UK - Logan Mwangi, 5, found dead in Wales River, Bridgend, 31 July 2021 *arrests, inc. minor* #3

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Kitkat28 said:
No, the biggest neglect was perpetrated by the parent and “parent” who were supposed to look after Logan. While I have very little time for social services, if parents didn’t abuse and neglect their children in the first place, there would be no need for them.
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A lot of people make this argument when a child comes to harm. I agree with the sentiment of it fully - the crime that ended the life or caused the harm has absolutely always been perpetrated by the abuser / offender / criminal.

However, social services are always outrageously failing in the background on these type of cases. They are paid professionals, trained to do what's best by the child. They often are involved in cases where the parent isn't capable of doing the right thing because of some pretty serious character flaw or mental health issue or poor decision making. In these cases, MOO, social services are the ones who neglect the child. They are aware and they fail to do the right thing over and over and over again.

That is why IMO children's human right to be kept safe by professionals needs to be fought for over and above the right of their parent to 'have them'.

In this instance, they have abjectly failed - Logan, the Youth, and the baby.

A personal aside: I was one of those children who was handed to an abusive parent and I feel extremely strongly about this.
 
Cross examination
On cross-examination Mr Andrews repeats that he found not all activity was recorded.

He said his main tests were related to the Dialer app.

Peter Rouch QC, representing Williamson, asks Mr Andrews: "So the purpose of the test was for comparison? To see the usage of the phone during the test and compare it to the usage of the phone nine or 10 months ago?"

Mr Andrews: "That's correct."

Barrister: "Would you agree when you carry out a test such as this, it is important you are testing the phone as it was when used months ago?"

Mr Andrews: "As far as possible yes."

Mr Rouch asks if Mr Andrews knew "exactly" what happened when it was interrogated by police before he did his own tests.

Mr Andrews said he was only involved in the tests earlier this month.

Mr Rouch: "Did you know what apps were open at the time of its usage in July 31 last year?"

Mr Andrews: "No."

Mr Rouch: "So it was not in the condition it was when it was used in July last year?"

Mr Andrews: "That is correct."

Logan Mwangi murder trial - live updates
 
RusselSprout said:
Mobile dialer - Wikipedia

Im not certain this is it, but looks like an app to make free calls from a mobile.
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This rather begs the question who AW was phoning in the middle of the night. Or perhaps she accessed the app at 2.26am with a view to calling emergency services (although not sure why as wouldn’t you just use your regular phone?) but was prevented from reporting then?

I’m wondering whether she was in fact acutely aware of her son’s potentially perilous condition (not not entirely “neglectful” as she was concerned) but knew that she or other people in the house were responsible so was looking to take care of it herself and hoped Logan would just recover under his own devices. I wonder whether her mindless scrolling through YouTube videos etc was as a means of staying awake demonstrating that she was concerned about him and checking up on him constantly.

Then she/they discover he’s dead but at this point JC takes over and in her shocked state she defers to him for the stupid plan they then, all 3 of them, possibly concocted. I am not sure AW was possibly aware of quite how serious Logan’s condition was, but by the time it was too late she then panicked and in her shocked desperate state allowed someone with far more to lose to take over (or someone less emotionally attached at that point, JC, to take over) . I think she has made herself possibly look more guilty than she was by participating in the stupid plan - but her attempt to explain this away by being “asleep” has made things worse for herself. I wonder whether she is guilty of PTCJ but perhaps was actually a more concerned mother than her own story credits herself with. But she’s decided to stick with it now - because she knows telling the truth about her concern and checking up on Logan throughout the night etc etc betrays the fact that she knew deep down something was not quite right but potently overrode her maternal instincts in favour of hoping for the best and protecting JC. But she doesn’t feel she can change her story now as she knows the constant lying will make her look more guilty and highlight that she suspected Logan was unwell and she didn’t do anything about it. But maybe she wasn’t fully aware of how utterly deadly his injuries had been and so her shock and devastation the next day was actually real as she couldn’t quite believe that her negligent actions resulted in her son’s death?
All conjecture as I’m not in the court hearing all the evidence first hand (quite a lot is being garbled in its translation to the updates filtered through journalists). But I think I am a bit shades of grey on the whole she is just a terrible mother and guilty of murder and looking to simply get rid of her son as he didn’t fit in with her life with JC as some people on here seems to be erring on. I think she is guilty of not following her instincts, subjecting Logan to an unsafe environment etc etc. But I think the main culprits in terms of actual murder are the others on trial. But that she should be held very much responsible for putting him Logan in that position. MOO.
 
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Mr Rouch: "Have you tested this phone when it was connected to any telephone provider, particularly to O2?"

Mr Andrews: "No."

Speaking about the police interrogation of the phone, which took place before Mr Andrews' involvement, the barrister asks: "Does it mean the settings are changed by the police for its contents to be extracted?"

Mr Andrews: "It can be."

Mr Rouch: "Did that happen in this case?"

Mr Andrews: "I don't know."

The expert said a simple extraction would only require limited interaction from the examiner, but a more complicated extraction could mean having to change some settings. Mr Andrews said he understands it was a limited extraction but he is not sure of the level.

Logan Mwangi murder trial - live updates
 
Sherlockhames said:
This rather begs the question who AW was phoning in the middle of the night. Or perhaps she accessed the app at 2.26am with a view to calling emergency services (although not sure why as wouldn’t you just use your regular phone?).

I’m wondering whether she was in fact acutely aware of her son’s potentially perilous condition (not not entirely “neglectful”) but knew that she or other people in the house were responsible so was looking to take care of it herself and hoped Logan would just recover under his own devices. I wonder whether her mindless scrolling through YouTube videos etc was as a means of staying awake demonstrating that she was concerned about him. Then they discover he’s dead but at this point JC takes over and in her shocked state she defers to him for the stupid plan they then, all 3 of them, possibly concocted. I am not sure AW was possibly aware of quite how serious Logan’s condition was, but by the time it was too late she the panicked and shocked allowed someone with far more to lose to take over. I think she has made herself possibly look more guilty than she was by participating in the stupid plan - but her attempt to explain this away by being “asleep” has made things worse. I wonder whether she is not certainly guilty of PTCJ but perhaps was actually a more concerned mother than her own story credits herself with. But she’s decided to stick with it now - because she knows telling the truth about her concern and checking up on Logan etc etc betrays the fact that she knew deep down something was not quite right but potently overrode her maternal instincts in favour of hoping for the best and protecting JC.
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I'm not a tech person but is it the case that some people don't have any credit or data left on their phone so they use a free app like WhatsApp that dials via their home wifi ?

I also wonder all the things above. I hope AW will have the capacity, willingness, and honesty, to one day share with us what happened in that house- maybe to the courts so that Logan can get justice. So that it may not happen to others. I imagine that once it's established a child is dead, the 'maternal' instinct could be over-ridden by a dark fear and at the point where AW became clear Logan was no longer alive, the woeful criminal cover up became her sole agenda.
 
Jay_Tec said:
I'm not a tech person but is it the case that some people don't have any credit or data left on their phone so they use a free app like WhatsApp that dials via their home wifi ?

I also wonder all the things above. I hope AW will have the capacity, willingness, and honesty, to one day share with us what happened in that house- maybe to the courts so that Logan can get justice. So that it may not happen to others. I imagine that once it's established a child is dead, the 'maternal' instinct could be over-ridden by a dark fear and at the point where AW became clear Logan was no longer alive, the woeful criminal cover up became her sole agenda.
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WhatsApp would be recorded as accessing WhatsApp though wouldn’t it?

I mean the standard dialler that’s included with all phones. Think of everything on a phone as an app.
 
I'm not sure how I can be any clearer so I'll state it one more time then I won't respond to these same factors in the thread again (happy to debate elsewhere)

Much of this is caused by confusion because many posts have been removed.

I don't believe the youth is 'innocent'.

I do hold the adults MORE responsible than the youth - MORE. That doesn’t mean that I don't hold the youth responsible for his actions AT ALL.

There is no appropriate 'excuse' or reason for a parent to violently beat their child. None. If you think there is then you pethaps shouldn't be on this thread - it's hypocritical.

13/14 is barely a teenager and definitely not an adult - that still doesn't mean the youth isn't culpable or knows right from wrong - JUST that he is NOT an adult.
 
I remember watching a programme where they scanned the brains of murderers (the murderers chose to co operate with the programme) and looked at their childhoods. It was surprisingly common for them to have suffered a serious head injury in childhood. Eg. In one case the mother had hit the boy on the head with a cricket bat. He said everything changed after that. The scans showed a hole in the bit of the brain that controls empathy. They'd also had traumatic childhoods. It would be interesting to know whether the youth ever experienced any brain damage.
 
Discrepancy question
Asked about a discrepancy between his statement and his activity during the tests, over whether he accessed Youtube on the phone, Mr Andrews says he believes his statement contained a typing error.

Mr Rouch then asks about another potential discrepancy between Mr Andrews' statement and activity, over whether he accessed another app at a certain time.

"Again, I can only assume I missed it in a rush to get the statement out," he said.

Logan Mwangi murder trial - live updates
 
Intelligence analyst to give evidence
Michelle Claxton, an intelligence analyst with South Wales Police, is now giving evidence. She says she analysed Williamson's Youtube for searches for the terms "blackhead" and "pimple popper".

Ms Claxton says she found the word "blackhead" 321 times in Williamson's Youtube watch history between October 2019 and August 2021, and the words "pimple popper" 623 times.

On July 29, 2021, Williamson visited sites with terms including: 'Debunking medical myths'; 'I drank pineapple juice before my wisdom surgery'; 'Free range kids - no medicine, no school routine, no bedtime'; and 'Long ingrown toenail', according to Ms Claxton.

Logan Mwangi murder trial - live updates
 
VioletLilac said:
I remember watching a programme where they scanned the brains of murderers (the murderers chose to co operate with the programme) and looked at their childhoods. It was surprisingly common for them to have suffered a serious head injury in childhood. Eg. In one case the mother had hit the boy on the head with a cricket bat. He said everything changed after that. The scans showed a hole in the bit of the brain that controls empathy. They'd also had traumatic childhoods. It would be interesting to know whether the youth ever experienced any brain damage.
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Was it 'What makes a murderer' on Channel4? That was a good, insightful documentary.
 
Jay_Tec said:
I'm not a tech person but is it the case that some people don't have any credit or data left on their phone so they use a free app like WhatsApp that dials via their home wifi ?

I also wonder all the things above. I hope AW will have the capacity, willingness, and honesty, to one day share with us what happened in that house- maybe to the courts so that Logan can get justice. So that it may not happen to others. I imagine that once it's established a child is dead, the 'maternal' instinct could be over-ridden by a dark fear and at the point where AW became clear Logan was no longer alive, the woeful criminal cover up became her sole agenda.
Click to expand...

I think I tend to agree with this. But I do wonder whether part of her participation in the cover up was maybe, not reluctant per se, but not really entirely consensual in that she was so shocked and stunned and emotional that she didn’t know what to do (although perhaps first instinct was indeed to call 999?). I think this is the point at which a more cool headed, less emotional about Logan, individual - JC - stepped in fearing for his own situation and being less devastated at Logan’s death came up with the plan and that this “strength” for what of a better word convinced AW to go along with it. AW has then concocted the whole “I was asleep all night” story almost as a means of self-preservation. Maybe convincing herself that being asleep makes her less culpable and involved. Whereas the phone evidence etc betrays that she was actually up and concerned (but not so concerned, I note, that she was looking up treatment of injuries etc. Which is what I would do if it was my child - I have a son who is the same age Logan was when he died. And a younger one who is horribly accident-prone. And any time he has a stupid knock on the head or anything, despite knowing what I need to look out for concussion-wise etc I still endlessly scroll health websites checking what signs and symptoms I need to look out for for fear of him dropping dead in the night or needing to take him to hospital. It’s never happened other than when I panic called an ambulance when he fell head first out of his high chair and then threw up (he had wind) and was sleepy (it was his nap time anyway) - but unsurprisingly he was fine and the paramedics were very sweet and reassuring that while there was absolutely nothing wrong with him I was ok for having called them out and it wasn’t time wasting as it at least showed I was “concerned” and showing motherly instinct! Anyway I digress).
I think maybe she had and inkling he wasn’t well, but was truly shocked that he died from injuries she maybe didn’t consider could be that serious. And it is only subsequently when she’s presented with the autopsy findings that realises quite was she’s put Logan through. But she’s in full denial by this stage so has continued to stick to her stupid story.
 
Sooty said:
Williamson watched hundreds of pimple popper videos
Ms Claxton again says the record showed Williamson watched 321 "blackhead" videos and 623 "pimple-popper" videos.

She has now concluded her evidence.

There will now be a short break.

Logan Mwangi murder trial - live updates
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I know some people on here can’t really fathom this search history but can I just add here that for some people (me included!) watching these videos is a form of displacement activity stress relief! These videos are wildly popular and I don’t subscribe to the view this is unconscionable or weird (I would say that wouldn’t I). For some people this is a kind of soothing ASMR. So far from demonstrating AW is morally abhorrent for watching these vids while her son is dying in his bedroom, I rather wonder whether she doesn’t derive some kind of soothing stress relief from mindlessly scrolling through Dr Pimple Popper videos. And that she is doing this precisely because she is actually a bit stressed. I go through phases of watching these, haven’t done in months but when I am super stressed I find myself absentmindedly drawn to them.

From Google -
Dopamine: Against dermatological advice, many people pick at their skin routinely. This habit releases dopamine, the feel-good hormone. As a result, popping and picking—or watching someone else do it—brings on a cathartic rush of satisfaction.
 
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