FL - Madeline Soto, 13, Missing Child Alert, 13500 blk Town Loop Blvd, Orlando, 26 Feb 2024 *arrest* #14

[tlcya]

Well rounded up ....thanks for that and yes I believe you are correct...I didn't even think of the roommates ...You are right they would have heard an argument..... I still think JS has acted weird since for someone who has just had her girl murdered and found out about the years of abuse... She just seems indifferent to it and I dont understand her lying about the morning saying 'We' this and 'we' that seems so peculiar but I guess everyone is different how they handle things

we are all in agreement with the BBM portion of your post. JS is off, her behaviors are off, most of us would like to see her charged with gross neglect of her child. But I don't think she killed her daughter. That lays squarely at the feet of SS. His mother's "dream" was her trying to push a narrative that her baby boy did not kill Madeline because she blames JS for her son's abhorrent behaviors.

 

[Pruddennce]

Yes! I found it odd that SS' father was so in the face of LE in the beginning, IMO trying to get ahead of the narrative. I had the sense he was somehow involved in something related to SS's crimes, but couldn't put my finger on anything specific. Another comment he made at one point was admiring the officer for having an interesting job, after talking about the SA photos (paraphrasing). I believe the father knows and may be involved in much more than what he lets on. MOO.

I agree. it was a very strange conversation he initiated with the officer. and also very strange he showed up announced a few months later.

 

[Gemmie]

Looks like there's some movement on this case in Osceola County's court documents as of yesterday. Specifically they are taking depositions on 3 different dates in February. Some in person, some via Zoom. They are....

Neighbor couple, roommate, witness that saw SS trying to change a flat tire, 7-11 witness when he was buying gas, owner of video showing SS’s car near parents house and I few others that I can't identify.

I am not going to paste a SS of it as it has full names of witnesses. Read it for yourself at: https://courts.osceolaclerk.com/

 

[Gemmie]

Just a reminder that it looks like SS will have a jury trail for the CSAM in a little over a month and a half from now.



Looks like the CSAM trial (above info) is before the murder trial:



All above info found on Osceola County's website: https://courts.osceolaclerk.com/

 

[FromGermany1]

we are all in agreement with the BBM portion of your post. JS is off, her behaviors are off, most of us would like to see her charged with gross neglect of her child. But I don't think she killed her daughter. That lays squarely at the feet of SS. His mother's "dream" was her trying to push a narrative that her baby boy did not kill Madeline because she blames JS for her son's abhorrent behaviors.

I am convinced, JS played an important role in the murder, and SS' mother with her dream isn't far away from what happened. MOO

ETA: I wonder, why SS is so very loyal to his ex girlfriend JS ....

 

[Mack the Knife]

Has the defense's motion (case: 2024 CF 001293) to modify jury instructions been spoken about here?

The standard jury instructions contain the following:

It is the defendant’s burden to prove that one or more mitigating circumstances exist. Mitigating circumstances and need not be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. Instead, the defendant need only prove a mitigating circumstance by the greater weight of the evidence, which means evidence that more likely than not tends to establish the existence of a mitigating circumstance. If you determine by the greater weight of the evidence that a mitigating circumstance exists, you must consider it proven and give that evidence such weight as you determine it should receive. You need not reach a unanimous decision about whether the defendant has proven the existence of a mitigating circumstance. Any juror persuaded as to the existence of a mitigating circumstance must consider it in this case.

and the defense asserts that Florida statute doesn't establish a standard of proof for mitigating circumstances, and doesn't place the burden of proof for mitigating circumstances onto the defendant, and so any mention of the burden of proof for mitigating circumstances being placed on the defense should be removed. (All from the 12/18/24 motion here: https://courts.osceolaclerk.com/)

I'm going to presume that the state has not tried to offer any sort of plea bargain to SS because their evidence is strong, they want the death penalty, and he has nothing to give them. I know some people are thinking that JS has not been arrested/charged because the state wants her to testify for them against SS before doing so, but IMO that makes the state look pretty bad and loses them a bunch of credibility in my eyes. Another idea is that they haven't arrested/charged JS because they don't want SS to be able to point the blame at her and away from him, but even if JS was the one who physically committed the act (which I highly doubt, as JS is a small woman and strangulation takes a while), IMO that would just make them both guilty of the murder.

Anyway with that stated, I've wondered what kind of defense they are preparing, and I think this motion gives a hint. I think they will not be trying for a Not Guilty verdict overall, and will instead be focusing on getting him convicted for lesser charges instead, and avoiding the death penalty. Things he might bring up as mitigating factors (whether true or not):

• His mental health/illness
• His substance use
• Pointing the finger at JS
• Saying it happened in the heat of the moment/wasn't planned
• His childhood head injury

 

[Gemmie]

Things he might bring up as mitigating factors (whether true or not):

• His mental health/illness
• His substance use
• Pointing the finger at JS

SBMFF

Let's not forget the finger pointing he did to Maddie herself!!! "I'm not the one that started it"

 

[CuriousCricket]

Has the defense's motion (case: 2024 CF 001293) to modify jury instructions been spoken about here?

The standard jury instructions contain the following:

and the defense asserts that Florida statute doesn't establish a standard of proof for mitigating circumstances, and doesn't place the burden of proof for mitigating circumstances onto the defendant, and so any mention of the burden of proof for mitigating circumstances being placed on the defense should be removed. (All from the 12/18/24 motion here: https://courts.osceolaclerk.com/)

I'm going to presume that the state has not tried to offer any sort of plea bargain to SS because their evidence is strong, they want the death penalty, and he has nothing to give them. I know some people are thinking that JS has not been arrested/charged because the state wants her to testify for them against SS before doing so, but IMO that makes the state look pretty bad and loses them a bunch of credibility in my eyes. Another idea is that they haven't arrested/charged JS because they don't want SS to be able to point the blame at her and away from him, but even if JS was the one who physically committed the act (which I highly doubt, as JS is a small woman and strangulation takes a while), IMO that would just make them both guilty of the murder.

Anyway with that stated, I've wondered what kind of defense they are preparing, and I think this motion gives a hint. I think they will not be trying for a Not Guilty verdict overall, and will instead be focusing on getting him convicted for lesser charges instead, and avoiding the death penalty. Things he might bring up as mitigating factors (whether true or not):

• His mental health/illness
• His substance use
• Pointing the finger at JS
• Saying it happened in the heat of the moment/wasn't planned
• His childhood head injury

His parents seemed to stress his childhood head injury frequently in their interview(s).

 

[Deleted member 339775]

Has the defense's motion (case: 2024 CF 001293) to modify jury instructions been spoken about here?

The standard jury instructions contain the following:

and the defense asserts that Florida statute doesn't establish a standard of proof for mitigating circumstances, and doesn't place the burden of proof for mitigating circumstances onto the defendant, and so any mention of the burden of proof for mitigating circumstances being placed on the defense should be removed. (All from the 12/18/24 motion here: https://courts.osceolaclerk.com/)

I'm going to presume that the state has not tried to offer any sort of plea bargain to SS because their evidence is strong, they want the death penalty, and he has nothing to give them. I know some people are thinking that JS has not been arrested/charged because the state wants her to testify for them against SS before doing so, but IMO that makes the state look pretty bad and loses them a bunch of credibility in my eyes. Another idea is that they haven't arrested/charged JS because they don't want SS to be able to point the blame at her and away from him, but even if JS was the one who physically committed the act (which I highly doubt, as JS is a small woman and strangulation takes a while), IMO that would just make them both guilty of the murder.

Anyway with that stated, I've wondered what kind of defense they are preparing, and I think this motion gives a hint. I think they will not be trying for a Not Guilty verdict overall, and will instead be focusing on getting him convicted for lesser charges instead, and avoiding the death penalty. Things he might bring up as mitigating factors (whether true or not):

• His mental health/illness
• His substance use
• Pointing the finger at JS
• Saying it happened in the heat of the moment/wasn't planned
• His childhood head injury

It seems to be quite the thing these days to use mental health as an excuse for pretty much any crime. Obviously he’s clearly not right by the acts he has committed but I hope he doesn’t use the cowards way out by saying it’s all down to mental health (and by that I do not mean you’re a coward if you’re mentally unwell, just that he should confess to the whole thing and do the right thing for Madeleines family)

 

[Mack the Knife]

SBMFF

Let's not forget the finger pointing he did to Maddie herself!!! "I'm not the one that started it"

I think that falls under “heat of the moment”. Unless you’re saying he might suggest MS killed herself?

But if you mean he killed her and it was her fault, I think that is covered under the possible defense that he didn’t plan it, so it shouldn’t be first degree premeditated murder. That could be him saying it was an accident or him saying she did something (ie. tried to fight him) and he went into a rage.

Truthfully, none of it sounds believable to me. I think it’s possible that MS resisted or did something that would trigger his anger, but she was strangled and if I recall correctly, her hyoid bone wasn’t even broken, implying he didn’t use some exceptional pressure in killing her. Strangulation takes a reasonably long time, long enough for premeditation to occur during the act.

 

[Mack the Knife]

I’d also be really shocked if we learn about SS having any significant participation in the online CSAM trade. The public hasn’t even learned of any CSAM in SS’s possession that may depict anyone other than MS, so it would be quite the trial bombshell to learn of him interacting much with other sexual predators online, such as to sell CSAM he had created. Quite frankly, within the world of child exploitation, “producers” of content are quite powerful, so if he had sold or traded one image he produced, I’d expect him to sell a lot and get a lot back, which would mean a lot of evidence.

All of which is to say if he kept his crimes and perversions offline, and the state’s murder case is as strong as it looks, he’s got nothing to offer them in a deal, and no good basis for a defense.

I don’t know if the time has passed or if this is even an option in Florida for a capital murder case, but I almost hope he asks for a bench trial just to save the time and emotions of a future jury.

 

[Gemmie]

I think that falls under “heat of the moment”. Unless you’re saying he might suggest MS killed herself?

But if you mean he killed her and it was her fault, I think that is covered under the possible defense that he didn’t plan it, so it shouldn’t be first degree premeditated murder. That could be him saying it was an accident or him saying she did something (ie. tried to fight him) and he went into a rage.

Truthfully, none of it sounds believable to me. I think it’s possible that MS resisted or did something that would trigger his anger, but she was strangled and if I recall correctly, her hyoid bone wasn’t even broken, implying he didn’t use some exceptional pressure in killing her. Strangulation takes a reasonably long time, long enough for premeditation to occur during the act.

I am absolutely not suggesting Maddie killed herself. The "I didn't start it" comment of SS's, IMO, is about the sexual abuse and ultimately her death. That was SS's answer to his father's question. I transcribed it because I think it's important people understand the context of SS's comment, plus it's a good convo to revisit.

CS: I wish there was a way that, you know, you and I could have a conversation, all of us could have a conversation, to understand, what... what's taken place. How this came about, how you arrived here because it would help us better understand the situation because we're just... we're at a loss, uh, for understanding, uhmm, how all this came about. I mean we're just totally... totally baffled.

SS: "Well I didn't start it"

CS: You didn't start it but you participated in it which is just as bad as not starting it.

SS: <SS talked over his father, then> "If you'd like to schedule a visit with me, or something, maybe we can find some way to talk.

CS: I don't know, I think we're always going to be recorded, so there won't be an opportunity to do that.

Convo starting at 10:18: Madeline Soto update: 'I didn't start it,' Stephan Sterns tells dad in recorded jail call

 

[Mack the Knife]

To clarify, @Gemmie , I definitely don't think you or anyone else on WS thinks that MS directly killed herself or is to blame for her death in any way. I only meant to bring up what he might use as a defense, or what others think he might use as a defense.

I had imagined when he was saying "I didn't start it," he was referring to the relationship* between them--either suggesting that JS is to blame or that MS enticed him or something--and not the series of moments that lead to her death. Obviously his abuse of MS is his own fault, but even if he was able to convince a jury that it was someone else's, I don't think that would lessen his legal culpability in her death.

*I mean "relationship" in the way that any two folks who know each other have a relationship, and not to imply that anything was consensual

 

[Gemmie]

Looks like there was an amended witness list update yesterday. No names or other info on it, just a notice that there's an amended witness list. I wonder if witnesses have been added?

Search

 

[girlhasnoname]

I think that falls under “heat of the moment”. Unless you’re saying he might suggest MS killed herself?

But if you mean he killed her and it was her fault, I think that is covered under the possible defense that he didn’t plan it, so it shouldn’t be first degree premeditated murder. That could be him saying it was an accident or him saying she did something (ie. tried to fight him) and he went into a rage.

Truthfully, none of it sounds believable to me. I think it’s possible that MS resisted or did something that would trigger his anger, but she was strangled and if I recall correctly, her hyoid bone wasn’t even broken, implying he didn’t use some exceptional pressure in killing her. Strangulation takes a reasonably long time, long enough for premeditation to occur during the act.

Respectfully disagree here. An innocent 13 yo young girl who has been proven to have been SA by this Defendant from the age of 8 couldn't possibly do anything to trigger HIS anger enough to cause HER murder. <modsnip>

Whether or not SS used exceptional pressure in strangling her doesn't mean anything to me either, she still ended up just as dead. Maybe he used a pillow to muffle the noise? IDK

Whatever actions that happened to cause her death late that night into the wee hours of the morning is on SS the child
r a p I s t. I hope he goes to the DP Express Lane to be honest, even though I am not a big proponent of it in general. Here we have factual, video evidence showing what he did to this innocent child for years, Madeline. That changes it completely for me.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

I’d also be really shocked if we learn about SS having any significant participation in the online CSAM trade. The public hasn’t even learned of any CSAM in SS’s possession that may depict anyone other than MS, so it would be quite the trial bombshell to learn of him interacting much with other sexual predators online, such as to sell CSAM he had created. Quite frankly, within the world of child exploitation, “producers” of content are quite powerful, so if he had sold or traded one image he produced, I’d expect him to sell a lot and get a lot back, which would mean a lot of evidence.

All of which is to say if he kept his crimes and perversions offline, and the state’s murder case is as strong as it looks, he’s got nothing to offer them in a deal, and no good basis for a defense.

I don’t know if the time has passed or if this is even an option in Florida for a capital murder case, but I almost hope he asks for a bench trial just to save the time and emotions of a future jury.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if he did participate in online CSAM. SS spent an inordinate amount of time online chatting with young girls. There are videos of him SA Madeline starting at age 8. There's no way I believe he didn't share them with someone else.

Why wouldn't it be logical to think he'd pass them along to like minded individuals? There is a whole community of these sickos on the internet. We don't know if, where and to whom he passed these too yet.

I want SS to be held publicly accountable for his actions. I know it would be hard and painful for some to hear, but I think the public needs to be more aware of the dangers and possibilities of this happening. JS doesn't seem like she'd be too upset based on her reactions so far IMO, SS's parents already know the details. Juries hear stories like this and worse every day unfortunately. I want SS to face his crimes and punishment in public. He has hidden in the shadows far too long.

Madeline deserves for her story to be told, it might help or save another child.

JMO

 

[Deleted member 339775]

Wasn’t it mentioned near the beginning of the case that SS had an account on some nefarious website (telegram? I might have got the name wrong). If that is correct then I’m pretty sure he wasn’t on there swapping cookie recipes!

 

[imstilla.grandma]

In an exclusive, livestreaming event at 7 p.m. on Monday, Jan 20, you will be able to see all of Justice for Madeline, from start to finish.

Watch the 6-part series followed by a live Q&A with News 6 Investigator Mike DeForest

The disappearance and death of 13-year-old Madeline Soto rocked Central Florida and attracted the attention of people from all across the U.S.

www.clickorlando.com

 

[Mack the Knife]

Respectfully disagree here. An innocent 13 yo young girl who has been proven to have been SA by this Defendant from the age of 8 couldn't possibly do anything to trigger HIS anger enough to cause HER murder. <modsnip>

Whether or not SS used exceptional pressure in strangling her doesn't mean anything to me either, she still ended up just as dead. Maybe he used a pillow to muffle the noise? IDK

Whatever actions that happened to cause her death late that night into the wee hours of the morning is on SS the child
r a p I s t. I hope he goes to the DP Express Lane to be honest, even though I am not a big proponent of it in general. Here we have factual, video evidence showing what he did to this innocent child for years, Madeline. That changes it completely for me.

JMO

<modsnip - personalizing>

Maddie does not deserve any of what happened to her. I have been clear in my belief of that. That is not changed by the possibility that she said or did something, and whatever she said or did made him angry and in that anger he reacted violently and killed her. Murder committed in the heat of the moment is considered legally different than premeditated murder. It does not make him less of a murderer, but if he can sufficiently prove it in a court, it would change his outcome. It is not victim-blaming to say that a victim might have triggered an offender.

The presence or lack thereof of exceptional pressure in strangling MS is evidence with regards to SS’s state while killing her. If his defense is that he did not plan to kill her, but acted in the heat of the moment, which is the hypothetical I was discussing, I would expect the violence to be particularly rage filled and aggressive (overkill). Apologies for starting to get graphic here, but that her hyoid bone was not broken implies to me that MS was not killed with so much strength that it would have occurred quickly, and SS wouldn’t have the time to decide to stop. If he had the time to decide to stop, that means he had the time to form intent, ie. premeditation and not heat of the moment.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if he did participate in online CSAM. SS spent an inordinate amount of time online chatting with young girls. There are videos of him SA Madeline starting at age 8. There's no way I believe he didn't share them with someone else.

Why wouldn't it be logical to think he'd pass them along to like minded individuals? There is a whole community of these sickos on the internet. We don't know if, where and to whom he passed these too yet.

I want SS to be held publicly accountable for his actions. I know it would be hard and painful for some to hear, but I think the public needs to be more aware of the dangers and possibilities of this happening. JS doesn't seem like she'd be too upset based on her reactions so far IMO, SS's parents already know the details. Juries hear stories like this and worse every day unfortunately. I want SS to face his crimes and punishment in public. He has hidden in the shadows far too long.

Madeline deserves for her story to be told, it might help or save another child.

JMO

I think it’s plenty logical for a person in SS’s situation and with his known history to have participated in the online exchange of CSAM and/or pursue inappropriate relationships online. But with this case in particular, we are aware of tons of evidence. I’ve personally requested evidence from at least three different LE agencies. There has been nothing publicly released that at all points to SS doing anything illegal online. In fact, the then Chief of Kissimmee PD said they believe the abuse was isolated to the home, and no one has ever amended that.



<modsnip - personalizing>

 

[Mack the Knife]

Wasn’t it mentioned near the beginning of the case that SS had an account on some nefarious website (telegram? I might have got the name wrong). If that is correct then I’m pretty sure he wasn’t on there swapping cookie recipes!

I think this came from Gray Hughes, but I don't recall any mentions from LE or any LE documents anywhere.

Telegram is an encrypted messaging app that is used for nefarious purposes sometimes, but not exclusively. I know journalists use it a lot to communicate with sources. Some privacy-minded people use it as well. Obviously SS isn't a journalist and isn't privacy-minded (keeping illegal material on Google Drive is not smart), but it's plausible he could have been using Telegram for legal reasons. Assuming he was really using Telegram at all.