Gun Control Debate #2

[BayouBelle_LA]

Key findings from the DCNF’s investigative report include:

A June 2016 Justice Department Inspector General’s report revealed that between 2008 and 2015 the U.S. Attorney’s office considered prosecuting "less than 32 people per year” for lying on form 4473, the federal application to buy guns. (Lying on an ATF Form 4473 constitutes a felony and is punishable by a $250,000 fine and 10 years in federal prison.)

Two of every 10 gun denials referred to the ATF was sent to field offices for prosecution, a Justice Department report by the Bureau of Justice Statistics in 2013 and 2014 found. Eight of ten never faced prosecution, according to the report.

U.S. Attorneys "accepted 80% of ATF field division referrals for consideration of prosecution in calendar years 2002 and 2003, 60% in FY 2008, and 38 percent in FY 2013."

https://www.dailywire.com/news/23642/report-obama-doj-prosecuted-less-1-criminals-who-ryan-saavedra

Audit of the Handling of Firearms Purchase Denials Through the National Instant Criminal Background Check System

https://oig.justice.gov/reports/2016/a1632.pdf#page=1

A good start would begin with enforcing the laws we already have. IMO

 

[CARIIS]

Sounds like a horrible place to live where everything in your life is controlled by the government. We sure don’t need to be like Japan. Won’t ever happen anyway as you’d need to get rid of the 2nd Amendment first. Can’t own a rifle in Japan even after jumping through all the hoops? How do they hunt?

grocery store?!

In air conditioning !!!!!!!

 

[rosemadderlake]

respectfully snipped for focus

I don’t see any added safety or value in arming teachers (or students). It would just make LE’s job more difficult.

MOO

Yes, in a variable of tragic scenarios, too, from teacher misidentified as the shooter, shooter calls out he's a teacher kills the cop, panicked kids caught in the crossfire, innocent kid shot misidentified by a teacher, on and on.

Until we have evidence, God forbid, we don't know.

A mass shooter has the element of surprise. And arming schools ups the element of surprise reactions.

Also, why is a handgun the only defense solution promoted? What other tactical solutions are there?

The barefoot neighbor in the tx church massacre was a true marksman with equal firepower. At a distance he shot the gunman in his side where his tactical armor gear didn't cover.

I can't see that defense scenario at close range with a handgun...

 

[CARIIS]

MSNBC

Cost to arm his 20% -- over 1 billion (training and guns only)

 

[human]

From a previous poster here:
When active shooter drills have become the norm in our schools, it is well past time to decide as a nation: Do we love our guns more than our children?

for me, this shouts “it is time for major changes to be made”. Now we move on to how we can do that. Not everyone will get what they want, either side, I am sure.

I don’t understand this “side” business. One side wants laws and the other side does not care that 26 elementary school children were killed and then on and on? Guns override any death?

 

[human]

Yes, in a variable of tragic scenarios, too, from teacher misidentified as the shooter, shooter calls out he's a teacher kills the cop, panicked kids caught in the crossfire, innocent kid shot misidentified by a teacher, on and on.

Until we have evidence, God forbid, we don't know.

A mass shooter has the element of surprise. And arming schools ups the element of surprise reactions.

Also, why is a handgun the only defense solution promoted? What other tactical solutions are there?

The barefoot neighbor in the tx church massacre was a true marksman with equal firepower. At a distance he shot the gunman in his side where his tactical armor gear didn't cover.

I can't see that defense scenario at close range with a handgun...

We are going to have the gunfight at the OK Corral as a new norm for schools? We are accepting that guns are so important that having armed camps like a war torn nation is normal? All because some people want to have weapons that have bullets that tumble and toss the inside of humans like a salad?

 

[bobcat]

Why does it have to cost anything? I thought the proposal was simply to allow school employees to retain their 2nd Amendment right to carry a firearm while on the job. No need for any special training and let these employees carry their own personal guns.

 

[Spellbound]

Proficiency in the use of these firearms must be regularly demonstrated through qualifying tests; in most states, re-qualification must occur annually.

https://www.correctionalofficeredu.org/training/

so ... if we were to arm our teachers, are we going to raise their salaries to compensate for the added stress/anxiety, and annual training/tests, etc. ?

 

[kimlynn]

grocery store?!

In air conditioning !!!!!!!

LOL.

Can anyone explain why Trump is giving over power or even taking into consideration the views of the NRA.
He keeps saying they ( the NRA) will do the right thing.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Sounds like a horrible place to live where everything in your life is controlled by the government. We sure don’t need to be like Japan. Won’t ever happen anyway as you’d need to get rid of the 2nd Amendment first. Can’t own a rifle in Japan even after jumping through all the hoops? How do they hunt?

Oh the irony.

I guess Japan (along with most other civilised nations) thinks peoples 'right to not be murdered in cold blood' is more important.

 

[human]

Sounds like a horrible place to live where everything in your life is controlled by the government. We sure don’t need to be like Japan. Won’t ever happen anyway as you’d need to get rid of the 2nd Amendment first. Can’t own a rifle in Japan even after jumping through all the hoops? How do they hunt?

i feel a trip to Japan would be a fabulous thing to do. Lots of cheap flights to there. A long plane ride, though

 

[human]

LOL.

Can anyone explain why Trump is giving over power or even taking into consideration the views of the NRA.
He keeps saying they ( the NRA) will do the right thing.

Really! We must counter that crazy idea. Who elected them? Or is it the other way around?

 

[human]

Proficiency in the use of these firearms must be regularly demonstrated through qualifying tests; in most states, re-qualification must occur annually.

https://www.correctionalofficeredu.org/training/

so ... if we were to arm our teachers, are we going to raise their salaries to compensate for the added stress/anxiety, and annual training/tests, etc. ?

Duh. Of,course! They are talking about a really hefty bonus. $1000 a year. Lol

Or maybe stock in NRA products or weapons?

 

[CARIIS]

Here is the bla bla on the bump stock stuff

it was a memo --- a duplicate of one from Dec that did nothing.

[FONT=&quot]Accordingly, following established legal protocols, the Department of Justice started the process of promulgating a Federal regulation interpreting the definition of “machinegun” under Federal law to clarify whether certain bump stock type devices should be illegal. The Advanced Notice of Proposed Rulemaking was published in the Federal Register on December 26, 2017. Public comment concluded on January 25, 2018, with the Department of Justice receiving over 100,000 comments.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
It is kinda like maybe making a little suggestion that someone might think about thinking about an idea a little bit..

Useless :

Unlike executive orders, memoranda are not required by law to be published in the Federal Register, but publication is necessary in order to have "general applicability and legal effect".[SUP][



[/SUP]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidential_memorandum


[/FONT]

 

[Spellbound]

Duh. Of,course! They are talking about a really hefty bonus. $1000 a year. Lol

Or maybe stock in NRA products or weapons?

:silly:
:doh: :sorry:

 

[bobcat]

LOL.

Can anyone explain why Trump is giving over power or even taking into consideration the views of the NRA.
He keeps saying they ( the NRA) will do the right thing.

The NRA represents the views of all their members and many other Americans. So, perhaps that is why? Not everyone believes in the same things that you’ll hear on <modsnip> news sites such as CNN and MSNBC.

 

[human]

Prison guards have guns and that's who needs them...not teachers. I have five grandchildren in the public school system, and I want a way to stop shooters from ever getting onto a campus. Fence them all and post armed guards at the entrance. I don't care...just find a way to prevent them from having the opportunity to enter a school yard.

I have six grandchildren and I want the weapons that cause the organs of a victim to turn into mincemeat to be banned. And to not be allowed even for police,

 

[CARIIS]

Duh. Of,course! They are talking about a really hefty bonus. $1000 a year. Lol

Or maybe stock in NRA products or weapons?

I did the math for you my dear. It is a whopping $29. a week Before taxes...pls be careful of the stampede for those that want to sign up for this winner!

Would you go to Paris or London with this windfall??

Get in line now don't do that - will never happen

We don't have any money to build some roads !!

 

[human]

The NRA represents the views of all their members and many other Americans. So, perhaps that is why? Not everyone believes in the same things that you’ll hear on the fake news sites such as CNN and MSNBC.

I feel and believe as everyone should that those weapons tumble the bullets and those bullets destroy even organs that cannot be repaired. There is no possible need for weapons such as that. Not even for target practice,

And someone’s need for a hobby does not trump the right for children and others to lve.

 

[kimlynn]

The NRA represents the views of all their members and many other Americans. So, perhaps that is why? Not everyone believes in the same things that you&#8217;ll hear on the fake news sites such as CNN and MSNBC.

But they have a vested interest in leaving things as they are. And why are we giving away our power to the NRA?
I think I know why but wanted to see if others are as angry as I am.