GUILTY Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 *Arrest* #17

[Kemug]

Would there be anywhere legitimate to dispose of a duffle bag (for example). Like an industrial bin that would be emptied?

Or would it be more likely you would hide something that size in the bushland?

It would never be safe in bushland, and the person who hid it would always be worrying about it, maybe even go back to move it. IMO. About a thousand years ago I was a child growing up on a farm (yes, I know I've said that many times before, but bear with me!) There was some bushland on our property, and I knew it all. The places where wildflowers grew, the places where mushrooms grew, where there were rabbit warrens, wombat holes, you name it. I remember once having a picnic by myself in a clearing full of ghosts. The ghosts of my greatgrandfather's generation of farmers, who met there every full moon for bareknuckle boxing. But I digress (yet again!) The point is that people who own some bushland/scrub/barrenish country don't completely ignore it. They know what is there, keep a bit of an eye on it, even have a use for some of it. And would notice anything out of the ordinary sooner or later.

 

[Megnut]

Hey Jake, Sorry to knit pick, I just want to pick up on your comment re EP having a backpack and a duffel bag and thinking she had two packed bags.

I can't find a source for 'duffel bag'. What is reported is a satchel and a backpack. The satchel is her crossbody handbag (which we see in photo images from August 2023). She actually only had a handbag and a backpack or daypack. That to me doesn't sound as though she had packed bags planning for an overnight stay.

'CCTV footage played to the jury shows Erin arriving there with a backpack and satchel bag.'

No Cookies | Townsville Bulletin

No Cookies | Townsville Bulletin

www.townsvillebulletin.com.au

'Erin is wearing a pink jumper, white pants, black sandals with a black handbag and black backpack. She is also wearing a face mask.'

Erin Patterson trial day seven – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

A face mask?

Does she have Stage IV fauxvid?

Asking for a friend.

 

[JBowie]

I was so certain that we would have a verdict by Friday and was utterly surprised this didn't happen. Now that the jury had chosen to be sequestered over the weekend, I also believe they weren't close to finishing up on their deliberations by Saturday, otherwise they might have fast tracked and delivered the verdict then so they could have gone home by the end of the day. They are likely going through everything in great detail and slowly and I also believe it will take time and unlikely to hear back from them until mid week or later.

By order of the judge, the jury is sequestered for the duration of their deliberations, not just the weekends.

 

[al66pine]

"What Happens" to EP's Money & Property, if Convicted?
^@LadyL asked^

I believe any debts are paid first (such as lawyers bills). Then when in prison, corrections controls your money (but its still yours)

https://www.corrections.vic.gov.au/being-in-prison/money

@Eloise
Thanks for your response w link, but personally am interpreting the info there differently from ^ post, saying that Corrections "controls" the money.

From link: "Prisons manage prisoners’ accounts which hold their earnings, savings and deposits from family and friends."
Imo this link applies to the $ a prisoner earns thru work at the prison or $ supplied by friends & fam. for conmmissary purchases, etc.

I doubt that a prison in OZ "contorls" or manages inmates' $ or property, like bank a/c, stocks, mutul funds, or investment brokerage a/c, home property, etc. on "the outside."

But I welcome any poster who can enlighten further w links defintively addressing this.

 

[Kemug]

Harking back to the fingerprints on the dehydrator - did we ever hear specifically where those (Erin's) fingerprints were? On the outside? The inside? In the depths? Did the tip footage show that she was wearing gloves? Or not?

 

[drsleuth]

People everyday turn up to Emergency Departments, not expecting to be admitted or transferred.

Do they all toddle off for 1-2 hrs to pack their bags etc, than just expect to rock on back into ED at their leisure & be seen straight away again. This is NOT how emergency departments work ( the hint is in the name - Emergency ). Yes you will wait, no you won't have your creature comforts etc. Yes it may not be a perfect climate, you may be uncomfortable.....sometimes in life you just have to go with it & cope!

Honestly, the entitlement of alot of people these days is unreal.

I don't care how many bags Erin had or didn't have, if you are told your life is in danger & your kids, you stay, simple as that IMO & not have medical staff wasting their time chassing you & also involving the police......all for a darn ballet bag & some sheep!

 

[LadyL]

I'm not sure, but another case I followed the jury were out for over 2 weeks, they asked no questions & came back with a guilty verdict. I think the trial was about 8 weeks long.

They've only be out a week.

and the days are short

 

[Yh5r]

By order of the judge, the jury is sequestered for the duration of their deliberations, not just the weekends.

Yes, I understand but being sequestered on a Sunday without the ability to deliberate wouldn’t have been appealing. It’s an extra day away from their families and homes for no productive reason. That’s why I think that since they didn’t reach a verdict by Saturday (which would have allowed them to avoid being sequestered on Sunday), it suggests they’re likely not close to an unanimous decision yet.

 

[LadyL]

I just found this..

The longest jury deliberation on record occurred in a 1992 civil case in Long Beach, California, where the jury deliberated for four and a half months before reaching a verdict.

Thank goodness ours are usually more swift. IMO

that's shocking
and their days were probably longer in duration

 

[Eloise]

"What Happens" to EP's Money & Property, if Convicted?
^@LadyL asked^


@Eloise
Thanks for your response w link, but personally am interpreting the info there differently from ^ post, saying that Corrections "controls" the money.

From link: "Prisons manage prisoners’ accounts which hold their earnings, savings and deposits from family and friends."
Imo this link applies to the $ a prisoner earns thru work at the prison or $ supplied by friends & fam. for conmmissary purchases, etc.

I doubt that a prison in OZ "contorls" or manages inmates' $ or property, like bank a/c, stocks, mutul funds, or investment brokerage a/c, home property, etc. on "the outside."

But I welcome any poster who can enlighten further w links defintively addressing this.

They confiscate assets connected to the crime https://www.justice.vic.gov.au/justice-system/fines-and-penalties/asset-confiscation

As for money etc this might provide some insight

Preparing for Prison

If you are facing a prison term, you should be preparing for prison. You can draw on our experience using this guide.

galballyparker.com.au

Arrange a Power of Attorney​

If you have ever moved house, you will have realized how complex relocating is. Well, this is a relocation of your whole life and it is unlikely that you will adequately be able to do this in advance of going into prison. If you need someone to handle your financial interests whilst you are in custody, a power of attorney is a way of allowing someone you trust to handle the practical aspects of your affairs for you. Many people actually appoint two powers of attorney, who must both agree on a course of action before they can make a decision on their behalf. This way their is a safeguard in place. We can prepare a power of attorney for you upon receiving instructions.

Make Arrangements for your Property

If you own your house and your absence will mean that your family will be unable to cover the costs of living there, or you live alone, make arrangements well in advance of your incarceration for the relocation of your family and the rental or sale of the property. This obviously involves finding a place for your family to live, packing and moving. It is better to do this in advance and settle into a routine than to arrange for it to be done after you are incarcerated. If you own pets, arrange for someone to care for them whilst you are away.

afaik she owned her properties outright, so mortgages are no issue to her, and her family are already living elsewhere etc because she's been on remand, not out on bail. Sounds like she just needs to appoint someone to care for her things but they're still hers. Nowhere have I found anything that says your things get taken away from you.

I know people want her to like, suffer or something but we don't really do that in Australia. Even prisoners have rights.

 

[Yh5r]

I'm not sure, but another case I followed the jury were out for over 2 weeks, they asked no questions & came back with a guilty verdict. I think the trial was about 8 weeks long.

They've only be out a week.

I've never followed a case this closely - so does the jury eleborate on their verdict in any way or give reasoning or it's simply "We found the defendant to be guilty/ not guilty" and nothing beyond that?

 

[Kemug]

and the days are short

But getting longer!

 

[Eloise]

I've never followed a case this closely - so does the jury eleborate on their verdict in any way or give reasoning or it's simply "We found the defendant to be guilty/ not guilty" and nothing beyond that?

no. you never find out anything other than their verdict and they can never talk about it

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Re only taking a few things with you.

I have lost count of the number of times I went somewhere that was indoors and realised it was too cold and I hadn't taken a cardigan or jacket with me.

Some of those times I ended up coming down with something after feeling too cold for two long.
Some of those times I was sick for days afterwards.

Just your phone, keys and sunglasses is not enough for everyone, no matter the weather.

Some of us like to be prepared. And EP was carrying stuff for not only herself but her children as well.

Everybody is not the same as everybody else.
Something we might do doesn't mean that everybody has to do the same thing and act the same way.

 

[Jake18]

Hey Jake, Sorry to knit pick, I just want to pick up on your comment re EP having a backpack and a duffel bag and thinking she had two packed bags.

I can't find a source for 'duffel bag'. What is reported is a satchel and a backpack. The satchel is her crossbody handbag (which we see in photo images from August 2023). She actually only had a handbag and a backpack or daypack. That to me doesn't sound as though she had packed bags planning for an overnight stay.

'CCTV footage played to the jury shows Erin arriving there with a backpack and satchel bag.'

No Cookies | Townsville Bulletin

No Cookies | Townsville Bulletin

www.townsvillebulletin.com.au

'Erin is wearing a pink jumper, white pants, black sandals with a black handbag and black backpack. She is also wearing a face mask.'

Erin Patterson trial day seven – as it happened

This blog is now closed

www.theguardian.com

It’s not nitpicking, it’s interesting.

So - assuming she presented with a handbag and a backpack to hospital and the backpack was just something she carried around all the time and not indicative of a few things for a longer stay…

That same backpack, presumably, would have accompanied her to her son’s flying lesson, especially if it contained heavier clothing and it was normal for her to transport a parka in a back pack. The weather wasn’t great so she’d be more likely to want warmer clothes, especially if it was her habit to carry them around.

In that case, why wouldn’t she have put the doggy bag full of her poo soaked tissues into the backpack? Easier to wash it later, if there’s just a parka in the backpack it’s less hassle to take this out rather than having the poo-soaked items touch the contents of a lady’s handbag.

If she had her back pack she wouldn’t have had to put the service station food into a handbag that had contained her explosive diarrhoea tissues as well. And for someone as infection-conscious as Erin - given the face mask- that makes a lot more sense. Although it still doesn’t explain the lack of hand washing

 

[Detechtive]

Do you have a reference for this. It seems very much at odds with the below testimonies:



And this:

Analysis of beef Wellington lunch leftovers probed in mushroom trial — as it happened

The triple murder trial of Erin Patterson continues from the Latrobe Valley Law Courts in Morwell. She's accused of killing three relatives who ate a meal she prepared which contained poisonous mushrooms. Follow the trial live.

www.abc.net.au

Dr Rogers says the leftovers he found contained a "single beef Wellington cut in half".​

Prosecution quizzes Erin Patterson on days after deadly mushroom lunch — as it happened

Erin Patterson gave evidence for a sixth day as her triple murder trial resumed in Morwell. Follow the court proceedings as they happened

www.abc.net.au

I will find the other bit I am referring to - I remember commenting about it in the thread previously.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Now 1pm, I presume they'll be taking their one hour lunch break.

 

[Two SCents]

It’s not nitpicking, it’s interesting.

So - assuming she presented with a handbag and a backpack to hospital and the backpack was just something she carried around all the time and not indicative of a few things for a longer stay…

That same backpack, presumably, would have accompanied her to her son’s flying lesson, especially if it contained heavier clothing and it was normal for her to transport a parka in a back pack. The weather wasn’t great so she’d be more likely to want warmer clothes, especially if it was her habit to carry them around.

In that case, why wouldn’t she have put the doggy bag full of her poo soaked tissues into the backpack? Easier to wash it later, if there’s just a parka in the backpack it’s less hassle to take this out rather than having the poo-soaked items touch the contents of a lady’s handbag.

If she had her back pack she wouldn’t have had to put the service station food into a handbag that had contained her explosive diarrhoea tissues as well. And for someone as infection-conscious as Erin - given the face mask- that makes a lot more sense. Although it still doesn’t explain the lack of hand washing

Why on earth would she put the dog poo bag in her handbag? Where are you getting this from, do you have a source?

Edited to add link.

Are you assuming because the dog poo bag isn't mentioned in the reporting it must have been in her handbag?


'CCTV footage from a Caldermeade BP station, about 70km southeast of Melbourne, was played to the jury, depicting Ms Patterson entering the store shortly after 3.20pm on July 30, 2023.

Wearing a grey long-sleeved top and white pants, with a black handbag slung over her shoulder, Ms Patterson gets out of her red MG car and visits the bathroom for nine seconds.'

https://www.news.com.au/national/victoria/courts-law/erin-patterson-trial-phone-placed-in-vicinity-of-loch-outtrim-after-death-cap-sightings/news-story/6a9bc1f64a75656a29128c1d186cafc7

 

[Detechtive]

Do you have a reference for this. It seems very much at odds with the below testimonies:



And this:

Analysis of beef Wellington lunch leftovers probed in mushroom trial — as it happened

The triple murder trial of Erin Patterson continues from the Latrobe Valley Law Courts in Morwell. She's accused of killing three relatives who ate a meal she prepared which contained poisonous mushrooms. Follow the trial live.

www.abc.net.au

It was from a live update in this thread from the ABC.

1m ago
Erin maintains she fed leftover beef to children

By Joseph Dunstan

Dr Rogers suggests the steak was removed from the leftover beef Wellington before the mushroom and pastry from that item were put into the bin.

Erin says the meat was removed and ultimately put "into my children's stomachs". Ms Patterson has previously told the court she fed her children the meat as leftovers for dinner on Sunday.

"I suggest that you certainly did not feed that steak to your children, but we've been over that anyway, you no doubt disagree with me," Dr Rogers says.

"Correct," Ms Patterson says.​

 

[Snoopster]

no. you never find out anything other than their verdict and they can never talk about it

This is similar to Canada. Jurors aren't allowed to talk about what they heard in court or their deliberations after the verdict. A few years ago there was finally an amendment to at least allow jurors to speak to health professionals about the case.