Verdict Watch Thread Saturday July 13

[Schuby]

I think they've decided to acquit and out of diligence want to be certain GZ's actions don't rise to the standard of manslaughter. Why else ask for clarification 5 minutes before Miller Time?

 

[Lovelymountains]

IMHO, people are only bringing this up to make Trayvon Benjamin Martin look sinister, what is more disturbing than to see a Black teen walking in the rain with a hoody up?
Zimmerman could have avoided killing an innocent teen by staying with his vehicle as he was told and wait for LE or driven to the back gate "where they all get away".

All this sympathy for Zimmerman is perplexing, perhaps it is because many are from high crime areas or areas where there are no people that don't look like yourselves.

Florida may have some "strange" laws but they sure do have stiff penalties for using a gun to kill someone.

Interesting to hear Judge Alex say last night that he really believes that Zimmerman had his gun out already when he approached Trayvon Benjamin Martin.

Now I will take a break and cool down, again!

IMO IMHO

I agree with Judge Alex in that GZ had his gun out and that he approached TM in back of the condo where he was staying. IMO that's how he got TM to come with him back toward his vehicle. But Trayvon tried to escape 70 yards away and was shot. I tried to say this during the trial, but was ridiculed that how did GZ make him come with him, flying saucers? So I more or less gave it up for a while. It kind of hurt my feelings because I thought I had as much right as anyone else to state my opinion. So, to make a long story short, which I haven't, I think that's what happened and all that the eyewitnesses saw was the scuffle when Trayvon tried to escape and then was shot dead.

 

[neesaki]

I think that one or two jurors are holding out for not guilty and the others are trying to get them to vote for manslaughter. That's why they asked for some help via this question to get the holdouts to change their mind. MOO.

I agree, it's not hard to come to the conclusion that this jury is very likely divided. Just look how much division there is here, lol. That said, it would not surprise me if it is manslaughter, or a hung jury. The only thing that would surprise me, if it was 2nd degree murder. jmo

 

[Karmady]

There are generally lesser included offenses under the law. But, perhaps they wanted the jury to be aware of that?? Kind of like an exclamation point!! Cause I remember another case when the jury seemed to disregard those lesser offenses completely.

They're available, but the judge has to charge them for the jury to consider them if they weren't in the original charging document. That's what the defense was arguing about. jmo

 

[Horace Finklestein]

I can't believe they're taking this long on a very simple case. The state showed it has absolutely no proof whatsoever of what they were claiming. I pray that emotion is set aside and logic and critical thinking are employed. imo.

 

[legalmania]

:twocents:

:twocents: I am not a lawyer and not an expert and not a chemist :waitasec:

But it ticks me off that the State is allowed to throw in this "manslaughter charge" when they were originally going for a 2nd Degree Murder charge ...

It's NOT fair to the defendant at all -- regardless of WHO the defendant is ...

All this does is CONFUSE jurors ... these laws need to change ...

You know, it's like this : if I can't have steak, I'll settle for a hamburger ...

:waitasec: I know ... not the best analogy ... but y'all know what I mean ...


I'm going to put on a pot of coffee ... :cup: ... maybe it will calm me down ...

:seeya:


All My Opinion JMO MOO !

If the judge allowed it how can it not be fair?

 

[Doop]

Only verdict reading I ever watched was Michael Jackson's.

 

[Reader]

Zimmerman jury has question regarding manslaughter charge

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...n-martin-jury-saturday-deliberations/2514233/

 

[Sonya610]

That's what I thought. I figured if they felt there was no evidence, they would have voted NG right away.

The prosecution has really played on their emotions. Most of these women are mothers. Their emotional response cannot be denied.

I just pray their logic will overcome any emotional spin and that these women can rationally look at the EVIDENCE or lack thereof.

IMO.

 

[iluvmua]

with respect - Manslaughter is a lessor charge than murder 2 and has always been on the table. The defense lawyers made the mistake of ignoring that.

IMO

Murder 2 has always been on the table, Murder 2 is what Angela Corey charged and she did not add manslaughter.

Manslaughter was just added a couple of days ago.

JMO

 

[Just Sailing Thru]

FYI now
Diana Tennis @TennisLaw
Jury may have had specific factual question that has keyed lawyers into where going and each want law read their way - researching.ReplyRetweet

 

[ShadyLady]

I wonder if anyone on jury would know manslaughter minimum...

 

[MeeBee]

In my state (NC) we have voluntary and involuntary manslaughter. There's a big difference in the sentences. Before this trial, I thought manslaughter was nothing more than a slap on the wrist. I'm just hoping this jury doesn't think that. In this case, and in this trial it's nothing more than another trick to put GZ in prison.

Different states have different laws. Can't pick and choose. The law is the law and it has to be followed. In Florida the punishment for manslaughter is harsher than other states. A jury should make a decision based on what the law says the charge is not based on how long the do or don't want someone to go away for. It's completely irrational.

I am just wondering is this a new opinion or have you always felt this way?

 

[RANCH]

with respect - Manslaughter is a lessor charge than murder 2 and has always been on the table. The defense lawyers made the mistake of ignoring that.

IMO

The defense didn't ignore that, they tried to keep manslaughter from the jury and the judge ruled against them. The "compromise verdict" was definitely on their minds. MOO.

 

[Smelly Squirrel]

I agree, also, at least in my state IIRC there is 1st and 2nd degree manslaughter.
Do we know if there is more than one specific manslaughter conviction possibility in this case? I haven't heard.

There's only one manslaughter charge, manslaughter by intentional act (not negligence).

I would just describe manslaughter as homicide that is not murder one or two and is not justifiable homicide or self defense. It's if you kill someone intentionally but without any good excuse.

 

[ShadyLady]

Firing of Kruidbos might set up appeal per CNN.

 

[logicalgirl]

In my state (NC) we have voluntary and involuntary manslaughter. There's a big difference in the sentences. Before this trial, I thought manslaughter was nothing more than a slap on the wrist. I'm just hoping this jury doesn't think that. In this case, and in this trial it's nothing more than another trick to put GZ in prison.

I believe ten years with no parole is added to the sentence if a firearm is used in the crime.

IMO

Ten minutes to go.

Martin Savage is saying five minutes and he sounds more nervous than Zimmerman looks.

 

[JeannaT]

I wonder if anyone on jury would know manslaughter minimum...

That's a good question. and maybe, but aren't they strictly forbidden from bringing in information that wasn't presented at trial?

So even if someone could write out the penalties for each of the charges, i don't believe they can tell the other jurors.

iMHO

 

[greycoupon]

Anyone know if, assuming they don't finish tonight, the judge will have them deliberate tomorrow?

Also, if he's found guilty is sentencing done immediately or later?

 

[TexMex]

No, they're not informed of the sentences. this came out a couple days ago - seems remiss to me.

iMHo

Yes. IIRC the judge instructed the jury to produce a verdict and the judge would apply the appropriate sentence