AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #19

[mtnlites]

Why would the "cartel" go after a family, kill the parents and take the child if they weren't involved in "drugs"?
Witnesses?
I am stumped!
Moo

A cartel killing would have most likely not leave any witnesses. And by that, I mean everyone in the house would be dead, not some of them dead and one taken on as prisoner. Cartel killings are usually either to settle a score (in which case they'd have all been killed) or to send a message (in which case they'd have been killed in a more brutal way). They'd have no qualms in killing a teenage girl.

I am not discounting the idea that drugs are involved in some way, but I don't think this was cartel related. That's waaayyy down on my list of possibilities.

 

[CuriousMaine]

Is Truth Finder a source we can quote??

I'm not sure.
Link to rules: The Rules
Rules - Etiquette & Information

 

[gngr~snap]

A cartel killing would have most likely not leave any witnesses. And by that, I mean everyone in the house would be dead, not some of them dead and one taken on as prisoner. Cartel killings are usually either to settle a score (in which case they'd have all been killed) or to send a message (in which case they'd have been killed in a more brutal way). They'd have no qualms in killing a teenage girl.

I am not discounting the idea that drugs are involved in some way, but I don't think this was cartel related. That's waaayyy down on my list of possibilities.

I agree!
Moo

 

[Gardener1850]

Odd that there is a big meth bust the next day accross the street! “Unrelated”, police say.

Not really odd IMO, considering LE would have been interviewing all of the neighbors about if they heard or saw anything and asking to search their premises. If someone had a secret meth lab in their barn, for example, and the FBI comes asking to search it and make sure Jayme isn't hiding in there-- the owners are going to either say no or let them search. If they say no and are acting suspicious then LE will get a warrant really fast and end up finding the meth lab. If the meth makers stupidly say, "sure go ahead and look she's not here," and the FBI goes back there and sees the chemicals to make meth just lying around and it's obvious what has been going on, then they are going to bust the neighbors for the meth. It doesn't mean the meth crime is related to the murders/Jayme going missing. It was just uncovered because she was missing and suddenly LE had a reason to check there. JMO.

 

[CuriousMaine]

Is Truth Finder a source we can quote??

What kind of page is it? Is it the public records lookup?
You can always private message an admin to be sure.

 

[Gardener1850]

Link?!

I think this is where it was reported to us here: AMBER ALERT - WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #11

ETA: Here's the Sheriff's twitter post: Chris Fitzgerald on Twitter

On further reflection, I'm not sure the Sheriff ever confirmed it was a meth bust but many have put two and two together from reading the jail inmate rosters. JMO.

 

[crhedBngr]

RBBM. Lots of families get together for lunch or dinner every Sunday as a matter of tradition. Perhaps it is less common these days? I saw my grandparents and cousins at least once a week for the family dinner growing up. If one of my cousins had a birthday that week then the meal included cake and ice cream and singing happy birthday. That said, I'm confused as to why this family gathering could be significant to the crime. A Sunday family gathering for a cousin's birthday sounds pretty common, mundane almost. Can either of you enlighten me as to why you think it could be significant? TIA

(as long as your thoughts are within TOS, of course, if not just ignore me and I won't take offense at all )

Yes, ditto this. I was thinking yesterday just how very family-oriented many of our gatherings were when I was growing up. Every Sunday, my Dad took us to visit his mother and father. I saw my maternal grandmother at least once/week--at church, after church, after school - you name it.

And cousins, second cousins - my maternal grandmother was one of 13 children!

As to Denise bringing gifts for everyone, I'm wondering if she was an arts-and-crafts person. Maybe she made something for everyone. I knew a lady who made little cross-stitched items and put them into crocheted frames, which were 2 inches by 3 inches.

 

[Confusion]

RBBM. Lots of families get together for lunch or dinner every Sunday as a matter of tradition. Perhaps it is less common these days? I saw my grandparents and cousins at least once a week for the family dinner growing up. If one of my cousins had a birthday that week then the meal included cake and ice cream and singing happy birthday. That said, I'm confused as to why this family gathering could be significant to the crime. A Sunday family gathering for a cousin's birthday sounds pretty common, mundane almost. Can either of you enlighten me as to why you think it could be significant? TIA

(as long as your thoughts are within TOS, of course, if not just ignore me and I won't take offense at all )

I think that after any murder, or other serious crime, you could probably look back and see something totally innocent that happened that day but wasn't the norm for a lot of families. I think that if a person tries hard enough he/she could find something suspicious about just about anything. MOO

 

[human]

I said Northern Wisconsin, not Barron. My father came from Barron, my mother came from Turtle Lake, a lot of both families still live in the immediate area and my son lives in Spooner. I hear a lot about what goes on out there (I was actually born in Rice Lake, but have spent almost all my life living in Minnesota.)

ETA: It's been longer than I thought since the worst one I was thinking of, but there were 6 people murdered and 2 others injured basically over nothing. A hunting spot if I remember correctly, and there are a lot of racists in the are. I heard some of their comments set him off, but I think it would take more than that to cause most 'normal' people to go off like that.

10 years ago, 6 deer hunters slain in woods of western Wisconsin – Twin Cities

I am very familiar with this as I taught many Hmong children. Their history is tragic. Years languishing in DP camps after being promised safety by the US govt

 

[BB71]

Not really odd IMO, considering LE would have been interviewing all of the neighbors about if they heard or saw anything and asking to search their premises. If someone had a secret meth lab in their barn, for example, and the FBI comes asking to search it and make sure Jayme isn't hiding in there-- the owners are going to either say no or let them search. If they say no and are acting suspicious then LE will get a warrant really fast and end up finding the meth lab. If the meth makers stupidly say, "sure go ahead and look she's not here," ... JMO.

If Jim WAS an informant, that would be the time to bust the neighbor.

Unlikely, I know.

<modsnip - rumor >

 

[l84tea2]

@Memphis Bluez said: ↑
I don't yet understand why some folks on here keep mentioning meth problems in the area. What would meth (which is a country wide epidemic), have anything to do with a double murder of an employed middle class couple? Are you suggesting they were some how involved with meth? I really find that a stretch from what we've been told about them. Can those of you who have the "meth" theories please explain? TIA

IMO, no family implication. I believe it's more environment and the reality of its impact on a community the size of Barron, WI.
June 9, 2018
Meth monster returns to Chippewa Valley and is extending its reach
Sept 28, 2018
Barron Co. Sheriff issues passionate plea to end meth epidemic in western WI
Sept 28, 2018
Meth investigation nets four arrests
Aug 22, 2018
Meth problem is top concern; Criminal Justice Collaborating Council
Feb 15, 2108
Barron County Sheriff Wants Drug Testing In High Schools

Guns are far, far FAR more valuable then meth.

 

[Confusion]

I am very familiar with this as I taught many Hmong children. Their history is tragic. Years languishing in DP camps after being promised safety by the US govt

It was a sad story all the way around. MOO

 

[human]

It was a sad story all the way around. MOO

I am very happy to hear you say that. I feel the same way. At least that kind of thing has stopped . There used to be more incidents but I have not heard of any for a long time.

 

[tigerteeth]

Some seem to think the weapon being shot at the door was a shotgun which I respect those opinions but disagree .

I havent seen anyone in LE say what type and caliber was used. I don't think this had anything to do with hunting or being a hunter.

It didn't take hunting skill to do any of this. Look at how many murders are done yearly by those who never hunted at all. Way more than hunters. Jmoo

Only about 150 peolple per year use shotguns or rifles as their weapon of choice when using a firearm. Most use handguns and not long guns.

However personally I dont think a shotgun was used. The second shot was muffled. If a shotgun was used it's impossible imo to muffle the sound.

It makes more sense to me they came to the door with a high powered semi automatic handgun which would be easy to conceal. Like a glock 40 or something even of a higher caliber or even a .357 or.44 magnum.

That would be much easier to conceal by dropping the weapon down by his side when James came to the door totally unaware he was armed.

The second shot if done with a high caliber handgun would muffle thesound if the end of the gun barrel made direct body or head contact when shooting James.

Jmo though

I noticed right away many people were saying “shotgun”. I was thinking how do we know? I think some people might just think it’s a general term or interchangeably used.

 

[tigerteeth]

Can I just say this before I burst ? I am really having the worst time getting past the panty stealer. I know LE cleared him of any involvement in this crime, and I know they had good reasons for doing so, but seriously...what the hell are the odds of that kind of wacky crime happening in the very same home where 2 people were brutally murdered and their daughter abducted ? It's so friggin' weird that I keep catching myself coming back to this guy again and again, and each time I have to snap myself back to reality and remind myself that this guy was cleared by LE.

UGH !

Can I just say this before I burst ? I am really having the worst time getting past the panty stealer. I know LE cleared him of any involvement in this crime, and I know they had good reasons for doing so, but seriously...what the hell are the odds of that kind of wacky crime happening in the very same home where 2 people were brutally murdered and their daughter abducted ? It's so friggin' weird that I keep catching myself coming back to this guy again and again, and each time I have to snap myself back to reality and remind myself that this guy was cleared by LE.

UGH !

I know he’s had other incidents but it seems he knew the house was as abandoned so he went there to steal. I don’t think it’s quite a coincidence.

 

[mtnlites]

I know he’s had other incidents but it seems he knew the house was as abandoned so he went there to steal. I don’t think it’s quite a coincidence.

I don't think it's a coincidence, but I don't think he had anything to do with the murders. I think he heard about them, heard that a teen daughter was missing, and thought, "Well that house is empty and the daughter's clothes are probably still there so..."

In other words, I think he chose that house on purpose, but only because he thought it would be easy to get in and out of and because he knew there were teen undergarments probably in it.

 

[Al Ka]

@ the idea of multiple perps...Sheriff did say 'killers' - now, this could be a turn of prhase...
However: I think of that 911 call..described as 'muffled shouting'...
So...who was shouting at whom?
Especially as quite possible both James & Denise were deceased...
Suggests more than one perp...all that shouting...

Some articles described sounds on 911 as yelling, some others as screams.

I still do consider two options here at the time of the call
- multiple people shouting and screams including Jayme
- but also only one person present there, Jayme, can't be excluded - Have you all ever heard person when they witnessed or just found their loved one murdered? Definitely lots of uncontrollable screams, weeping or yelling. Probably dog barking in between too.

I really feel horrible for what Jayme, still just a child, had to witness that night. If scene was too shocking for adults and police, I can't imagine in what state she was.

 

[Al Ka]

I wonder if it has a mortgage. I suppose someone might buy it . I would tear the house down and hope a neighbor would buy it for additional acreage and leave it empty

There is a mortgage. In May 2017 there was also $13 K borrowed against the house by Denise (as per Realtor info in previous threads). The same month and year there was huge storm in that area too, so maybe loan was taken due to that.

I was wondering the same question, what happens with the house in such a situations. Is it repossessed if mortgage is not paid due to situation? Or sold and proceeds goes to next of kin? Would it even sell due to what happened there?

Either way I do not see any family member ever putting their foot there apart of sorting paperwork and saying their last good bye...

 

[chihuahua]

This is all so very puzzling. Nothing to add. Following and reading.
Something has to "give", someone has to know the facts because they were involved.
This girl didn't disappear on her own as we all know.

Perps and those with undisclosed info often search the net and WS comes up and leads them here.
(fear is the biggest factor in not giving up that info, and it is very understandable)

If you are involved or have info step up and do the decent thing.
{Even if you were directly involved and J is no longer in this life, at this moment you can find a way to let the searchers know where she can be found...please don't make this so much worse than it already is }

This "situation" is not going to just go away.
Jayme's family needs the answers. They deserve it.
Heck, that whole community deserves it too.

Chi

 

[RavenDoc]

There is a mortgage. In May 2017 there was also $13 K borrowed against the house by Denise (as per Realtor info in previous threads). The same month and year there was huge storm in that area too, so maybe loan was taken due to that.

I was wondering the same question, what happens with the house in such a situations. Is it repossessed if mortgage is not paid due to situation? Or sold and proceeds goes to next of kin? Would it even sell due to what happened there?

Either way I do not see any family member ever putting their foot there apart of sorting paperwork and saying their last good bye...

Good information. I’m suspecting that the 13k probably went to pay off the financial judgment against her in the past (referenced in some early threads).