UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 7 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 6 hung re attempted #34

[ColourPurple]

I suppose, but the baby might have something to say about it! Nurses don't just go wandering around maternity wards, you'd stand out like a sore thumb.

Well yes but this is LL we're talking about lol.

I was thinking about times like this when the swipe date showed she'd popped to the labour ward.

Letby is asked about messages exchanged between her and a doctor when, at 2.30pm, she was recorded as taking observations for Child O.

The messages were sent at 2.20pm and 2.23pm.

Child O collapsed shortly after 2.40pm. In her defence statement, she said the doctor colleague was on the unit at the time.

Swipe data shows Letby has arrived on the neonatal unit from the labour ward at 2.39pm.

Letby says she cannot say, definitively, where she was at that time. She denies 'nipping out' of the neonatal unit to make it look like she was elsewhere at the time Child O collapsed.

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Dotta]

Well yes but this is LL we're talking about lol.

I was thinking about times like this when the swipe date showed she'd popped to the labour ward.

Letby is asked about messages exchanged between her and a doctor when, at 2.30pm, she was recorded as taking observations for Child O.

The messages were sent at 2.20pm and 2.23pm.

Child O collapsed shortly after 2.40pm. In her defence statement, she said the doctor colleague was on the unit at the time.

Swipe data shows Letby has arrived on the neonatal unit from the labour ward at 2.39pm.

Letby says she cannot say, definitively, where she was at that time. She denies 'nipping out' of the neonatal unit to make it look like she was elsewhere at the time Child O collapsed.

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

If mother said she saw LL snooping around her medical notes, then I believe mother.

100%

JMO

 

[cottonweaver]

the cps say “several” and considering there were thirteen babies and 22 charges it’s not helpful. Could be “in half the cases she lied in med notes” etc.

here’s what the cps say.

“Several medical documents featured falsified notes made by Letby to hide her involvement. She amended timings on several documents in an attempt to distance herself from incidents where babies had suddenly become severely unwell.”

Lucy Letby found guilty of baby murders | The Crown Prosecution Service

www.cps.gov.uk

interestingly this website gives you the evidence the cps believes got the g verdict.

Yes but while you, or I, might be curious, CPS is not obliged to give us a detailed breakdown.

Nonetheless I do think it's helpful that they give a brief summary, it could help negate SM speculation about her conviction. ( Cheshire Police said they had a SM strategy & their decision to air that docu immediately has to have been partly for same reasons. No police force is going to be unaware of the insanity surrounding the N Bulley misper case)

 

[cottonweaver]

I suppose, but the baby might have something to say about it! Nurses don't just go wandering around maternity wards, you'd stand out like a sore thumb.

Mary, is it SOP for neo natal nurse to attend caes section of a very premature baby? ( Baby Alvin Morris, mild musc dystrophy, so they would have already known he was going to NNU before baby delivered. The NNU team/nurse comes to collect?)

 

[marynnu]

Mary, is it SOP for neo natal nurse to attend caes section of a very premature baby? ( Baby Alvin Morris, mild musc dystrophy, so they would have already known he was going to NNU before baby delivered. The NNU team/nurse comes to collect?)

Where I worked, a nurse attended all deliveries when resus & admission to NNU was anticipated. I honestly can't recall the exact cutoff but certainly less than 34 weeks, and for babies with conditions which put them at risk.

 

[Tortoise]

tortoise I was wondering if you might be able to provide some pointers as to other examples of when she is alleged to falsified the notes Pls. I lost count after five times I think. If you could give me the cases I’ll do the research. It’s allot of info

I'll put something together. Probably tomorrow.

 

[katydid23]

People laughed at me when I said maybe she blocked the sink with tightly pushed down paper towel but why not. God only knows what other terror and aggression she perpetrated in the environment on a daily basis.

I agree. It fits with other behaviour of hers, where she tries to create chaos on the unit. It would be the perfect way to deflect and aggravate the situation. And if she wanted to be designated to a certain nursery over another, closing down one would be helpful. JMO

 

[katydid23]

RSBM

As she was present at some births and was able to access the maternity ward as part of her role, I've wondered whether she might have used insulin to create low blood sugar in any newborns on the maternity ward so that they would be transferred over to her in the NNU to become her new "favourite"! I know there were anecdotal reports of a mother on the labour ward, who said she woke up to find LL going through her medical notes, but don't know if that was ever officially reported in the press.

That is very creepy and makes me more certain about her need for all of those handover sheets. I was already pretty sure that she kept them so she could hunt for future victims. Like a catalogue for her to scan through at night.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I agree. It fits with other behaviour of hers, where she tries to create chaos on the unit. It would be the perfect way to deflect and aggravate the situation. And if she wanted to be designated to a certain nursery over another, closing down one would be helpful. JMO

In this regard, it could be the case that her only defence witness was also giving more evidence to the prosecution. Had I been speaking for the prosecution, it would have been my first question!

Dear plumber are you certain this towel was purposefully forced? (yes)
Do you know who forced it? (no)
Is it possible that LL could have been the person to do that? (well, possibly I suppose)
Was LL on duty and in the same area when this incident happened? (records can be checked)

 

[marynnu]

In this regard, it could be the case that her only defence witness was also giving more evidence to the prosecution. Had I been speaking for the prosecution, it would have been my first question!

Dear plumber are you certain this towel was purposefully forced? (yes)
Do you know who forced it? (no)
Is it possible that LL could have been the person to do that? (well, possibly I suppose)
Was LL on duty and in the same area when this incident happened? (records can be checked)

I just found it weird that he said adults did this. Why would he think so?

 

[ColourPurple]

I just found it weird that he said adults did this. Why would he think so?

Maybe the sink was too high or the plug hole set too deep for a child to have been able to reach? .

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I just found it weird that he said adults did this. Why would he think so?

Maybe the height required to push down so hard into the plug hole or maybe he was aware that there's only medics, parents, and tiny babies in the whole area?

Seems to me that he openly suggested malicious tampering and then it went nowhere and nobody speculated who or why.

 

[marynnu]

Maybe the height required to push down so hard into the plug hole or maybe he was aware that there's only medics, parents, and tiny babies in the whole area?

Seems to me that he openly suggested malicious tampering and then it went nowhere and nobody speculated who or why.

He might not have realised that siblings visit, I suppose.

 

[Dotta]

"Medical Killers Society"

As Lucy Letby is imprisoned, here are the UK's other murderer medics

Nurse Lucy Letby has now joined roster of other medics convicted of murdering those they were meant to care for. Here MailOnline details the horrific stories of so-called 'angles of death'.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Sweeper2000]

Ive just thought of a potential reason why the other deaths in 15/16 perhaps were not mentioned in the trial. It makes for grim reading. Of all the babies we’ve heard of I don’t really remember getting the impression they were particularly unwell with a low chance of survival. Baby g for instance, very premature, 450 grams and at birth had a 5% chance of survival. thats A baby at high risk but 100 days later that baby was looking healthy with good prospects. Had shown great resilience and progress. That baby I don’t think was actually in danger from anything other than Lucy letby. thats terrible to think. However that baby was actually out of the ball park, was looking good. What if these other deaths were actually of babies who had other more prominent issues that make it harder To distinguish Foul play? So the cps picked the ones where it’s actually easier for the jury to see how unusual the events were.

 

[katydid23]

I just found it weird that he said adults did this. Why would he think so?

Are families allowed to bring older siblings into the unit?

 

[cottonweaver]

People laughed at me when I said maybe she blocked the sink with tightly pushed down paper towel but why not. God only knows what other terror and aggression she perpetrated in the environment on a daily basis.

That Beverley Allitt dramatisation depicts BA doing random destructive acts. Setting ward fires. Moving objects around her friends home to try & scare them. And much more.
I've never read plumber's evidence before now but I can see how frequently he was having to attend during this period.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Are families allowed to bring older siblings into the unit?

Maybe not because of spread of disease and infection risk. But I'm not a doctor and not sure.

 

[cottonweaver]

Maybe not because of spread of disease and infection risk. But I'm not a doctor and not sure.

twice on one night shift, was LL on shift 25 Jan 2016?

'Nursery 4 was closed at 2.30am 'due to plumbing work/deep cleaning of nursery.' 'Mixer tap was switched on, and sink completely blocked.' 'Floor noted to be completely flooded'. 'Water within sink noted to contain much black debris. Sink still blocked however'.

The nursery was 'noted to be flooded again at approximately 4.30am', with the 'floor almost completely flooded again'.

ETA link

Plumber tells of sewage issues at neonatal unit where Lucy Letby worked

Plumbers were called out “weekly” to drainage problems at an ageing Chester hospital building where nurse Lucy Letby allegedly attacked 17…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Tortoise]

With the verdicts being taken piecemeal I've been wondering if the time limit for an appeal against conviction runs from the dates of the individual verdicts. 28 days is up this coming week, from the first verdicts returned on 8th August.