TX - 26 dead, 20 injured in church shooting, Sutherland Springs, 5 Nov 2017 #1

[HoneyWest]

So are you saying the neighbor shouldn't have even tried?

I'm saying it was too little, too late. I'm saying no one should have been shot with a legal AR 15, let alone 26 people.

 

[bluesneakers]

With a dishonorable discharge, the shooter shouldn't have passed a background check. I wonder how he acquired multiple weapons. The brave neighbor who shot him may have prevented further deaths as he had more weapons in his car. Unless the shooter left a journal or confided in someone, we may never know what his plans were. All MOO.

So a veteran with a less than honorable discharge isn't allowed to buy a gun?

 

[totesmagoat]

Oh!! I'm so sorry to hear that. That hits so close to home for you. It must feel personal and even more devastating to you than to the rest of us. So sorry. Our collective hearts are hurting for all of you.

Thank you Gitana! Yes, I have been freaking out. My mom was at church in her town when the news broke and then she was driving down to visit for my kids birthdays. I didn't want to tell her until she got here. I'm trying to catch up with the thread so I know what information is in MSM before I say something that might get me in trouble.


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[MIKAYOYO]

The whole problem with guns is they’re everywhere. One can get them legally or illegally. That’s not the point. The point is they’re prevalent and nothing can get rid of them all. We are a flawed country for sure, but I love my country and proud to be American.

 

[TTF14]

I'm saying it was too little, too late. I'm saying no one should have been shot with a legal AR 15, let alone 26 people.

Well, of course not.

But I think the neighbor did the right thing.

 

[Indy Anna]

This is 100% speculation on my part. I'm just putting some parts together. Perhaps he was a practicing, devout Christian. Married with a child. Maybe his marriage fell apart, his wife went home to mom and took the baby. It's possible that at this point he blamed God and decided to hit back at the church. Just a guess on my part. Trying to make sense of the senseless.

Have been trying to catch up on here, but had been thinking something similar. I've known people who abandoned their Faith when life turns sour for them. Some people think of God as a genie who is supposed to grant them their every wish in life.

I'm thinking something happened while this guy was in the military and his outlook on life changed. He taught Bible School in 2013 and then was dishonorably discharged from military in 2014 (IIRC). I'm wondering if the reason he chose to commit this horrible violence in a church was to display his anger toward God.

I'm also waiting to hear if he had family members who attended that church and was angry at them, but chose to unleash that anger where he did for the reason I cited above. JMO

 

[rabidstoat]

I see reports of him being court martialed in May 2014. I don't know how the US Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces works, but he had an appeal for "something" (it doesn't say specifically what) that was a "petition for a grant for review" filed on February 4, 2014 and denied on March 10, 2014.

I'm not sure if this is something different, or something that preceded the May court martial, or if he was really dishonorably discharged in March, not May, of 2014.

 

[bluesneakers]

I mean do we know why he was court marshaled/dishonorably discharged?

My guess is AWOL. It could be something like sexual assault or murder or manslaughter but I think he would have gone to jail if so.

 

[deoneta]

So a veteran with a less than honorable discharge isn't allowed to buy a gun?

One of the questions on the 4473 is "have you ever been dishonorably discharged from the US military?" or words to that effect. I don't remember the exact wording. If a person answered yes, he would be denied immediately. If a person lies, a background check should catch that. All MOO.

 

[Ontario Mom]

This is 100% speculation on my part. I'm just putting some parts together. Perhaps he was a practicing, devout Christian. Married with a child. Maybe his marriage fell apart, his wife went home to mom and took the baby. It's possible that at this point he blamed God and decided to hit back at the church. Just a guess on my part. Trying to make sense of the senseless.

That actually does make a lot of sense, but the worst part about it is, even if it's exactly what happened, it'll never be enough info to stop it from happening again. And again, and again, and again. Human history has made it abundantly clear it's a matter of what's in the heart (mind, psyche, soul, call it whatever), not what's in the holster...

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Um, I wonder if this is why he was court martialed?

Someone posted it on another site, and I confirmed it with the Mobile Alabama court records.

Mobile Alabama: Warrant alias 4/15/14 8:00am. Cannibis possession 2nd.

https://www.municipalrecordsearch.c...lePlateSearch=&VehicleStateSearch=&VINSearch=

 

[bluesneakers]

Um, I wonder if this is why he was court martialed?

Someone posted it on another site, and I confirmed it with the Mobile Alabama court records.

Mobile Alabama: Warrant alias 4/15/14 8:00am. Cannibis possession 2nd.

https://www.municipalrecordsearch.c...lePlateSearch=&VehicleStateSearch=&VINSearch=

Is there any way to tell if that's the same Devin Kelley?

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Is there any way to tell if that's the same Devin Kelley?

I believe if you look at other sites, it has a picture of him as well. I just didn't think they were solid links to post.

 

[TTF14]

Um, I wonder if this is why he was court martialed?

Someone posted it on another site, and I confirmed it with the Mobile Alabama court records.

Mobile Alabama: Warrant alias 4/15/14 8:00am. Cannibis possession 2nd.

https://www.municipalrecordsearch.c...lePlateSearch=&VehicleStateSearch=&VINSearch=

I know of two people who received dishonorable discharges this way.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

http://jail.com/arrest-records/devin-patrick-kelly-5433445#.Wf-VrrmOWQI.facebook

 

[Footwarrior]

One of the questions on the 4473 is "have you ever been dishonorably discharged from the US military?" or words to that effect. I don't remember the exact wording. If a person answered yes, he would be denied immediately. If a person lies, a background check should catch that. All MOO.

That only applies when you ourchase a firearm from a licensed dealer. Texas allows private firearms sales without filling out a form 4473 or a background check.

 

[bluesneakers]

http://jail.com/arrest-records/devin-patrick-kelly-5433445#.Wf-VrrmOWQI.facebook

The last name has a different spelling.

(Does it look like the same guy to you? It's hard to know when we only have one picture of each. I can't tell.)

 

[x_files]

Someone is looking at this shooting right now, and planning how he's going to try the same thing. Except bigger.

Even if it it isn't conscious.

 

[cady]

That is the sad truest truth of these shootings. It seems to only get worse.

Announcing the superlatives....worst, most, ugliest etc. also sets a new bar for the next creep. JMO

 

[Ontario Mom]

Is there any way to tell if that's the same Devin Kelley?

Spelling of the name seems way off. I've seen it consistently spelled Devon Kelly. Plus, wrong state.