GUILTY Canada - Marie-France Comeau, 37, & Jessica Lloyd, 27, slain, Ont, 2009 & 2010 - #3

[Wondergirl]

Wondergirl, this is JMO, but I don't think LE was ready to arrest RW that Thursday night, right after the roadside check. First of all, I suppose they had to keep checking all other cars like they have been instructed. That will also rule out that there were no other cars traveling that same route, during the same day (Thursday) and same time (evening/night/wee hours morning/early morning) when Jessica went missing exactly one week before.

Also, as Pinkeyesucks already said, in February it gets dark really early, and they probably wanted to match the tire tracks from RW driveway, against the picture they had of the tire tracks on Jessica's driveway, so better wait till daylight.

Also, I imagine LE wanted all the "i"s dotted and "t"s crossed; add to that the high rank of the suspect.

What makes you think LE was still watching the Jones that weekend? Mr. LJ had already been thoroughly investigated a few months back, and he was no longer a suspect.

The article I was looking for no longer exists, but I recall LJ saying they checked his garage and took some of his things. Here are just a few snippets from another article I found:


Hope this helps,

Answers:

-Hypothetically speaking, if LE was onto RW at the Thursday night roadside check, and let's say, they did have a picture or imprints of the tire track at the roadside check, then they pretty much knew right away that they had a suspect. Really, if the tracks were that rare, they knew.

-Let's assume that RW went through the check relatively early,I believe they started the massive check sometime around 4pm ish. If the alarm bells were going off considering RW's answers to the location of his cottage (Cosy Cove), which just so happened to be right beside LJ's house, his interest in photography (LE knew the perp had been camped out behind JL's home and that the assault vicitms had been photographed), his affiliation with the military (MFC was military, JL's father was military), etc., LE would have probably had enough info to get a search warrant from a judge, and would have wasted no time in doing so, especially if the tire treads were very similar and rare. So, hypothetically speaking, the potential was there on the Thursday night/Friday, for the search warrant. I draw my own conclusion, based on these things, that LE did not excercise the search warrant right away, because they wanted to keep RW under surveilance, in hopes of him leading them to JL. There was a hope, I am sure, that JL was still alive, and a decision must have been made to follow him, rather than search right away.

If you toss these things aside, and presume that LE did NOT have a search warrant right away, that they had to dot their i's and cross their t's, then what spurred the warrant and when was it issued? LE had Cosy Cove under surveilance that Saturday, RW was invited to talk in Ottawa sometime Saturday or Sunday....

-The location of RW's cottage beside LJ's is no small coincidence, because I think that the dogs were called in on at least one of the 2009 assaults, and the trail ended at "LJ's" house. So, it would not be improbable to think that the alarm bells would have been ringing at this also, given the close proximity to a known scent trail.

-The Jones' themselves spotted LE in the woods on the Saturday (as indicated in the articles), so either the Jones' were under suspicion still, or LE was watching RW. If the Jones' spotted LE, RW probably did too. Especially if he was sweating from the roadside check at all. LE watching Cosy Cove would mean RW was still in Tweed on the Saturday. Or they could have been watching his cottage to be sure nobody entered or left.

-I would agree about the "I's" and "t's", given the high rank of the offender. But I feel that LE probably knew early in the week, like the Monday or Tuesday prior to the roadside check, that they were looking for a serial offender, with crimes being connected. IF LE had DNA from any of the 3 previous crime scenes, LE could have been lifting DNA from every person stopped at the roadside. They would have known very quickly if they had the right perp. Rank would not matter at that point. There was alot of public pressure, and generally an awareness that they were dealing with something huge, so I am sure that time was of the essence, most definitely.

I am sure there was great hope that JL was still alive. :-(

 

[Hazel]

Answers:

-Hypothetically speaking, if LE was onto RW at the Thursday night roadside check, and let's say, they did have a picture or imprints of the tire track at the roadside check, then they pretty much knew right away that they had a suspect. Really, if the tracks were that rare, they knew.

-Let's assume that RW went through the check relatively early,I believe they started the massive check sometime around 4pm ish. If the alarm bells were going off considering RW's answers to the location of his cottage (Cosy Cove), which just so happened to be right beside LJ's house, his interest in photography (LE knew the perp had been camped out behind JL's home and that the assault vicitms had been photographed), his affiliation with the military (MFC was military, JL's father was military), etc., LE would have probably had enough info to get a search warrant from a judge, and would have wasted no time in doing so, especially if the tire treads were very similar and rare. So, hypothetically speaking, the potential was there on the Thursday night/Friday, for the search warrant. I draw my own conclusion, based on these things, that LE did not excercise the search warrant right away, because they wanted to keep RW under surveilance, in hopes of him leading them to JL. There was a hope, I am sure, that JL was still alive, and a decision must have been made to follow him, rather than search right away.

If you toss these things aside, and presume that LE did NOT have a search warrant right away, that they had to dot their i's and cross their t's, then what spurred the warrant and when was it issued? LE had Cosy Cove under surveilance that Saturday, RW was invited to talk in Ottawa sometime Saturday or Sunday....

-The location of RW's cottage beside LJ's is no small coincidence, because I think that the dogs were called in on at least one of the 2009 assaults, and the trail ended at "LJ's" house. So, it would not be improbable to think that the alarm bells would have been ringing at this also, given the close proximity to a known scent trail.

-The Jones' themselves spotted LE in the woods on the Saturday (as indicated in the articles), so either the Jones' were under suspicion still, or LE was watching RW. If the Jones' spotted LE, RW probably did too. Especially if he was sweating from the roadside check at all. LE watching Cosy Cove would mean RW was still in Tweed on the Saturday. Or they could have been watching his cottage to be sure nobody entered or left.

-I would agree about the "I's" and "t's", given the high rank of the offender. But I feel that LE probably knew early in the week, like the Monday or Tuesday prior to the roadside check, that they were looking for a serial offender, with crimes being connected. IF LE had DNA from any of the 3 previous crime scenes, LE could have been lifting DNA from every person stopped at the roadside. They would have known very quickly if they had the right perp. Rank would not matter at that point. There was alot of public pressure, and generally an awareness that they were dealing with something huge, so I am sure that time was of the essence, most definitely.

I am sure there was great hope that JL was still alive. :-(

- I really don't know how the LE work, but we don't know if those officers doing the checks had been ordered to make an arrest 'on the spot' if they got a match. Besides, IMO there could have been some explanation like (1) he was not the only one driving that SUV or (2) that he had lend it to someone else the week before, or (3) the SUV had been stolen and just recovered a few days ago, just to name a few.

- I wasn't aware the roadchecks started that early, I was under the impression it started around 7:30 pm. Did they ask him for his address or did they just saw it in his car documents? You think the officers doing the road checks also had ALL the documents regarding the 2 sexual assaults in hand? You think they had time to be making the connection between those 2 sexual assaults that occured in September and November, while they have a long line of cars waiting in the highway to be checked? IMHO, they were just asking simple questions, mostly if they had some information regarding Jessica's disappearance, while another officer looked at the tires discreetly. It is my understanding that it was RW dirty conscience that gave him away, because he was the only person to be stopped that night to ask questions to the officers about tires and tire tracks. IIRC, I also read he was the only one that was nervous and uncomfortable. All other people were happy to cooperate with LE, because the whole town was worried and cared about Jessica.

Just to clarify RW's cottage in Cosy Cove (Tweed) is NOT right beside Jessica's house, which is not even located in Tweed. Mr. Jones is the one who lives right beside RW's cottage, and I believe one of the sexual assault victims also lives relatively close to RW.

His interest in photography? You mean 'birds'? How did LE know that at that point?

LE knew the perp had camped out behind Jessica's? Honestly, this is the first time I read about that. I think you are confusing things. The night Jessica disappeared it was a very cold night. If you want I'll go look at the weather for that day, but I very much doubt RW was out there in a tent freezing his AR$$, lol.

You have some facts that are totally wrong, and other info that I am not privy to. I only go by what I have read in the papers, watched on video clips and/or interviews, and after this long time I'm just relying on memory, because it takes a long time to search old posts and articles, and some articles are already gone. It would have been much easier if you had been here since January.
Oh boy! It is going to take me a very long time to address all that you are saying, LOL ~~ perhaps AG or someone else could come give me a hand ~~ HELP!!! :help:

ETA: By the way, why were you not here in January or February when the news first broke, and it was all over the world in newspapers, TV, magazines? Now is all just about the court appearances.

 

[antiquegirl]

- I really don't know how the LE work, but we don't know if those officers doing the checks had been ordered to make an arrest 'on the spot' if they got a match. Besides, IMO there could have been some explanation like (1) he was not the only one driving that SUV or (2) that he had lend it to someone else the week before, or (3) the SUV had been stolen and just recovered a few days ago, just to name a few.

- I wasn't aware the roadchecks started that early, I was under the impression it started around 7:30 pm. Did they ask him for his address or did they just saw it in his car documents? You think the officers doing the road checks also had ALL the documents regarding the 2 sexual assaults in hand? You think they had time to be making the connection between those 2 sexual assaults that occured in September and November, while they have a long line of cars waiting in the highway to be checked? IMHO, they were just asking simple questions, mostly if they had some information regarding Jessica's disappearance, while another officer looked at the tires discreetly. It is my understanding that it was RW dirty conscience that gave him away, because he was the only person to be stopped that night to ask questions to the officers about tires and tire tracks. IIRC, I also read he was the only one that was nervous and uncomfortable. All other people were happy to cooperate with LE, because the whole town was worried and cared about Jessica.

Just to clarify RW's cottage in Cosy Cove (Tweed) is NOT right beside Jessica's house, which is not even located in Tweed. Mr. Jones is the one who lives right beside RW's cottage, and I believe one of the sexual assault victims also lives relatively close to RW.

His interest in photography? You mean 'birds'? How did LE know that at that point?

LE knew the perp had camped out behind Jessica's? Honestly, this is the first time I read about that. I think you are confusing things. The night Jessica disappeared it was a very cold night. If you want I'll go look at the weather for that day, but I very much doubt RW was out there in a tent freezing his AR$$, lol.

You have some facts that are totally wrong, and other info that I am not privy to. I only go by what I have read in the papers, watched on video clips and/or interviews, and after this long time I'm just relying on memory, because it takes a long time to search old posts and articles, and some articles are already gone. It would have been much easier if you had been here since January.
Oh boy! It is going to take me a very long time to address all that you are saying, LOL ~~ perhaps AG or someone else could come give me a hand ~~ HELP!!! :help:

ETA: By the way, why were you not here in January or February when the news first broke, and it was all over the world in newspapers, TV, magazines? Now is all just about the court appearances.

Sorry, I'm a little busy now and don't have time to research ALL the questions, but I can certainly verify that JL's home was approximately 25 kilometers from RW's cottage on Cosy Cove. It was located on Highway 37, just north of Harmony Rd. near Thrasher's Corners.

One of the assault victims lived right on Cosy Cove Lane and the other was very close by on Charles Rd.

http://www.northumberlandnews.com/news/article/148332

I'm not positive about the timing of the roadblocks, but according to this article,

From 7 p.m. that evening until 6 a.m. Friday, officers stopped every vehicle travelling in either direction and asked questions.

http://www.northumberlandnews.com/news/article/148332

Hazel, ITA about Williams' demeanor that gave him away at the roadside canvass (along with the tire tracks, of course). Several reports claimed he behaved suspiciously and alerted LE with his questions about tire tracks.

Also, a search warrant is difficult to obtain and probably impossible based only on a set of tire tracks. A judge would need a lot more than that. We do know that it took a while to get a warrant for RW's Ottawa home.

As of 3 p.m. Monday, OPP officers were parked outside a home that Williams and his wife own in Ottawa's Westboro neighbourhood, waiting for a search warrant that would allow them to enter.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/ottawa/story/2010/02/08/belleville-jessica-lloyd-dead-missing.html

 

[antiquegirl]

I'm very curious about that too Pink Panther. Are those letters private, as in he seals the envelopes in front of jail person and that's how we know those are written in code? Or does he handle the open letter(s) for jail people to put in envelope(s)? Is he writing in code to more than one person? Is that even allowed? Oh! how I wish we could be able to try decypher those.
Imagine he has more 'secrets' stashed somewhere, and is telling those addressees where more 'trophies' are hidden so they can destroy evidence!!! Or is he blackmailing someone!! My imagination is just running wild! LOL

Where is this coming from? I couldn't see anything referring to codes. Is there a link, please?

 

[flipflop]

Where is this coming from? I couldn't see anything referring to codes. Is there a link, please?

The info regarding the code is in this link, it comes from a "source" so take it as you will. I could feed the media some garbage and be called a source as well, so I don't take anything to serious when it is quoted by "the source".

As well, he has been writing communiqués that appear to be in code, the source said.


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/williams-case-adjourned-for-one-month/article1615776/

 

[flipflop]

-
Just to clarify RW's cottage in Cosy Cove (Tweed) is NOT right beside Jessica's house, which is not even located in Tweed. Mr. Jones is the one who lives right beside RW's cottage, and I believe one of the sexual assault victims also lives relatively close to RW.


Hazel you read it wrong...no one mentioned that JL lived right beside RW's cottage, read the initials, it says LJ (Mr Jones) lives beside RW's cottage. It does get confusing with the initials JL and LJ

 

[Wondergirl]

Closing comments on stories related to Col. Russell Williams

• February 12, 2010 3:20 PM |
• By Kim Fox

Hi everyone,

We've received feedback from the community asking why we closed commenting on stories related to Col. Russell Williams.

The Your Voice team put your questions to our Executive Editor of News, Esther Enkin, and here is her response:

Since we launched our comments section in March 2008, you have embraced our invitation to make this space yours, a place where you can express your opinions on the events of the day and share your views with others.

We now have a community in the hundreds of thousands and, as you've come to feel more at home on our site, often times you ask us why we make the decisions we do. In particular, regarding when commentary is allowed to continue on certain stories or when it is closed.

Most recently, we've heard from you about our decision to first allow commentary, and then close it, on stories related to Col. Russell Williams. Let us explain why we did what we did.

Your Space, Our Site.

While this is a space that belongs to you, we manage it. And while we want to foster discussion among Canadians, every topic may not be appropriate for this website.

For our community members this means that if we determine that a conversation isn't appropriate for our site, that topic will be closed to commentary.

As the public broadcaster we are held to high standards. We take great care to curate our content on radio and television and these values extend to our content and community online, and drive the decisions we make every day.

We never make the decision to shut down commentary lightly. Our moderators and editorial staff talk regularly and we think long and hard about balancing free expression -- and reflecting the mood and tone of the community - while maintaining civility, taste and just plain good manners.

Why did we arrive at this particular decision?

In this case, there were two distinct reasons.

One is that the story of Col. Williams continues to develop and is now part of an ongoing police investigation.

By allowing comments on crime or justice stories we run a risk of allowing something to be published that might break the law or cause serious harm to people involved in the story.

Our other concern was the tone and civility of the discussion.

Categorical condemnations and pronouncements of guilt, as well as sometimes vicious sentiments expressed by some members of our online community went beyond the bounds of good taste and the guidelines we've established for conduct on our site.

When comments are made that are rude, threatening or offensive they can upset both your fellow community members and those personally affected by the story.

We are committed to fostering a vibrant online community where we can all exchange our viewpoints- but in doing so we must maintain an environment of mutual respect.

This conversation is ongoing. We want to be transparent in our decision-making and we are learning every day. Our approach to community moderation is evolving and decisions are informed by the context in which comments are made and the lessons we have learned so far.

We are listening to you and we will keep revisiting our decisions.

We look forward to hearing your thoughts, please comment below.

Esther Enkin
Executive Editor, News

http://www.cbc.ca/news/yourcommunit...-stories-related-to-col-russell-williams.html

 

[Wondergirl]

Where is this coming from? I couldn't see anything referring to codes. Is there a link, please?

There has been other unusual conduct from Williams since his arrest in early February.

He has been writing in a diary in what appears to be code. The writings are seen by staff who search his cell. The code appears between sentences he writes about the mundane affairs of daily life in a jail.

The suicide message he left noted that his affairs were now in order and that his feelings were too much to bear.

When Williams first arrived at the cramped Napanee facility, he behaved as if he were a prisoner of war, refusing to provide anything except name, rank and serial number.

Despite the extreme precautions that have been taken, authorities remain concerned that Williams, who is extremely intelligent and resourceful, will find other means to try to end his life.

http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2010/04/05/13474776-qmi.html

 

[flipflop]

Hazel, ITA about Williams' demeanor that gave him away at the roadside canvass (along with the tire tracks, of course). Several reports claimed he behaved suspiciously and alerted LE with his questions about tire tracks.

everytime I read about his ?'s about tires during the check, I think about RW being kept up to date on the investigation from LE (I can't find the link that stated that, but remember reading that RW received updates and was kept well informed of the investigations, I wonder up until what point this happened)

Also, a search warrant is difficult to obtain and probably impossible based only on a set of tire tracks. A judge would need a lot more than that. We do know that it took a while to get a warrant for RW's Ottawa home.

and the lead investigator would not go on tire tracks when it is up against the highest ranking military personal, with RW's position, LE would have known he wasn't a flight risk and that they could take their time to dot all i's and cross all t's before making the biggest arrest in history.

 

[Wondergirl]

- I really don't know how the LE work, but we don't know if those officers doing the checks had been ordered to make an arrest 'on the spot' if they got a match. Besides, IMO there could have been some explanation like (1) he was not the only one driving that SUV or (2) that he had lend it to someone else the week before, or (3) the SUV had been stolen and just recovered a few days ago, just to name a few.

- I wasn't aware the roadchecks started that early, I was under the impression it started around 7:30 pm. Did they ask him for his address or did they just saw it in his car documents? You think the officers doing the road checks also had ALL the documents regarding the 2 sexual assaults in hand? You think they had time to be making the connection between those 2 sexual assaults that occured in September and November, while they have a long line of cars waiting in the highway to be checked? IMHO, they were just asking simple questions, mostly if they had some information regarding Jessica's disappearance, while another officer looked at the tires discreetly. It is my understanding that it was RW dirty conscience that gave him away, because he was the only person to be stopped that night to ask questions to the officers about tires and tire tracks. IIRC, I also read he was the only one that was nervous and uncomfortable. All other people were happy to cooperate with LE, because the whole town was worried and cared about Jessica.

Just to clarify RW's cottage in Cosy Cove (Tweed) is NOT right beside Jessica's house, which is not even located in Tweed. Mr. Jones is the one who lives right beside RW's cottage, and I believe one of the sexual assault victims also lives relatively close to RW.

His interest in photography? You mean 'birds'? How did LE know that at that point?

LE knew the perp had camped out behind Jessica's? Honestly, this is the first time I read about that. I think you are confusing things. The night Jessica disappeared it was a very cold night. If you want I'll go look at the weather for that day, but I very much doubt RW was out there in a tent freezing his AR$$, lol.

You have some facts that are totally wrong, and other info that I am not privy to. I only go by what I have read in the papers, watched on video clips and/or interviews, and after this long time I'm just relying on memory, because it takes a long time to search old posts and articles, and some articles are already gone. It would have been much easier if you had been here since January.
Oh boy! It is going to take me a very long time to address all that you are saying, LOL ~~ perhaps AG or someone else could come give me a hand ~~ HELP!!! :help:

ETA: By the way, why were you not here in January or February when the news first broke, and it was all over the world in newspapers, TV, magazines? Now is all just about the court appearances.

I will address a few things here, Hazel, hope it clears things up. I don't really have time to pull links for all that I have said, but I don't take back anything, everything is true as I understand it from reading. I believe everything I stated has been mentioned as fact in the news articles.

I simply wonder about things regarding the timeline, I am sorry if bringing them up here in this forum is untimely or inappropriate.

I think LE was very, very, well versed in exactly the things they were looking for, in their roadside check that night. I think it's safe to say that RW answered some of the questions in a questionable manner, and the flags were raised.

LE was working with a psychological, emotional, physical and geographical profile of the perpetrator of the heinous acts already committed, and the one they were closing in on.

You end up at Websleuths when you end up here, sorry it took me so long! I have many questions about the whole case, but am not sure if I should ask them now, not entirely sure what the request for help is for?! lol

ETA: I don't remember it being reported that RW questioned LE about tire tracks.

 

[Wondergirl]

I should also add, that as far as your question about the photographs, Hazel, it was reported that RW answered he took photos of his cat, when asked what he photographed, at the roadside check.

I don't think there are any facts that I have totally wrong, not sure why it's a big deal to be discussing the timeline now? The story is only just beginning, in my opinion, as I feel there will be other closures of cold cases relating to RW.

 

[Pink Panther]

Closing comments on stories related to Col. Russell Williams

• February 12, 2010 3:20 PM |
• By Kim Fox

Hi everyone,

We've received feedback from the community asking why we closed commenting on stories related to Col. Russell Williams.

The Your Voice team put your questions to our Executive Editor of News, Esther Enkin, and here is her response:

Since we launched our comments section in March 2008, you have embraced our invitation to make this space yours, a place where you can express your opinions on the events of the day and share your views with others.

We now have a community in the hundreds of thousands and, as you've come to feel more at home on our site, often times you ask us why we make the decisions we do. In particular, regarding when commentary is allowed to continue on certain stories or when it is closed.

Most recently, we've heard from you about our decision to first allow commentary, and then close it, on stories related to Col. Russell Williams. Let us explain why we did what we did.

Your Space, Our Site.

While this is a space that belongs to you, we manage it. And while we want to foster discussion among Canadians, every topic may not be appropriate for this website.

For our community members this means that if we determine that a conversation isn't appropriate for our site, that topic will be closed to commentary.

As the public broadcaster we are held to high standards. We take great care to curate our content on radio and television and these values extend to our content and community online, and drive the decisions we make every day.

We never make the decision to shut down commentary lightly. Our moderators and editorial staff talk regularly and we think long and hard about balancing free expression -- and reflecting the mood and tone of the community - while maintaining civility, taste and just plain good manners.

Why did we arrive at this particular decision?

In this case, there were two distinct reasons.

One is that the story of Col. Williams continues to develop and is now part of an ongoing police investigation.

By allowing comments on crime or justice stories we run a risk of allowing something to be published that might break the law or cause serious harm to people involved in the story.

Our other concern was the tone and civility of the discussion.

Categorical condemnations and pronouncements of guilt, as well as sometimes vicious sentiments expressed by some members of our online community went beyond the bounds of good taste and the guidelines we've established for conduct on our site.

When comments are made that are rude, threatening or offensive they can upset both your fellow community members and those personally affected by the story.

We are committed to fostering a vibrant online community where we can all exchange our viewpoints- but in doing so we must maintain an environment of mutual respect.

This conversation is ongoing. We want to be transparent in our decision-making and we are learning every day. Our approach to community moderation is evolving and decisions are informed by the context in which comments are made and the lessons we have learned so far.

We are listening to you and we will keep revisiting our decisions.

We look forward to hearing your thoughts, please comment below.

Esther Enkin
Executive Editor, News

http://www.cbc.ca/news/yourcommunit...-stories-related-to-col-russell-williams.html

I would think that if they are choosing to cover a high profile case that provokes strong responses that they should be willing to assign an individual to moderate comments accordingly. What a lame response. They want to cover the case but not allow comments or discussions about it because they can't moderate them??? Geez. Bloggers have figured out how to do it and they can't??? So some people are rude and leave inappropriate comments...No one is allowed to comment? Maybe they should just stop covering cases that cause controversy altogether. There. Problem solved. (Their response is a bit like being "half pregnant" to me.)

MOO

 

[Hazel]

-
Just to clarify RW's cottage in Cosy Cove (Tweed) is NOT right beside Jessica's house, which is not even located in Tweed. Mr. Jones is the one who lives right beside RW's cottage, and I believe one of the sexual assault victims also lives relatively close to RW.


Hazel you read it wrong...no one mentioned that JL lived right beside RW's cottage, read the initials, it says LJ (Mr Jones) lives beside RW's cottage. It does get confusing with the initials JL and LJ

Yes, you are right Flip, I read it wrong!!! I didn't actually confuse JL with LJ, but didn't see the "L" in

LJ's house, so my brain only registered J's and automatically assumed it meant Jessica's house.

Sorry about that guys :truce:

Thank you AG and Flipflop for all the other help

 

[Hazel]

I will address a few things here, Hazel, hope it clears things up. I don't really have time to pull links for all that I have said, but I don't take back anything, everything is true as I understand it from reading. I believe everything I stated has been mentioned as fact in the news articles.

I simply wonder about things regarding the timeline, I am sorry if bringing them up here in this forum is untimely or inappropriate.

I think LE was very, very, well versed in exactly the things they were looking for, in their roadside check that night. I think it's safe to say that RW answered some of the questions in a questionable manner, and the flags were raised.

LE was working with a psychological, emotional, physical and geographical profile of the perpetrator of the heinous acts already committed, and the one they were closing in on.

You end up at Websleuths when you end up here, sorry it took me so long! I have many questions about the whole case, but am not sure if I should ask them now, not entirely sure what the request for help is for?! lol

ETA: I don't remember it being reported that RW questioned LE about tire tracks.

It's OK to ask questions, and we are all here willing to answer and help. I was overwhelmed at the amount of questions and issues you raised simultaneously, questions and details that we have analyzed, commented and dissected earlier, but we did that, one by one, and it took a lot of time and team effort to extract bits and pieces from different sources. As you know, there is no one place you can go and get all the information like in a book, or Wikipedia.

Also keep in mind that LE doesn't put out much information, specially information of evidentiary nature. There is a lot more information that we are not, and may never be made aware of, so we try to make sense with what is official, and what is reported, and we discuss and speculate, but try not to decide or come to a definite conclusion, and everything is Just Our Own Opinion.

Regarding your ETA, even though I read that months ago, I DO remember reading that. Will try go look for an article for you. As I said before, many articles are now gone. By the way, we always do pull links to back up what we say. That is one of the TOS here in WS. We already did that back then, while all the discussion was taking place, everything we posted was substantiated.

ETA: Found it!
Please keep in mind that what is written in that article is not to be taken 'as an official statement" It very clearly says 'anonymous source'.

Behaviour put cops on track
'Unusual interest' in Jessica Lloyd probe led police to investigate Col. Williams
In its investigation of the then still-missing Jessica Lloyd, the OPP pulled over scores of motorists in its roadblock on Hwy. 37 across from her house, but what was it that initially made police at the scene suspicious of Col. Russell Williams in particular, leading to further investigation and his arrest on murder charges?

The OPP is not saying publicly.

However, a law enforcement source with knowledge of the matter, and speaking on condition of anonymity, says Williams, whose vehicle was one of the earlier ones stopped as he was on his way from CFB Trenton to his home in Tweed, "showed the kind of unusual interest that others (motorists) didn't. Body language, facial expressions, questions asked -- police are trained in this kind of psychology. They look for tell-tale signs that could be the tip of the iceberg. It's a start."

It's not inconceivable, though, that more than one vehicle could have had tires with treads identical to those at the Lloyd house; it does not necessarily point to criminal culpability. There would have to be more than that to raise suspicions.

"That's true." And what would it have been? He hesitates for a second. He answers this way: "You have to understand that the police didn't tell the drivers they pulled over anything about tire treads.

"They didn't tell the public they were looking for matching treads. They only asked the drivers if they saw anything unusual. Don't forget, at the time she was just missing, they didn't know she'd been murdered.

"A lot of drivers wouldn't have known about her because they probably weren't from around there. Hwy. 37 is used to get from 7 down to the 401 and the reverse. So, like I say, there was no reason for a driver pulled over, even one who knew she was missing, to be curious about tire tracks.

"But when a driver comes out of the blue and asks the police if they checked into tire tracks, did they have anything -- why the hell would you ask that?

"And if you started asking other probing questions about what was going on, and there's something about your demeanour that seems strange, or nervous, well, like I say, you're not going to let it go. Especially if the tire tracks match your vehicle's. You report to your superior officer, and it goes from there. Obviously everything after that fell into place."

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2010/02/13/12864936-sun.html

 

[antiquegirl]

I should also add, that as far as your question about the photographs, Hazel, it was reported that RW answered he took photos of his cat, when asked what he photographed, at the roadside check.

I don't think there are any facts that I have totally wrong, not sure why it's a big deal to be discussing the timeline now? The story is only just beginning, in my opinion, as I feel there will be other closures of cold cases relating to RW.

I have read every article regarding this case several times and don't recall it being reported anywhere that RW was asked about photography at the roadside check. Although we've covered this ground before, here is the only mention of it I could find. The discussion took place between RW and LJ.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...s+cats&cd=13&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca&client=opera

I find it very hard to believe that LE questioned anyone about photography during the canvass on Hwy. 39. The above was printed only after RW was arrested and charged. This is why WS dictates that we back up our statements with links. If we don't, claims like this feed the rumour mill and lead unknowing members down the wrong path.

 

[antiquegirl]

(Respectfully snipped)

Answers:

-Let's assume that RW went through the check relatively early,I believe they started the massive check sometime around 4pm ish.

As I previously linked, the roadchecks were reported to have been between 7:00 p.m. Thursday and 6:00 a.m. Friday. Obviously, RW became a suspect during his interview, but if LE had been certain he was the perp, they wouldn't have continued with the canvass.

and If the alarm bells were going off considering RW's answers to the location of his cottage (Cosy Cove), which just so happened to be right beside LJ's house, his interest in photography

(BBM)

As previously noted, LE did not know about RW's interest in photography at this point and were unlikely to have asked him until his interview on Sunday.

(LE knew the perp had been camped out behind JL's home and that the assault vicitms had been photographed),

(BBM)

As has been pointed out, we have never heard this before. A link is needed to prove that the perp had "camped out behind JL's home".

his affiliation with the military (MFC was military, JL's father was military), etc.,

I doubt that JL's late father's military history was being connected to her case at that time. If anything, it would be MFC's military background that would raise red flags. Even that is tenuous because we don't know if the lower level LE doing the spot checks were even made aware of any connection between MFC and the missing JL. At that time, I believe they were only trying to find whomever was responsible for her disappearance. They didn't even know she was deceased yet.

If you toss these things aside, and presume that LE did NOT have a search warrant right away, that they had to dot their i's and cross their t's, then what spurred the warrant and when was it issued?

We don't know when the warrant was issued for the Tweed cottage, but IMO it was after LE's interview in Ottawa on Sunday, February 7th. By that afternoon, LE was searching that house. I believe that either RW confessed during that interview, or at the very least, raised enough suspicion (besides the tire tracks) to give a judge enough cause to issue the warrant. MOO

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...orensic&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca&client=opera

-The Jones' themselves spotted LE in the woods on the Saturday (as indicated in the articles), so either the Jones' were under suspicion still, or LE was watching RW. If the Jones' spotted LE, RW probably did too. Especially if he was sweating from the roadside check at all. LE watching Cosy Cove would mean RW was still in Tweed on the Saturday. Or they could have been watching his cottage to be sure nobody entered or left.

I don't recall it ever being reported whether RW drove to Ottawa on the Friday night or the following day.

IF LE had DNA from any of the 3 previous crime scenes, LE could have been lifting DNA from every person stopped at the roadside. They would have known very quickly if they had the right perp.

(BBM)

I believe that LE did have DNA samples from at least two of the previous crimes (MFC and one sexual assault victim or both). But, seriously? "DNA from every person stopped at the roadside"? Illegal, unprecedented, and highly improbable. Even if every person stopped voluntarily agreed to give a sample, there was not nearly enough time to process and match those samples by the week-end. These things take weeks and sometimes months.

Wondergirl, it would be very helpful if you took the time to do your own research and provide links to your claims, as per WS TOS, sparing some of us the time to address issues that we had already covered months ago. TIA

 

[antiquegirl]

The info regarding the code is in this link, it comes from a "source" so take it as you will. I could feed the media some garbage and be called a source as well, so I don't take anything to serious when it is quoted by "the source".

As well, he has been writing communiqués that appear to be in code, the source said.


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/williams-case-adjourned-for-one-month/article1615776/

Thanks, flip. I had heard this before, but I couldn't find the reference here on WS. I wonder if any OPP personnel are trying to decipher his code.

From the link you provided, I was interested in this bit, as I don't recall seeing it before:

"then taken to Col. Williams’s lakeside cottage in Tweed"

Does anyone else remember hearing this before about JL? I somehow trust TA's stories more than others, since he is the one writing the book about this case. I imagine he is doing extensive research and may have inside sources other reporters do not.

If LE found even the tiniest trace of DNA from JL in RW's cottage, he's toast!

JMO

 

[Macright]

The info regarding the code is in this link, it comes from a "source" so take it as you will. I could feed the media some garbage and be called a source as well, so I don't take anything to serious when it is quoted by "the source".

As well, he has been writing communiqués that appear to be in code, the source said.


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/williams-case-adjourned-for-one-month/article1615776/

this is the first time I have read that Marie France was beaten and choked to death.. that you for that link to G&M article

 

[flipflop]

Thanks, flip. I had heard this before, but I couldn't find the reference here on WS. I wonder if any OPP personnel are trying to decipher his code.

From the link you provided, I was interested in this bit, as I don't recall seeing it before:

"then taken to Col. Williams’s lakeside cottage in Tweed"

Does anyone else remember hearing this before about JL? I somehow trust TA's stories more than others, since he is the one writing the book about this case. I imagine he is doing extensive research and may have inside sources other reporters do not.

If LE found even the tiniest trace of DNA from JL in RW's cottage, he's toast!

JMO

This is the first I have heard of RW taking JL to his cottage. You are so right AG about TA's info. I trust him well above the rest.

 

[Sillybilly]

The info regarding the code is in this link, it comes from a "source" so take it as you will. I could feed the media some garbage and be called a source as well, so I don't take anything to serious when it is quoted by "the source".

As well, he has been writing communiqués that appear to be in code, the source said.


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/williams-case-adjourned-for-one-month/article1615776/

I recall shortly after his arrest that he was writing in a diary in code, but this refers to "communiques", which to me means letters/correspondence. Anyone know if prisoners who haven't yet gone to trial are allowed uncensored mail? I am concerned if he is communicating with anyone in code (possibly through letters given to his lawyer?). Seems we can add cryptology to his acquired skills. Wonder what he is hiding.