CASO records

[missy1974]

I have definitely seen the signs of LE pitting the Avery's against each other, even before they used those tactics with Brendan (telling him that SA was already making statements against him) to get the confession. Another thing I found interesting was that on 11/05 LE informed Bobby that they had heard that Stephen said that Bobby saw TH after SA did (pg 91), but there is a problem here because Jodi didn't make that statement until 11/06 (pg. 113)

I noticed that, but Jodi said that SA told her that in a phone call on Friday evening, so what it tells me is that they were listening to his calls to her as early as the Friday night, she was in jail, so they were all recorded. When LE talked to Bobby it was 17:53, the day they found the RAV4. This is Dedering's report, and he's from Calumet County, so when did he listen to the calls, or was he just given that info randomly and then just happened to come across Bobby at the scene when he was trying to get his dog? He does say Jacobs, a MTSO officer was with him during this interview, so maybe he had the info?

Also... if they were listening to his calls..... wouldn't they also know who was going where and when? He would have told Jodi he was going to the lake, what time he was planning on going, who had already left to go there, etc.

I am not sure what to think if they were actually listening to his calls that early on in the investigation.... not if they were trying to say that he was not a suspect as of the Friday.

jmo

 

[dexter75]

I know what to think...

I noticed that, but Jodi said that SA told her that in a phone call on Friday evening, so what it tells me is that they were listening to his calls to her as early as the Friday night, she was in jail, so they were all recorded. When LE talked to Bobby it was 17:53, the day they found the RAV4. This is Dedering's report, and he's from Calumet County, so when did he listen to the calls, or was he just given that info randomly and then just happened to come across Bobby at the scene when he was trying to get his dog? He does say Jacobs, a MTSO officer was with him during this interview, so maybe he had the info?

Also... if they were listening to his calls..... wouldn't they also know who was going where and when? He would have told Jodi he was going to the lake, what time he was planning on going, who had already left to go there, etc.

I am not sure what to think if they were actually listening to his calls that early on in the investigation.... not if they were trying to say that he was not a suspect as of the Friday.

jmo

 

[dexter75]

Agreed,

a fire " whoosh " / flames igniting heard from 4 miles away???

And HE didn't testify why??

http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/CASO-Investigative-Report.pdf#page=289

here is the report for the guy that heard a "whoosh" and smelled something "vile" and his cows knocked over fences.

First, I find it really hard to believe that if it was at Avery's, that he could hear that from that far away.... AND that the buildings surrounding the fire pit were still standing, not to mention the propane tank JMO

Second, the smell... this is the first time we have read that anyone smelled anything!!! If it was coming from Avery's, how come no one on that property smelled it? what about their neighbours? If someone 4-5 miles away could smell it, surely the neighbours must have been chocked out?

Third, why didn't this guy testify? Because it was the the 1st of November? because it didn't fit the prosecutions timeline? Did they look at area's around this guys farm for any signs of a burn site? I have always thought she was burned elsewhere and not on the property (regardless of who is guilty) Are there any quarries near this guy? I big fire started in a pile of rocks isn't going to blow up buildings if there isn't any buildings around.

__________________________________________________________________
​

Reports relevant to the key:
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/CASO-Investigative-Report.pdf#page=230
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/CASO-Investigative-Report.pdf#page=288

We still don't have an answer to when the RAV4 was open. I knew they had a copy made, it's in the evidence list, what is missing from the evidence list is the key they found in the trailer, or at least, I can't find it lol The RAV4 got to the crime lab at 1-2am, it was open when the photographer got there "mid-morning". I'm still reading, but there is no indication of when and where the key was made, and who opened the RAV4 drivers door.

___________________________________________________________________​

RH and SB - I still have a lot to read, but there seems to be things missing so far. Like why was he on the CASO logs at the crime scene? Who was he with? Where are those reports? Anyone come across those yet?

BC - I have some questions about his day. He said he slept during the day, but sent a text to TH at 12:45 and got no response, he got a voicemail at 2pm, got up and did some things and went back to bed. He showed the officers that he had missed calls later in the day, I guess that's a good alibi? Missed calls.... during the time she would have been missing? Again, I'm not done reading so maybe there is more somewhere else in the document. You can read that report here: http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/CASO-Investigative-Report.pdf#page=44

 

[missy1974]

http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/CASO-Investigative-Report.pdf#page=420

Upon arrival, we were invited into the residence. I asked KAREN if she had any other deceased
children. KAREN stated other than TERESA, she does not have any other deceased children.
KAREN also told us that her mother, DOROTHY SAKORSKI (ph) is still alive; however, she is
in poor health. KAREN also stated she does not have any nieces that are deceased and she only
has one aunt who would be deceased who is buried in Schofield, WI

Why would Wiegert be asking about female relatives?
I have no idea when exactly this report is from because it is dated 2/18/05 <<<<< 9 months previous to TH going missing ( I would assume it is supposed to be 06 LOL)

 

[Sunkist]

http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/CASO-Investigative-Report.pdf#page=420

Upon arrival, we were invited into the residence. I asked KAREN if she had any other deceased
children. KAREN stated other than TERESA, she does not have any other deceased children.
KAREN also told us that her mother, DOROTHY SAKORSKI (ph) is still alive; however, she is
in poor health. KAREN also stated she does not have any nieces that are deceased and she only
has one aunt who would be deceased who is buried in Schofield, WI

Why would Wiegert be asking about female relatives?
I have no idea when exactly this report is from because it is dated 2/18/05 <<<<< 9 months previous to TH going missing ( I would assume it is supposed to be 06 LOL)

Right now I'm reading pages 392-394, interview of CP, someone who was in jail with SA after Teresa's death. CP states that SA said someone might have gotten Teresa's grandmother's bones & sprinkled them around the pit.

The DNA wasn't actually matched to Teresa, was it, just a female relative (or something like that) of Teresa's mother.

So my guess is they are trying to make sure no female relatives of Mrs. Halbach had recently passed away. Checking all leads, I guess.

 

[missy1974]

Right now I'm reading pages 392-394, interview of CP, someone who was in jail with SA after Teresa's death. CP states that SA said someone might have gotten Teresa's grandmother's bones & sprinkled them around the pit.

The DNA wasn't actually matched to Teresa, was it, just a female relative (or something like that) of Teresa's mother.

So my guess is they are trying to make sure no female relatives of Mrs. Halbach had recently passed away. Checking all leads, I guess.

Thanks Sunkist, I just read that now. And the timing (assuming that Wiegert meant 2006 LOL) would make sense

It's interesting that he seems to make some comments that implicate SA, but then he goes on to say how SA tells him how MTSO framed him, etc. The comments that SA makes about the bones and how far gone they were could easily be information he received from his lawyers but I could see how it could be taken differently. Then the comment about the plates being found in 2 different vehicles when they weren't.

I really wish these documents were in chronological order, it's ridiculously hard to follow!

 

[zerbert]

So my guess is they are trying to make sure no female relatives of Mrs. Halbach had recently passed away. Checking all leads, I guess.

I'm glad to see that they're taking it seriously, honestly.

 

[Sunkist]

I'm glad to see that they're taking it seriously, honestly.

Yes, me too. There have been several times I've felt they were following up, making sure no loopholes were there.

Even with the "found" key. The write up seemed much more detailed than most of the others. Almost like they knew it might seem suspicious and were trying to compensate.

There are several interviews that seemed to be the result of improbable tips, but they were doing their job & following up- just in case.

Then there are other areas where I wonder why they weren't so thorough- the ex-boyfriend/friend; documenting the bones. Of course I'm not through the whole thing yet.

 

[missy1974]

Yes, me too. There have been several times I've felt they were following up, making sure no loopholes were there.

Even with the "found" key. The write up seemed much more detailed than most of the others. Almost like they knew it might seem suspicious and were trying to compensate.

There are several interviews that seemed to be the result of improbable tips, but they were doing their job & following up- just in case.

Then there are other areas where I wonder why they weren't so thorough- the ex-boyfriend/friend; documenting the bones. Of course I'm not through the whole thing yet.

BBM ~ which actually makes it look suspicious IMO LOL He goes into detail about putting on new gloves before handling the key and putting it into the evidence bag.... then writes this:

I called the command post and informed them that we had found this key. Special Agent TOM
FASSBENDER and CALUMET CO. SHERIFF'S DEPT. Inv. MARK WIEGERT came to the
residence to look at the key. With my gloved hand, I took the key out of the evidence bag and
retaining physical control of it, I showed it to them.

Did he open and dial his phone with his nose? did he change gloves before handling the key again? Did he hold his hands in the air until they got there, making sure not to touch anything... well, wait, he just touched his phone, where was his phone? had he had it out before while in the trailer? did it pop out of his pocket and land on SA's bed while he was relaxing and sitting writing his notes? The detailed notes could be because it was dictated at a much later date when they did know that it was suspicious ;-) Honestly, the most suspicious part about that key is the fact that there was no DNA of TH's on it. IMO

Asking KH about relatives that have passed.... did they do any follow up? did they find out where the Aunt was buried, check it out?

I definitely don't see a thorough follow-up/interviews of the friends/ex-bf's. I have yet to see reports with anyone saying they were with her the previous weekend, no friends saw her on Saturday night? hung out? Ok, there was internet guy that insists he talked to her the night before ... did they do any follow up on that? Did they check her computer?

Oh... talking about the computer, they did take a mirror image of it, so I hope this is something that KZ can get and check it out. (I would actually be more interested in any activity from the 31st-3rd)

ugggh, I have so many questions LOL There is so much information in these reports and I know there are people "elsewhere" working on timelines, it would be nice if someone put it in order LOL

ETA: I'm not asking you specifically these questions Sunkist They are just the questions I am left with after reading some of this stuff *sigh*

 

[Limaes]

A letter written by JS' daughter to her grandparents. Thank goodness the little girl got her wish. She got to grow up feeling safe knowing the evil monster was locked up for good. This case is so sad for many reasons.

SA never aimed up at other men...only women and little girls [emoji35]

 

[Limaes]

Is this why MaM were so one-sided against LE? Were they just miffed that LE didn't want a bar of their film? Neither Teresa's family or friends wanted anything to do with it. Explains why they were cast in such a negative light.

I believe the report regarding Laura (whats-her-name-again?) Starts on page 974.

 

[Limaes]

So far, I'm with you here Missy.

When LE was watching Jodi & SA, ( across the street ) when was this, I wonder?

LE was there because JS called them because SA was choking and beating her and continued to do so because he was angry she called the cops. He dragged her out to the car hoping to getaway before the cops got there because he knew he would be arrested.

 

[Limaes]

I have definitely seen the signs of LE pitting the Avery's against each other, even before they used those tactics with Brendan (telling him that SA was already making statements against him) to get the confession. Another thing I found interesting was that on 11/05 LE informed Bobby that they had heard that Stephen said that Bobby saw TH after SA did (pg 91), but there is a problem here because Jodi didn't make that statement until 11/06 (pg. 113)

They heard it through a 3rd person first and then spoke to BoD and JS. Nothing untoward happening there.

 

[Jaiddie]

LE was there because JS called them because SA was choking and beating her and continued to do so because he was angry she called the cops. He dragged her out to the car hoping to getaway before the cops got there because he knew he would be arrested.

Soooo, Jodi called them and they just sat across the street watching and waiting until Steven dragged her to his car and took off? Then they followed and pulled him over? That doesn't make any sense. IMO, they waited to pull them over in the car, because they did not want him to know he was being watched.

 

[Jaiddie]

Is this why MaM were so one-sided against LE? Were they just miffed that LE didn't want a bar of their film? Neither Teresa's family or friends wanted anything to do with it. Explains why they were cast in such a negative light.

I believe the report regarding Laura (whats-her-name-again?) Starts on page 974.

It was more than just LE not wanting to be a part of their film...Kratz was also trying to get the filming stopped by taking what film had already been filmed. That's what the Subpoena was all about. Unfortunately for him, at this point, he did not know that one of them was actually a lawyer as well, and would fight it.

 

[Limaes]

Soooo, Jodi called them and they just sat across the street watching and waiting until Steven dragged her to his car and took off? Then they followed and pulled him over? That doesn't make any sense. IMO, they waited to pull them over in the car, because they did not want him to know he was being watched.

They were not just "across the street". Not sure where you're getting your info, but it is all in the reports.

JS was being choked and badly beaten and feared for her life to the point she called police for help but yet the story is twisted so badly that, once again, SA is the victim in it? That is what really makes no sense!

Sent from my SM-N910G using Tapatalk

 

[Limaes]

It was more than just LE not wanting to be a part of their film...Kratz was also trying to get the filming stopped by taking what film had already been filmed. That's what the Subpoena was all about. Unfortunately for him, at this point, he did not know that one of them was actually a lawyer as well, and would fight it.

They wanted it for evidentiary value. Nothing sinister in that. This was a vicious murder, which is why the subpeona was granted. Her resistance to helping seek justice says a lot about the integrity behind MaM.

 

[missy1974]

the subpeona...
http://www.indiewire.com/article/wh...-filmmakers-behind-making-a-murderer-20160108

"Ken Kratz was alleging in [the subpoena that we were] acting as an investigative arm of the defense," explained Ricciardi. "So we brought the motion to quash the subpoena, refuting Mr. Kratz’s accusations as baseless."

Ultimately, Judge Willis, who presided over the Halbach murder case, agreed with the filmmakers' claim that the subpoena was baseless and quashed it, ensuring that the filmmakers enjoyed the same protection as other journalists.

I'm sure there are some legal documents floating around here somewhere, too tired to find them at the moment

ETA: well dang, I just googled 'motion to quash Ricciardi' and it popped right up haha
http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...d-Order-Granting-Motion-to-Quash-Subpoena.pdf

 

[BigCityAccountant]

The guy 4-5 miles away doesn't seem that important to me... There's no way to know it was coming from Avery's and if the boom was so loud it was heard that far away, why did no one on the property mention it or anyone else much closer!? And I don't know... There's lots of weird smells out in the country... To smell it 4-5 miles away and say it came from the direction of Avery's just sounds like someone who doesn't like the Averys.

Hi Ya'll!! Family emergency over the last several days. Just catching up! It would appear to me that it was no secret the Avery family wasn't well liked and as such I 'm sure they stuck together as a clan. That being said, no one in the beginning mentioned the fire on Monday either. Seems to me, it was a slip-up later on. However, Radant (sp) an external sources notes that he was at his camp at 4:30 pm and saw the fire. Thus, they Avery clan couldn't keep that a secret anymore.

 

[missy1974]

Hi Ya'll!! Family emergency over the last several days. Just catching up! It would appear to me that it was no secret the Avery family wasn't well liked and as such I 'm sure they stuck together as a clan. That being said, no one in the beginning mentioned the fire on Monday either. Seems to me, it was a slip-up later on. However, Radant (sp) an external sources notes that he was at his camp at 4:30 pm and saw the fire. Thus, they Avery clan couldn't keep that a secret anymore.

Hey BCA, hope all is ok, I was going to send out a search party if I didn't see you tonight LOL

Thing is.... this fire thing, there is so many different stories and versions and times, it's crazy. I wish I had more time, I would try to track them all with the new info (and I'm hoping someone else will because I have read other summaries, but now with new info, I would like to see it all together... I wonder if this is what Zellner's team has been doing too? LOL) Randant says he saw the fire at 4:30, but Earl and Fabian didn't see it... the boys didn't either at that time, even ST said it was later that night. Smelly guy, said he 'heard' and 'smelled' it on the 1st.

I still think.... those bones were moved there, and it's regardless of who is guilty, whether it be SA or someone trying to frame him. There is just so much wrong with that burn pit and lack of documentation. If smelly guy did hear and smell it on the 1st, I would have been looking for a burn site closer to his property, even if you think SA was guilty, would it be that 'out there' that he took her off the property to burn her? I do think that if the prosecution conceded that they could have been moved there, they open up the 'reasonable doubt', so that just couldn't happen.

Anyway.... good to have you back I've been busy the last few days as well, so I haven't even gone back to look at phone records and try to make some sense of it all *sigh*