AZ - Lori Vallow Daybell charged w/ conspiring to kill ex-husband Charles Vallow and another relative, Brandon Boudreaux, Chandler, Maricopa County #3

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Diddian said:
First, it was my understanding that LVD told Detective CY that Charles had taken JJ to the car with his backpack and left his phone inside the kitchen on the counter and that - after CV returned to retrieve his phone and Tylee had come out with bat and Charles had taken it from her - Lori had then urged Tylee to go out to the car with JJ. (That is, Tylee was not the one who originally took JJ to the car according to Lori.)

Timeline of Charles' phone from today's testimony:

CV’s phone arrives at Lori’s house at 7:31 and at 7:37 Charles is texting Lori’s brother Adam (based on Adam's testimony, this was to let him know that Alex is at the house and they together assume that “something is up.”)

Between 7:37 and 7:49, Charles’ phone is “in the area of” the rental house where Lori was living.

(My notes: So 12 minutes for all the following to happen: Charles gets out of his rental car, which he leaves running, knocks at door and comes inside into kitchen area, leaves his phone on counter, gets JJ and his backpack and Lori tells him that he will need to get JJ breakfast and that school gate doesn’t open until around 8:20, loads JJ and his backpack into the rental car, goes back into the home to retrieve his phone, has reported conflict involving Lori keeping his phone away from him, for Tylee to come out of her bedroom with bat, for CV to threaten Tylee with bat and to come after Lori backward swinging the bat, for Alex to grapple with CV and bat and become injured on back of his head, for Alex to go to his bedroom to retrieve his loaded gun – and, what is Charles doing, twiddling his thumbs while Alex goes back to the bedroom to get a gun? -- , for Tylee to go out to the car where she hears the shot, for Lori to join her there and ask that Tylee go inside for Lori’s purse, and for Lori to depart with JJ, and Tylee - and possibly JJ's dog - in the car).

At 7:50 Charles’ cellphone leaves the area of the house (Lori drives away in Charles’ rental car).

At 7:52, Alex calls Lori on her own phone.

At 7:54 Lori is on camera at Burger King drive up window, where she purchases Chicken Fries and a small Sprite for breakfast for JJ (and it looks like chicken nuggets for likely Tylee). Receipt time 7:56 am. Phone travels north from Burger King.

At 8:06 am, Alex calls Lori on her own phone.

At 8:16 am, Lori arrives at Walgreen’s on Cooper Rd.

At 8:17, Lori is seen on surveillance walking into Walgreen’s to purchase two pair of flip-flops (one for herself, one for Tylee). Transaction complete at 8:20 am. Phone heads south.

At 8:33, phone arrives at LIFE academy where JJ goes to school. (8:35 is when 911 call is placed by Alex – that is he waited until LVD was in a place where she can be seen by others, i.e. not at the home where CV was shot).

At 8:49, CV’s phone – traveling south - returns to the neighborhood, “in the area of” the home. Approx 8:48 police body cam video on and Lori’s arrival at scene is seen.

Various times indicating Lori was transported to the Chandler PD Family Advocacy Center (where she was interviewed) and then was transported back to the area of the home – arriving in the “noon hour” (where she, AC, and TR then left in the rental car because the house and Alex’s, Lori’s, and Tylee’s vehicles were all subject to search warrant).

Charles’, Alex’s, and Lori’s phones all in the area of Alex’s house between 1:42 and 2:07 pm. Lori called Det Ynclan’s phone at 2:07 pm.

At 2:18 pm, Lori was already calling Valley of the Sun Mortuary.

Charles’ iPhone returned to the area of the home between 2:43 and 3:11 so Lori could return that device to detectives, as requested.

Conclusion:
At the very least, we know that Alex was done shooting CV for the second time (or maybe I should say we know CV was down and immobilized) by 7:52 when he called Lori on her own phone. Alex called 911 at 8:33. So he waited at least 41 minutes to call 911 after CV had been shot.

Also, AC's call to 911 at 8:33 am coincides with LVD's arrival at JJ's school. To me, this indicates they had agreed - either as part of an original plan or in a plan they made in the calls after Lori left the home - that 911 would not be called until LVD was somewhere that other witnesses would see her, as they believed that would prove that she was NOT at the home when CV was shot.

ETA: Note that the 7:37 to 7:49 timeframe... when talking to Det CY and asked particulars about what was happening when, Lori described this as "all happening in seconds."
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You never cease to amaze me while being a valuable asset to WS and us fellow members.
Your generosity and time spent is greatly appreciated.
 
Wishbone said:
I don't believe a word of the LVD made up story of the entire murder. Starting with the business about taking CV's phone. IMO that never happened until after CV was murdered. I could make up a version of events that would make more sense than the LVD version. I doubt LE believes her story either but there is no way to prove anything else since 4 or the 5 people that were there are now DEAD. All that remains alive is the lying story teller LVD. JMOO
Click to expand...
"Conspiracy to commit murder"

I'm listening to Det. Duncan from a year ago and him reading and going over all the messages between LVD-Chad_Charles and more people starting 2 weeks before CV was killed.
They leave me speechless yet with no doubt if they are entered as evidence in this trial LVD is doomed.

Detective Duncan;s testimony was postponed today due to illness and hopefully he'll be presenting as evidence what is in this video.
Duncan found them in LVD's phone.

 
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Tricia said:
Attention Websleuths Members, I need your help (in more ways the one but this time I just need help with the timeline)
I am confused by the timeline.
Lori claims she, Tylee, and JJ were there when Charles and Alex's confrontation started. Tylee brought out the baseball bat.
Lori claims she told Tylee to take JJ out to the car. Lori followed. She and Tylee were barefoot. While outside, Lori heard a gunshot.
Lori had Charles' phone, and therefore, the state can show where the phone traveled, meaning they can prove where and when Lori traveled with the phone the morning of the murder.
Detective Werner took the stand.
Werther says the device “clearly departed the scene well before the 911 call.” Either the shooting happened much later than we were told, or the device and the person bearing it, Ms. Vallow, left well before the 911 call was made" he says.
Hasn't it already been determined that Alex waited 47 minutes after he shot Charles to call 911? Is the state trying to prove Lori was not there at all when the gunshot went off?
OR is this just the state's way of proving to the jury that Alex waited a long time to call 911
Any help you can provide will be greatly appreciated.
Tricia
PS. Real life job stuff got in the way of my true crime watching time. I hate that when that happens.
Click to expand...
You know we’re here for you, Tricia!

Yes the state is just driving home…

1) LVD left the home after CV was shot and did not call 911 when her husband was shot in self defense by her brother like most of us would do.
2) AC lied when he told 911 it happened moments ago and told LE on scene it was a few minutes ago or whatever it was he said.
3) They also used the cell phone timeline to show that while neither LVD nor AC called 911 they did call each other during that time.

Also showing when and how they learned of the issue with the timeline AC & LVD gave should help the jury understand a bit about why LE didn’t question LVD as a suspect when she was at police station that morning since they didn’t know at that time the timeline they were giving was impossible. But they had to get CVs phone and the receipts to establish LVD’s actions.

Note - LVD didn’t say she heard shot while outside - she said she had gone around the little wall and didn’t see the shot but heard it and then saw CV on the floor and she ran out and got in the car.

Correction to your info - LVD did not tell Tylee to take JJ to the car. CV had already put JJ in the car and went back in to get his cell phone. Then the argument began and Tylee came out with bat etc. LVD told Tylee to go to the car with JJ before the first shot was fired. Tylee was the one who was outside and heard the shot though at first she thought it was someone hitting the bat on the floor.
 
So as time goes on and witnesses are called, Is the jury going to start wondering when Tylee is going to be called to testify since she was there. And then will they have questions as to why she was never called? Because if I'm understanding things correctly they (jury) don't know she and JJ are dead? Or that LVD was convicted of killing them? Please correct me if I'm wrong. TIA
 
Still want to know whose flip flops were by the front door, LVD or Tylee's... and wonder if shoes belonging to one of them were missing from the home (and discarded elsewhere).

We're not going to find out, but that doesn't mean I don't wonder what evidence might have been discarded during that school trip.

It's bonkers that she would even have taken JJ to school at all; almost anyone else would have gotten on the phone to 911... and known not to leave the scene, even if they hadn't been too shaken up to drive! (In other words, she has no clue whatsoever what normal behavior would be. And despite all this time, she still hasn't realized what an outlier she is.)

I mean... I witnessed a shooting myself a few years ago between strangers at a public location, and leaving never crossed my mind. And this was between people she knew, during a conflict she was part of and acknowledges instigating, in her own home. And yet she left instead of immediately calling 911?

Just those facts would have me believing she was guilty of planning his murder! Nevermind the rest of it.

Arizona dropped the ball. If they'd caught on a little sooner, the kids might still be here... though from this moment on, they were a risk due to Tyler knowing too much and JJ being an inconvenience.
 
Izzylizzy said:
Many of you probably heard this audio years ago.
I'm new to LVD and this is the first trial of hers I'm following.

Between what we heard from the tech guy today and how within days they had serious questions about LVD's actions and timeline.
Then within the same few days Adam gives Moffatt everything and more to open a homicide investigation.
IMO:

I have 2 questions I can't find the answers to

1. Did LE ever call LVD & AC back to be interviewed again or where they only interviewed that once?

2. Did Chandler LE sit on whatever info they had about the shooting and only begin to investigate it when TR & JJ were reported missing?
Click to expand...
I don’t think that either AC or LVD were ever interviewed again - or perhaps I should say I’d be surprised that we haven’t heard about it if they were.

I don’t know exactly when LE began to get serious about this investigation. Clearly those at the scene had doubts about the self defense story that same day. The cell phone timeline guy had doubts the next day. And when did they learn of the events in January from Gilbert PD? They didn’t reach out to Adam right away - I remember him saying he was surprised since he knew they would see his was CVs last text but I don’t know why he didn’t call LE upon learning of CV’s death or how long it was before they spoke to him. I listened to part of CV’s brother’s phone interview with police and the officer clearly indicated he thought it was murder but wasn’t sure he could prove it. I don’t know when that call took place either. But if they spoke to either Adam or CV’s brother any time prior to KW’s call for a welfare check on JJ then they had a pretty good idea of the conspiracy before the kids were reported missing. The problem was did they have enough for an arrest? Enough to prove it?

Apparently someone didn’t think so because they didn’t get the Grand Jury indictment until June of 2021 and didn’t act on it at that time because of the Idaho charges and upcoming trials. At some point they did notify Idaho they wanted LVD when her trial was over to face charges regarding both CV & BB in AZ.

When did LE decide to give it to the prosecutor and when did they decide to seek the GJ indictment and what was it that made them think they could get it in June of 2021 that they didn’t know in July or Aug of 2019? And whatever that was, have we seen it yet in this trial?
 
tealrose said:
Still want to know whose flip flops were by the front door, LVD or Tylee's... and wonder if shoes belonging to one of them were missing from the home (and discarded elsewhere).

We're not going to find out, but that doesn't mean I don't wonder what evidence might have been discarded during that school trip.

It's bonkers that she would even have taken JJ to school at all; almost anyone else would have gotten on the phone to 911... and known not to leave the scene, even if they hadn't been too shaken up to drive! (In other words, she has no clue whatsoever what normal behavior would be. And despite all this time, she still hasn't realized what an outlier she is.)

I mean... I witnessed a shooting myself a few years ago between strangers at a public location, and leaving never crossed my mind. And this was between people she knew, during a conflict she was part of and acknowledges instigating, in her own home. And yet she left instead of immediately calling 911?

Just those facts would have me believing she was guilty of planning his murder! Nevermind the rest of it.

Arizona dropped the ball. If they'd caught on a little sooner, the kids might still be here... though from this moment on, they were a risk due to Tyler knowing too much and JJ being an inconvenience.
Click to expand...
BBM:
I'm catching up on LVD and thankfully Rexburg Police Lt. Ray Hermosillo entered the picture in Nov 2021 because everyone from the Chandler PD should hang their heads in shame.
Thankfully Hermosillo had Prosecutor Wood.

I was impressed just listening to Det. Nathan Duncan's testimony from LVD's last trial but he responded to LVD's residence when CV was killed so I gather he also dropped the ball?
imo
 
aafromaa said:
I don’t think that either AC or LVD were ever interviewed again - or perhaps I should say I’d be surprised that we haven’t heard about it if they were.

I don’t know exactly when LE began to get serious about this investigation. Clearly those at the scene had doubts about the self defense story that same day. The cell phone timeline guy had doubts the next day. And when did they learn of the events in January from Gilbert PD? They didn’t reach out to Adam right away - I remember him saying he was surprised since he knew they would see his was CVs last text but I don’t know why he didn’t call LE upon learning of CV’s death or how long it was before they spoke to him. I listened to part of CV’s brother’s phone interview with police and the officer clearly indicated he thought it was murder but wasn’t sure he could prove it. I don’t know when that call took place either. But if they spoke to either Adam or CV’s brother any time prior to KW’s call for a welfare check on JJ then they had a pretty good idea of the conspiracy before the kids were reported missing. The problem was did they have enough for an arrest? Enough to prove it?

Apparently someone didn’t think so because they didn’t get the Grand Jury indictment until June of 2021 and didn’t act on it at that time because of the Idaho charges and upcoming trials. At some point they did notify Idaho they wanted LVD when her trial was over to face charges regarding both CV & BB in AZ.

When did LE decide to give it to the prosecutor and when did they decide to seek the GJ indictment and what was it that made them think they could get it in June of 2021 that they didn’t know in July or Aug of 2019? And whatever that was, have we seen it yet in this trial?
Click to expand...
Thank you, how LVD & AC weren't called back is mindboggeling.
Earlier tonight I posted Adam Cox's phone call with Det Moffat that was recorded a few days after CV was killed and how Moffat or his superiors didn't open a homicide investigation after all AC told them I find highly questionable.
IIRC: Adam had said that the LE never got back to him.

From listening to Rexburg Police Lt. Ray Hermosillo's interview with Nate Eton after LVD's conviction it appears that 2 things happened almost simultaneously.

On Nov 1,2019 Det. Hermosillo began investigating a call that came in about a jeep possibly being related to a homicide,this was the shots fired from a jeep at Brandon B and he recognized the jeep as the one TR drove.

Then at the end of Nov in came the call from Gilbert LE they were asked by JJ's grandmother KW to do a welfare check on him and Gilbert LE contacted Chandler police to do the check.

We know whose name kept popping up..LVDs.

Begins @ 1:40
 
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Gigiky said:
So as time goes on and witnesses are called, Is the jury going to start wondering when Tylee is going to be called to testify since she was there. And then will they have questions as to why she was never called? Because if I'm understanding things correctly they (jury) don't know she and JJ are dead? Or that LVD was convicted of killing them? Please correct me if I'm wrong. TIA
Click to expand...
If I was on the jury, I’d be wondering about Tylee and Alex not testifying too. And even if someone said they were deceased, I’d be wondering about that.
 
TDoc72 said:
If I was on the jury, I’d be wondering about Tylee and Alex not testifying too. And even if someone said they were deceased, I’d be wondering about that.
Click to expand...

LOL, that reminded me of the ending of "1923", when the Indigenous gal was on trial in Oklahoma. Everyone that would have testified in the trial was dead. So the judge let her go.
 
aafromaa said:
I don’t think that either AC or LVD were ever interviewed again - or perhaps I should say I’d be surprised that we haven’t heard about it if they were.

I don’t know exactly when LE began to get serious about this investigation. Clearly those at the scene had doubts about the self defense story that same day. The cell phone timeline guy had doubts the next day. And when did they learn of the events in January from Gilbert PD? They didn’t reach out to Adam right away - I remember him saying he was surprised since he knew they would see his was CVs last text but I don’t know why he didn’t call LE upon learning of CV’s death or how long it was before they spoke to him. I listened to part of CV’s brother’s phone interview with police and the officer clearly indicated he thought it was murder but wasn’t sure he could prove it. I don’t know when that call took place either. But if they spoke to either Adam or CV’s brother any time prior to KW’s call for a welfare check on JJ then they had a pretty good idea of the conspiracy before the kids were reported missing. The problem was did they have enough for an arrest? Enough to prove it?

Apparently someone didn’t think so because they didn’t get the Grand Jury indictment until June of 2021 and didn’t act on it at that time because of the Idaho charges and upcoming trials. At some point they did notify Idaho they wanted LVD when her trial was over to face charges regarding both CV & BB in AZ.

When did LE decide to give it to the prosecutor and when did they decide to seek the GJ indictment and what was it that made them think they could get it in June of 2021 that they didn’t know in July or Aug of 2019? And whatever that was, have we seen it yet in this trial?
Click to expand...
BBM:
In July/Aug 2021 the Chandler gang that couldn't shoot straight was still in charge.
It did take years to get to trial(s) but starting in Nov/Dec 2021 it went from a self-defense case to the murders of 4 people and in June an upcoming attempted murder trail for LVD.
They were also dealing with indictments in 2 states, Idaho and Arizona.


An excellent timeline link.

September 1, 2020: Madison County Prosecuting Attorney Rob Wood filed a motion to combine the cases of Chad and Lori. It was decided in March 2023 that they would have separate cases as Lori did not waive her right to a speedy trial.

September 10, 2020: Lori appeared for her District Court arraignment, and pleaded not guilty to two counts of conspiracy to commit destruction, alteration, or concealment of evidence.

2021​

May 24, 2021: A grand jury indicted Chad and Lori on several new felony charges including first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder.

June 8, 2021: Lori was committed to the Idaho Department of Health and Welfare where a psychologist deemed her not fit for trial.

June 9, 2021: Chad pleaded not guilty to all charges in the indictment. His children attended this meeting.

June 24, 2021: A grand jury in Arizona indicted Lori for conspiracy to commit murder in the death of her fourth husband, Charles Vallow. The Arizona proceedings are on hold while she faces her charges in Idaho.

July 29, 2021: Prosecutors dropped the destruction, alteration, or concealment of evidence charges against Chad and Lori.

August 5, 2021: Prosecutors said they will seek the death penalty against Chad stating, “the nature and magnitude of these crimes warrant the possibility of the highest possible punishment.”

 
Izzylizzy said:
BBM:
In July/Aug 2021 the Chandler gang that couldn't shoot straight was still in charge.
It did take years to get to trial(s) but starting in Nov/Dec 2021 it went from a self-defense case to the murders of 4 people and in June an upcoming attempted murder trail for LVD.
They were also dealing with indictments in 2 states, Idaho and Arizona.


An excellent timeline link.

September 1, 2020: Madison County Prosecuting Attorney Rob Wood filed a motion to combine the cases of Chad and Lori. It was decided in March 2023 that they would have separate cases as Lori did not waive her right to a speedy trial.

September 10, 2020: Lori appeared for her District Court arraignment, and pleaded not guilty to two counts of conspiracy to commit destruction, alteration, or concealment of evidence.

2021​

May 24, 2021: A grand jury indicted Chad and Lori on several new felony charges including first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder.

June 8, 2021: Lori was committed to the Idaho Department of Health and Welfare where a psychologist deemed her not fit for trial.

June 9, 2021: Chad pleaded not guilty to all charges in the indictment. His children attended this meeting.

June 24, 2021: A grand jury in Arizona indicted Lori for conspiracy to commit murder in the death of her fourth husband, Charles Vallow. The Arizona proceedings are on hold while she faces her charges in Idaho.

July 29, 2021: Prosecutors dropped the destruction, alteration, or concealment of evidence charges against Chad and Lori.

August 5, 2021: Prosecutors said they will seek the death penalty against Chad stating, “the nature and magnitude of these crimes warrant the possibility of the highest possible punishment.”

Click to expand...
Rbbm

I had forgotten about that.

She's a headcase case study, for sure.

From unfit for one trial to defending herself at another.

I see more shape shifting.

In her first trial, she studied the lawyers, now she's copying them. I think that's largely how she's managed in life to date. Copying. Morphing.

Chameleon.

JMO
 
Diddian said:
If I'm a juror, having heard what has been presented so far, I am thinking to myself:
  • LVD invites AC to stay the night knowing CV is to visit the next morning to pick JJ up for school,
  • LVD initiates and sustains conflict (grabbing CV's phone and playing keep away from CV with it),
  • the conflict draws LVD's teen daughter into the room where the conflict is occurring,
  • the conflict escalates to the point that first a bat and later a gun is introduced into the conflict,
  • LVD sees that AC has a gun and hears a shot fired by him from that gun,
  • LVD leaves the scene of the shooting in the shooting victim's vehicle (and with his wallet and cellphone) with her 2 children-witnesses,
  • before she knows if anyone is dead and/or seriously injured and in need of emergency medical treatment,
  • before she knows whether the conflict continued in her absence, thus endangering either AC and CV,
  • LVD makes phone call(s) to AC while away in that rental car, and
  • LVD NEVER CALLS 911 for LE and emergency assistance for either Charles or Alex - not when her daughter comes into the room (thus endangering herself), not when her brother comes into the room with a gun (thus potentially seriously escalating the conflict), not when she hears a shot and allegedly goes outside, not when she departs the scene in a vehicle, not at any time when she is driving around or buying breakfast items at Burger King or flip flops at Walgreen's, not when she takes JJ into his school and likely speaks with others, not when she is driving back to the scene.
  • Instead, AC calls 911 at the exact time that LVD arrives at JJ's school where witnesses can attest to LVD being present somewhere other than the room where CV died.


    And I am thinking this situation has multiple indicators of a set up and the only indicators of a self-defense situation are those coming out of the mouth of the defendant in contrast to the indicators of a set up.
Click to expand...
I think you should present the closing arguments:)
 
mickey2942 said:
I have not watched the entire trial, but I haven't heard or seen any evidence linking the shooting of BB by LVD. This seems to be stretched out to me. If anyone should be on trial for conspiracy to kill BB it is is MBP!!!
Click to expand...
LVD wanted one trial for both charges against her ( CV and BB ).

The Judge ruled that there will be a separate trial for the BB charges to follow this current one.


IMG_1825.webp

https://twitter.com/x/status/1911831194549076022
 
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