TX - Sandra Bland, 28, found dead in jail cell, Waller County, 13 July 2015 #2

[arkansasmimi]

What "public servants" are you talking about? According to the article posted (http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/sandra-bland-be-laid-rest-scrutiny-continues):

(BBM)

"More than two dozen members of the Sigma Gamma Rho sorority – of which Bland was a member – marched into the sanctuary as the service began, wearing white: the color worn by Bland’s family and by many who attended the closed service, or decked out in signature blue and gold. included members of the national leadership Bland had joined the sorority in college, and two of her line sisters participated in the service, tearfully remembering the young woman who one sister called her “backbone,” and the glue that held the chapter together."

National leadership (in reference to THIS article) = the national leadership of Sigma Gamma Rho
(http://www.sgrho1922.org/leadership)

It's always intriguing to me how, in all of these cases [threads] that involve white law enforcement officers and black [victim] descendants; those who consistently and unquestionably support the white PO also typically equate it with and take the opportunity to post their anti-Obama rhetoric. While it may be subtle and covert, allowing those expressing those particular views to vehemently deny the existence of their bias, the [long] history of posts speaks loudly. MO ~

Respectfully BBM, I am not the orig member your comment was quoted :

Quote Originally Posted by Nana View Post
This msm headline is part if the problem in our country today!
She is labeled a hero and we have "public servants" attending her funeral, however our "public servants" including THE top "public servant" also known as commander in chief couldn't be bothered to pay respects to our military in Chattanooga!

But Nana was responding to this comment, in which Illinois Sen. Dick Durbin and Rep. Bill Foster ARE "Public Servants"

KateB‘We’re celebrating a hero’: Sandra Bland laid to rest
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/sandra-bl...tiny-continues

LISLE, Illinois – Sandra Bland was remembered as a sister, friend, her mother’s “baby” and, in the words of her pastor, a hero, during her funeral here on Saturday.

Bland was laid to rest at her home church of DuPage African Methodist Episcopal, as nagging questions about her death in a Texas jail cell, and the arrest that preceded it, continue. Bland was found dead in her cell in a Waller County, Texas, jail three days after she was arrested during a traffic stop in Hempstead, Texas. Authorities have ruled her death a suicide by hanging. The case is under investigation.

Bland’s funeral drew Illinois Sen. Dick Durbin and Rep. Bill Foster, who came to pay their respects to the family, and to announce that they sent joint letters to Attorney General Loretta Lynch calling for a “fair and thorough federal investigation” into Bland’s death.

Durbin drew rousing applause as he pointed out that on the drive from Chicago to Lisle, his car passed many vehicles that were changing lanes without signaling, the minor offense for which Bland was pulled over in Texas.

more at link

 

[KaaBoom]

So that's just your opinion that you think you know her race??... And you think he just looked up and saw a black lady steady drive thru a stop sign that he did the u-turn for, so it wasn't because her actions caught his attention, it was because he was down the road a short ways and saw a black lady driving. I see. ullhair: Officer stopped this driver, who ran a stop sign, changed lanes without properly giving turn signal, while she is under the influence but she is only stopped because of the color of her skin. Innocent young lady. :what:

First it's obvious that he didn't see her run the stop sign, or didn't notice her do it. Probably because he only became interested in how she was driving after he saw that she was black.

If you want to believe that it's a coincidence that black drivers are pulled over 31 times more often then white drivers, and that race plays no factor in it, then go ahead and believe that.

 

[sonjay]

10 Things About The Sandra Bland Traffic Stop That Every Texan Should Know
http://kut.org/post/10-things-about-sandra-bland-traffic-stop-every-texan-should-know

Harrington: He does not have the right to say, get out of the car. He has to express some reason. ‘I need to search your car,’ or, whatever; he needs to give a reason. He can’t just say ‘get out of the car’ for a traffic offense.

Audio recording of Harrington's interview and more at link.

BBM. I'm surprised that the guy who is director of the Texas Civil Rights Projects thinks that "I need to search your car" is an appropriate thing for the police officer to say.

The police can't search your car without probable cause, a warrant or your consent. I'm really surprised Harrington said what he did up there.

He's got quite a bit else wrong in his Q&A too. The police do in fact have pretty wide latitude during traffic stops to give lawful orders to ensure their own safety, the safety of the persons they're interacting with, the safety of bystanders and passers-by, and safety in general. They have the right to tell you to get out of the car, or to stay in the car. They have the right to pat you down for weapons if they have reason to believe you may be armed.

With that said, the officer was in the wrong here. SB was also in the wrong. They both behaved like bratty 2-year-olds. If either one of them had behaved like an adult, it wouldn't have gone sideways like it did.

I see no evidence whatsoever to suggest that the officer's behavior was motivated by racism. He reacted very poorly to the challenge to his authority, but that doesn't mean racism. Some cops (a very small percent, IMO) simply don't tolerate challenges to their authority and don't respond appropriately. This cop, IMO, at the very least needs training on interacting with citizens who are less than polite. If he can't shape up and learn better ways to interact with people, then policing is probably not the best career for him.

I see no evidence whatsoever to justify the officer's threat to "light you up" or his decision to arrest her. She had a bad attitude and a potty mouth, but that doesn't justify arresting her, or threatening to light her up, or physically dragging her out of her car.

I've seen no evidence to suggest that her death was anything other than suicide, or that there was any coverup, maliciousness or negligence at the jail.

 

[arkansasmimi]

You're right - to a point. However, just because someone is not in custody does not mean they have NO rights:

"If a person is not in police custody, no Miranda warning is required and anything the person says can be used at trial if the person is later charged with a crime. This exception most often comes up when the police stop someone on the street to question him or her about a recent crime or the person blurts out a confession before the police have an opportunity to deliver the warning. If a person believes that he or she is a potential suspect in a crime, then it may be wise to politely decline to answer questions, at least until after consulting an attorney." (http://resources.lawinfo.com/criminal-law/when-must-the-police-read-me-my-miranda-right.html).

Officer approached and asked for license/registration/insurance information - Sandra Bland complied.
Officer came back to vehicle and inquired about her "appearing irritated" - in response, Sandra Bland explained the reason for her irritability.
Officer then, following Sandra Bland's answer to his inquest, asks her if she's done - Sandra Bland pointed out to the officer that HE asked the question and she simply answered.
Officer then, rather then simply giving her the warning that he'd planned to give her (would have taken all of 10 seconds, with officer handing her the written warning and verbally giving her a word of caution, and then Sandra Bland would have been on her way), asks Sandra Bland to extinguish her cigarette. STOP here: Why did the officer ask her to extinguish her cigarette when all he had to do was pass her the written warning/tell her to use caution in the future and be on his way? BECAUSE he was angry that Sandra Bland dared to speak up to him and he wasn't gonna have that. Instead, he wanted to "put her in her place" and "show her who's boss" - all emotionally [ego] driven unprofessional behavior. HE should have NEVER let it go this way and she should NEVER have been incarcerated in the first place. Had she not been, she would be alive today. So, while OBE didn't directly kill Sandra Bland, he is, IMO, indirectly, but nonetheless, responsible for her death.

MO ~

Respectfully, what does this have to do with SB calling her attorney and if she can stay in the car? I never said she had NO RIGHTS lol That's what the whole comment to me was about

Quote Originally Posted by human View Post
If LE commands you to get out of your car, can you demand a call to an attorney and remain in your car?

This whole situation is absurd

Quote Originally Posted by arkansasmimi View Post
Respectfully, orig question wasn't about the right to remain silent, it was "If LE commands you to get out of your car, can you demand a call to an attorney and remain in your car?"

bluesneakers Are you not familiar with your miranda rights?

 

[bluesneakers]

This msm headline is part if the problem in our country today!
She is labeled a hero and we have "public servants" attending her funeral, however our "public servants" including THE top "public servant" also known as commander in chief couldn't be bothered to pay respects to our military in Chattanooga!

Her pastor calling her a hero is part of the problem in our country today?! Why on earth would that be a problem for you or for anyone? She WAS a hero to some people and they're in mourning right now. I don't think it's on ANYONE to say what someone in mourning should or shouldn't say, and whether or not it's a problem for our country. Please.

 

[bluesneakers]

What "public servants" are you talking about? According to the article posted (http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/sandra-bland-be-laid-rest-scrutiny-continues):

(BBM)

"More than two dozen members of the Sigma Gamma Rho sorority – of which Bland was a member – marched into the sanctuary as the service began, wearing white: the color worn by Bland’s family and by many who attended the closed service, or decked out in signature blue and gold. They included members of the national leadership. Bland had joined the sorority in college, and two of her line sisters participated in the service, tearfully remembering the young woman who one sister called her “backbone,” and the glue that held the chapter together."

National leadership (in reference to THIS article) = the national leadership of Sigma Gamma Rho
(http://www.sgrho1922.org/leadership)

It's always intriguing to me how, in all of these cases [threads] that involve white law enforcement officers and black [victim] descendants; those who consistently and unquestionably support the white PO also typically equate it with and take the opportunity to post their anti-Obama rhetoric. While it may be subtle and covert, allowing those expressing those particular views to vehemently deny the existence of their bias, the [long] history of posts speaks loudly. MO ~

It sure does.

 

[Rocco]

Maybe she should have called her attorney he/she could have bailed her out.
But it looks like she waisted her calls on family and friends.

Priceless. :loveyou:

 

[Rocco]

Her pastor calling her a hero is part of the problem in our country today?! Why on earth would that be a problem for you or for anyone? She WAS a hero to some people and they're in mourning right now. I don't think it's on ANYONE to say what someone in mourning should or shouldn't say, and whether or not it's a problem for our country. Please.

What happened to this free speech concept everyone keeps talking about?

 

[human]

You all took what I said and took it a step further. And said I thought she should be tased . I never said that.

He gave her a lawful order, which was to exit her vehicle. She refused about ten times. Then he threatened to use his taser, which is what got her to finally leave the car. And I said 'that is what the taser is for.' And what i meant was that it is used to get a non-compliant person to comply, without using force.

One year in college , I worked in a summer camp. The director told us to never say anything that we were not going to carry out.

 

[bluesneakers]

No, I suspect the OP was saying that some of us are fully well aware of how the public can behave towards LEO and that some of us may know quite intimately how stressful the LEO job can be.

That is exactly what I was saying. Thank you.

 

[Rocco]

One year in college , I worked in a summer camp. The director told us to never say anything that we were not going to carry out.

You don't think he would have carried it out if she hadn't gotten out of the car?

 

[bluesneakers]

What happened to this free speech concept everyone keeps talking about?

What are you trying to say?

 

[arkansasmimi]

First it's obvious that he didn't see her run the stop sign, or didn't notice her do it. Probably because he only became interested in how she was driving after he saw that she was black.

If you want to believe that it's a coincidence that black drivers are pulled over 31 times more often then white drivers, and that race plays no factor in it, then go ahead and believe that.

:rumor: :sweep:

 

[arkansasmimi]

It sure does.

it also says as KateB linked and quoted http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...County-13-July-2015-2&p=11955527#post11955527 (respectfully bbm the public servants Nana was talking about)
‘We’re celebrating a hero’: Sandra Bland laid to rest
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/sandra-bl...tiny-continues

Bland’s funeral drew Illinois Sen. Dick Durbin and Rep. Bill Foster, who came to pay their respects to the family, and to announce that they sent joint letters to Attorney General Loretta Lynch calling for a “fair and thorough federal investigation” into Bland’s death.

Durbin drew rousing applause as he pointed out that on the drive from Chicago to Lisle, his car passed many vehicles that were changing lanes without signaling, the minor offense for which Bland was pulled over in Texas.

 

[human]

Have you ever been to downtown Chicago or Baltimore or South Central LA at night? We have vicious gangs that often shoot 10, 15, 20 people in one weekend, in each city. That is what our cops have to deal with and what they endure. I am scared to death for my son and his friends. I now what they go through. How dangerous the gangs can be. And it hurts me to hear them being dissed and belittled.

Have you?

I actually know a former gang membet,,a Crips. He was a parent when I was teaching. I asked him why gang members kill each other and not kill white people.

He said it was all about asserting power.

I don't remember the name of it, but there is a good program on PBS that interviews the Bloods and the Crips. I recommend it.

I also have a friend who is now dead. He grew up in Watts. He said they would fight with fists just like boys growing up in my middle class white neighborhood. Guns changed everything.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Priceless. :loveyou:

:ditto:

 

[bluesneakers]

Have you?

I actually know a former gang membet,,a Crips. He was a parent when I was teaching. I asked him why gang members kill each other and not kill white people.

He said it was all about asserting power.

I don't remember the name of it, but there is a good program on PBS that interviews the Bloods and the Crips. I recommend it.

I also have a friend who is now dead. He grew up in Watts. He said they would fight with fists just like boys growing up in my middle class white neighborhood. Guns changed everything.

I'm sorry about your friend.

 

[human]

I just now realized that a few of the biggest critics of our police in this forum, are not living in the US. And now I understand a little better. If you have not experienced the chaos and danger of some of our urban centers, you would not understand why our police need to be powerful and in control. They cannot go eye to eye with the MS13, and be all squishy and 'nice.' LOL

I think most of our citizens know and accept that they need to be compliant during a traffic stop because our police can not afford to joke around. There are way too many guns and drugs and whack jobs ready to go off. So when an officer requests the driver put out a cig---then MOST drivers do so because they understand the gravity of the situation. JMO

I am from,the US and now live in a country that does not allow guns. The social problems are incredible, but a killing is almost unheard of.

About 10 years ago, I was in London for three weeks and there were zero murders. Can you even fathom something like that in the US?

And England has plenty of social problems.

Gee, how do they do it?

France has outlawed the taser.

I have met people from all over the world. Because I seem to be an approachable person, people are always asking me what is wrong with Americans and their obsession with guns.

 

[Nana]

Her pastor calling her a hero is part of the problem in our country today?! Why on earth would that be a problem for you or for anyone? She WAS a hero to some people and they're in mourning right now. I don't think it's on ANYONE to say what someone in mourning should or shouldn't say, and whether or not it's a problem for our country. Please.

Well I didn't see anything in that video that makes her a hero!
I wouldn't want my kids to act like that hero, I also wouldn't want them to act like the Police officer neither one IMO is a hero.

 

[bluesneakers]

I am from,the US and now live in a country that does not allow guns. The social problems are incredible, but a killing is almost unheard of.

About 10 years ago, I was in London for three weeks and there were zero murders. Can you even fathom something like that in the US?

And England has plenty of social problems.

Gee, how do they do it?

France has outlawed the taser.

I have met people from all over the world. Because I seem to be an approachable person, people are always asking me what is wrong with Americans and their obsession with guns.

Me too. And I am always at a loss.