Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #11 *Arrest*

[Lisa4]

Sorry, been hectic and no time to keep up.
Has it come up why she felt the need to include the strong/funny smelling dried Asian mushrooms in this particular meal when they were not in the recipe and she had loads of woolworths mushrooms?

 

[Deleted member 363451]

Didn't she say they were still a bit soggy in the middle?

She has an answer for everything, doesn't she?

 

[BreakingNews]

Exactly right. If she admits that she accidentally foraged Death Caps and fed them to her guests, she is at least on the hook for manslaughter.

It depends what the judge tells the jury while summing up. Remember the Hill/Clay case. It was murder or acquittal.

 

[katydid23]

Key Event
Just now
Stoush over child support between Simon and Erin

By Joseph Dunstan

Erin says the topic of child support first came up in her memory in October of 2022 as she was preparing tax return paperwork.

She says in a discussion with Simon, she learnt he had listed himself as single on his tax return.

"I said words to the effect of 'well that's good, now I can claim a family tax benefit' that I had been precluded from [until that point]," she says.

She says those who are single and wanting to claim family tax benefits need to put in a child support application from the other parent in order to do that.

Erin says she was frustrated that she hadn't learnt earlier when she could have applied for the family tax benefit, but that was her only annoyance.

Mr Mandy asks if that issue snowballed into other issues about finances.

"Yeah, it did, it did," Erin says.

Oh poor Erin Erin Erin---so worried about the family tax benefit.

Family Tax Benefit (FTB) in Victoria, Australia is a government payment designed to help families with the cost of raising children
. Services Australia (formerly Centrelink) administers these payments.


Was this government program designed for people who have inherited millions from various family estates and thus own 3 to 4 properties ?

 

[Detechtive]

It depends what the judge tells the jury while summing up. Remember the Hill/Clay case. It was murder or acquittal.

That is my point, though. If Manslaughter is on the table, which her defence need to plan for, because in Victoria it automatically is on the table in Murder cases, then it's transparent why they have decided to take this tactic.

 

[katydid23]

Her defence have versed her well. She's going to walk, I'm telling you.

She has not been cross examined yet. This is the easy part of her presentation.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

So far nothing I have heard makes me think she is an awful person. It just makes her human.
Just a human being with all our complexities and imperfections.
I'm not interested in throwing stones.

Maybe some on the jury might have the same opinion.
I would not be surprised.

 

[BreakingNews]

I’m just going to get real with you guys; if I purchased mushrooms and I got them out to cook them and they smelled so pungent that I didn’t feel comfortable putting them in a pasta dish, I would throw them out.

I wouldn’t store them. I wouldn’t put them back in a container. I wouldn’t put them in the pantry, I would throw them in the bin.

I also don’t forage. I was always taught not to touch wild mushrooms and not to eat them. I’m sensible like that.

I’m also going to say that one of the worst decisions Ms Patterson has made during this trial is to take the stand. All my opinion only.

Mushroom foraging was great fun as a kid. Even from a very young age we were taught what we could and could not eat.
Agree, accused murderers never do well in the witness stand.

 

[MrJ]

She has not been cross examined yet. This is the easy part of her presentation.

I keep forgetting this, this is hysterical! Even with her 'friendly' team asking her questions it's not looking great IMO

 

[Detechtive]

Oh poor Erin Erin Erin---so worried about the family tax benefit.

Family Tax Benefit (FTB) in Victoria, Australia is a government payment designed to help families with the cost of raising children
. Services Australia (formerly Centrelink) administers these payments.


Was this government program designed for people who have inherited millions from various family estates and thus own 3 to 4 properties ?

I know you're in the USA Katy, where social welfare is very different to here. In Aus, child support and family tax benefit is generally NOT means tested. It is income-based. So yeah, theoretically someone with $5-8m in assets could still get it.

But i think the important point here is that it was *only* 15k a year. It is not a lot of money when you consider the kids school fees were 40k+ a year. Simon was paying those prior. Her math is illogical. I think she threatened the child support and family tax benefit to make him comply, rather than having done the math - because, she was an accountant, she surely knew she wouldn't be eligible for much from Simon, but I think she tried to threaten him which didn't work.. he seemed disengaged and called her bluff (perhaps, finally?) "Go right ahead Erin, you will be worse off if you take that tactic with me..." (is what i imagined him projecting to her).

 

[katydid23]

Key Event
Just now
Erin felt 'hurt' by manner of invite to Gail Patterson's birthday

By Joseph Dunstan

Erin puts on her glasses as a piece of evidence is brought up on the monitor sitting in front of her in the witness box.

The first message, from Erin to Simon in November 2022, is about working out family schedules around the children.

In Simon's reply, he gives some feedback on that, and then shortly afterwards asks if she's coming to Gail's birthday lunch at the pub with the kids.

In Erin's reply, she said she didn't know anything about the birthday lunch for Gail.

Erin says she "felt hurt" because she felt she'd been left off the invite list.

"But I was also annoyed with myself because I had forgotten that it was a big birthday coming up for Gail, but yeah, I was hurt," she says.

Are they seriously bringing this Birthday kerfuffle up again? It's like she is complaining about it and wanting to look like 'the victim' because someone supposedly forgot to invite her.

 

[Baby baby Jane]

It is REALLY a shame that she feels she needs to discuss her 11 yr old child's gastric health in public---and for what? How is this relevant to the poisonous lunch?

I'm sure she could speak about her lack of faith in hospitals without giving minute details of her little girls bowel issues.

ErinErinErin… your 4 year old is so constipated as to be hospitalized and x-rayed and somehow makes you a very very good and concerned parent and you both suffered trauma? Please tell us the doctor recommended remedy? More fibre?

This is just another parenting experience, Erin, you are just like the rest of us. (Even ovarian mass … scary, but she’s fine)

 

[BreakingNews]

That is my point, though. If Manslaughter is on the table, which her defence need to plan for, because in Victoria it automatically is on the table in Murder cases, then it's transparent why they have decided to take this tactic.

The Hill/Clay case was in Victoria. Greg Lynn was found guilty of 1 count of murder and acquitted of the other. So manslaughter is not automatically on the table in murder charges in Victoria.

 

[katydid23]

I know you're in the USA Katy, where social welfare is very different to here. In Aus, child support and family tax benefit is generally NOT means tested. It is income-based. So yeah, theoretically someone with $5-8m in assets could still get it.

But i think the important point here is that it was *only* 15k a year. It is not a lot of money when you consider the kids school fees were 40k+ a year. Simon was paying those prior. Her math is illogical. I think she threatened the child support and family tax benefit to make him comply, rather than having done the math - because, she was an accountant, she surely knew she wouldn't be eligible for much from Simon, but I think she tried to threaten him which didn't work.. he seemed disengaged and called her bluff (perhaps, finally?) "Go right ahead Erin, you will be worse off if you take that tactic with me..." (is what i imagined him projecting to her).

Yes, I guess I can't compare it to US support benefits. If a family receives a few million inheritance and buys several properties, worth 6 to 8 million, then you are on your own to support your kids. lol

Although you can receive certain tax breaks etc.

 

[Salah11]

I laughed out loud at "slagging off". Very good point. I shouldn't laugh, those poor people, but it is true.

The British in me coming out. I don’t know if Americans use it as well. Sorry

 

[Detechtive]

Mushroom foraging was great fun as a kid. Even from a very young age we were taught what we could and could not eat.
Agree, accused murderers never do well in the witness stand.

I grew up in the country and was told explicitly ad nausea to NEVER touch ANY mushrooms EVER. "You just don't know which ones are poisonous, so NEVER take the risk". Just like we were taught not to EVER eat berries from trees unless our parents gave them to us (eg Mulberries or Blackberries), or not to touch snakes even if they looked harmless, or not to put our fingers under rock surfaces at the beach, because of blue ringed octopus, or not to swim outside the flags due to the risk of rips. Or to be very cautious at Dusk on rural roads due to the kangaroos and deer coming to the side of the road to feed.

Australia is a very deadly country when it comes to our Flora and Fauna and natural environmental dangers. Most of us got the memo without really being conscious of it. It's absolutely crazy to me that anyone would forage for mushrooms, let alone feed them to unsuspecting guests without discussion.

Where my family comes from in Sweden, everyone forages because there's basically nothing harmless over there. But here? No way! Nearly everything here is deadly! lol

 

[Detechtive]

The British in me coming out. I don’t know if Americans use it as well. Sorry

Us Aussies use that term.
You're absolutely right. I hadn't considered that point, and it's fascinating. Only the people she bemoaned ended up sick, except for Simon, who I honestly believe she thought would arrive after her coercive guilt tripping the night prior.

 

[Monstradamus]

IMO, Simon only being required to pay $40 per month to Erin in child support is really unfair, no matter what her financial situation was. Yes, he covered costs for the children's school fees up until the beginning of 2023 (i think), but $20 per month per child is a pittance! It would barely cover snacks for one weekend and It certainly doesn't paint him as a doting, dedicated and supportive father. Not that this is any sort of excuse for the crimes committed against his family, but objectively speaking, its pretty horrible.

I think that he definitely was trying to extract himself from the toxic relationship and i wonder if he had told his parents to put distance between them and her for the sake of the separation and needing to move on... and she didnt (obviously) take it well.

Unfair, regardless of her financial situation? Child Support is worked out on incomes, and her income was about 3 x Simon's income. I don't think it's unfair at all. She's lucky she didn't have to pay him.

 

[Salah11]

Her defence have versed her well. She's going to walk, I'm telling you.

I honestly don’t believe that for a second. Her story is full of holes and if this was a boat I
Would be jumping ship right about now. IMO

 

[Detechtive]

The Hill/Clay case was in Victoria. Greg Lynn was found guilty of 1 count of murder and acquitted of the other. So manslaughter is not automatically on the table in murder charges in Victoria.

It is automatically on the table, unless it is taken off the table. Which happened in the Greg Lynn case, actually.