Gene Hackman dead at 95: Iconic actor and wife, 63, are found dead with their dog at Santa Fe home. #2

[Cardgame]

People suffer from cardiac events and do simply drop dead and die.

As I posted upthread, many deaths have undetermined causes. It is fairly common.

The husband of one of my cousins “dropped dead” at age 32. His heart just stopped beating. No reason for his heart to stop beating was discovered during autopsy or tox testing.

But in this instance two humans have dropped dead, at close enough the same time to mean neither could alert anyone, plus a dog.

I'm not sure anyone here is arguing that one sudden death is strange, it's the combination of circumstances.

 

[friendlysleuther]

Why does all of these make me feel you spent a good portion of your life watching old people fight? Mainly your last two bullet points.

Well, not necessarily — But, I do hear & see some things in my work life…

 

[Cherwell]

It does seem she had enormous responsibilities if she had no help. House keeping that huge house, laundry, grocery shopping, meal prep, caring for three dogs, possibly assisting her 95 year old husband with things such as dressing and bathing or at least watching over his wellbeing. It just doesn’t seem as if there’d be enough hours in the day for one person to manage all that, reclusive lifestyle or not. Something isn’t adding up. I’m wondering if we’ll learn the couple had given the hired help time off during their final days together.

That is possible, that the cleaner/housekeeper was on holiday or off sick. How tragic if this was the case, because they would have been found sooner and possibly saved if someone was coming in daily.

I just don't understand the lack of professional care workers with virtually unlimited wealth, status, etc..

Some people are very private and don't want strangers performing intimate services for them.
This can mean that the spouse or family member is forced to take on too much.

I knew someone whose father was bedbound and paralysed after a stroke. He had carers coming in every day, but whenever my friend visited (and this would be between long periods of work away, when she was due a break) her father would dismiss the carers "My daughter can do it."

 

[friendlysleuther]

It doesn't, but they don't seem to have had a cleaner. If they did, surely their bodies would have been discovered much sooner.

It’s still very possible that they did have a cleaner, —

The cleaner could have worked tri-weekly, monthly, every 2 months, seasonally, etc., etc.,

 

[Deleted member 235284]

I just don't understand the lack of professional care workers with virtually unlimited wealth, status, etc.. I had a friend, "Peter" a cancer patient, etc., who was living with a kind woman who became a care giver. There came a point at which she could no longer care for him and I was called to contact 911 where he was taken to a nursing home. I can understand they'd try to avoid a care facility or hospital, but there comes a time when that is unavoidable usually.

From some of what we have learned seems like she was very devoted to him, perhaps in a way too devoted and she wanted to do it all her self pretty much, or just took on to much of a workload. I just kind of hope this did not contribute to her health being affected and hence her having a medical episode.

 

[Cherwell]

But in this instance two humans have dropped dead, at close enough the same time to mean neither could alert anyone, plus a dog.
I'm not sure anyone here is arguing that one sudden death is strange, it's the combination of circumstances.

But one death was very likely the consequence of the other.
Without Betsy to help him, Gene was not fully capable of looking after himself and a fall while he was alone would have been catastrophic as he wouldn't have been able to get up without help.
Betsy's sudden unexpected death was the catalyst for the others.

 

[Cherwell]

It’s still very possible that they did have a cleaner, —
The cleaner could have worked tri-weekly, monthly, every 2 months, seasonally, etc., etc.,

Perhaps. Or, as suggested above, they could have been on leave or off sick.
If so the timing was very unfortunate.

 

[Cardgame]

But one death was very likely the consequence of the other.
Without Betsy to help him, Gene was not fully capable of looking after himself and a fall while he was alone would have been catastrophic as he wouldn't have been able to get up without help.
Betsy's sudden unexpected death was the catalyst for the others.

Assuming gene was completely incapacitated, which is possible but we don't have any evidence of that.

 

[ClearAhead]

Gene suffering cardiac arrest is my top theory

From the linked article:

Given the new findings, Dr. Baden believes that the retired star may have suffered from a sudden cardiac arrhythmia episode - a malfunction of the heart's electrical system that occurs when the signals telling the heart to beat don't work properly.

I wonder if Gene’s pacemaker was properly maintained and batteries in good working order or if had simply stopped, causing death?

 

[acutename]

I agree. Communication with my own elderly father was difficult. We'd end up just kind of yelling stuff back and forth for a few minutes. However, Gene had a young wife who you would think could receive and participate in phone calls from his children checking in on him. Did this not happen?

some elderly people sleep a lot- sleep late and go to bed early so if you are a "normal" working person, you cannot call them "after work" because they go to sleep at dusk. maybe GH's children just assumed his second wife was handling it all? Do not recall where the children live if it was printed but maybe they were not all that close any more.

 

[Deleted member 235284]

I think the ‘cognitive decline’ is overhyped

He had online yoga sessions via Zoom on a daily basis so will have been able to understand and process instructions from the teacher and copy the moves the teacher did

If he can do that I would have thought he would have the thought process to at least do basic tasks at home or know how to use a phone

Yep, I have seen lots of people saying he had dementia or something. I have seen nothing concrete to back that up. Pretty sure it's just people overhyping his age.

 

[Deleted member 235284]

I wonder if Gene’s pacemaker was properly maintained and batteries in good working order or if had simply stopped, causing death?

The way they worded what they said about it recording its last event on the 17th, would make it seem more likely he died hence it stopped recording more events.

But who knows maybe too early to fully assume that until its been looked into more.

 

[formerreddingrunner]

Maybe she did, plenty of women her age do. But probably most of those are not caring for a 95 year old spouse. It's not impossible that she did it all herself, but I would find it surprising. Of course, we don't know what state their home was in, maybe her housekeeping was the bare minimum (and who am I to criticise? )

I know!! This is what I feel the most confused about. Besty (Gene's wife) taking care of *everything* and not having even a simple house cleaner on a weekly basis? There were two homes on the 12-acre property! She did everything HERSELF? (A previous post mentioned that the groundsperson who called 9-1-1 is someone hired by the gated community?) Caregiving and cleaning, etc. Meal prep, too? And even caring for 3 dogs! That's sounds like a tremendous amount for one person without a break?

Unless Gene was in extremely good health (both mentally & physically) at age 95, but I find that hard to believe that he didn't need supervision at all times at that age! That's a lot to coordinate. If it was "natural causes," the only way it makes sense to me is: Betsy had a medical event. Then Gene fell and couldn't get up.

 

[Cherwell]

Assuming gene was completely incapacitated, which is possible but we don't have any evidence of that.

No, he didn't need to be "completely incapacitated". I didn't say that. The older you get, the harder it is to get up from the floor unaided.
Gene was 95, we know he was frail and friends have said that his health had declined further over the last year. There's little doubt that if he had fallen he would have needed help to get up.

 

[Cardgame]

I know!! This is what I feel the most confused about. Besty (Gene's wife) taking care of *everything* and not having even a simple house cleaner on a weekly basis? There were two homes on the 12-acre property! She did everything HERSELF? (A previous post mentioned that the groundsperson who called 9-1-1 is someone hired by the gated community?) Caregiving and cleaning, etc. Meal prep, too? And even caring for 3 dogs! That's sounds like a tremendous amount for one person without a break?

Unless Gene was in extremely good health (both mentally & physically) at age 95, but I find that hard to believe that he didn't need supervision at all times at that age! That's a lot to coordinate. If it was "natural causes," the only way it makes sense to me is: Betsy had a medical event. Then Gene fell and couldn't get up.

You've articulated something interesting here:

The fact they were reclusive indicates that gene was in relatively good health. IMO. Otherwise why would they not have been discovered sooner?

Therefore if Betsy had a medical event then we must also be assuming that gene immediately fell over.

If he fell over on his way to help Betsy, why was he in the mudroom with his cane and sunglasses? And if he was on his way into the house, then how did he know Betsy needed help?

I guess it could be horrible coincidence, they both had fatal events at the same moment, but for me this isn't definitely more likely than something else.

And the idea that they are somehow casually related, that I'm struggling to see.

Surely gene would have fallen on his way either to Betsy, or to the phone?

 

[acutename]

could you get an electrical shock from a space heater? I understand having one in the bathroom because you can get chilled washing, and most of them have shut offs if they tip, but just thinking outside the box.

 

[Sunshynn]

No, he didn't need to be "completely incapacitated". I didn't say that. The older you get, the harder it is to get up from the floor unaided.
Gene was 95, we know he was frail and friends have said that his health had declined further over the last year. There's little doubt that if he had fallen he would have needed help to get up.

Yes, this.

It’s just fact that the older you get that a fall could be fatal.
If Betsy went first, which I think is what happened, then Gene even taking a minor fall and without her help to get up, could have been the fatal event for him.
Moo

 

[priyaya]

It does seem she had enormous responsibilities if she had no help. House keeping that huge house, laundry, grocery shopping, meal prep, caring for three dogs, possibly assisting her 95 year old husband with things such as dressing and bathing or at least watching over his wellbeing. It just doesn’t seem as if there’d be enough hours in the day for one person to manage all that, reclusive lifestyle or not. Something isn’t adding up. I’m wondering if we’ll learn the couple had given the hired help time off during their final days together.
JMO

My close friend is in this situation with her husband. She was 28 and he was 65 when they married and despite my reservations they've been an excellent inspiring couple with the way they support each other. he's in his 80s now and she is stretched so thin between caring for him, her aging parents, and their house full of pets. It is overload for sure and it pains me because the workload to care only increases the older her husband gets. they live rural so its beyond a full time job trying to plan supplies, meds, doctors visits, house care and financial responsibility on top of their pets. Yeah I'm sure Becky had her hands totally full, but sounds like being the sole care taker was important for her to stay in charge. seems they both kind of retreated to spend the most possible time together.

 

[acutename]

I've seen caregiver burnout, ive seen depression turn into aggression too , it was with dementia, b/c the wife couldnt understand why he couldnt put his pants on but could beat her in chess or checkers and from her perspective, she was tired enough and if he could beat her in checkers he could put his pants on, when youre tired and feeling manipulated , not a good combo. its just the illness, some areas are great and some suffer, Not saying thats the case here, just saying caregiver burnout is a real thing. You have to really be informed on how that illness works.

her own mother was 91 and had a care giver....
Gene Hackman’s wife Betsy Arakawa ‘hadn’t called’ her dementia-plagued mom, 91, in months, housekeeper says not sure how that factors into the situation

 

[Cardgame]

No, he didn't need to be "completely incapacitated". I didn't say that. The older you get, the harder it is to get up from the floor unaided.
Gene was 95, we know he was frail and friends have said that his health had declined further over the last year. There's little doubt that if he had fallen he would have needed help to get up.

But do you mean he fell over immediately at the exact same moment she had a medical event? Otherwise why wouldn't he dial 911?

This would be horrible luck. Not impossible of course. Just horrible luck.