Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #3

[jjleroche]

Circumstantial evidence can be an extremely strong form of evidence and murderers have definitely been convicted based solely on it.

Maybe she’s confided to a friend how much she hates her in laws and was going to kill them?
There may be google searches on where to forage for DC mushrooms?
There may be google searches of how to best hide them in food or drink? And how long until they take effect?

This isn’t physical evidence but it would be pretty convincing for me if I was a juror.

Who knows?

Moo imo if EP guilty, of course.

IIRC I read in one of the poosts that EP was very fond of her mother-in-law. I can't find the post now, but if anyone can enlighten me, TIA.

If she was indeed very fond of her mother-in-law, particularly since her own mother had passed away, what motive would she have to murder her?

 

[JLZ]

IIRC I read in one of the poosts that EP was very fond of her mother-in-law. I can't find the post now, but if anyone can enlighten me, TIA.

If she was indeed very fond of her mother-in-law, particularly since her own mother had passed away, what motive would she have to murder her?

Inadequate reciprocation. Boundaries. Sense of being abandoned, rage.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I'm totally open to all ideas and look forward to us having some verified facts to go on.

Meantime, one of the very many ideas I could generate is that has anyone considered *if* EP did this, that she did it spontaneously and not as part of a planned and cooked meal?

How about the conversation went south in a way she hadn't expected. Things weren't going in her favour, the people she thought loved her and whom she trusted suddenly seemed to be betraying her, raising issues that criticised her, not just criticisms but slurs on her character and things that would put her future life at risk, questioning her fitness to be a mother etc? Maybe her children had been reporting things about her behind her back to their father?

What if she felt so mad she went out the back door, grabbed the mushrooms she knows very well are poisonous that she can see from her kitchen window maybe and added them fresh into the desert in a fit of rage and temper. Because wiping out your dinner guests to me sounds like one of those 'rage' crimes where someone grabs and gun and shoots everyone. It doesn't not sound like the premeditated considered crime because it has way too many plot holes and illogical aspects.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Inadequate reciprocation. Boundaries. Sense of being abandoned, rage.

Indeed. A sudden sense of being betrayed and abandoned. A 'crash' in mood and a sudden realisation these people were never really there for her and it's all been a phoney front. The rage that could arise from that. But premeditated mushroom murder doesn't really go with that level of rage IMO unless she felt like her life was so incredibly effed nothing mattered anymore.

It would have to be something huge like 'the kids have said they don't want to live with you any longer'.

I had two parents who drove each other into the ground and severely harmed one another. Can't say more but on reflection, can't imagine why my mother didn't poison my father, it would have been a really good idea.

 

[JLZ]

I'm totally open to all ideas and look forward to us having some verified facts to go on.

Meantime, one of the very many ideas I could generate is that has anyone considered *if* EP did this, that she did it spontaneously and not as part of a planned and cooked meal?

How about the conversation went south in a way she hadn't expected. Things weren't going in her favour, the people she thought loved her and whom she trusted suddenly seemed to be betraying her, raising issues that criticised her, not just criticisms but slurs on her character and things that would put her future life at risk, questioning her fitness to be a mother etc? Maybe her children had been reporting things about her behind her back to their father?

What if she felt so mad she went out the back door, grabbed the mushrooms she knows very well are poisonous that she can see from her kitchen window maybe and added them fresh into the desert in a fit of rage and temper. Because wiping out your dinner guests to me sounds like one of those 'rage' crimes where someone grabs and gun and shoots everyone. It doesn't not sound like the premeditated considered crime because it has way too many plot holes and illogical aspects.

I think we discovered that death caps wouldn't have been growing so late in the year.

Mushrooms in dessert? New to me.

 

[jepop]

Does anybody here read anything into the fact (presumably a fact anyway) that SP was invited to lunch but cancelled? Or just a very fortunate coincidence?

Thinking out loud.

Edit - not necessarily saying he’s complicit, but maybe EP warned him not to come?
I’d like to know why he cancelled when it was his family that EP was hosting.

Conflicting reports Imo. Msm reports from unverified, anonymous source/s that SP cancelled "at the last minute". Not posting msm again - but positive that is the way it's been generally reported. I suppose there's a good chance that "at the last minute" is Msm spin on what may have actually been communicated by anonymous source. Moo

OTOH, EP in her statement IIRC says that SP cancelled the day before the lunch. Perhaps some consider that last minute? I don't, but concede others may. Moo

 

[Ellery84]

IIRC I read in one of the poosts that EP was very fond of her mother-in-law. I can't find the post now, but if anyone can enlighten me, TIA.

If she was indeed very fond of her mother-in-law, particularly since her own mother had passed away, what motive would she have to murder her?

Her fondness for Gail is in this article which was published around 4pm today.

Mushroom cook's ex-husband jokes about why he's still alive

The estranged husband of the woman accused of cooking a fatal lunch of beef Wellington with death cup mushrooms has made a joking comment about his wife and the reason he is still alive.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Source Credit: C Sutton
T. D. M.

 

[jepop]

I think we discovered that death caps wouldn't have been growing so late in the year.

Mushrooms in dessert? New to me.

Eeewk, sounds gross but each to their own hey.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I should have qualified by saying deliberate poisoning. But even so, IIRC he was in hospital for about 16 days , self described on fb posts I believe as "intestinal". I think he would have described it as food poisoning if he'd been told that by the hospital and I think the hospital would have been able to identify food poisoning if that was the case. Jmo.

Also as we know, such poisoning isn't so much creating 'intestinal' problems - obviously the body tries to reject a toxin as fast as possible and there'll be vomiting and diarrhea (sp?) at first (if not a deadly anaphalaxis reaction) but then it's down to the organs failing, not pain in the intestines.

 

[Ellery84]

wiping out your dinner guests to me sounds like one of those 'rage' crimes where someone grabs and gun and shoots everyone. It doesn't not sound like the premeditated considered crime because it has way too many plot holes and illogical aspects.

I think if a crime occurred (and I’m not saying that a crime did occur), it may be premeditated…. The reason I think this is because DC mushrooms are in season in Autumn, and we are now in the last weeks of Winter in Australia.

So if they were in fact used, they had to be picked, dehydrated or dried, and stored. Hence, the planning….


IMO, JMO

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I think we discovered that death caps wouldn't have been growing so late in the year.

Mushrooms in dessert? New to me.

Oh yes this is true the time of year is out of whack for spontaneous mushrooms.

Poisonous substances can be finely chopped and added into anything though right?

Obviously it's awaiting verified fact but this woman's own mother was an intellectual, an academic, and expert in children's stories, which are effectively mostly fairy tales and fantasies using narratives based on traditional archetypes. There's very few basic archetypes and there's very few basic 'stories'.

Personally, I don't think someone brought up with that background would be so pedestrian and obvious as to poison her guests with mushrooms in a mushroom based dish (that anyway she ate and so did her kids, maybe). It's a classic case of misdirection IMO. The poison was probably elsewhere in something else. And until there's evidence ... who knows.

 

[JLZ]

Her fondness for Gail is in this article which was published around 4pm today.

Mushroom cook's ex-husband jokes about why he's still alive

The estranged husband of the woman accused of cooking a fatal lunch of beef Wellington with death cup mushrooms has made a joking comment about his wife and the reason he is still alive.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Source Credit: C Sutton
T. D. M.

This is new:
Mr Patterson and Ms Patterson own separate residences in the Gippsland region
Meaning he owns it as a result of a property settlement, although it was previously Erin's, or is this another house he acquired independently?

 

[jepop]

Also as we know, such poisoning isn't so much creating 'intestinal' problems - obviously the body tries to reject a toxin as fast as possible and there'll be vomiting and diarrhea (sp?) at first (if not a deadly anaphalaxis reaction) but then it's down to the organs failing, not pain in the intestines.

Personally Moo sounds like could have been a bad dose of guardia or something like that. Plus SP's fb posts, as reported by Msm IIRC, also referenced a planned intestinal procedure he undertook whilst he was in hospital. That kind of gets pushed to one side - (it's almost like a passing reference in his fb posts reportedly re-produced verbatim by Msm) - in the speculations here regarding the possibility that he was being deliberately poisoned by EP last year. Moo

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

If she had a stash of dried and powdered poisonous mushrooms, that would be a very long term plan.

I had an idea. What if she made five separate individual beef wellingtons (or any type of food with poison in) and only one had poison in it - the one for her husband - but because the guests loved the food so much and SP never turned up, they ate his portion between them?

 

[JLZ]

OTOH, EP in her statement IIRC says that SP cancelled the day before the lunch. Perhaps some consider that last minute? I don't, but concede others may. Moo

I believe what I read was 'prior to the day'. So it might have been the day before, or even earlier.

 

[jepop]

Indeed. A sudden sense of being betrayed and abandoned. A 'crash' in mood and a sudden realisation these people were never really there for her and it's all been a phoney front. The rage that could arise from that. But premeditated mushroom murder doesn't really go with that level of rage IMO unless she felt like her life was so incredibly effed nothing mattered anymore.

It would have to be something huge like 'the kids have said they don't want to live with you any longer'.

I had two parents who drove each other into the ground and severely harmed one another. Can't say more but on reflection, can't imagine why my mother didn't poison my father, it would have been a really good idea.

"Premeditated Mushrom Murder" aka PMM.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

"Premeditated Mushrom Murder" aka PMM.

As opposed to MMM - mindless mushroom murder

 

[jepop]

DBM

 

[Salah11]

I still firmly believe she is guilty and it’s so convenient she made a food where the poison is completely hidden inside a crust. It’s not like she made a Mushroom omelette.


As she pointed out her kids don’t like Mushrooms so why not make it without mushrooms so her children could enjoy it? - I just googled and it’s easily made without them.


MOO

 

[jepop]

I believe what I read was 'prior to the day'. So it might have been the day before, or even earlier.

Confirmed -prior to day as reported by ABC.

Woman who cooked suspected poisoned meal details where she bought mushrooms

The woman who cooked a meal that is believed to have contained poisonous mushrooms and led to the deaths of three people gives a lengthy written statement to police detailing her account of what happened, and revealing she was hospitalised after the incident.

www.abc.net.au