GUILTY UK - Joanna Yeates, 25, Clifton, Bristol, 17 Dec 2010 #6

[MoveEveryStone]

The plastic drum is a good possibility, but if there was any water in it, it too could have been frozen .. limiting the space in the drum.

Seems far fetched, but agree a possibility. It could have been easily removed, taken into the flat, body input, and then rolled out on a dolly, or rolled. I think it unlikely to be carried since the shape would have made the weight harder to deal with (assuming 110-145 lbs). But definatly it could be lifted into a boot. It would be "forensically aware" given it is plastic. Could be discarded and replaced with another purchased at a hardware store or building supplies.

 

[Texas Mist]

sleeping bag? carried like a sack over shoulder?...... again, sincere apols for being so graphic.

I thought about a big suitcase on wheels....wouldn't be the first time that was done.

 

[otto]

Police asking people to pretty much look at the people they know and see if anything odd has happened in their behavior or statements since the murder.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...joanna-s-killer-plead-police-115875-22850017/

 

[otto]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...joanna-s-killer-plead-police-115875-22850017/[/QUOTE]

Snow in Bristol between 3 and 15 CM of snow on the weekend of Dec 19, and another 5-15 CM expected on the Monday.

More on heavy snow on the weekend Joanna disappeared: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12025793 (airport closed, buses stopped)

Of course ... I forgot all about this. The snowfall was so heavy in the week before Christmas that air travelers were stranded all over the place because of the heavy snowfall in the UK. There was heavy criticism that more was not done to keep the airport running properly.

 

[Myserty64]

One minute I believe the police have DNA and the next minute I don't.

All we really have to go on are newspaper reports claiming a detective said this or someone close to the investigation said something else.

I wouldn't be relying on a murderer having too much of a conscience.
If you can take the life of a vibrant young adult like Joanna nothing else is going to worry you too much.
All the murderer is concerned about is not getting caught.

This week is crunch time as the results for the DNA they claim to have will be in.
If we are getting the truth from the media we can expect an arrest unless of course it is a perpetrator not on anyone's radar.
Then it may take a little longer.

 

[Phillb]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...joanna-s-killer-plead-police-115875-22850017/

Snow in Bristol between 3 and 15 CM of snow on the weekend of Dec 19, and another 5-15 CM expected on the Monday.

More on heavy snow on the weekend Joanna disappeared: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12025793 (airport closed, buses stopped)

Of course ... I forgot all about this. The snowfall was so heavy in the week before Christmas that air travelers were stranded all over the place because of the heavy snowfall in the UK. There was heavy criticism that more was not done to keep the airport running properly.

Hi Otto.

I really dispute the depth of snow in Bristol.
They've reported about 2'' of snow fell on Saturday night. 2'' of snow isn't really sufficient to hide a body, and I do think the 2'' quote is an over exageration. The story is reporting travelling difficuilty regarding the icy road and pavement conditions, and not the depth of snow. A field mouse stands around 2'' tall.

'Like an ice-rink'

Dave Harper, safety officer for Rovers, said:

"It's just basically the car park, the terracing and the walkways at the back of the stand.

"It's too dangerous - it's just like an ice-rink - there's no way you can get spectators in there."

You can see the snow depth in Bristol that week here, an inch at most I.M.O
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates, Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #5

 

[otto]

One minute I believe the police have DNA and the next minute I don't.

All we really have to go on are newspaper reports claiming a detective said this or someone close to the investigation said something else.

I wouldn't be relying on a murderer having too much of a conscience.
If you can take the life of a vibrant young adult like Joanna nothing else is going to worry you too much.
All the murderer is concerned about is not getting caught.

This week is crunch time as the results for the DNA they claim to have will be in.
If we are getting the truth from the media we can expect an arrest unless of course it is a perpetrator not on anyone's radar.
Then it may take a little longer.

I've been reading most of the linked articles in the last few days, and I agree that the information seems mixed. From what I understand, saliva DNA was found, but it will require special analysis. LGN Forensics has been asked to assist with the analysis. It could mean that it's low number count DNA; the same method that was used to identify Meredith Kerchers DNA on a knife, or it could require a special interpretation ... different from typical blood or hair samples ... don't know the reason this lab has been asked to help except that they have assisted with previous difficult to solve cases.

I think there has also been a lot of speculation about who should be randomly tested and compared to the sample. The family wants all of her co-worker and local friends tested. Another town indicated they would like to see all 250,000 men in Bristol tested (I think that's what I read).

I don't have any links ... just reading and thinking about what might have happened.

http://www.lgc.co.uk/divisions/lgc_forensics.aspx

 

[otto]

Hi Otto.

I really dispute the depth of snow in Bristol.
They've reported about 2'' of snow fell on Saturday night. 2'' of snow isn't really sufficient to hide a body, and I do think the 2'' quote is an over exageration. The story is reporting travelling difficuilty regarding the icy road and pavement conditions, and not the depth of snow. A field mouse stands around 2'' tall.

You can see the snow depth in Bristol that week here, an inch at most I.M.O
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates, Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #5

Higher elevations would have had more snow. Was the quarry at a higher elevation?

 

[Phillb]

Higher elevations would have had more snow. Was the quarry at a higher elevation?

Well this is the snow depth where they found the body.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates, Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #5

 

[otto]

Well this is the snow depth where they found the body.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates, Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #5

The snow was on the weekend, and again on Monday. By Friday, some of it must have disappeared, which is when dog walkers saw her. The dogwalkers said that they had been on the road daily and had not seen the body, but that there had been snow. It's conceivable that she was not easily seen on the verge under a light blanket of snow from Monday, when it snowed, until Friday, when some melted or settled and she was found. She had to be there from at least Monday, as I didn't hear about footprints around her. She could have been there from before the first snowfall, and the second was shortly after. If she was under two light blankets of snow, it's understandable that it would take 7 days for her to be found ... three for the first snowfall and four for the next.

 

[MMENJBRIT]

re: White Dove and MikeyMot.

Hey White Dove... It was MikeyMot whose friends lost their daughter....

I apololgize in advance for any confusion.

 

[Phillb]

The snow was on the weekend, and again on Monday. By Friday, some of it must have disappeared, which is when dog walkers saw her. The dogwalkers said that they had been on the road daily and had not seen the body, but that there had been snow. It's conceivable that she was not easily seen on the verge under a light blanket of snow from Monday, when it snowed, until Friday, when some melted or settled and she was found. She had to be there from at least Monday, as I didn't hear about footprints around her. She could have been there from before the first snowfall, as the second was shortly after. If she was under two light blankets of snow, it's understandable that it would take 4 days for her to be found.

LOL. I don't want to go round in circles, and over old ground with this snow depth, and hidden body thing again really

So i'll just make a few last points on it and say no more.

Firstly there never has been an official statement saying her body was 'snow covered' The only people to see the body were the dog walkers, and the Police. They are the only ones who know how the body was.

The dog walkers were adamant that they would have seen that body if it had been there earlier. The Police also have doubts the body could have lain undiscovered there for 8 days.
The Police aren't satisfied enough, and are exploring the possibilities the body was kept somewhere else.

The only reports to say the body was 'snow covered' come from the press who assume she was murdered on Fri 17th, so they presume she was dumped there that night. The only reason they think her body was there for 8 days is because they conclude it must have been snow covered and hidden from view.
It's all surmise and conjecture, not fact.

The press have reported many things wrong in this case.
Taking press reports as sound fact is a sure way to cloud judgement.

 

[otto]

LOL. I don't want to go round in circles, and over old ground with this snow depth, and hidden body thing again really

So i'll just make a few last points on it and say no more.

Firstly there never has been an official statement saying her body was 'snow covered' The only people to see the body was the dog walkers, and the Police. They are the only ones who know how the body was.

The dog walkers were adamant that they would have seen that body if it had been there earlier. The Police also have doubts the body could have lain undiscovered there for 8 days.

The Police aren't satisfied enough, and are exploring the possibilities the body was kept somewhere else.

The only reports to say the body was 'snow covered' come from the press who assume she was murdered on Fri 17th, so they presume she was dumped there that night. The only reason they think her body was there for 8 days is because they conclude it must have been snow covered.

The press have reported many things wrong in this case.
Taking press reports as sound fact is a sure way to cloud judgement.

Quite right. She was frozen in place and needed a crane to take her to the coroner, and a day to thaw out. Maybe she was placed there the night before, maybe kept elsewhere for a week. I had assumed that she was found lying down, but I read something earlier about being in a seated position but not needing a seatbelt. Was she found lying down?

 

[Phillb]

Quite right. She was frozen in place and needed a crane to take her to the coroner, and a day to thaw out. Maybe she was placed there the night before, maybe kept elsewhere for a week.

The tempretures were bone chilling that week. As someone else said it was impossible to move a frozen plant pot from the ground. A body left out overnight would certain do the same. The body wouldn't have been so moulded to the ground they couldn't have got it up without a winch. There are lots of methods they could have used to lift it. But it has to be very delicate to preserve evidence of course.

Here's a photo taken in Clifton on Christmas Eve.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates, Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #6

The day before her body was found. You can see the severe frost. That would freeze anything to the surface. The frost is plenty, but the depth of snow?? The snow depth is nothing more than a dusting.
Does anyone really think a body could still be snow covered looking at that shot?

You can check the date the photo was taken on the left.

 

[teabreid]

I too..thought this odd...why leave her mobile with the first (by historical terms) prime suspect. But that is what fuelled my speculation that this may have been an abduction and the perp had left instructions to wait for a call on jos' mobile.

From what I know of the technology, the police would not require physical possession of the phone or the sim card to carry out a triangulation exercise, That is done from the phone company logs. However they would need the phone to recover contacts etc held on the sim or phone memory. So I too was surprised that the phone was left with GR.

 

[otto]

The tempretures were bone chilling that week. As someone else said it was impossible to move a frozen plant pot from the ground. A body left out overnight would certain do the same. The body wouldn't have been so moulded to the ground they couldn't have got it up without a winch. There are lots of methods they could have used to lift it. But it has to be very delicate to preserve evidence of course.

Since it is also possible that she was only there for say 1-2 days ... seeing as how she was found at 9 am as soon as the dog walkers were out ... that leaves until Wednesday unaccounted for. That also makes me think about cause of death ... was it force on the neck or constriction ... strangulation ... but not necessarily ligature strangulation?

 

[otto]

The tempretures were bone chilling that week. As someone else said it was impossible to move a frozen plant pot from the ground. A body left out overnight would certain do the same. The body wouldn't have been so moulded to the ground they couldn't have got it up without a winch. There are lots of methods they could have used to lift it. But it has to be very delicate to preserve evidence of course.

Here's a photo taken in Clifton on Christmas Eve.
http://snipurl.com/1uqyz9
The day before her body was found. You can see the severe frost. That would freeze anything to the surface. The frost is plenty, but the depth of snow?? The snow depth is nothing more than a dusting.
Does anyone really think a body could still be snow covered looking at that shot?

You can check the date the photo was taken on the left.

The image doesn't display for me, but I'll take your word for it. If she wasn't under snow, then she wasn't there since Monday when it snowed, as the snow cover was the only reason to think that she could have been there and not been seen.

 

[Phillb]

Since it is also possible that she was only there for say 1-2 days ... seeing as how she was found at 9 am as soon as the dog walkers were out ... that leaves until Wednesday unaccounted for. That also makes me think about cause of death ... was it force on the neck or constriction ... strangulation ... but not necessarily ligature strangulation?

Well we can only guess until we know the facts can't we Otto? We all have our different theories, as do the Police. But i'm as satisfied as can be the body was put there in the early hours of Christmas day.

The only thing to solve with that theory is where was the body prior to Longwood Lane, but of course knowing who the perp really is helps first

 

[otto]

From what I know of the technology, the police would not require physical possession of the phone or the sim card to carry out a triangulation exercise, That is done from the phone company logs. However they would need the phone to recover contacts etc held on the sim or phone memory. So I too was surprised that the phone was left with GR.

Since everything would be recorded, wouldn't it be a good idea to leave the phone with him and see what he did with it? He could have thrown away the card, but that would be very suspicious. Seeing what he did with it was maybe part of the investigation.

 

[Phillb]

The image doesn't display for me, but I'll take your word for it. If she wasn't under snow, then she wasn't there since Monday when it snowed, as the snow cover was the only reason to think that she could have been there and not been seen.

Here you go Otto.
Clifton December 24th.