there wasnt an altercation we know that .
Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire), Jan 2023 #19
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CoverMeCagney
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I work from home. I turn my laptop volume up when we have all staff briefings, because I don’t look at the screen as much as when I have a face to face meeting. It’s easier to hear if you can also see the person you’re listening to. So, I turn it up so I don’t have to diligently watch them waffling on for an hour.
Blondiexoxo
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I think the discrepancy is due to this part of the testimony. I must admit it piqued my interest too…
Ms Cheshire said that other than Penny, who owns the caravan park next to the river, she didn’t see anyone else other than one dog walker much further down. Ms Cheshire left the field at around 9.15am and was captured on nearby CCTV at 9.18am.
From Penny’s evidence.
The inquest is now hearing from Penny Fletcher, the owner of a campsite in St Michael’s On Wyre which is close to where Nicola was last seen. Mrs Fletcher took her dog for a walk at 9.30am and found Willow with Nicola nowhere to be seen.
www.lancs.live
Maybe it was just the way it was reported but IMO I got the impression that Mrs Cheshire may have seen Mrs Fletcher before she left the field at around 9.15am. Then Mrs Fletcher said she didn’t take her dog a walk until 9.30am. Mrs Cheshire was spotted on nearby cctv at 9.18am so it kind of suggests that Mrs Cheshire saw Mrs Fletcher before then as Mrs Fletcher’s camp site was near to the field. But then when Mrs Fletcher said she didn’t walk her dog until 9.30am which is when she found Willow it confused me a little. If Mrs Fletcher was mistaken on timings and Mrs Cheshire was correct then that could mean she might have been one of the only people in the vicinity at the time Nicola is believed to have entered the water. It’s a small discrepancy that may not be a discrepancy atall, but it was something I noticed straight away when it was reported.
I’m aware we are simply the general public and we have no actual right to the information, however the media have reported this which obviously will lead to people discussing it is it was a high profile case at the time. The media giving live updates from the inquest also means that the public having a discussion about what was said is only expected? JMO
I am not looking for a conspiracy I don’t believe in those. I don’t believe anything has been covered up intentionally either, but if something has been overlooked accidentally then discussing it could lead Mrs Fletcher or Mrs Cheshire to remember something they didn’t think was relevant at the time but that’s JMO.
The coroners ruling is final however, and no amount of discussion will ever bring Nicola back to her family unfortunately. I just wanted to point out that I noticed this detail myself and I’m certainly not trying to promote a conspiracy.
However it has to be said that IMO I didn’t think from just what was reported that the evidence definitively suggested an accidental fall. I don’t know how all other possibilities could be ruled out but they were, I was honestly expecting an open verdict with the possible 4 minute or so gap for which there were apparently no witnesses to what happened during this time. I’m not a coroner obviously though and we likely don’t have as much evidence as he did to come to this decision..
All MOO
Ms Cheshire said that other than Penny, who owns the caravan park next to the river, she didn’t see anyone else other than one dog walker much further down. Ms Cheshire left the field at around 9.15am and was captured on nearby CCTV at 9.18am.
From Penny’s evidence.
The inquest is now hearing from Penny Fletcher, the owner of a campsite in St Michael’s On Wyre which is close to where Nicola was last seen. Mrs Fletcher took her dog for a walk at 9.30am and found Willow with Nicola nowhere to be seen.
Nicola Bulley inquest latest updates as two day hearing continues
A two day inquest into the death of Nicola Bulley begins on Monday. Our reporter will be in court providing updates on proceedings as it happens.
Maybe it was just the way it was reported but IMO I got the impression that Mrs Cheshire may have seen Mrs Fletcher before she left the field at around 9.15am. Then Mrs Fletcher said she didn’t take her dog a walk until 9.30am. Mrs Cheshire was spotted on nearby cctv at 9.18am so it kind of suggests that Mrs Cheshire saw Mrs Fletcher before then as Mrs Fletcher’s camp site was near to the field. But then when Mrs Fletcher said she didn’t walk her dog until 9.30am which is when she found Willow it confused me a little. If Mrs Fletcher was mistaken on timings and Mrs Cheshire was correct then that could mean she might have been one of the only people in the vicinity at the time Nicola is believed to have entered the water. It’s a small discrepancy that may not be a discrepancy atall, but it was something I noticed straight away when it was reported.
I’m aware we are simply the general public and we have no actual right to the information, however the media have reported this which obviously will lead to people discussing it is it was a high profile case at the time. The media giving live updates from the inquest also means that the public having a discussion about what was said is only expected? JMO
I am not looking for a conspiracy I don’t believe in those. I don’t believe anything has been covered up intentionally either, but if something has been overlooked accidentally then discussing it could lead Mrs Fletcher or Mrs Cheshire to remember something they didn’t think was relevant at the time but that’s JMO.
The coroners ruling is final however, and no amount of discussion will ever bring Nicola back to her family unfortunately. I just wanted to point out that I noticed this detail myself and I’m certainly not trying to promote a conspiracy.
However it has to be said that IMO I didn’t think from just what was reported that the evidence definitively suggested an accidental fall. I don’t know how all other possibilities could be ruled out but they were, I was honestly expecting an open verdict with the possible 4 minute or so gap for which there were apparently no witnesses to what happened during this time. I’m not a coroner obviously though and we likely don’t have as much evidence as he did to come to this decision..
All MOO
Interested_But_Confused
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Was it Ms. Cheshire who left the riverbank down Allotment Lane?
If so, she would have passed the Caravan Park as she was leaving. She could have seen Penny at the caravan park at around 9:15, before Penny reached the riverbank herself 10-15 minutes later.
If so, she would have passed the Caravan Park as she was leaving. She could have seen Penny at the caravan park at around 9:15, before Penny reached the riverbank herself 10-15 minutes later.
I think the discrepancy is due to this part of the testimony. I must admit it piqued my interest too…
Ms Cheshire said that other than Penny, who owns the caravan park next to the river, she didn’t see anyone else other than one dog walker much further down. Ms Cheshire left the field at around 9.15am and was captured on nearby CCTV at 9.18am.
From Penny’s evidence.
The inquest is now hearing from Penny Fletcher, the owner of a campsite in St Michael’s On Wyre which is close to where Nicola was last seen. Mrs Fletcher took her dog for a walk at 9.30am and found Willow with Nicola nowhere to be seen.
Nicola Bulley inquest latest updates as two day hearing continues
A two day inquest into the death of Nicola Bulley begins on Monday. Our reporter will be in court providing updates on proceedings as it happens.
Maybe it was just the way it was reported but IMO I got the impression that Mrs Cheshire may have seen Mrs Fletcher before she left the field at around 9.15am. Then Mrs Fletcher said she didn’t take her dog a walk until 9.30am. Mrs Cheshire was spotted on nearby cctv at 9.18am so it kind of suggests that Mrs Cheshire saw Mrs Fletcher before then as Mrs Fletcher’s camp site was near to the field. But then when Mrs Fletcher said she didn’t walk her dog until 9.30am which is when she found Willow it confused me a little. If Mrs Fletcher was mistaken on timings and Mrs Cheshire was correct then that could mean she might have been one of the only people in the vicinity at the time Nicola is believed to have entered the water. It’s a small discrepancy that may not be a discrepancy atall, but it was something I noticed straight away when it was reported.
I’m aware we are simply the general public and we have no actual right to the information, however the media have reported this which obviously will lead to people discussing it is it was a high profile case at the time. The media giving live updates from the inquest also means that the public having a discussion about what was said is only expected? JMO
I am not looking for a conspiracy I don’t believe in those. I don’t believe anything has been covered up intentionally either, but if something has been overlooked accidentally then discussing it could lead Mrs Fletcher or Mrs Cheshire to remember something they didn’t think was relevant at the time but that’s JMO.
The coroners ruling is final however, and no amount of discussion will ever bring Nicola back to her family unfortunately. I just wanted to point out that I noticed this detail myself and I’m certainly not trying to promote a conspiracy.
However it has to be said that IMO I didn’t think from just what was reported that the evidence definitively suggested an accidental fall. I don’t know how all other possibilities could be ruled out but they were, I was honestly expecting an open verdict with the possible 4 minute or so gap for which there were apparently no witnesses to what happened during this time. I’m not a coroner obviously though and we likely don’t have as much evidence as he did to come to this decision..
All MOO
The problem with fixating on a single report is that there will be discrepancies, omissions and inaccuracies.
I had a good old google looking for the 9.30 thing elsewhere and noticed that the Claire Cheshire mentioned in this report appears as Claire Chesham elsewhere.
Reporters don't get everything right.
Seattle1
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Exactly! I recall that NB logged in to her Team Meeting around 9 AM and her phone was on mute.
In the minutes before she turned the volume up at 9:18 AM, she received messages and/or sent messages from her phone.
I also presume NB turned up her volume when she was ready to listen and engage in the Team Meeting.
Typically, I also log in to a meeting or even WebEx for a Court hearing and spend 10-15 minutes getting myself ready before I shut my door, sit down, and turn the volume up.
IMO, I think NB was on the bench when she turned the volume up but within minutes, she abruptly set the phone down and headed toward where ever her dog was but not before falling off the bank into the water at about 9:22 AM.
Sadly, I don't think NB ever reached the harness or her dog before the accident. JMO
The problem with your theory is she can't then have walked 230 yards between 9.15 and 9.22
Seattle1
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Nope. The facts dictate Fitbit records steps in 15- minute increments but I know you don't believe the manufacturer and/or FitBit.
Noseyposy76
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I don’t think PF is at fault for causing the initial suspicion and in turn media circus. Certainly without blame, it was Nikki’s partner, family and friends who kept expressing that they didn’t think she was in the river from day one, which made me start to question the LP hypothesis. That is what is so absurd with these conspiracy theorists, they were/still are levelling accusations against the very people who were not willing to accept her disappearance could be nothing more than a tragic accident - out of their own grief, desperation and hope.
I definitely think PF was responsible for exasperating the situation with his absolutes, especially when he had already stated himself his equipment would not be able to penetrate the reeds…which is likely where she was most of the time. For me it was the reporting on the water levels around the bench area and still now I am confused by the height as it looks so shallow with the rocks there immediately below the edge, with PF saying it was at least waist level. In addition to that, he said she couldn’t possibly have got over the weir and had tested it out himself with a log! As a result, it has incorrectly been in my mind for the past few months that poor Nikki had entered the river further up, intentionally - but even then, it still seemed so overly complicated and didn’t make sense!
I don’t understand after all the evidence and facts presented, there are so many not accepting this verdict. What seems to have been glossed over, but to me is a huge indicator that nothing nefarious or something suddenly happened, is for her to turn the volume up on the phone and then leaving it on the bench. You would only do this if you are about to move away from your phone and need to do something hands free. And sadly as we know, due to Fitbit data, she had passed away just minutes later.
To me, if possible, this verdict is the kindest one to Nikki, her family and friends, knowing it was all over so quickly. But also, when you lose someone to suicide or murder, from people I know, you are left with a whole load of other emotions, along with the grief alone to contend with.
I think and hope we can all learn very many lessons from this tragic case. RIP Nikki x.
I definitely think PF was responsible for exasperating the situation with his absolutes, especially when he had already stated himself his equipment would not be able to penetrate the reeds…which is likely where she was most of the time. For me it was the reporting on the water levels around the bench area and still now I am confused by the height as it looks so shallow with the rocks there immediately below the edge, with PF saying it was at least waist level. In addition to that, he said she couldn’t possibly have got over the weir and had tested it out himself with a log! As a result, it has incorrectly been in my mind for the past few months that poor Nikki had entered the river further up, intentionally - but even then, it still seemed so overly complicated and didn’t make sense!
I don’t understand after all the evidence and facts presented, there are so many not accepting this verdict. What seems to have been glossed over, but to me is a huge indicator that nothing nefarious or something suddenly happened, is for her to turn the volume up on the phone and then leaving it on the bench. You would only do this if you are about to move away from your phone and need to do something hands free. And sadly as we know, due to Fitbit data, she had passed away just minutes later.
To me, if possible, this verdict is the kindest one to Nikki, her family and friends, knowing it was all over so quickly. But also, when you lose someone to suicide or murder, from people I know, you are left with a whole load of other emotions, along with the grief alone to contend with.
I think and hope we can all learn very many lessons from this tragic case. RIP Nikki x.
Seattle1
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We both agree she was most likely on the bench at 9.15 listening into her work teams call (surely we agree on that).
The Fitbit recorded 230 yards of walking between 9.15 and 9.30.
The coroner report indicates 9.22 as time of entering the water. Where has she walked the 230 yards between 9.18 (time she turned volume up) and 9.22?
running up and down with Willow?
The phone was on the bench at 9.20.
I guess she walked there between 9.15 and 9.18, turned the volume up and placed it on the bench.
Everything we know about the disappearance of Nicola Bulley ahead of inquest
Nicola Bulley vanished after taking her two daughters to school. Here is a timeline of events after her disappearance
Seattle1
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When did 230 Fitbit steps translate to 230 yards?!! That's one heck of a Jolly Green Giant stride.
I dont know Lol. It's like we are in a different universe at the moment
That's one heck of a Jolly Green Giant stride.
Blondiexoxo
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Dr Adeley says that the medical cause of death was drowning. He said it likely that Nicola entered the water at 9.22am when her Fitbit recorded a significant spike in her heart rate. He is unable to determine exactly why Nicola entered the water.
Dr Adeley said: "On January 27 at around 9.22am Nicola Jane Bulley fell into the River Wyre and died almost immediately".
The bit in bold is why I don’t understand the eventual ruling IMO. Unable to determine exactly why Nicola entered the water, suggests to me anyway that there could have been an event. She was in a and e after suffering a head injury shortly before her death, can a medical episode be ruled out? The embankment is a long way to tumble unless you are right by the waters edge. Had she stumbled or tripped then wouldn’t she have managed to gather her balance before reaching the river?
I think the speculation her family has endured has been horrible, especially how her partner was vilified. I 100% do not believe anyone close to Nicola had any involvement in her tragic death and I do believe the coroners ruling that Nicola ending up in the water was an accident. However I do not understand from what we read how the possibility of a third party (not someone close to Nicola) was ruled out, nor a medical episode. Many things could have happened on that field, the last people to see Nicola saw her from a distance, the person to find willow came along approximately 8 minutes after she entered the water. In 8 minutes how far could she have been swept down stream? There were no obvious slip marks from her wellies, no sounds of splashing or even Willow barking. If why Nicola ended up in the river cannot be answered, then how can an accidental fall verdict be reached?
I am not in any way pointing a finger at any of Nicolas immediate loved ones. My heart goes out to them, I lost my dad suddenly in an accidental fall and had to sit at his inquest while his horrific injuries were listed. At the time I was so grief stricken I just wanted it over, but now looking back I wish I’d asked whether it was possible he had a heart attack or some kind of medical episode that caused him to fall (his fall from height resulted in cardiac arrest, bleed on the brain, brain injury, shattered cheek bones, broken facial bones, shattered spine, pneumothorax, shattered pelvis amongst other injuries - there was no way of telling which came first) we refused a post mortem as we were in such shock and distress I just wanted it all over with. Now looking back I wish I’d asked more questions but at the time I just couldn’t think straight my dad was dead and nothing was going to bring him back, that inquest was just awful and I didn’t really listen to what was being said.
Nicola’s family have to try and navigate the rest of their lives without her which will be so very difficult. I don’t want to speculate or cast aspersions and I certainly don’t hold them in anyway responsible, her sister clearly cared so much for her to seek help for her a few weeks before her death, her husband was so concerned when she wasn’t home on time and is obviously grief stricken, reading her poor parents describing their daughter broke my heart.
I just wanted to point out my personal reasons for not understanding exactly how the verdict was reached however I respect the coroners decision as he had more information and all the facts which we didn’t have (and have no right to).
Perhaps we will never know the ins and outs but I hope her family find comfort in knowing that the end came quickly whatever the circumstances of how she came to be in the water, the evidence from her post mortem shows she was most likely physically unable to react before succumbing to the water.
Rest in peace Nicola x
Dr Adeley said: "On January 27 at around 9.22am Nicola Jane Bulley fell into the River Wyre and died almost immediately".
The bit in bold is why I don’t understand the eventual ruling IMO. Unable to determine exactly why Nicola entered the water, suggests to me anyway that there could have been an event. She was in a and e after suffering a head injury shortly before her death, can a medical episode be ruled out? The embankment is a long way to tumble unless you are right by the waters edge. Had she stumbled or tripped then wouldn’t she have managed to gather her balance before reaching the river?
I think the speculation her family has endured has been horrible, especially how her partner was vilified. I 100% do not believe anyone close to Nicola had any involvement in her tragic death and I do believe the coroners ruling that Nicola ending up in the water was an accident. However I do not understand from what we read how the possibility of a third party (not someone close to Nicola) was ruled out, nor a medical episode. Many things could have happened on that field, the last people to see Nicola saw her from a distance, the person to find willow came along approximately 8 minutes after she entered the water. In 8 minutes how far could she have been swept down stream? There were no obvious slip marks from her wellies, no sounds of splashing or even Willow barking. If why Nicola ended up in the river cannot be answered, then how can an accidental fall verdict be reached?
I am not in any way pointing a finger at any of Nicolas immediate loved ones. My heart goes out to them, I lost my dad suddenly in an accidental fall and had to sit at his inquest while his horrific injuries were listed. At the time I was so grief stricken I just wanted it over, but now looking back I wish I’d asked whether it was possible he had a heart attack or some kind of medical episode that caused him to fall (his fall from height resulted in cardiac arrest, bleed on the brain, brain injury, shattered cheek bones, broken facial bones, shattered spine, pneumothorax, shattered pelvis amongst other injuries - there was no way of telling which came first) we refused a post mortem as we were in such shock and distress I just wanted it all over with. Now looking back I wish I’d asked more questions but at the time I just couldn’t think straight my dad was dead and nothing was going to bring him back, that inquest was just awful and I didn’t really listen to what was being said.
Nicola’s family have to try and navigate the rest of their lives without her which will be so very difficult. I don’t want to speculate or cast aspersions and I certainly don’t hold them in anyway responsible, her sister clearly cared so much for her to seek help for her a few weeks before her death, her husband was so concerned when she wasn’t home on time and is obviously grief stricken, reading her poor parents describing their daughter broke my heart.
I just wanted to point out my personal reasons for not understanding exactly how the verdict was reached however I respect the coroners decision as he had more information and all the facts which we didn’t have (and have no right to).
Perhaps we will never know the ins and outs but I hope her family find comfort in knowing that the end came quickly whatever the circumstances of how she came to be in the water, the evidence from her post mortem shows she was most likely physically unable to react before succumbing to the water.
Rest in peace Nicola x
kittythehare
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The questions have all been answered, more than once.
she could have been dizzy from medication and had a medical episode but its more likely she slipped in when trying to fix the harness. She was so slight and if Willow had just jumped suddenly that could have been all it took to be honest.
Observe_dont_Absorb
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If she fell in where he peers down at 'the rocks' that form a vertical wall, how could she have fallen downwards then tumbled over those into the water without sustaining injuries at the very least on her head / face and hands? The rest of her she had winter clothes but even so wouldn't there be bruises where she'd hit on them?
Or when they say she had 'no injuries' do they mean no injuries that could have caused her death, say for example if she'd been assaulted?
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