the team at the entrance down to the cave where the boys are stuck. Even so that seems too much of a delay. I think they need to ensure that someone with command permissions is positioned inside the cave system to reduce the comms time? Hopefully they have.
 
Amonet said:
Thai cave rescue: army drains site in bid to free boys before monsoon

About half-way down the page is a graphic showing roughly how much water is left to be drained out and approximately what they think it looks like now. More places with headspace above the water from what I can see, but I have no idea how accurate the graphic might be.

It also mentions some of the health issues developing in the boys.... apparently three have intestinal upsets :-(
Click to expand...

I think that graphic is from a few days ago. There was another one today, posted previously somewhere, where it showed a completely dry walkable stretch between Pataya Beach and Monk's Junction. But I don't know how accurate that is either. Lots of conflicting accounts of the situation (the article I just posted above for example said that between Chamber 3 and Pattaya Beach is ALL dive, nothing walkable).
 
Amonet said:
Also from the Guardian link in my last post...

All the info about the cave that arrives at the entrance is about 11 hours old as that's the time it takes for a diver to go all the way in and all the way out!

So it doesn't sound like they've yet managed to set up a direct comms link :-(
Click to expand...

I don't understand because last night we heard they were able to get out in under an hour.
 
"Thai officials said the boys have been practicing breathing in diving masks in case heavy rain forces the group to swim and dive out the same way rescuers entered. But there are concerns that something could go awry on the way out, or the boys could panic underwater in the narrow tunnels and passageways.

An official with Thailand's National Broadcasting and Telecommunications Commission told ABC News that rescuers would like to wait until the water level inside the cave recedes so the boys can float out in life jackets rather than dive.

Monsoon rains are forecast to pummel the region Sunday as Thailand enters its wet season. "

Monsoon rains could damper rescue efforts to save soccer team in Thailand cave
 
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