Canada - USA Trade War commencing March 2025 #3

[Lyanna]

That's quite a stretch for Trump. He can't impose a tariff on a product (crude oil) that isn't imported to the US.

His followers are dumb enough to think he can, though.

I know. Not quite sure I'm reading it right

 

[Kudzuu]

That's quite a stretch for Trump. He can't impose a tariff on a product (crude oil) that isn't imported to the US.

His followers are dumb enough to think he can, though.

He resorts to old behaviors. Slap a tariff on it! He actually believes a tariff is a tax on the other country! Fake news!

IMO Trump is not able to fulfill his duties. When asked about the latest horrific breach where the Atlantic journalist actually revealed he was in the chat on signal then did not disclose sensitive information his response was the familiar "I don't know anything about it.". Then he attacks the very media outlet that protected classified information. Think about that.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

DBM

 

[Herat]

That's quite a stretch for Trump. He can't impose a tariff on a product (crude oil) that isn't imported to the US.

His followers are dumb enough to think he can, though.

Most of his Executive Orders aren't valid. They aren't worth the paper they're printed on.

https://www.axios.com/2025/03/23/trump-courts-injunctions

I can't read through the entire thing, as it is so utterly pompous and imperial in it's tone. The use of "me" in the first line makes it seem like a parody piece from The Onion. However, I suspect it is real.

The only two paragraphs I could get through are the essence of the bit:

"Sec. 2. Imposition of Tariffs. (a) On or after April 2, 2025, a tariff of 25 percent may be imposed on all goods imported into the United States from any country that imports Venezuelan oil, whether directly from Venezuela or indirectly through third parties. Duties imposed by this order will be supplemental to duties on imports already imposed pursuant to IEEPA, section 232 of the Trade Expansion of 1962, section 301 of the Trade Act of 1974, or any other authority.

(b) The Secretary of State, in consultation with the Secretary of the Treasury, the Secretary of Commerce, the Secretary of Homeland Security, and the United States Trade Representative, is hereby authorized to determine in his discretion whether the tariff of 25 percent will be imposed on goods from any country that imports Venezuelan oil, directly or indirectly, on or after April 2, 2025."

So, if any country, like say Peru, decided to import Venezuelan oil because they are almost next door to Venezuela, ALL of Peru's imports into the US would have a 25% tariff on them, if he cadre of the 4 Secretaries, apparently headed by Mark Rubio, would determine this was necessary. So all those great blueberries and lovely asparagus in my Trader Joe's would now cost 25% more, but I don't really know who gets the money that I, personally, have to pay. Does TJ's have to now submit monies to DJT Trade Enterprizes? Does the shipper have to pay ? Who keeps track of all this BS if Musk has fired everyone who knows how to use a computer.

I really think Secretary Rubio has enough to do, trying to wraggle swords with Greenland, and make nasty comments about Canada, and hover over the Panama Canal to please his master. And it seems like Rubio is sent to Saudi Arabia to talk about Ukraine or Gaza, or oil every weeek. Oh, and don't forget he has to do all these chats and war emojis with the Trump BFF gang on Signal. I don't understand why Rubio is involved other than Trump realizes he can further punish and humiliate him for daring to be disloyal while campaigning against Trump.

Edited to add:

Further research about the EO shows that China is specifically the target of this tome, as the long rambling piece specifically includes Hong Kong and Macau. Other countries with significant Venezuelan oil imports are Spain and India. The US does import a lot from India, including a large amount of pharmaceuticals, of which there are already shortages for hospitals. Not a great idea to be further restricting imports of necessary pharmaceuticals such as operating room medications and antibiotics.

Every action has an opposite and equal reaction. One of the true LAWS, Newton's Third Law of Motion.

 

[Yellowbelly]

I can't read through the entire thing, as it is so utterly pompous and imperial in it's tone. The use of "me" in the first line makes it seem like a parody piece from The Onion. However, I suspect it is real.

The only two paragraphs I could get through are the essence of the bit:

"Sec. 2. Imposition of Tariffs. (a) On or after April 2, 2025, a tariff of 25 percent may be imposed on all goods imported into the United States from any country that imports Venezuelan oil, whether directly from Venezuela or indirectly through third parties. Duties imposed by this order will be supplemental to duties on imports already imposed pursuant to IEEPA, section 232 of the Trade Expansion of 1962, section 301 of the Trade Act of 1974, or any other authority.

(b) The Secretary of State, in consultation with the Secretary of the Treasury, the Secretary of Commerce, the Secretary of Homeland Security, and the United States Trade Representative, is hereby authorized to determine in his discretion whether the tariff of 25 percent will be imposed on goods from any country that imports Venezuelan oil, directly or indirectly, on or after April 2, 2025."

So, if any country, like say Peru, decided to import Venezuelan oil because they are almost next door to Venezuela, ALL of Peru's imports into the US would have a 25% tariff on them, if he cadre of the 4 Secretaries, apparently headed by Mark Rubio, would determine this was necessary. So all those great blueberries and lovely asparagus in my Trader Joe's would now cost 25% more, but I don't really know who gets the money that I, personally, have to pay. Does TJ's have to now submit monies to DJT Trade Enterprizes? Does the shipper have to pay ? Who keeps track of all this BS if Musk has fired everyone who knows how to use a computer.

I really think Secretary Rubio has enough to do, trying to wraggle swords with Greenland, and make nasty comments about Canada, and hover over the Panama Canal to please his master. And it seems like Rubio is sent to Saudi Arabia to talk about Ukraine or Gaza, or oil every weeek. Oh, and don't forget he has to do all these chats and war emojis with the Trump BFF gang on Signal. I don't understand why Rubio is involved other than Trump realizes he can further punish and humiliate him for daring to be disloyal while campaigning against Trump.

Edited to add:

Further research about the EO shows that China is specifically the target of this tome, as the long rambling piece specifically includes Hong Kong and Macau. Other countries with significant Venezuelan oil imports are Spain and India. The US does import a lot from India, including a large amount of pharmaceuticals, of which there are already shortages for hospitals. Not a great idea to be further restricting imports of necessary pharmaceuticals such as operating room medications and antibiotics.

Every action has an opposite and equal reaction. One of the true LAWS, Newton's Third Law of Motion.

Can he specifically impose import tariffs on Spain? Spain is in the EU Customs Union, so wouldn't he have to impose the tariff on the whole of the EU?

 

[Herat]

Can he specifically impose import tariffs on Spain? Spain is in the EU Customs Union, so wouldn't he have to impose the tariff on the whole of the EU?

That's how I would read it. So, maybe Rubio et al give Spain a pass on the addiional oil tariff?

There is a lot of non-logic in this edict.

 

[otto]

Every night on MSNBC Rachell Maddow shows protests all over the US. Some are against DOGE/Musk, Tariffs, Veterans Administration and social security messes, privatizing the Post Office, Ukraine, Tesla, etc etc. It’s interesting to me as a senior citizen that the vast majority of demonstrators seem to be seniors. The same at town halls. It will be interesting to see what is going to happen when the government turns on these protesters. It didn’t stop the Vietnam War protests (also my generation), so I have a feeling it won’t stop the old folks now.

What that tells us is that people who've been around for a while see what's happening and are deeply concerned. People between 20-50 need to wake up and see what is happening to them.

The Netherlands has just issued travel warnings for the US too - specifically for LHBTI people

Nederland scherpt reisadvies naar de VS aan voor lhbti'ers

Het ministerie schrijft dat de wetten en gebruiken in de VS met betrekking tot lhbti'ers kunnen afwijken van die in Nederland.

nos.nl

and a previous article says the Dutch already booked 20% less trips to the US in january 2025 (compared to january 2024)

Europese landen scherpen reisadvies VS aan, minder Nederlanders op vakantie

Toeristen die naar de Verenigde Staten reizen stuiten steeds vaker op buitengewoon strenge grenscontroles, soms zelfs met detentie tot gevolg.

nos.nl

"The figures for February are not there yet, but we expect that in that month far fewer people booked a trip to the US."

Radstake cites the high dollar exchange rate as a possible explanation, but doesn't think that's the whole story. "We don't ask people why they don't book to the U.S., but in a general sense, travelers don't like uncertainty. If it's uncertain whether you will get into the country, that doesn't help sell a trip."

That uncertainty is not unjustified. In recent weeks, for example, some German tourists were detained at the U.S. border.

Tariffs increase cost of living. Now loss of tourism from Canada, the EU, and possibly many other countries, reduces revenue. Trump appears to want to be a dictator who dominates allies, but that goal is driving the USA into recession and economic turmoil.

I don't think anyone wants to vacation, work, or study in a country where they could be detained at any moment for being who they are, or for doing something that is legal according to the constitution. It's not worth the risk when there are so many alternatives.

I do think that this will change the tone towards people from the USA who travel to other countries, so it might be best that they travel within the USA until the situation improves. Not everyone voted for Trump's government this time, but the fact that he was elected twice speaks volumes about USA population values.

• The Travel & Tourism market is expected to generate a revenue of US$223.64bn in the United States by 2025.

Travel & Tourism - United States | Statista Market Forecast

United States: The Travel & Tourism market is expected to generate a revenue of US$233.93bn in the United States by 2025. Definition: The Travel & Tourism market encompasses a diverse range of accommodation services catering to the needs and preferences of travelers.

www.statista.com

 

[musicaljoke]

CANADA: Mark Carney's Liberal Party has a 59% chance of winning the election, compared to 41% for the Conservative Party according to prediction market..

Are those numbers right??? that is one hell of a gap......

Welcome to 338Canada

338canada.com

I'm not sure if that will work out into actual votes. The Liberal Party is missing representatives in many regions, so although the people might wish to vote for the Liberal Party, there might not be a name on the ballot for a Liberal candidate.

 

[musicaljoke]

Hey fellow Canadians on here I have a question I'm a resident of bc but will be in Manitoba all of April how can I vote ? Lol I've never had this issue before

You need to get on the voter's list. You'll need to update your address to your Manitoba address, or apply to vote by mail.

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[otto]

I'm not sure if that will work out into actual votes. The Liberal Party is missing representatives in many regions, so although the people might wish to vote for the Liberal Party, there might not be a name on the ballot for a Liberal candidate.

I checked my voting district last night and no one is running in that district at this time. Elections Canada and political parties have had lots of time to prepare, so perhaps names have not yet been formally added to the website.

"As of today, there are no candidates who have been officially confirmed in your electoral district."

Voter Information Service - Find your electoral district

 

[Herat]

What that tells us is that people who've been around for a while see what's happening and are deeply concerned. People between 20-50 need to wake up and see what is happening to them.

Tariffs increase cost of living. Now loss of tourism from Canada, the EU, and possibly many other countries, reduces revenue. Trump appears to want to be a dictator who dominates allies, but that goal is driving the USA into recession and economic turmoil.

I don't think anyone wants to vacation, work, or study in a country where they could be detained at any moment for being who they are, or for doing something that is legal according to the constitution. It's not worth the risk when there are so many alternatives.

I do think that this will change the tone towards people from the USA who travel to other countries, so it might be best that they travel within the USA until the situation improves. Not everyone voted for Trump's government this time, but the fact that he was elected twice speaks volumes about USA population values.

• The Travel & Tourism market is expected to generate a revenue of US$223.64bn in the United States by 2025.

Travel & Tourism - United States | Statista Market Forecast

United States: The Travel & Tourism market is expected to generate a revenue of US$233.93bn in the United States by 2025. Definition: The Travel & Tourism market encompasses a diverse range of accommodation services catering to the needs and preferences of travelers.

www.statista.com

As a US citizen who has a trip planned to an EU country later this year, I am having second thoughts for a number of reasons. I had also thought to add a week-long cruise at the end as the rates were cheaper in winter, but decided against it. Best I keep that money.

Not only concern for anti-US sentiments, but also concerned the $USD will drop against the Euro.

I have been reading on Trip Advisor that a number of EU or UK travelers are changing plans to visit the US this year because of the severe and irrational penalties and seizures being applied to arriving foreign EU and UK travelers upon arrival at US airports and land borders.

It is still very unclear as to why the German fellow was kept in a US holding cell for more than a week and deported to Germany at his own cost.

 

[otto]

USA tourism is starting to feel the financial impact of a war against Canada. The fact that some people from the USA don't understand that reducing travel is one way of speaking-out is hard to believe. Reading between the lines, it sounds like USA people expect Canadians to vacation in a country where they can be arrested and detained for weeks without cause, and where they are perceived as nasty, unfair, thieves, free-loaders, cheaters and generally rotten people.

"Fram said bookings appear to be slowing and they've seen an increase in negative comments on their promoted social media posts.

"We picked up on our ads with U.S. landmarks drawing a lot of negative responses from Canadians and then Americans pushing back and retaliating on that, so what we did was eliminate those ads facing Canadian audiences," Fram said.

He said some Americans in those comments didn't understand Canadians withholding their dollars was a way to have their voices heard."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/u-s-road-trip-destinations-seeing-signs-of-canadians-staying-away-1.7490169

 

[detective.moon]

As a US citizen who has a trip planned to an EU country later this year, I am having second thoughts for a number of reasons. I had also thought to add a week-long cruise at the end as the rates were cheaper in winter, but decided against it. Best I keep that money.

Not only concern for anti-US sentiments, but also concerned the $USD will drop against the Euro.

I have been reading on Trip Advisor that a number of EU or UK travelers are changing plans to visit the US this year because of the severe and irrational penalties and seizures being applied to arriving foreign EU and UK travelers.

as for anti-US sentiments, i honestly think things should be fine in the EU! at least where i live (amsterdam, the netherlands) i would think maybe someone will ask you what you think about trump when they hear you’re american, but other then that people won’t really mind.

i’m often perplexed by american politics, but it doesn’t reflect the americans i’ve actually met here! it seems like it’s maybe more common for liberal or maybe centrist americans to travel/study/work here than it is for a typical MAGA supporter.

and different european universities are actually starting programs to attract researchers from the US

Instellingen willen Nederlandse wetenschappers uit VS terughalen

"De vrijheid van wetenschap staat onder druk in de VS", zegt de Nederlandse Organisatie voor Wetenschappelijk Onderzoek.

nos.nl

 

[otto]

As a US citizen who has a trip planned to an EU country later this year, I am having second thoughts for a number of reasons. I had also thought to add a week-long cruise at the end as the rates were cheaper in winter, but decided against it. Best I keep that money.

Not only concern for anti-US sentiments, but also concerned the $USD will drop against the Euro.

I have been reading on Trip Advisor that a number of EU or UK travelers are changing plans to visit the US this year because of the severe and irrational penalties and seizures being applied to arriving foreign EU and UK travelers.

It's always an option to do what USA tourists did in the 1970s - put a Canadian flag patch/sticker on their backpacks and clothing ... and maybe throw in the occasional "eh"!

 

[otto]

as for anti-US sentiments, i honestly think things should be fine in the EU! at least where i live (amsterdam, the netherlands) i would think maybe someone will ask you what you think about trump when they hear you’re american, but other then that people won’t really mind.

i’m often perplexed by american politics, but it doesn’t reflect the americans i’ve actually met here! it seems like it’s maybe more common for liberal or maybe centrist americans to travel/study/work here than it is for a typical MAGA supporter.

and different european universities are actually starting programs to attract researchers from the US

Instellingen willen Nederlandse wetenschappers uit VS terughalen

"De vrijheid van wetenschap staat onder druk in de VS", zegt de Nederlandse Organisatie voor Wetenschappelijk Onderzoek.

nos.nl

That's interesting! Not only is the EU inviting EU scientists to return to the EU, but inviting USA scientists to move to the EU to ensure scientific independence and freedoms. I don't think that has happened since WW2, and at that time the invitation was in the other direction.

same link ...
"According to the FD, more scientific institutions are working on this. For example, research institute Nias in Amsterdam has opened the so-called Safe Haven Fellowship to scientists from the US. This is a fund that normally allows scientists from conflict areas such as Gaza and Ukraine to continue their work in the Netherlands for a year. The Eindhoven University of Technology is also considering recruiting people in the US.

In other European countries, institutions are also looking to attract scientists from America. For example, a university in Marseille, France, launched a "Safe Space for Science" program this month . "In a context where some scientists in the U.S. feel threatened or obstructed, we welcome scientists to continue their work," Aix-Marseille University said."

Instellingen willen Nederlandse wetenschappers uit VS terughalen

"De vrijheid van wetenschap staat onder druk in de VS", zegt de Nederlandse Organisatie voor Wetenschappelijk Onderzoek.

nos.nl

 

[otto]

The USA government is again using propaganda, claiming that Greenland extended a formal invitation to the USA national security advisor, the wife of the VP, and the fracking expert energy minister. The USA government wants to convince USA people that Greenland wants USA control so, in the event that military force is used, it will be portrayed as necessary for the small minority (troublemakers) that disagree with their own Greenland government decisions.

"Frederiksen expressed her criticism in an interview with the Danish public broadcaster , partly in response to a controversial visit by an American delegation to Greenland.

Yesterday, Greenland Prime Minister Egede also condemned the American visit planned for this week. "We can no longer call this an innocent visit," he said. "Its only purpose is a show of force."

Greenland insists that the visit was not discussed, and that no one was invited. Trump had previously stated that there was an invitation, without explicitly saying who it came from.
...

President Trump's national security adviser Michael Waltz is visiting a U.S. base in Greenland this week. Usha Vance, the wife of Vice President JD Vance, is also going to Greenland. She is said to want to attend a sled dog race and learn more about the local culture. Energy Minister Chris Wright, a former top executive of a fracking company, is also reportedly part of the delegation.

Frederiksen says in the interview that the visit "is clearly not about what Greenland wants or needs. President Trump means it. He wants Greenland." According to her, the delegation's visit cannot be seen in isolation from this."

Danish PM condemns 'unacceptable pressure' from US on Greenland

 

[Kudzuu]

I don't think this will end well. I question sending the wife of the VP instead of the VP. One thing I've observed about VP is he likes to change the narrative which he will probably do if his wife isn't welcomed with open arms.

Why don't we hear from Usha Vance herself? Why would she want to go to Greenland under these circumstances? Something is fishy.
MOO

EBM

 

[LovesPeace2]

You need to get on the voter's list. You'll need to update your address to your Manitoba address, or apply to vote by mail.

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Eugh will have to do mail in . I'm just going to watch my grands for a month

 

[otto]

Canada is pivoting to new security sources and priorities, and there appears to be a strong future for opportunity within the Canadian military. For example, completing an engineering degree specializing in shipbuilding, with a future military job, looks attractive.

"Liberal Leader Mark Carney says the leak by top U.S. national security officials of plans for military strikes in Yemen — and the shifting security priorities of the Trump administration — mean "we have to look out for ourselves." "My responsibility is to plan for the worst, is to think about the most difficult evolution of the new threat environment, what it means for Canada and how do we best protect Canada," Carney said during a campaign stop in Halifax on Tuesday.
...

"What's important is how people react to those mistakes and how they tie them up," he added. "They don't deny the mistakes, but they are clear and transparent and [are] progressing them."
...

"The priorities of the United States, once closely aligned to our own, have shifted. Our sovereignty is under threat … President Trump wants to break us so America can own us," he added.
...

"We will have more defence announcements with the platform, before the platform comes out," Carney said. "So we will lay all of that out as well. We will cost our broader ... electoral platform so you can see ... how we're balancing the budget.""

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/carney-intelligence-yemen-strike-1.7492736

 

[LovesPeace2]

The USA government is again using propaganda, claiming that Greenland extended a formal invitation to the USA national security advisor, the wife of the VP, and the fracking expert energy minister. The USA government wants to convince USA people that Greenland wants USA control so, in the event that military force is used, it will be portrayed as necessary for the small minority (troublemakers) that disagree with their own Greenland government decisions.

"Frederiksen expressed her criticism in an interview with the Danish public broadcaster , partly in response to a controversial visit by an American delegation to Greenland.

Yesterday, Greenland Prime Minister Egede also condemned the American visit planned for this week. "We can no longer call this an innocent visit," he said. "Its only purpose is a show of force."

Greenland insists that the visit was not discussed, and that no one was invited. Trump had previously stated that there was an invitation, without explicitly saying who it came from.
...

President Trump's national security adviser Michael Waltz is visiting a U.S. base in Greenland this week. Usha Vance, the wife of Vice President JD Vance, is also going to Greenland. She is said to want to attend a sled dog race and learn more about the local culture. Energy Minister Chris Wright, a former top executive of a fracking company, is also reportedly part of the delegation.

Frederiksen says in the interview that the visit "is clearly not about what Greenland wants or needs. President Trump means it. He wants Greenland." According to her, the delegation's visit cannot be seen in isolation from this."

Danish PM condemns 'unacceptable pressure' from US on Greenland

How long will Americans allow trump to act like this. How long will other countries allow this to go on before snapping back. It's really disgusting how they are acting now . I'm waiting to see how long before war starts between the tariffs the bullying of other countries people are getting fed up jmvho