The Smiths

[time]

It's a shame not to look at the possibility of Elizabeth acting on her own, because Gabe, if still with us, is a defenseless baby in grave danger. He deserves every chance that can be given to him to be found and returned to safety.

I can't really follow your post... no one said that shouldn't be considered or looked into. He could be in the same danger even if the Smith's are involved or if the truth lies somewhere between the two theories.

 

[time]

<snip>
This has me sick to my stomach, knowing what the possibilities are here. None of them are good. The Smith's involvement has been changing with the weather. Lies change. The truth - always stays the same. TS is trying to make herself out to be a kind and benevolent Good Samaritan - she reminds me of Sue Baker, she knows much more than she is telling.

I think you may have nailed this. Either TS knows exactly where Gabe is or she knows who has him. Possibly more information than EJ has. Has her (TS) affect ever changed? Has she ever appeared really concerned?
[/COLOR]

Yeah ... I think the lack of concern part could be more telling than anything. I can't fathom that Tammi doesn't know anything of Gabriel's whereabouts and she is then unconcerned. Good point on lies change and the truth stays the same. If the Smith's weren't involved far more than what they claim, there wouldn't be this mess of changing stories and conflicting accounts.

 

[Prof]

Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but some posts might make some posters feel like they are being critiqued for their efforts

I think we ARE all well-aware that Gabriel is defenseless and in danger; this is evidenced by the amount of time we spend here posting --most of us have been working hard and long to do what ever we can to help bring him home--

This is the Smith's thread, and I don't want to feel like I am doing the wrong thing by posting my theories on their involvement, or that by doing so I am not helping bring Gabe home

IMO EVERY post made to these forums that bring in new theories or develop old theories, discuss facts or speculate on anything possible in this case should be encouraged rather than discouraged -- they are all helpful if they do that, and there is no shame here

Again, this is my opinion, and perhaps I misunderstood a post

 

[time]

Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but some posts might make some posters feel like they are being critiqued for their efforts

I think we ARE all well-aware that Gabriel is defenseless and in danger; this is evidenced by the amount of time we spend here posting --most of us have been working hard and long to do what ever we can to help bring him home--

This is the Smith's thread, and I don't want to feel like I am doing the wrong thing by posting my theories on their involvement, or that by doing so I am not helping bring Gabe home

IMO EVERY post made to these forums that bring in new theories or develop old theories, discuss facts or speculate on anything possible in this case should be encouraged rather than discouraged -- they are all helpful if they do that, and there is no shame here

Again, this is my opinion, and perhaps I misunderstood a post

Thanks... I guess I am feeling the same.

 

[Prof]

Thanks... I guess I am feeling the same.

It is possible that it is just a misunderstanding, a wrong word choice

Anyway, I just started a thread to discuss the possibility that EJ found an adoptive couple on her own without the Smiths' at all

I hope this new thread helps Logan and Gabriel, and any frustrated posters here

 

[Amster]

LE have said the Smiths are POI and know more than they are telling, possibly. That's good enough for me to think they should be looked at inside out and upside down and everything in between. Isn't that why we have this thread? The Smiths? If not, I apologize and will go into lurk mode. Because there is no doubt in my mind that they are involved....big time!

 

[TXHOPE]

It is possible that it is just a misunderstanding, a wrong word choice

Anyway, I just started a thread to discuss the possibility that EJ found an adoptive couple on her own without the Smiths' at all

I hope this new thread helps Logan and Gabriel, and any frustrated posters here

I think everyone here wants to hear any and all theories and they are very much appreciated. When I post a theory, I'm hoping someone does a poke a hole in it so I can move on to the next and find out wht really happened. I think that's why it's good to share and bounce ideas off eachother so we can find the flawproof plan of what really happened. Don't be frustrated posters! We just have to put our heads together and figure this out!

 

[time]

It is possible that it is just a misunderstanding, a wrong word choice

Anyway, I just started a thread to discuss the possibility that EJ found an adoptive couple on her own without the Smiths' at all

I hope this new thread helps Logan and Gabriel, and any frustrated posters here

Honestly, I think there are a lot of areas where it could be gray - it was not the Smith's total planning nor totally EJ. Even if, in the end, EJ found a couple on her own, that does not mean someone wasn't advising her on how to do that or aware of what she was doing.

 

[Prof]

Amster, there's is not really much doubt in my mind that the Smith's are involved, but I will give some thought to the theory that they were not involved in the last part --just as every avenue should be explored --

The Smith's involvement is obvious, and IMO they should be grilled and their changing stories should be confronted until they give up some information that will help find Gabriel

Give them the dang Body Talk therapy or whatever they were asking for --give them another lie detector -- put some pressure on them, already! Ask them the hard questions reporters!

 

[TXHOPE]

Honestly, I think there are a lot of areas where it could be gray - it was not the Smith's total planning nor totally EJ. Even if, in the end, EJ found a couple on her own, that does not mean someone wasn't advising her on how to do that or aware of what she was doing.

I totally agree. There's alot of gray area here between the Smiths involvement and EJ. I do think the Smiths helped her get out of town and may of gave her the idea to leave and that in my eyes causes Gabriel to go missing and this whole mess. I do think Elizabeth is smart enough to come up with plan B on her own and we shouldn't under estimate what she is capable of doing on her own-be it find another couple or worse.

 

[time]

I totally agree. There's alot of gray area here between the Smiths involvement and EJ. I do think the Smiths helped her get out of town and may of gave her the idea to leave and that in my eyes causes Gabriel to go missing and this whole mess. I do think Elizabeth is smart enough to come up with plan B on her own and we shouldn't under estimate what she is capable of doing on her own-be it find another couple or worse.

I agree with what you are saying also and would not underestimate Elizabeth. I am basing my thoughts that the Smith's are more involved than some want to think (however much that is) on much of what Tammi and Jack have said and done themselves. And, then couple that with the fact that Elizabeth's behavior indicates to me that she thought they were all in this together.

I think that one 9 minute interview she did with the Smith's via phone sheds more light on their interactions, then this recent interaction where Elizabeth appears to tell Tammi outright that she set her up. Like others, the only reason I can see for Tammi going to the media with that is for damage control since it is going to come out anyway. It fits the pattern of the Smith's behavior also - they only tell what they think they have to, then they tell a little more or remember something or confess to something when they know they have been caught in deceit.

It just seems to me that IF most of their involvement was 'pre-leaving Tempe' and that had nothing to do with setting something up in SA or elsewhere, or if they simply didn't know what was really going on, then why would they be acting this way? I don't think they are doing it to help Elizabeth and they certainly aren't doing it to help find Gabriel.

 

[time]

I just cringe when I read this...

McQueary recently showed AZ Central 12 News a text message that he says the Smiths sent to him on December 22, four days after Johnson ran away with Baby Gabriel. The text said, "Can we get together tomorrow morning to talk with you and your dad [Frank McQueary]? I'm afraid she [Johnson]'ll be gone forever, cause she doesn't want to go to jail for kidnapping. She doesn't trust u or ur dad. The only way she'll come back is if my attorney faxes the signed papers to her so she won't get in trouble, and Gabriel b w/us". McQueary has said the Smiths tried to pressure him into signing adoption papers. The Smiths have denied it.

http://www.associatedcontent.com/ar...mmi_smith_hired_killer_lawyer_pg2.html?cat=25

 

[time]

Logan saying what he thinks about the recent call between Elizabeth and Tammi Smith

As for Smith, McQueary turned down her offer for a public apology, and thinks after her phone call with Elizabeth Johnson over the weekend, Tammi is really the one pulling the strings. "It kind of sounded like Tammi kind of said you need to watch your mouth and be careful what you said. Maybe she said that for a reason," said McQueary.

http://www.kpho.com/news/22350870/detail.html

 

[time]

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1001/11/ng.01.html.

T. SMITH: Well, I met her seven months ago so I didn`t know her until she came and called us on the 8th. So probably nine or 10 days. But, you know, the thing about emotionally attached to -- not to her, to Gabriel, you know?

Yes, we had some attachment. I mean, anybody would have attachment even if that baby came to your house for 24 hours. You still have that love for that child that you held in you and you hugged and played with.

You fed him and change his diaper, and, you know, and taught him how to eat with a spoon. He couldn`t really eat with a spoon when we got him. We tried to teach him how to crawl.

You know nine or 10 days, I`m sorry. We fell in love with him.

MCCOLLUM: You just used past tense. You just said we had attachment. Mr. And Mrs. Smith, please take a second polygraph. I find it very difficult to believe two of you in two separate tests were inconclusive.

 

[DairyGirl]

Ok, I am confused. I just read on TPS's Facebook where she said that LM is the one that told her how to get in touch with EJ in San Antonio. Didn't she say before that she is the one that told LM how to get in touch with EJ in San Antonio? Does anyone remember? Because she had a new cell phone that she got in San Antonio and after EJ called her she called LM and gave him the number?

 

[yosande]

I'm not getting it. Are you saying that EJ's bail is too high? She may have killed her baby!

I'm saying that yes, her bail is too high. She has not been charged with murder, that I know of.

In fact, the only thing she is obviously guilty of is custodial interference, everything else is speculation at this point. Because they don't know where the baby is, and mom isn't talking, they are attempting to keep her in jail with a high bail for not cooperating with them, imoo.

ETA;
My anger, and concern is that judges are doing this more and more. The common man cannot possibly attain that amount. The purpose of the high bail is to keep her in jail as if he judged her with no bail. So then why didn't he? Because by law her couldn't with the charges and evidence against her.

It's an abuse of power, and The Constitution set safeguards in place to protect the common man from such abuses. More and more judges are not respecting The Constitution, therefore, we should all be concerned.

Here's some history as to why our Constitution set these safeguards in place.
[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excessive_bail[/ame]

I'm sorry for this being o/t. I'll not bring it up again in this thread.

 

[DairyGirl]

I'm saying that yes, her bail is too high. She has not been charged with murder, that I know of.

In fact, the only thing she is obviously guilty of is custodial interference, everything else is speculation at this point. Because they don't know where the baby is, and mom isn't talking, they are attempting to keep her in jail with a high bail for not cooperating with them, imoo.

Sounds like a good reason to me. The baby, if alive, could very well be in danger. Anyone that procurs a baby illegally is suspect. They could be predators for all we know.

 

[sleuth2001]

Ok, I am confused. I just read on TPS's Facebook where she said that LM is the one that told her how to get in touch with EJ in San Antonio. Didn't she say before that she is the one that told LM how to get in touch with EJ in San Antonio? Does anyone remember? Because she had a new cell phone that she got in San Antonio and after EJ called her she called LM and gave him the number?

I believe you are right.

 

[Prof]

I'm saying that yes, her bail is too high. She has not been charged with murder, that I know of.

In fact, the only thing she is obviously guilty of is custodial interference, everything else is speculation at this point. Because they don't know where the baby is, and mom isn't talking, they are attempting to keep her in jail with a high bail for not cooperating with them, imoo.

I think they have her for some other charges, like kidnapping? She is a flight risk, and that is why her bail is high IMO

 

[Prof]

Ok, I am confused. I just read on TPS's Facebook where she said that LM is the one that told her how to get in touch with EJ in San Antonio. Didn't she say before that she is the one that told LM how to get in touch with EJ in San Antonio? Does anyone remember? Because she had a new cell phone that she got in San Antonio and after EJ called her she called LM and gave him the number?

That is my understanding; TS stated this though